950 réponses à ce sujet

[KLUME777]

Forget it...

Modifié par KLUME777, 05 février 2011 - 04:18 .

[TheRevanchist]

Foxvos wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

Well ladies I'll tell ya...the gameing audience mainly is men. Not just men either...big strong manly men who need to be reminded they can play as big strong manly men as offten as possible in order to remind themselves they are big strong manly men and that theres no way a woman is capable of doing the job of their big strong manly man or else they would feel less like big strong manly men.

Everytime somebody says big strong manly man
I think of Gaston from Beauty and the Beast.

...

Good...then the message was delivered as intended.

[tigrina]

@Stanley: Can you maybe tell us how she sounds compared to femShep? (as we already know she is not the same VO).

[Ninotchka]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Ninotchka wrote...
We are still at about the 'rational' level of tizzy about an issue that's tizzyworthy.

As long as the tizzy is about gender politics and marketing, i can not participate in this thread. If we're still talking about LadyHawke voice acting and how awesome she is, then I can. Sorry, kind of a resolution this year.

Alrightey then.

One question though, Stan, and I understand you're not permitted to reveal female Hawke's VA, but who does her voice remind you of? Any famous female voices out there who sound similar to female Hawke?

[Foxvos]

kylecouch wrote...

Foxvos wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

Well ladies I'll tell ya...the gameing audience mainly is men. Not just men either...big strong manly men who need to be reminded they can play as big strong manly men as offten as possible in order to remind themselves they are big strong manly men and that theres no way a woman is capable of doing the job of their big strong manly man or else they would feel less like big strong manly men.

Everytime somebody says big strong manly man
I think of Gaston from Beauty and the Beast.

...

Good...then the message was delivered as intended.

But aren't you staring at a guy's backside for most of the game?

Modifié par Foxvos, 05 février 2011 - 04:19 .

[TheRevanchist]

Foxvos wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

Foxvos wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

Well ladies I'll tell ya...the gameing audience mainly is men. Not just men either...big strong manly men who need to be reminded they can play as big strong manly men as offten as possible in order to remind themselves they are big strong manly men and that theres no way a woman is capable of doing the job of their big strong manly man or else they would feel less like big strong manly men.

Everytime somebody says big strong manly man
I think of Gaston from Beauty and the Beast.

...

Good...then the message was delivered as intended.

But aren't you staring at a guy's backside for most of the game?

Aaah but you see...thats the thing...they are too bust being big strong manly men choping hurlocks in half by the millions to stare at their big strong manly mans ass. Meanwhile in between Hurlock encounters they pause the game in order to make sure they eat their hourly ration of four dozen eggs in order to maintain their big strong manly manness.

[raziel3080]

Foxvos wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

Foxvos wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

Well ladies I'll tell ya...the gameing audience mainly is men. Not just men either...big strong manly men who need to be reminded they can play as big strong manly men as offten as possible in order to remind themselves they are big strong manly men and that theres no way a woman is capable of doing the job of their big strong manly man or else they would feel less like big strong manly men.

Everytime somebody says big strong manly man
I think of Gaston from Beauty and the Beast.

...

Good...then the message was delivered as intended.

But aren't you staring at a guy's backside for most of the game?

Yeah, we are... that's why every now and then( or 5 times during origins), I play woman...so i can 'admire' her bakside for awhile. 

@ kylecouch : ROTFLMAO!

Modifié par raziel3080, 05 février 2011 - 04:26 .

[Apollo Starflare]

Seems to me people are remarkably calm and polite when discussing this topic, considering how passionate some of us are about it, compared to other topics that cause a stir around here.



Considering the two characters I most associated with Jade Empire through it's marketing were Death's Hand and Furious Ming I'd be quite surprised if giving 'face' time to Lotus Blossom was the reason it didn't meet sales expectations or something.



It's perhaps important to note that while Bioware's marketing of it's female protagonists is pretty shocking lately, the rest of the games industry isn't much better. It is definitely an industry wide problem, one that is very sad to see present in this day and age. I'll be following the new Tomb Raider's marketing with great interest to see if they actually do take away from her sexuality somewhat and sell her more as an actual heroine and person.



I can only think that Bioware's marketing team is using the ME approach to marketing DA2 due to ME's financial success and the way it's helped get that franchises name out into the world in such a big way. It really makes me question whether the focus is still on 'Thedas' or if it's not now on Hawke, in the same way the focus was on Shepard. If the focus was still the fantasy world itself then why create and market one face to such a degree? Plus there is the likelihood that the ending of DA2 will leave a few big plot hooks dangling for a direct sequel.

[yoshibb]

Merci357 wrote...

yoshibb wrote...

That's an interesting resolution 

In all seriousness, if I ever had a chance to, I would definitely like to have conversation about gender politics in marketing with someone in the business, particularly someone who markets games that are both male and female oriented. It really doesn't effect me too much. I know that I'll get great female characters from Bioware games. But I do feel like it is limiting Bioware's overall market for continuing in this way.

Perhaps, there's more research that I'm not aware of. Like a game that totally bombed because the company marketed both protagonists.  

Well, there are games that did not that well - and had a female lead. Mirror's Edge comes to mind. Even though a possible sequel to that one is still up in the air, afaik - and I've no idea if Faith was the reason ME did somewhat poorly. On the other hand, there are dozens of games that bombed, and had the typical male lead. Since there are movies (of any possible genre) that did well with a female lead, why should games be any different?
*Edit* And, in BioWare's case, we aren't even talking about a female lead, "just" a co-lead.

Was mirror's edge specifically marketed towards females or was it just a female lead? The reason I ask is because a lot of games with female don't exactly have a particular hook for females. Would ME be all that different if you swapped a male with the female lead. Then there are other female lead games like Lara Croft which just market towards males anyway. 

Like I said, there really haven't been many games for me that I can say, this is a strong female lead. Whereas, Bioware's games have that, but they're not really showing it off.

[BurtonSD]

Stanley Woo wrote...

Ninotchka wrote...
We are still at about the 'rational' level of tizzy about an issue that's tizzyworthy.

As long as the tizzy is about gender politics and marketing, i can not participate in this thread. If we're still talking about LadyHawke voice acting and how awesome she is, then I can. Sorry, kind of a resolution this year.

Not much to talk about when we having to talk about. Well... besides complaining about it I suppose. <_<

[Collider]

Was mirror's edge specifically marketed towards females or was it just a female lead? The reason I ask is because a lot of games with female don't exactly have a particular hook for females. Would ME be all that different if you swapped a male with the female lead. Then there are other female lead games like Lara Croft which just market towards males anyway.

Like I said, there really haven't been many games for me that I can say, this is a strong female lead. Whereas, Bioware's games have that, but they're not really showing it off.

A lot of the games specifically targeted towards female players are basically gimmicks and of low quality. <_<

[Foxvos]

We could all compile a list of what we think F!Hawke will sound like from what he heard from other people.



...

Or we could "riot" some more.

[Foxvos]

Collider wrote...

Was mirror's edge specifically marketed towards females or was it just a female lead? The reason I ask is because a lot of games with female don't exactly have a particular hook for females. Would ME be all that different if you swapped a male with the female lead. Then there are other female lead games like Lara Croft which just market towards males anyway.

Like I said, there really haven't been many games for me that I can say, this is a strong female lead. Whereas, Bioware's games have that, but they're not really showing it off.

A lot of the games specifically targeted towards female players are basically gimmicks and of low quality. <_<

Seriously
Bioware you did amazing with Fem Shepherd. I wanna go out on a limb and say that it was probably a revolutionary female character.
I mean I cannot even name any other space marine who is female and kick ass.
Samus does not count anymore because of the awful new game out.

Bioware you make really awesome female characters show eemmm offf.

[tigrina]

Foxvos wrote...

We could all compile a list of what we think F!Hawke will sound like from what he heard from other people.

...
Or we could "riot" some more.

I'm all for the list.

And this topic of gender equality in games and marketing  is maybe more of a general BW discussion than a DA2 one. Or at least also with ME. Maybe we will be heard for future installments. One can hope

[TheRevanchist]

 Men wish to be Gaston...hence the marketing...

Modifié par kylecouch, 05 février 2011 - 04:37 .

[raziel3080]

Foxvos wrote...

Collider wrote...

Was mirror's edge specifically marketed towards females or was it just a female lead? The reason I ask is because a lot of games with female don't exactly have a particular hook for females. Would ME be all that different if you swapped a male with the female lead. Then there are other female lead games like Lara Croft which just market towards males anyway.

Like I said, there really haven't been many games for me that I can say, this is a strong female lead. Whereas, Bioware's games have that, but they're not really showing it off.

A lot of the games specifically targeted towards female players are basically gimmicks and of low quality. <_<

Seriously
Bioware you did amazing with Fem Shepherd. I wanna go out on a limb and say that it was probably a revolutionary female character.
I mean I cannot even name any other space marine who is female and kick ass.
Samus does not count anymore because of the awful new game out.

Bioware you make really awesome female characters show eemmm offf.

In gaming....NO
In movies and literature... not since Ripley in the alien movies....

[namedforthemoon]

kylecouch wrote...

 Men wish to be Gaston...hence the marketing...

This is the second thread in the DA2 forums that feature that video clip... The first being the Varric thread.

We need a Mulan clip to show how girls can kick ass, too.

[Merci357]

yoshibb wrote...
Was mirror's edge specifically marketed
towards females or was it just a female lead? The reason I ask is
because a lot of games with female don't exactly have a particular hook
for females. Would ME be all that different if you swapped a male with
the female lead. Then there are other female lead games like Lara Croft
which just market towards males anyway. 

Like I said, there
really haven't been many games for me that I can say, this is a strong
female lead. Whereas, Bioware's games have that, but they're not really
showing it off.

Well, it wasn't marketed towards
females, I guess - but it's a very unique game, and wasn't hiding the
fact that you play as a female. Just watch the short trailer if you want to form your own opinion.

[RosaAquafire]

This is honestly just frustrating :/

Girls can't feel excluded and infuriated by the fact that the female character is literally being hidden to sell the game to Action Jacksons without being PMS internet warriors?

Times like this, I disagree with my own sig.

I'd feel a lot better if the reaction were "we know this sucks for you guys, but we trust our marketting department to sell our game, trust that we're doing what we can and we'll work towards being able to show the lady protagonist someday." Instead, it always feels so ... "Oh, god, here come the girls, storming the gates and throwing tampons again."

[namedforthemoon]

RosaAquafire wrote...

This is honestly just frustrating :/
Girls can't feel excluded and infuriated by the fact that the female character is literally being hidden to sell the game to Action Jacksons without being PMS internet warriors?
Times like this, I disagree with my own sig.
I'd feel a lot better if the reaction were "we know this sucks for you guys, but we trust our marketting department to sell our game, trust that we're doing what we can and we'll work towards being able to show the lady protagonist someday." Instead, it always feels so ... "Oh, god, here come the girls, storming the gates and throwing tampons again."

ROFL!

It does tend to feel that way. As I understand it, the female writers are referred to as "The Estrogen Brigade" or something to that effect.

[tigrina]

We might still hear from her soon. I haven't given up yet. It is a little voice in my head* telling me so.

/not really, but I did get a hint that the chance is still there

Modifié par tigrina, 05 février 2011 - 04:45 .

[TheRevanchist]

namedforthemoon wrote...

kylecouch wrote...

 Men wish to be Gaston...hence the marketing...

This is the second thread in the DA2 forums that feature that video clip... The first being the Varric thread.

We need a Mulan clip to show how girls can kick ass, too.

But but but...then that would destroy the confidence of all the big strong strong manly men who play video games in order to be big strong manly men that chop Hurlocks in half by the millions while eating four dozen eggs and totaly NOT stareing at their manly mans ass while playing their big strong manly man. IF they ever find out that the danzel in distress can kick as much ass as their big strong manly men then they cease to be the big strong manly man that never shows emotion and chops Hurlocks in half by the millions!

[Collider]

Even with Shepard, content seemed to be mostly tailored to male players/male Shepard.

[tigrina]

Oh I did like Fanny and how the guy fell in love with her when he found out she didn't need that much of a rescue.



/wonders who will spot the reference

[Stanley Woo]

And with that, this "lady Hawke voice acting" thread is done. Thank you.



end of line.