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Female Turians in ME: Evolution


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#351
Bluko

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ShadyKat wrote...

I'm just going to chalk up the female Turian, to crappy art work from Dark Horse. Bioware would not have held off on putting female Turians in ME1&2 if all they were going to look like were fringe-less males. They were going to make them look like the males at first, but one of the devs said that idea was dropped.



Image IPB

This is how they should look. Still looks just like the males, just thinner and more  fimmine looking.



This is about what I expected. Just from what we've heard of male Turians, this seems a lot more sensible. Yes male birds tend to have brighter colors, but Turians are mostly Gray, White, and Brown to begin with. And while some bird species do have more plummage to atract females, that's only with a select few species and it's not exclusive to all birds. So why should this apply to Turians anyways? I never really saw Turians head fringe as a masculine display/peacock equivalent. If anything I thought the fringe was more of something related to age and clan status. Saren has some of the longest fringes so I guess you could make a point this made him more Charismatic as a male Turian.

Still the female Turian has like no fringes at all in the comic. Just some additional face plating, which fail to protect as much of the head. If anything she looks like a very young Turian or odd off-shoot of the species. If Turians are dinosaur like, shouldn't the females have more plating?

Still I got my ideas from what I heard in-game. The Turian at the Bachelor Party says Asari's heads look more like Turians. I assumed this meant females had head fringes in similair fashion as most males. Also Garrus says he would normally compliment a female on her fringe. I assumed this was an ancedote for hair. That's essentially the only thing I can Turian's fringe being really, since they have no real pratical purpose. Also Turians while bird/dinosaur-like are suppose to be more like us then any other species. I mean Turian society really isn't much different then many of our Imperial societies have been. Also I'm fairly certain Turians do not lay eggs like birds and dinosaurs, and guessing they mate in similair fashion as we do. Otherwise what the hell do males find attractive about the Asari at all?

Garrus also tells us a few other things. He pretty much alludes to the fact that in terms of physique female Turians aren't all that disimilar from human females. Female Turians are supposedly more flexible. They have larger supportive waists. Hmm sounds an awful lot like the dimoprhism in our species so far. Also Garrus says he has reach which implies males are larger/taller at the very least. Also it's implied they intercourse similair to us as well.

So yes I think it would be fair to expect female Turians to look somewhat feminine by our standards. This game is still just fantasy anyways, and most importantly it is game. To me it would be more sensible to have female Turians look feminine so that the majority of players aren't going "WTF". Now I'm not saying female Turians should cleavage, since they are obviously not mammals. I think most people are mature enough to realize that. Also the groundskeeper un-used dialogue refers to females not having funny bumps. So yes female Turians should not have boobs.

But that said it's utterly silly to make them un-feminine just because it's slightly more plausible from a scientific perspective. Hate to burst your bubble but ME is far from being scientifically accurate or logical. Also given the trend that ME2 kind of threw out practicality for having sex appeal, it seems silly Bioware would go this route. Maybe Bioware decided to wise up a bit for ME3, but after being subjected to Miranda, Tali, and Jack it seems especially silly to change their approach to character design. Also don't say ME1 was any better cause Ashley and Liara were in ME1 just as much for the sex appeal.

So why is it any worse that they would do the same for female Turians? What's the point of having them in-game if they aren't even really distinguishable as feminine to the average gamer? Let's be frank if there is a female Turian introduced as a sqadmate she'll probably be an L.I. Even if they aren't it just makes Turians seem more odd to us then they need be. Even those these are aliens they are all still very much human. Honestly I would been more content to simply have it explained the males and females are indistinguishable. That could at least better explain their lack of noticeable presence. But to make the females look like what's shown in this comic is just pointless, if not dumb.

I sincerely hope this is just bad concept work, and that if we do see something in ME3 it'll be something a bit more believable to concepts most players would get from what we know of Turians.

#352
didymos1120

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Bluko wrote...

I sincerely hope this is just bad concept work, and that if we do see something in ME3 it'll be something a bit more believable to concepts most players would get from what we know of Turians.


It wouldn't be the first time alien appearances in out-of-game material don't match up to the games.  In Revelation, the volus didn't wear exosuits and had what sounded like wattles on their neck.  The batarians in that book don't accord with their final design either.

#353
Bluko

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didymos1120 wrote...

Bluko wrote...

I sincerely hope this is just bad concept work, and that if we do see something in ME3 it'll be something a bit more believable to concepts most players would get from what we know of Turians.


It wouldn't be the first time alien appearances in out-of-game material don't match up to the games.  In Revelation, the volus didn't wear exosuits and had what sounded like wattles on their neck.  The batarians in that book don't accord with their final design either.


I hope so. I know Feron didn't look that much like his in-game appearence. Yeah I'm hoping what we've seen is really more just some early concept. Who knows perhaps they did this just to see what our early reactions are. Changing character models towards the end of development is probably one of the easier things to do I imagine, especially if it's just superficial features. Considering how I've seen random modders switch character models, it can't be that impossibly difficult, especially when you have a team  that knows the game engine.

#354
AxoneNeurone

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@pikalex88

Thak you very much! Glad to see that someone found my... er, impromptu essay enjoyable rather than tedious, heh!

didymos1120 wrote...

It wouldn't be the first time alien
appearances in out-of-game material don't match up to the games.  In
Revelation, the volus didn't wear exosuits and had what sounded like
wattles on their neck.  The batarians in that book don't accord with
their final design either.


First of all, I'm
glad I hadn't decided to have breakfast yet or I might have done a
spit-take at first sight of your avatar. NOICE.

Second of all, I
forgot about that! That's a very good point. I do remember
batarians being described as furry, and all throughout Mass Effect 2 I
was looking hard for traces of fuzz. I guess that's a more powerful
argument for Camp Wait n' See.

#355
Brienna_

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Got to sneak here and comment because I saw the pic of my MERP character Rica Krylus here hahah. (The picture above is made by her http://rikona.deviantart.com/ , if someone wants to see more feminine turians)



I made that character as girly as possible, and frankly I don't expect or want the turians in ME3 (LETS HOPE WE WILL SEE THEM <3 ) to be like her. I hope them to be as badass-looking as the male turians, but still seeing the pictures from the comic brought up puke in my throat. Mainly because the lack of fringe and horrible drag-queen dress. But like I have heard many people say, this is just one turian female, it doesn't mean that all of them will look like her. Besides after being huge Bioware fan for many years, I trust those guys. Even if my expectations of female turians turn out to be completely different from BW's, I will probably just be so over-joyed to see them in ME3 so that I don't care if they look like elcor's butt. ...



And because my mind is in such a messy place and my grammar sucks as always, I'm just gonna say that Bluko's long post had many points, which I endorse.

#356
Guest_AwesomeName_*

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I still don't think there's necessarily an inconsistency with what Garrus or bach. party turian have said... The bach. party showed that each of those guys disagreed and thought the Asari looked the most like their own species, and could barely see the similarity with other species... So while the turian sees the female turian fringe as very similar to the asari, it's a similarity that's tenuos to his human friend... It's possible the visual cortex just works differently for each species at processing superficial features... e.g. the turian's visual cortex may respond very strongly to the way the female turian fringe flare up slightly at the tips, in much the same way the human visual cortex responds to faces (your brain "enhances" the image when you look at a face).



Maybe I just can't remember - but what exactly did Garrus say about female turians, other than saying one female he slept with had more flexibility and less reach than him?

#357
Aeowyn

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@Awesome: In the pre-Omega 4 romance scene he says:

"If you were a turian I would be complementing your waist or your fringe, so your...hair...looks good, and your waist is...very supportive."



That's the line we use when arguing that female turians should have fringes and not the pathetic excuse the turian in the comic has.

#358
Guest_AwesomeName_*

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Aeowyn wrote...

@Awesome: In the pre-Omega 4 romance scene he says:
"If you were a turian I would be complementing your waist or your fringe, so your...hair...looks good, and your waist is...very supportive."

That's the line we use when arguing that female turians should have fringes and not the pathetic excuse the turian in the comic has.


"Is everyone saying the same thing when they use the word "fringe"? 
Fringe just means "outermost edge"... That turian has a "fringe" - an
edge to her forehead - it just doesn't end with extra crest "spikes". 
She lacks a lot of the spikes that males have, but she has a fringe
nonetheless.  Just a bit of semantics there, so not necessarily a big
deal, I guess *shrugs*...  "

Basically, Garrus saying that doesn't mean that female turian fringes must have extra spikes coming out.  That's adding extra information to what he's saying, I think... 

#359
Phaedon

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DH has always messed turian anatomy, don't worry guys.

#360
armass

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Hey maybe the turian lietenant is one of those masculinic turian females, u know like how some of our women in olympics really havent looked like women :P

#361
Aeowyn

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AwesomeName wrote...

Aeowyn wrote...

@Awesome: In the pre-Omega 4 romance scene he says:
"If you were a turian I would be complementing your waist or your fringe, so your...hair...looks good, and your waist is...very supportive."

That's the line we use when arguing that female turians should have fringes and not the pathetic excuse the turian in the comic has.


"Is everyone saying the same thing when they use the word "fringe"? 
Fringe just means "outermost edge"... That turian has a "fringe" - an
edge to her forehead - it just doesn't end with extra crest "spikes". 
She lacks a lot of the spikes that males have, but she has a fringe
nonetheless.  Just a bit of semantics there, so not necessarily a big
deal, I guess *shrugs*...  "

Basically, Garrus saying that doesn't mean that female turian fringes must have extra spikes coming out.  That's adding extra information to what he's saying, I think... 



But then the turian at the bachelor party is commenting on how asari looks like them because if the head fringe. Asari crests cover the entire head. Why would a turian compare a turian woman with an asari if their fringes weren't similar?

#362
Guest_AwesomeName_*

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Aeowyn wrote...

AwesomeName wrote...

Aeowyn wrote...

@Awesome: In the pre-Omega 4 romance scene he says:
"If you were a turian I would be complementing your waist or your fringe, so your...hair...looks good, and your waist is...very supportive."

That's the line we use when arguing that female turians should have fringes and not the pathetic excuse the turian in the comic has.


"Is everyone saying the same thing when they use the word "fringe"?  Fringe just means "outermost edge"... That turian has a "fringe" - an edge to her forehead - it just doesn't end with extra crest "spikes".  She lacks a lot of the spikes that males have, but she has a fringe nonetheless.  Just a bit of semantics there, so not necessarily a big deal, I guess *shrugs*...  "

Basically, Garrus saying that doesn't mean that female turian fringes must have extra spikes coming out.  That's adding extra information to what he's saying, I think... 



But then the turian at the bachelor party is commenting on how asari looks like them because if the head fringe. Asari crests cover the entire head. Why would a turian compare a turian woman with an asari if their fringes weren't similar?


I know and that's a good point - but I think there could be an explanation for that...  Obviously as far as the turian is concerned, the asari looks more turian than human - the human doesn't quite agree, though.  I think it's to do with a difference in the way the visual cortex works for the different species.  I think the following might be worth mentioning again:

I can sort of see some similarity to asari - I mean you can see how the
tips of her fringe flare up a bit... So it's not necessarily a retcon if
they all look like this - it's just a similarity that humans see as
tenuous (as the guy at the bach. party does), but is something Turians
possibly respond to straight away... 

...consider how the human visual cortex is designed to
process certain visual information, e.g. when you see a face, your brain
does a lot more than just show you the light bouncing off the face,
that information goes through a complex process so that you actually see
more.  The hollow mask illusion
demonstrates quite powerfully how the human brain responds to faces
specifically ... Anyway, my point here is that Turian
brains may, in a similar way, be hot wired to certain features on a
Turian that we might take for granted...  Just something to think about,
I suppose...../../../images/forum/emoticons/smile.png



#363
volus4life

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they should distinguish female turians from male turians by giving them brooms and laundry baskets.



*ducks tomatoes*

#364
volus4life

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AwesomeName wrote...
 I think it's to do with a difference in the way the visual
cortex works for the different species.


i think turians have worse vision than humans. that's why they're always losing battles to humans in the comics, turians can't see past 10 feet unless they are wearing scouters like garrus does.

#365
ReiSilver

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Man I'm SO glad at least that they didn't make the females as fragile looking as some fan designs are. They're fine as fan work but Turians are already slender and sleek, the females don't need to be slimmed down any more and I'm glad that the comic didn't do that.
They just need to not go against established lore and their heads need radiation protection. That's all.
(remember what happened when people didn't like the mako or inventory? Bioware didn't improve those things they removed them altogether! They're easily startled, like deer, we're going to scare them from ever showing a female turian anywhere ever again!)

Modifié par ReiSilver, 23 janvier 2011 - 12:14 .


#366
volus4life

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ReiSilver wrote...

Man I'm SO glad at least that they didn't make the females as fragile looking as some fan designs are. They're fine as fan work but Turians are already slender and sleek, the females don't need to be slimmed down any more and I'm glad that the comic didn't do that.
They just need to not go against established lore and their heads need radiation protection. That's all.
(remember what happened when people didn't like the mako or inventory? Bioware didn't improve those things they removed them altogether! They're easily startled, like deer, we're going to scare them from ever showing a female turian anywhere ever again!)


are turians physically weak, though? just because they're sleek, it doesn't mean they're flimsy, does it?

i mean, they're obviously not powerhouses like a krogan, for example, but if a female turian was a little thinner than a male turian, i don't see how it would suddenly turn her into paper mache.

Modifié par volus4life, 23 janvier 2011 - 12:24 .


#367
Suron

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RiouHotaru wrote...

GodWood wrote...

God the artwork, dialogue, and overall story in ME comics is an abortion


Fixed.


fixed x 2

Modifié par Suron, 23 janvier 2011 - 01:50 .


#368
RiouHotaru

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Suron wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

GodWood wrote...

God the artwork, dialogue, and overall story in ME comics is an abortion


Fixed.


fixed x 2


Hahaha, why thank you!  You caught my errors for me ;)

#369
AgentMulder5

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God the ME comics are an abortion



Final Fix






#370
STG

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ShadyKat wrote...

Image IPB

This is how they should look. Still looks just like the males, just thinner and more  fimmine looking.


Good God, no!

This looks like a mix between Jessica Rabbit and Garrus. And that is bad.

#371
Zaxares

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Interesting... I'd always wondered what female turians looked like, and now that I've seen one... Well, admittedly my first impression was "That's a female turian?" She looks kind of odd with such a short fringe though, like the back of her head is totally exposed. Then again, maybe she got the fringe trimmed? Or it was broken off in an accident? There could be any number of reasons as to why this female had such a short crest/fringe.



It's also very unfair to judge the appearance of a gender just from one example. What if the very first human couple turians had met were a grossly obese one and the man had, ah, upper-chest corpulence? The turians may not have been able to tell the difference unless they looked under their clothes.

#372
lovgreno

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STG wrote...

Good God, no!

This looks like a mix between Jessica Rabbit and Garrus. And that is bad.

Bad? Not at all. That sounds like a top quality piece of awesome mix to me!

#373
kidbd15

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Wasn't thrilled about the design, but I don't hate it either... just don't like inconsistencies with the established universe... BW needs to do a better job at that, or at least explain why any inconsistencies occurred

#374
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kidbd15 wrote...

Wasn't thrilled about the design, but I don't hate it either... just don't like inconsistencies with the established universe... BW needs to do a better job at that, or at least explain why any inconsistencies occurred


They're not necessarily inconsistent though (I made a post further up about it, which may or may not work)

#375
Criz

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I tried to scribble another concept based on what was in 'Evolution' and it occured to me that not all the clan face paints would work on the females since they lack the top fringes...
throw us a bone here, BioWare or better yet in-game models of fem turians :o