404 réponses à ce sujet

[hrothgar99]

can't wait ....the party convo thing seems really cool .......

[AlanC9]

prazision wrote...

This close to release, I would expect:

- Number of, names of, and vague backstories for, all companions.

- Idea of the overarching plot and how it connects to Origins beyond "Hawke becomes the Hero/Tyrant of Kirkwall" and "Hawke does not save the world"

- Detailed breakdown of all class specs and skills.

- In-depth information about how the battles will work out, not just a demo of a fight against a few thugs in a generic alley which demonstrates very little beyond "you don't have to ever pause, but if you want to drag out these trash mob fights by pausing, knock yourself out".  This would include at least vague confirmation or denial of whether the Origins tradition of "fight a few generic Hur/Genlocks every twenty feet that provide no actual challenge or in any way enhance the gaming experience" will be continued

- Names of voice actors

- Absolute confirmation of the vague hint that there might be an actual male homosexual romance that is deeper than Zevran

Well, you're certainly not going to get the last one; since the writers don't believe in your "deeper" metric in the first place, it's difficult to see how they could answer it.

I'm also not aware of an RPG detailing combat the way you seem to expect. Examples?

As for companions, did we actually have detailed info on DAO companions two months before release? IIRC that came later, but since I wasn't actually reading that stuff I'll have to defer to others. I'd be happier if they didn't release any of that information, since I prefer to meet characters in-game without knowing stuff my character doesn't know. And I really hope they don't breathe a word of the plot either.

[Mad-Max90]

This game is gonna be HOT POCKETS!

[prazision]

AlanC9 wrote...
As for companions, did we actually have detailed info on DAO companions two months before release? IIRC that came later, but since I wasn't actually reading that stuff I'll have to defer to others. I'd be happier if they didn't release any of that information, since I prefer to meet characters in-game without knowing stuff my character doesn't know. And I really hope they don't breathe a word of the plot either.

Here's the thing about pre-release information: you don't have to read it.  I want that info, you can avoid it very easily.  It's even easier than avoiding spoilers about films in television commercials.  So saying "I don't want that information" is not really a defense for it not being available for those of us who want to know what the game will be like before we pay 60 non-refundable dollars for it.

We knew more about Origins a year before release than we do about DA2 a month before release.  And as I said, Mass Effect 2 had very good pre-release info, with character trailers and extensive in-game videos.

Origins also had the "Ostagar walkthrough" video.

Look, I un-sarcastically respect the developers' decision to withhold more information than usual for a modern game, but I also remember the quote where they said they wanted DA2 to sell 10 million copies, which it is just not gonna do on name recognition alone.  Evil Chris keeps harping on the fact that the Social Forum members are a "very, very small minority" of the fanbase.  Well, so far, not even all of the members of this forum are convinced this is a game they're interested in!

Mike, if you want me to buy your product, show me why.  Don't just tell me "trust me, it's awesome and dark" like George Lucas did with Revenge of the Sith.

[prazision]

Mad-Max90 wrote...

This game is gonna be HOT POCKETS!

Something that you consume quickly and isn't really nourishing or substantial and then just as quickly expel from your system?

[DPB]

As far I'm concerned, they went completely overboard with spoilers in the marketing of DAO. We knew details of every origin, companion, area and plot leading up to the Landsmeet. If you read most of the previews there was very little new left to discover.

[prazision]

dbankier wrote...

As far I'm concerned, they went completely overboard with spoilers in the marketing of DAO. We knew details of every origin, companion, area and plot leading up to the Landsmeet. If you read most of the previews there was very little new left to discover.

Previews are optional.  As soon as you start reading things you don't want to know, just stop.  Is self-control really that rare among BioWare fans?

I mean, when William Gibson puts a new novel out, I don't read even the plot synopsis on the jacket cover.  But books are much cheaper than games and are returnable.

If BioWareEA are so sure this game is good, it would be pretty nice of them to let you return it provided you don't register it or do anything else to invalidate its ability to be resold as a New Copy.

[hrothgar99]

isnt something like that already promised here aswell .......i mena i can a remember a guy saying it will soon be from no information to too much information

[Liablecocksman]

prazision wrote...
snip

I'm lending my support here.
I wouldn't have any problem with the lack of information, if not for the pre-order bonuses.
That's not even mentioning the bull**** that was the free-upgrade to the signature edition. If you're going to force (if they want a $7 "bonus companion" free) to pre-order months before release, you had better give those people some substantial information about the game.

Sure, a lot of people pre-ordered, I'm sure. They did it out of, as prazision said, "blind faith". That's totally cool with me, that other people want to do that. I'm not going to, and would appreciate not having to.

I'm most certainly getting the game, but I wasn't feeling entirely comfortable pre-ordering the signature edition. I suppose the "We want to give our most devoted fans this treat"(or however it was worded in that particular interview) is right - the most devoted(in my opinion stupid) fans preordered, and would now feel a little stupid if they cancel their preorder, as it would then make little sense buying the game at one point in the future, given that they would then miss out on content that would otherwise have gotten for free.

I'm bitter that I don't get the signature edition, sure, and that's mainly why I'm writing. I still, however, feel that my stance ("give me some information on the game before forcing me to preorder") is legitimate.

[prazision]

Liable****sman wrote...
I'm most certainly getting the game, but I wasn't feeling entirely comfortable pre-ordering the signature edition. I suppose the "We want to give our most devoted fans this treat"(or however it was worded in that particular interview) is right - the most devoted(in my opinion stupid) fans preordered, and would now feel a little stupid if they cancel their preorder, as it would then make little sense buying the game at one point in the future, given that they would then miss out on content that would otherwise have gotten for free.

Exactly.  Most stores won't refund cash for pre-orders (I know Gamestop won't, and like it or not, they're really the only brick and mortar store for games).  So if someone pre-ordered to get the Signature Edition, then a few days before release and reviews start rolling in and it sounds like something they don't want, or want to wait to purchase used, the best they can do is get store credit.  They're still out however much cash they put down, with the slight consolation that they can use it for some other game later.

I really hope that EA (and let's not kid ourselves, EA is the one pushing DLC and pre-orders) learn a lesson from this game and allow BioWare to apologize to their true fans (those of us that have been with them since Baldur's Gate).  Looking at the difference in quality between the DLC for, say, Mass Effect 2 or New Vegas vs. something like Witch Hunt (which was a failure on every metric and should also be apologized for) it's clear that some teams "get it" and some don't.

A lot of people were saying "I liked Origins just fine, I don't want to play Dragon Effect" but you know what?  At this point, "Dragon Effect" is looking like the best I can hope for from this game.  The level of immaturity in the PR and dev quotes (the phrase "sexy blood" is both disturbing and confusing to me, not to mention the embarrassing recent "up against the wall or virginal girl next door" quote) is making me think "I'm getting too old for this ****."

Which brings up yet another point, that on the one hand you have people saying that the "romances" are not a big deal, are not a selling point, yadda yadda, and then you have that video with the aforementioned quote and there seems to be some kind of cognitive dissonance going on even within the team itself - I don't know if this game is going to be silly, serious like ME2, "serious" like George RR Martin (blood, blood, rape, rape, blood, blood), adventurous like Time Bandits, epic like Fable 3 is intended to be, or what.  I just don't know!

[DPB]

prazision wrote...

dbankier wrote...

As far I'm concerned, they went completely overboard with spoilers in the marketing of DAO. We knew details of every origin, companion, area and plot leading up to the Landsmeet. If you read most of the previews there was very little new left to discover.

Previews are optional.  As soon as you start reading things you don't want to know, just stop.  Is self-control really that rare among BioWare fans?

There are plenty of other games that I followed that managed to keep the spoilers in check in their marketing material.

Modifié par dbankier, 23 janvier 2011 - 04:52 .

[Josef bugman3]

Sometimes I have to remind myself that you guys are actually fans of this game and not just resentful buggers who want an entire marketing department tailored around your expectations. To be honest, I am just wondering why do you want to know all this stuff?

I mean, do you want it to know you are going to purchase the game? Can you not wait till its out and then read the wiki/reviews? I mean, perhaps they are keeping this underwraps a bit more so that people can get hyped about it (and they can hype it up) without everyone knowing the exact series of events that occurs in the game.

Plus I just have to wonder why Bioware would bother promoting a game on its plotlines and companions when 1. We know its written by Bioware and is thus going to be at least reasonable and 2. The majority of complaints about origins focussed on other matters. It is a sequal after all and the PR team has probably decided to focus on the issue that people commented most on last time.

Modifié par Josef bugman3, 23 janvier 2011 - 04:58 .

[In Exile]

prazision wrote..

Here's the thing about pre-release information: you don't have to read it.  I want that info, you can avoid it very easily.  It's even easier than avoiding spoilers about films in television commercials.  So saying "I don't want that information" is not really a defense for it not being available for those of us who want to know what the game will be like before we pay 60 non-refundable dollars for it.

We can avoid it in the sense that once the tides start, we can avoid the entire forum. And I will certainly do that if it seems like Bioware has started to really spoil content, but I happen to like this forum and want to stick around.

[prazision]

dbankier wrote...

There are plenty of other games that I followed that managed to keep the spoilers in check in their marketing material.

Well, that's pretty much my point.  Dead Space 2, for example, is pretty light on story "spoilers" but gives you a great indication of what kind of game you'll be playing, and the tone of it.

That's not really too much to ask for, is it?  Some kind of definitive evidence about the general tone and gameplay instead of this schizophrenic talk about "sexy blood" and how cute Merrill is and how Hawke can be a Paragon or a Renegade and how you can beat the game without ever pausing or assuming direct control of your party members and how Varric has a wicked awesome double-crossbow-bayonette thing and...

I mean I really have no clue what kind of game this is going to be.  Will it be the kind of "mature" that is aimed at hyperactive 14-18 year olds or "mature" like Mass Effect 2?  I mean, I'm pretty sure it's the former and for obvious PR/marketing reasons they can't just come out and say that.

[prazision]

Josef bugman3 wrote...
Plus I just have to wonder why Bioware would bother promoting a game on its plotlines and companions when 1. We know its written by Bioware and is thus going to be at least reasonable

OK, first of all, you are aware that "BioWare" doesn't write games, okay?  Each game has its own team, writers and lead writer.  So, if you're talking about the Mass Effect team?  Yeah, they have a pretty good grasp of cinematic writing.  The Origins team?  That's a bit more iffy.  Some stuff worked really well, some was just kind of juvenile.

Secondly, BioWare has not made that many games, and some of them have been fairly mediocre in the story department.  Jade Empire and NeverWinter Nights certainly come to mind.  If you're going to sit there with a straight face and tell me that the BioWare-created campaign that shipped with NWN was higher than a 6/10 on a good day, then... well, I don't know, I just don't know.

Third, "at least reasonable" is not worth pre-ordering 3 months in advance, or indeed paying $60 at all.  EA hates people buying used games?  Here's a radical way to combat that: Make the game so good I have to buy it at launch instead of the extortionist "pre-order so you don't miss out on a boatload of content!!!!" strategy.  And show me that the game is that good.  You don't need to use big spoilers to do that.

[stephen1493]

prazision wrote...

Josef bugman3 wrote...
Plus I just have to wonder why Bioware would bother promoting a game on its plotlines and companions when 1. We know its written by Bioware and is thus going to be at least reasonable

OK, first of all, you are aware that "BioWare" doesn't write games, okay?  Each game has its own team, writers and lead writer.  So, if you're talking about the Mass Effect team?  Yeah, they have a pretty good grasp of cinematic writing.  The Origins team?  That's a bit more iffy.  Some stuff worked really well, some was just kind of juvenile.

Secondly, BioWare has not made that many games, and some of them have been fairly mediocre in the story department.  Jade Empire and NeverWinter Nights certainly come to mind.  If you're going to sit there with a straight face and tell me that the BioWare-created campaign that shipped with NWN was higher than a 6/10 on a good day, then... well, I don't know, I just don't know.

Third, "at least reasonable" is not worth pre-ordering 3 months in advance, or indeed paying $60 at all.  EA hates people buying used games?  Here's a radical way to combat that: Make the game so good I have to buy it at launch instead of the extortionist "pre-order so you don't miss out on a boatload of content!!!!" strategy.  And show me that the game is that good.  You don't need to use big spoilers to do that.

1. Do you even know who David Gaider is?!?! Edit: My bad, I had thought you meant that Bioware had hired outside writer's at first.

2. They've made far more than most companies, they may not be on the sega side of things, but at least ALL bioware games are high quality and have humongous fan bases.

3. DA2 is going to be a great game even if you buy it used, The only difference is that you won't be up to your ears in EXTRA content.

Modifié par stephen1493, 23 janvier 2011 - 05:21 .

[Josef bugman3]

Hence why I said "reasonable" not "stellar" or "eye bleedingly good". And how can they show, to you specifically lets note, that this game is worth the price tag? Turn up at your house with blackjack and hookers?

And when you say "some stuff was juvenile" that's a bit of personal preference there because I didn't really see anything I considered completly dense. In short, I don't actually understand what your problem is, or why you want to know everything about this game before you get the chance to play it.

As a purely personal thing I like the mystery of it all.

Modifié par Josef bugman3, 23 janvier 2011 - 05:21 .

[stephen1493]

filaminstrel wrote...

You misunderstand-- I don't want E.T., or Bill Cosby, or Dragon Age 2-- I want an RPG.

And your disgraceful ad hominem is not welcome here good sir.

If you don't want DA2 then feel free to leave. I don't go into a phantom brave forum to talk about how much I hated that game. What makes it worse is that you're basing DA2 being a horrible rpg, by the table scraps Bioware decides to throw us every biweekly.  So in all, feel free to stop your pre-order. Bioware and I aren't really going to lose any sleep over it.  (yes... we sleep together, and it's wonderful)

Modifié par stephen1493, 23 janvier 2011 - 05:49 .

[prazision]

Josef bugman3 wrote...
And when you say "some stuff was juvenile" that's a bit of personal preference there because I didn't really see anything I considered completly dense. In short, I don't actually understand what your problem is, or why you want to know everything about this game before you get the chance to play it.

I've said like three times now that I don't need big story spoilers, but I would like some coherent talk when it comes to the tone of the story and gameplay.  "Hot Rod", "sexy blood", Varric's crossbow, "up against the wall or virginal girl next door", "Think like a general, fight like a Spartan", these are all things that I consider juvenile and aimed at teenagers.  Origins had some things like that, but depending on the day of the week, sometimes the developers' quotes make it sound like this game is going completely in that direction.

And BioWare has made 12 unique games (not counting expansions).  That really is not a very large sample size to judge the quality of their next "RPG", especially since that includes MDK2 (not an RPG at all), Sonic Chronicles (not a very good game), Jade Empire (a mediocre action-adventure), and NeverWinter Nights (seriously, how was the core story campaign of that remarkable).

[AlanC9]

I have no idea what you mean by "tone of the story and gameplay." How about an example -- what would have been an acceptable description of DAO?

[stephen1493]

prazision wrote...

Josef bugman3 wrote...
And when you say "some stuff was juvenile" that's a bit of personal preference there because I didn't really see anything I considered completly dense. In short, I don't actually understand what your problem is, or why you want to know everything about this game before you get the chance to play it.

I've said like three times now that I don't need big story spoilers, but I would like some coherent talk when it comes to the tone of the story and gameplay.  "Hot Rod", "sexy blood", Varric's crossbow, "up against the wall or virginal girl next door", "Think like a general, fight like a Spartan", these are all things that I consider juvenile and aimed at teenagers.  Origins had some things like that, but depending on the day of the week, sometimes the developers' quotes make it sound like this game is going completely in that direction.

And BioWare has made 12 unique games (not counting expansions).  That really is not a very large sample size to judge the quality of their next "RPG", especially since that includes MDK2 (not an RPG at all), Sonic Chronicles (not a very good game), Jade Empire (a mediocre action-adventure), and NeverWinter Nights (seriously, how was the core story campaign of that remarkable).

Oh pooh on Bioware, marketing a video game to teenagers. Who do they think they are?

[Bryy_Miller]

Praz,

At this point, I think you're reading way too much into marketing taglines and spur of the moment phrases.