404 réponses à ce sujet

[Josef bugman3]

Seconding AlanC9's idea. That and the fact that "rise to power" kind of sets the tone really, its a story of rags to riches that is (from what I have gathered) taking place in the big city and you can make it as serious or silly as you want it to be really.

And you are complaining because you personally find some of the hyped language surrounding this juvenile? I'm not even going to disagree with you, but I am going to forgive Bioware that because of two things called "hyperbole" and "summurisation". The first is neccesary to PR the second is neccesary for anyone to get some idea.

And not defining the product means it gets more people interested.

Modifié par Josef bugman3, 23 janvier 2011 - 07:55 .

[prazision]

AlanC9 wrote...

I have no idea what you mean by "tone of the story and gameplay." How about an example -- what would have been an acceptable description of DAO?

Do I seriously need to define the word "tone"?

The tone of Origins was "realistic low fantasy".  The PR and marketing for DA2 seems to be aiming for... whatever you would call the movie 300.

And of course there's nothing "wrong" with marketing the game to the 13-18 year old crowd, if that's how they want to sell 10 million copies, but Origins was not aimed at that market, so it is understandably frustrating if its sequel is.

[Josef bugman3]

So how was the first one not like that? What with the Marilyn Manson song, the huge king based battle sequence? The promise of lasciviousness?

Oh yeah, Origins turned out to be a low fantasy, but it was marketed as enough "grrr Rahhh, kill blood, sex" nonsense to sink an aircraft carrier.

Modifié par Josef bugman3, 23 janvier 2011 - 08:04 .

[stephen1493]

Wow, they weren't kidding when they said, change is scary. Play the game, as of now this is just a lot of complaining over the trailors and explanations of it. You don't see me complaining about how the "Your Highness" trailor is taking away from the directors "Pineapple Express" roots.

Modifié par stephen1493, 23 janvier 2011 - 08:21 .

[Mike Laidlaw]

Request for more gameplay specific information has been noted. Thanks for the feedback. It's coming reasonably soon, probably in more ways than expected.

I regret not being perfectly clear in this interview, but it's how things go. It's surprisingly hard to be crystalline and perfectly clear when answering questions off the cuff and in casual discussion.

As to questions regarding "how this game actually plays" I will hold true to what I have said countless times before: Dragon Age Origins, but without the shuffling. It's faster, and your party react quickly to your orders, but the gameplay is essentially the same. And you'll see that first-hand in the future.

[prazision]

Bryy_Miller wrote...

Praz,
At this point, I think you're reading way too much into marketing taglines and spur of the moment phrases.

You may not realize this, but the entire point of PR and Marketing is to get people interested in buying the game, not to make it look bad.  Everyone made fun of the Marilyn Manson trailer, so one would think they could have learned their lesson instead of making it even worse.

If I'm reading into those things, it's because they refuse to give me much else to read into that is positive.

You may not realize this, but outside of this forum the general expectation from everything we've seen is that DA2 will be horrible.  Not "okay", not "decent", but actually bad.  The PR department is a nightmare, the developer quotes are nightmarish, it's all a mess.

I guarantee you there are more people who can point to more concrete reasons why they won't like this game than people who can point to concrete reasons why they will.

The people on here who are looking forward to this game generally seem to be basing their expectations on brand loyalty and how attractive the possible companions are.  That's pretty sad.

[nightcobra]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

Request for more gameplay specific information has been noted. Thanks for the feedback. It's coming reasonably soon, probably in more ways than expected.

I regret not being perfectly clear in this interview, but it's how things go. It's surprisingly hard to be crystalline and perfectly clear when answering questions off the cuff and in casual discussion.

As to questions regarding "how this game actually plays" I will hold true to what I have said countless times before: Dragon Age Origins, but without the shuffling. It's faster, and your party react quickly to your orders, but the gameplay is essentially the same. And you'll see that first-hand in the future.

i'm guessing that gameplay info (skill trees and etc) is more prominent in the next dev diary which i suppose is soon?

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 23 janvier 2011 - 08:42 .

[prazision]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...
As to questions regarding "how this game actually plays" I will hold true to what I have said countless times before: Dragon Age Origins, but without the shuffling. It's faster, and your party react quickly to your orders, but the gameplay is essentially the same. And you'll see that first-hand in the future.

So the combat will still rely on numerous encounters with unchallenging low-level generic monsters, rather than, say, a more "set-piece" based approach a la Mass Effect 2?  Because Origins really failed hard with the constant, dull fights every twenty feet.

[Mike Laidlaw]

prazision wrote...

You may not realize this, but outside of this forum the general expectation from everything we've seen is that DA2 will be horrible.  Not "okay", not "decent", but actually bad.  The PR department is a nightmare, the developer quotes are nightmarish, it's all a mess.

And outside of those forums are other people, who think that DA II will not be horrible. As a general rule, turning to an anonymous forum as a barometer for public opinion is risky, since in my experience, people rarely spend time on forums saying "I think this will be good." Faced with a wall of hate, and often derision, most people will simply disengage, rather than try to defend; it's not worth the stress.

[HTTP 404]

I think we are going to get a lot of info about this game in the coming month before it is released. That way it builds maximum buzz before selling the product. btw the gameplay is pretty amazing! I've seen it and played it. I don't think we need to take Mike's word for it, I think we will see more of it soon enough.

[In Exile]

prazision wrote...
Do I seriously need to define the word "tone"?

The tone of Origins was "realistic low fantasy".  The PR and marketing for DA2 seems to be aiming for... whatever you would call the movie 300.

I don't know what game you played, but mine had people causing ice storms, fire storms, throwing exploding balls of fire from their hands, not to mention flying fire-breathing lizards, shape-shifting, dimension-hopping, real honest to god demons...

If DA:O was "realistic low fantasy" then what the hell is "unrealistic high fantasy"?

[Piecake]

prazision wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

I have no idea what you mean by "tone of the story and gameplay." How about an example -- what would have been an acceptable description of DAO?

Do I seriously need to define the word "tone"?

The tone of Origins was "realistic low fantasy".  The PR and marketing for DA2 seems to be aiming for... whatever you would call the movie 300.

And of course there's nothing "wrong" with marketing the game to the 13-18 year old crowd, if that's how they want to sell 10 million copies, but Origins was not aimed at that market, so it is understandably frustrating if its sequel is.

It wasnt?  I definitely remember a commercial or two that seemed aimed at that demographic



Looks very 300ish to me

[In Exile]

prazision wrote...
You may not realize this, but the entire point of PR and Marketing is to get people interested in buying the game, not to make it look bad.  Everyone made fun of the Marilyn Manson trailer, so one would think they could have learned their lesson instead of making it even worse.

Who is everyone? If you check it out on youtube, it has like 4000 likes and 100 dislikes. Those people obviously thought it was great. You read their random comments, and it's all DA:O was awesome! Yeah dude, Awesome!

[Josef bugman3]

Evidence of both Gentlemen, can you provide support for your claims Mr Prazision? Is there a large amount of people such as yourself who think that DA2 will suck? If you can find them post them.

And whilst I agree with your point about disengaging when the hate gets too high Mr Laidlaw (and whilst I myself am excited about the game) can you provide specifics?

And I must note, first you like Origins then you dislike it Mr Prazision... that is a worrying change of heart right there.

Modifié par Josef bugman3, 23 janvier 2011 - 08:51 .

[Mike Laidlaw]

prazision wrote...

Mike Laidlaw wrote...
As to questions regarding "how this game actually plays" I will hold true to what I have said countless times before: Dragon Age Origins, but without the shuffling. It's faster, and your party react quickly to your orders, but the gameplay is essentially the same. And you'll see that first-hand in the future.

So the combat will still rely on numerous encounters with unchallenging low-level generic monsters, rather than, say, a more "set-piece" based approach a la Mass Effect 2?  Because Origins really failed hard with the constant, dull fights every twenty feet.

This is what you call "baiting," prazision. Few things make me disengage from a conversation faster than starting a paragraph with "So..." and then flinging the most negative interpretation of what I've just said at me.

[Mike Laidlaw]

Josef bugman3 wrote...
And whilst I agree with your point about disengaging when the hate gets too high Mr Laidlaw (and whilst I myself am excited about the game) can you provide specifics?

Nope. Just how I perceive human nature. You're correct in that he-said she-said arguments have no basis in fact, and should probably be discounted in general.

[nightcobra]

one question if i may mike, is this pic representative of what we'll see regarding enemy numbers on screen (i'm not saying for every battle but for the bigger battles)?

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 23 janvier 2011 - 09:02 .

[Josef bugman3]

I guess that is always a problem when it comes to viewing silence on an issue in a measurable way.

Well no matter, the least I can say is that I am thouroughly looking forward to DA2. Also, it is very brave and foolhardy of you to actually bother turning up in the community like this.

Oh yes, and before I forget, a random question I have been meaning to ask but... will there be a chance to take part in some spy games?

Modifié par Josef bugman3, 23 janvier 2011 - 09:04 .

[In Exile]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

This is what you call "baiting," prazision. Few things make me disengage from a conversation faster than starting a paragraph with "So..." and then flinging the most negative interpretation of what I've just said at me.

This is totally unrelated to that post of yours Mike, but it just occured to me - one of the things you mentioned a while back (and based on the released screens, are well on the way to delivering) is more information on how precisely damage & effects are calculated re: our skills.

On that note, are there plans for either the manual itself, or some associated pdf, to really get into the details of the damage calculations for those of us that are really interested in it?

[nightcobra]

just found another interview



this time with gaider regarding romances



http://www.gamezone....-game_romances/



i'll put it in the OP

[Liablecocksman]

GZ: Last year when I was here for Dragon Age: Origins, nobody knew that Dragon Age II was in production. Do you already have stories, ideas in your head for Dragon Age III? Knowing that Dragon Age II is going to be done within the next 3-6 months?

This is an interview from today.

Modifié par Liablecocksman, 23 janvier 2011 - 09:13 .

[Josef bugman3]

Technically it is 3 months; January, Febuary, March.

Its just that one of them is halfway finished, another is the shortest in the year and the game comes out at the beginning of the other.

Modifié par Josef bugman3, 23 janvier 2011 - 09:15 .

[Mike Laidlaw]

Josef bugman3 wrote...
Also, it is very brave and foolhardy of you to actually bother turning up in the community like this.

Every so often someone sends me a PM thanking me for taking the time or makes note of something I've said in another post that helps the overall clarity. Absolutely makes it worthwhile.

In general, I take anything hostile as more of a general frustration/malaise that's being directed at me simply because I have a face and a name. And becuase Epler and Hanlon are adorable, and thus immune.

To generalize (again), the two main complaints I see about DA II are either "we don't know enough!" or "This isn't the game I was hoping you would make!" As to the first, we will continue to rectify that situation, especially in February. As to the latter, while I understand the desire to see a more hardcore, more realistic, more-fiddly-stats experience, that's not the game we are making. We could have. Trust me, my systems guys were more than up to the task, but there comes a point where, in my opinion, some complexity is just there for complexity's sake.

As I've noted before, the general principle behind DA II was to take the Origins experience and achieve three goals:

1) Make combat responsive.

No more shuffling into position or sitting around waiting for your character to follow up after a shield bash.

2) Bring the classes into parity.

In a world where mages can lob balls of exploding fire using only their will, it was dischordant to have warriors and rogues who moved slowly and carefully. We could have absolutely addressed this by changing mages to make them more realistic, but we chose to instead give Warriors and Rogues more personality, since it added more visual flair to the game, and created a stronger identity for each class.

3) Smooth out unnecessarily convoluted mechanics, and create an experience that was less daunting for people new to Dragon Age, or new to RPGs in general.

If there's one thing I firmly believe, it's that there are a LOT more people able and ready to play fantasy RPGs than realize it, and I have always believed that opening a game with a big wall of stats is the wrong way to make a game feel welcoming.

I liken it to the time I sat down with my inlaws to learn how to play bridge. They didn't teach me how to play, or the rules, they started with "how you should evaluate your hand so you can bid." That didn't work for me at all, as it gave me a confusing rule structure with no context. I was supposed to place a bid on how well my hand would do at a game I did not know how to play. That stuck with me, and so one of the things we set out to do was create a more engaging opening; hence the exaggerated portion of Varric's story in which your goals are, quite simply, to kill things.

But like Varric's story, there's more going on than just mauling through darkspawn. Stats are still there. Talent and spell trees are still there. Enchantment? Enchantment! Crafting is no longer about fiddly stacks of elfroot and is more about exploration and discovery. Character progression (talents) is no longer proscribed in terms of order, you have significantly more control over your character's development than you did before. Tactics are still there, and, get this, you don't have to spend points to unlock them; they just do as you gain levels*. Oh, and you'll be hearing more about this shortly, but spell combos have been replaced by a system that's far more robust and includes all three classes.

Overall, I'm very pleased with how DA II has come together. There will always be people who take a demented glee in informing the world that it's horrible, or that it will be, or that the marketing is horrible or any number of complaints, but at the end of the day, I participated in a product I'm proud to have my name on, and that's what, to me, really matters.

[Legion 2.5]

Mike Laidlaw wrote...

Josef bugman3 wrote...
Also, it is very brave and foolhardy of you to actually bother turning up in the community like this.

Every so often someone sends me a PM thanking me for taking the time or makes note of something I've said in another post that helps the overall clarity. Absolutely makes it worthwhile.

In general, I take anything hostile as more of a general frustration/malaise that's being directed at me simply because I have a face and a name. And becuase Epler and Hanlon are adorable, and thus immune.

To generalize (again), the two main complaints I see about DA II are either "we don't know enough!" or "This isn't the game I was hoping you would make!" As to the first, we will continue to rectify that situation, especially in February. As to the latter, while I understand the desire to see a more hardcore, more realistic, more-fiddly-stats experience, that's not the game we are making. We could have. Trust me, my systems guys were more than up to the task, but there comes a point where, in my opinion, some complexity is just there for complexity's sake.

As I've noted before, the general principle behind DA II was to take the Origins experience and achieve three goals:

1) Make combat responsive.

No more shuffling into position or sitting around waiting for your character to follow up after a shield bash.

2) Bring the classes into parity.

In a world where mages can lob balls of exploding fire using only their will, it was dischordant to have warriors and rogues who moved slowly and carefully. We could have absolutely addressed this by changing mages to make them more realistic, but we chose to instead give Warriors and Rogues more personality, since it added more visual flair to the game, and created a stronger identity for each class.

3) Smooth out unnecessarily convoluted mechanics, and create an experience that was less daunting for people new to Dragon Age, or new to RPGs in general.

If there's one thing I firmly believe, it's that there are a LOT more people able and ready to play fantasy RPGs than realize it, and I have always believed that opening a game with a big wall of stats is the wrong way to make a game feel welcoming.

I liken it to the time I sat down with my inlaws to learn how to play bridge. They didn't teach me how to play, or the rules, they started with "how you should evaluate your hand so you can bid." That didn't work for me at all, as it gave me a confusing rule structure with no context. I was supposed to place a bid on how well my hand would do at a game I did not know how to play. That stuck with me, and so one of the things we set out to do was create a more engaging opening; hence the exaggerated portion of Varric's story in which your goals are, quite simply, to kill things.

But like Varric's story, there's more going on than just mauling through darkspawn. Stats are still there. Talent and spell trees are still there. Enchantment? Enchantment! Crafting is no longer about fiddly stacks of elfroot and is more about exploration and discovery. Character progression (talents) is no longer proscribed in terms of order, you have significantly more control over your character's development than you did before. Tactics are still there, and, get this, you don't have to spend points to unlock them; they just do as you gain levels*. Oh, and you'll be hearing more about this shortly, but spell combos have been replaced by a system that's far more robust and includes all three classes.

Overall, I'm very pleased with how DA II has come together. There will always be people who take a demented glee in informing the world that it's horrible, or that it will be, or that the marketing is horrible or any number of complaints, but at the end of the day, I participated in a product I'm proud to have my name on, and that's what, to me, really matters.

I'm glad to think that the game is very well put together.  I pre-ordered and I am getting it no matter what happens.