50 réponses à ce sujet

[TheButterflyEffect]

 So are we going to get a better conclusion to the Kaidan/Ashely romances in ME3? I really hope so, because the way it was done in ME2 was really upsetting and unsatisfying.

Especially Kaidan's dumb email where he puts salt in your wounds by mentioning the new girlfriend. Ugh that was just horrid. Could have been handled so much better than that.

Maybe next time Shepard suffocates in space he/she will just be sure to stay dead if that makes them happier. Hmph.

Modifié par TheButterflyEffect, 24 janvier 2011 - 01:39 .

[Gemini1179]

I hope for all the Ash/kaiden fans that there is. I'm not in that group but it desn't mean that I don't think it should be done.

[Dexi]

Kaidan and Ash suck. Get over it.

[lawp79]

I really, really hope that either of the vs dont get screwed over in mass effect 3. They are both great characters and would personally pick them over any of the me2 lot.

[squirtle_]

Dexi wrote...

Kaidan and Ash suck. Get over it.

[ShepardOsiris]

I may be in the minority, but I liked Ashley, and I was horribly depressed how they handled her and obviously Kaidan if he was your choice, in ME 2. That said, I do really want them back in a deeper and meaningful way in ME 3, but at the same time, Bioware screwed up the relationship so bad, It's kind of beyond fixing, or very close to it.

For me, it was like going up to tell someone you have to do something extremely important, to save untold numbers of people, and you really need that person with you, and then having them tell you to go to hell over some BS that you really had no control over. Hard to move past that later on. It would take an extremely strong effort by Bioware with the characters to make things right in ME 3.

[TheButterflyEffect]

I agree that they screwed it up with that crap on Horizon really bad... i'm happy you feel the same way.

[Getorex]

ShepardOsiris wrote...

I may be in the minority, but I liked Ashley, and I was horribly depressed how they handled her and obviously Kaidan if he was your choice, in ME 2. That said, I do really want them back in a deeper and meaningful way in ME 3, but at the same time, Bioware screwed up the relationship so bad, It's kind of beyond fixing, or very close to it.

For me, it was like going up to tell someone you have to do something extremely important, to save untold numbers of people, and you really need that person with you, and then having them tell you to go to hell over some BS that you really had no control over. Hard to move past that later on. It would take an extremely strong effort by Bioware with the characters to make things right in ME 3.

Now now...if you played your cards right, you get a little email message after that little bit of cattiness apologizing for the bad behavior and saying it's all good. Thus that little email promises to allow you to bed Ashley again come ME3! Of course, you had to have chosen her in ME1 AND remained faithful up to that little fight...

I assume something similar concerning Kaiden for those who cannot accept the reality of a male Shep and played as a chick fantasy >:-)

Modifié par Getorex, 24 janvier 2011 - 02:24 .

[Babli]

Dexi wrote...

Kaidan and Ash suck. Get over it.

Yeah, because you dont get to see their T&A for a whole Mass Effect 2, they suck.
If something sucks, its dialogue on Horizon.

LotSB managed to "repair" unnatural change of Liara´s character at least a bit, so now VS needs their DLC.

[rma2110]

I am a Kaidan and Ashley fan, and I would be greatly disappointed if we don't get a conclusion. I feel like Kai and Ash fans have been given the short stick with horizon and Liara's "Shadow Broker" DLC was just rubbing salt in the wound.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed LoTSB and I am happy for the Liara fans. I just want to know when it'll be our turn?

Edit: Let's face it: the reason some us feel shafted is because we have been.

Modifié par rma2110, 24 janvier 2011 - 02:42 .

[ShepardOsiris]

Getorex wrote...

Now now...if you played your cards right, you get a little email message after that little bit of cattiness apologizing for the bad behavior and saying it's all good. Thus that little email promises to allow you to bed Ashley again come ME3! Of course, you had to have chosen her in ME1 AND remained faithful up to that little fight...

I assume something similar concerning Kaiden for those who cannot accept the reality of a male Shep and played as a chick fantasy >:-)

   Yeah, I'm well aware of the half ***ed email.  I'm not saying the door isn't open for a return of some sort, but I'm saying in my view, from a character and story perspective, it's a near completely busted relationship.   Every other LI, has a deeper connection now, no matter your choice, they were there and they stood by you when it counted.  Even Liara had a damned good reason and you got a chance to work through it.  

   Bioware wrecked that for Ashley and Kaidan. They took away the option for them to be there for your Shepard through thick and thin.  There is still atleast a chance left to fix it, and even if they just reunite you with them, on some levels it's still a realistic relationship to some degree, as many people that aren't exactly perfect for one another stay together.  However for people that liked Ashley or Kaidan, right now anyway, it seems almost impossible for your Shepard to have a relationship with those characters on the same level as all the other LIs in the series. 

[Dexi]

Brodyaha wrote...
If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck... 
There's a reason most people think they're bad characters.

The minority, the people who like them, like them for the chars they COULD be, that's why they wanna see a DLC, to see them fixed and how they COULD be, but they don't like what the characters really ARE.

As they are now, they suck. Accept it or not, start all sorts of discussions, truth's still there. 

Modifié par Dexi, 24 janvier 2011 - 02:49 .

[Aslanasadi]

Brodyaha wrote...

TheButterflyEffect wrote...
So are we going to get a better conclusion to the Kaidan/Ashely romances in ME3? I really hope so, because the way it was done in ME2 was really upsetting and unsatisfying.
Especially Kaidan's dumb email where he puts salt in your wounds by mentioning the new girlfriend. Ugh that was just horrid. Could have been handled so much better than that.
Maybe next time Shepard suffocates in space he/she will just be sure to stay dead if that makes them happier. Hmph.

Many people hope for a better conclusion in ME3 as well.
Although I disagree about the "new girlfriend;"  he just went for drinks to help get over his grief, that doesn't mean he's in a serious relationship.
If you want to see them in DLC, there's a wishlist thread in the Spoilers Warning forum, or you can click on my sig bar--it links to the DLC group, which anybody can join.

Dexi wrote...

Kaidan and Ash suck. Get over it.

No.

If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.
Also, many fans have been waiting over a year to see their favourite characters, have politely asked as to why we haven't seen them, and some fans feel shafted.  Many of us are willing to pay for DLC featuring these characters in a fairly large role.

This
I think there is nothing for me to add...

[Babli]

Dexi wrote...

Brodyaha wrote...
If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck... 
There's a reason most people think they're bad characters.

The minority, the people who like them, like them for the chars they COULD be, that's why they wanna see a DLC, to see them fixed and how they COULD be, but they don't like what the characters really ARE.

As they are now, they suck. Accept it or not, start all sorts of discussions, truth's still there. 

Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

[habitat 67]

TheButterflyEffect wrote...

 So are we going to get a better conclusion to the Kaidan/Ashely romances in ME3? I really hope so, because the way it was done in ME2 was really upsetting and unsatisfying.

Especially Kaidan's dumb email where he puts salt in your wounds by mentioning the new girlfriend. Ugh that was just horrid. Could have been handled so much better than that.

Maybe next time Shepard suffocates in space he/she will just be sure to stay dead if that makes them happier. Hmph.

They make them jerks on purpose so you don't get as choked up in ME3 when the surviving Virmirer explodes.
BOOM!

[Zubie]

Dexi wrote...

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck... 
There's a reason most people think they're bad characters.

The minority, the people who like them, like them for the chars they COULD be, that's why they wanna see a DLC, to see them fixed and how they COULD be, but they don't like what the characters really ARE.

As they are now, they suck. Accept it or not, start all sorts of discussions, truth's still there. 

wat

[Dexi]

Babli wrote...

Dexi wrote...

Brodyaha wrote...
If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck... 
There's a reason most people think they're bad characters.

The minority, the people who like them, like them for the chars they COULD be, that's why they wanna see a DLC, to see them fixed and how they COULD be, but they don't like what the characters really ARE.

As they are now, they suck. Accept it or not, start all sorts of discussions, truth's still there. 

Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

Funny quote, but your opinion of my opinion being just... my opinion, well, thats just... like, your opinion, man  

Modifié par Dexi, 24 janvier 2011 - 03:00 .

[Getorex]

Brodyaha wrote...

TheButterflyEffect wrote...
So are we going to get a better conclusion to the Kaidan/Ashely romances in ME3? I really hope so, because the way it was done in ME2 was really upsetting and unsatisfying.
Especially Kaidan's dumb email where he puts salt in your wounds by mentioning the new girlfriend. Ugh that was just horrid. Could have been handled so much better than that.
Maybe next time Shepard suffocates in space he/she will just be sure to stay dead if that makes them happier. Hmph.

Many people hope for a better conclusion in ME3 as well.
Although I disagree about the "new girlfriend;"  he just went for drinks to help get over his grief, that doesn't mean he's in a serious relationship.
If you want to see them in DLC, there's a wishlist thread in the Spoilers Warning forum, or you can click on my sig bar--it links to the DLC group, which anybody can join.

Dexi wrote...

Kaidan and Ash suck. Get over it.

No.

If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.
Also, many fans have been waiting over a year to see their favourite characters, have politely asked as to why we haven't seen them, and some fans feel shafted.  Many of us are willing to pay for DLC featuring these characters in a fairly large role.

I would certainly pay for the DLC on that, so long as it is of the quality and size of LotSB. The problem here is that Bioware is likely at full throttle working on ME3 so that the peeps available to do such a DLC may be short of time AND unfunded to do so. We can HOPE that Bioware will make good the statement that there will be a few DLCs to bridge the gap between ME2 and the release of ME3 but I am no holding my breath on that.

[Babli]

Dexi wrote...

Babli wrote...

Dexi wrote...

Brodyaha wrote...
If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck... 
There's a reason most people think they're bad characters.

The minority, the people who like them, like them for the chars they COULD be, that's why they wanna see a DLC, to see them fixed and how they COULD be, but they don't like what the characters really ARE.

As they are now, they suck. Accept it or not, start all sorts of discussions, truth's still there. 

Yeah, well, that's just, like, your opinion, man.

Funny quote, but your opinion of my opinion being just... my opinion, well, thats just... like, your opinion, man  

But your opinion about my opinion about your opinion... nevermind
I think that many people didnt even tried to know these characters better. For example, I didnt like Ash until my 5th playtrough where I romanced her and saw that there is a lot under the surface. Same goes for Kaidan.
They are not bad characters. They just dont have so much fanservice like...lets say Miranda and are not so cool like Garrus or Thane. But that doesnt make them a bad characters, I find them to be the most believable(well, in ME1). Horizon was just writting fail.

Modifié par Babli, 24 janvier 2011 - 03:20 .

[Getorex]

ShepardOsiris wrote...

Getorex wrote...

Now now...if you played your cards right, you get a little email message after that little bit of cattiness apologizing for the bad behavior and saying it's all good. Thus that little email promises to allow you to bed Ashley again come ME3! Of course, you had to have chosen her in ME1 AND remained faithful up to that little fight...

I assume something similar concerning Kaiden for those who cannot accept the reality of a male Shep and played as a chick fantasy >:-)

   Yeah, I'm well aware of the half ***ed email.  I'm not saying the door isn't open for a return of some sort, but I'm saying in my view, from a character and story perspective, it's a near completely busted relationship.   Every other LI, has a deeper connection now, no matter your choice, they were there and they stood by you when it counted.  Even Liara had a damned good reason and you got a chance to work through it.  

   Bioware wrecked that for Ashley and Kaidan. They took away the option for them to be there for your Shepard through thick and thin.  There is still atleast a chance left to fix it, and even if they just reunite you with them, on some levels it's still a realistic relationship to some degree, as many people that aren't exactly perfect for one another stay together.  However for people that liked Ashley or Kaidan, right now anyway, it seems almost impossible for your Shepard to have a relationship with those characters on the same level as all the other LIs in the series. 

I was being (halfway) facetious. The thing is, I am not expecting some oscar-worthy performance from characters in a video game. A LOT of dialog in the game is hackneyed and forced (but some small bits here and there are fine). See, sure I was bent about how the writers had Ash behave on Horizon. Hell, I was bent about Garrus and a series of other characters before that all UNNATURALLY acting before the miraculous re-appearance of a dead Shepard! Garrus was all "ho-hum" as if he sees dead friends reappearing every day. Tali barely registered surprise at your reanimation. Liara...OK, you can give her SOME excuse since she handed your crispy carcass over to Cerberus and possibly had SOME inkling of what the deal was. Ash, your LI (presumably, or at least a trusted friend/colleague) comes forward and...shakes your hand and is pretty blase about your resurrection. So yeah, on THAT aspect I was already kinked out of true so the infantile anger and rejection of Horizon was just lemon juice on the papercut - but that email washed SOME of the lemon juice away.

There are all sorts of things concerning plot and character development/response/dialog that one can fault here so I just cannot get way too off kink because of the one. Again, I am not expecting "The King's Speech" or "Up in the Air" dialog levels here so water on a (dampened) duck for me.

[lazuli]

If they were aliens they would probably be more popular. If Garrus were a human, he'd be the whiny one, not Kaidan.

[Fiery Phoenix]

Dexi wrote...

Brodyaha wrote...
If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck... 
There's a reason most people think they're bad characters.

The minority, the people who like them, like them for the chars they COULD be, that's why they wanna see a DLC, to see them fixed and how they COULD be, but they don't like what the characters really ARE.

As they are now, they suck. Accept it or not, start all sorts of discussions, truth's still there. 

I literally facepalmed at this.

Modifié par Fiery Phoenix, 24 janvier 2011 - 03:30 .

[Getorex]

Dexi wrote...

Brodyaha wrote...
If you go into the Kaidan and Ashley threads, there are all sorts of discussions as to the reasons why they do not suck.

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck... 
There's a reason most people think they're bad characters.

The minority, the people who like them, like them for the chars they COULD be, that's why they wanna see a DLC, to see them fixed and how they COULD be, but they don't like what the characters really ARE.

As they are now, they suck. Accept it or not, start all sorts of discussions, truth's still there. 

Well, don't go putting the why's of my likes of dislikes into some generic bin you have constructed for yourself.

I liked Ash in spite of what you say. I liked her look (that look in real females does me in big time) and I tended to like her in spite of her bringing a hint of religion into sh*t (no thanks!). As for Kaiden, my first few plays of ME1 saw me having no particular like or dislike of Kaiden. He, to me, was just blah. I hated having to choose to get him killed on Virmire but he was still mainly blah to me. Had nothing to do with what I may have imagined he COULD have been (as I recall, I didn't imagine him being anything...he was a game cartoon character). On my last playthrough I decided to chat him up a bit more and actually kind of liked the character (but I still killed him on Virmire...his cartoon butt is a hairy man butt while Ash's is a sweet, perfectly shaped female cartoon butt. There's no contest between butts, be they cartoon or real in that regard). I felt some sympathy for his character after that and saw him as a BIT more of a real character rather than a cardboard cutout.

It is as simple as that. Ash was fine by me as she was. Liara wasn't actually fleshed out much more than Ash was...but I guess because she had blue skin, a calamari on her head, and interesting tattoos that makes her a better character? C'mon! Her response to killing mommy was every bit as shallow and wooden as everyone's response to a resurrected Shepard in ME2! Ho-hum and, "Yeah, I'm bummed. Did I hear there's donuts in the galley?"

[Estelindis]

TheButterflyEffect wrote...

So are we going to get a better conclusion to the Kaidan/Ashely romances in ME3? I really hope so

I hope so too.  Bioware has said in the past that they regard all romances as equal.  This may be a bit hard for us to believe, given what we've seen so far, but we still have reason to hope.  Feel free to drop by the discussion threads in the character forum for more in-depth discussion of their possible futures in ME3 (or the Ash/Kai DLC thread in the spoiler forum).

Dexi wrote...

All sorts of discussions as to the reasons why VS don't suck implies that the majority of people think they suck.

No - it implies that those who don't like the characters see no problem in being offensive about them, which causes fans to then respond to defend the characters.  You can be sure that this reaction also occurs when people post about disliking, say, Tali.  But she's one of the most popular characters out there.  Ultimately, I don't see why we can't just accept that different people like different things and get along.

(Just for the sake of being clear, I don't mean that criticising a character, or the way a character is written, is off-limits.  But simply saying "X sucks" isn't going to get anyone anywhere.  Why do you feel X doesn't measure up?  What would you have done better?  Criticism can lead to a very fruitful discussion if we allow it to do so.)

Modifié par Estelindis, 24 janvier 2011 - 04:53 .