172 réponses à ce sujet

[ZLurps]

rrp wrote...

ZLurps the content filter would be optional so you wouldn't lose the environment that makes it dark and immoral you just would not turn the content filter on. i don't mind sacrificing the dark and immoral parts in the game and even Uszi could still spend 297+ hours in Chora's den with a content filter option in Mass Effect.

It's just my opinion that those dancers are big part of what makes what the place is visible to players. Mercenaries get drunk (or high) watch dancers, look for cheap and fast love because that is likely all that they are going to get during their most likely short life and so on.

[rrp]

sth128 what your saying is minority opinion does not matter or have any weight? i am not asking bioware to hide their creation i am just asking to make it optional while still being able to enjoy 99% of their creation.

Modifié par rrp, 26 janvier 2011 - 06:45 .

[ianmcdonald]

So women dancing in provocative outfits in a bar is "immoral" but murdering hundreds of enemies is fine? Cool logic, man.

[sth128]

rrp wrote...

sth128 what your saying is minority opinion does not matter or have any weight? i am not asking bioware to hide their creation i am just asking to make it optional while still being able to enjoy 99% of their creation

A filter by definition is to BLOCK certain parts of the content. When you "block" something, it's hidden.

For example, when you filter water, you block the minerals and chemicals from consumption. When you filter web content (like the Chinese government does) you block free speech and freedom of expression and you HIDE the information that disagree with your view.

You can never enjoy someone else's view 100%. That's just a fact of life. People will always have different opinions and we must learn to accept them. It doesn't mean we have to agree with them. Of course the minority opinion has weight, but Bioware cannot be held to accommodate everyone's wish. If they wanted to, that's their choice. But in general, we go with the majority consensus. That's how society works.

I mean, there's probably a small population of fans who want to see lightsabres in Mass Effect; should Bioware change the game just to accommodate those people? Absolutely not.

Modifié par sth128, 26 janvier 2011 - 06:46 .

[Uszi]

lol dude, read the the back of the box next time

it tells you why it's rated m:
 

Modifié par Uszi, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:08 .

[rrp]

I agree filtering will block content, but the point you are missing is it is OPTIONAL! i am not censoring Bioware or the story for you or for anyone else i am censoring it for me. just like if i set up a web content filter i am not censoring anyone else i am blocking content for myself. a content filter would not change your gameplay it would not change the game it would not change the story it would not change the environments for anyone else a content filter is for the end user or consumer not for a mass of population or for all of the United States it is for one person and you can activate it or you don't have to it is optional. and you never know there may be some easter egg in ME3 that the "small population" of users could use a light saber if they push the right buttons in the right order.

[Uszi]

rrp wrote...

sth128 what your saying is minority opinion
does not matter or have any weight? i am not asking bioware to hide
their creation i am just asking to make it optional while still being
able to enjoy 99% of their creation.

But the majority content of the game series is Chora's den.
And that's the best part!

rrp wrote...

I agree filtering will block content, but the point you are missing is it is OPTIONAL! i am not censoring Bioware or the story for you or for anyone else i am censoring it for me. just like if i set up a web content filter i am not censoring anyone else i am blocking content for myself. a content filter would not change your gameplay it would not change the game it would not change the story it would not change the environments for anyone else a content filter is for the end user or consumer not for a mass of population or for all of the United States it is for one person and you can activate it or you don't have to it is optional. and you never know there may be some easter egg in ME3 that the "small population" of users could use a light saber if they push the right buttons in the right order.

But if the game is about strippers, then you're blocking all of the content.

You're advocating like, putting a big censor bar over the character Charles Foster Kane in Citizen Kane, and bleeping out his dialogue.

Modifié par Uszi, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:01 .

[ZLurps]

rrp:

1. Authors usually wish every one who reads their books read the same material. Say someone who writes about young mans life in Paris during early 1900 wish that everyone understands this character s/he has created. Making stuff "Optional" while may seem nice, is not exactly good solution because readers who read alternative version may not understand at all what drives the character(s) in the novel at first place.

2. Okay this is a game, budget. I guess that people here prefer Bioware using their budget for content in ME games and not additional features like making exotic dancers (who don't show boobies or naked butt at all) and swearing optional.

3. Now, that these dancers don't show nude T&A at all, only way to make this content more optional would be removing them from game. This is slippery slope if anything is. They aren't nude but they are still too offending? You see about the same amount of skin if you watch women beach volley. Or women swimming competition, women posing in underwear adverts.

Edit, attempt to clarify: It's already tamer than things in TV or in other media, or real life if you go to beach... if Bioware choosed this route, where would it end?

Modifié par ZLurps, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:06 .

[Uszi]

ZLurps wrote...

3. Now, that these dancers don't show nude T&A at all

this is my main criticism of the game!
the ESRB warning says "Partial Nudity!"

what a let down! in my 297+ hours of play time I have only seen girls dancing in 1 piece bathing suits.  

Modifié par Uszi, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:05 .

[ZLurps]

Uszi wrote...

ZLurps wrote...

3. Now, that these dancers don't show nude T&A at all

this is my main criticism of the game!
the ESRB warning says "Partial Nudity!"

what a let down! in my 297+ hours of play time I have only seen girls dancing in 1 piece bathing suits.  

Well, but isn't ESBR just great for marketting? 

[Uszi]

ZLurps wrote...

Uszi wrote...

ZLurps wrote...

3. Now, that these dancers don't show nude T&A at all

this is my main criticism of the game!
the ESRB warning says "Partial Nudity!"

what a let down! in my 297+ hours of play time I have only seen girls dancing in 1 piece bathing suits.   [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/sad.png[/smilie]

Well, but isn't ESBR just great for marketting? [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]

i thought that an organization like the esrb would be committed to truth and honesty

not lying to me to get me to watched their pg rated gogo dancers.

Modifié par Uszi, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:10 .

[sth128]

rrp wrote...

I agree filtering will block content, but the point you are missing is it is OPTIONAL! i am not censoring Bioware or the story for you or for anyone else i am censoring it for me. just like if i set up a web content filter i am not censoring anyone else i am blocking content for myself. a content filter would not change your gameplay it would not change the game it would not change the story it would not change the environments for anyone else a content filter is for the end user or consumer not for a mass of population or for all of the United States it is for one person and you can activate it or you don't have to it is optional. and you never know there may be some easter egg in ME3 that the "small population" of users could use a light saber if they push the right buttons in the right order.

So you want Bioware to set up a filter just for YOU? Did D-link (or whichever company your router belongs to) set up your web filter for you? No. Optional or not, it is censorship and you are asking for the ability to censor content for everyone. And how can censorship not change the gameplay, the story, or the environment?

If you censor the dancers in Chora's Den, now you have a very different ENVIRONMENT (with no dancers). The GAMEPLAY element of "sit up" and "lean back" would be gone. And the STORY of Ash telling Kaiden to close his jaw or Tali telling Shepard about dancers in her culture or Liara commenting on Asari exploitation would be erased.

And exactly how should Bioware censor these contents? Just erase those things? So you walk into a silent bar with no conversation and patrons sitting apparently staring at oddly shaped tables? In order to amend these oddities Bioware would have to change the entire scenario. And EA being a company in the profit business will probably ask Bioware to not include the club at all since "you can turn it off anyway and making a new scenario to accommodate the filter costs more money and time". This means the entire game would see dramatic changes in many places.

History is full of examples of censorship destroying artistic vision. One need look no further than the castrated statues of Vatican. The Pope decided the nude statues were "immoral" and so ordered all of them castrated and put in place stone leafs. You are essentially asking Bioware to castrate Mass Effect and put in place a digital leaf.

Modifié par sth128, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:19 .

[ZLurps]

Uszi wrote...

ZLurps wrote...
Well, but isn't ESBR just great for marketting? [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]

i thought that an organization like the esrb would be committed to truth and honesty

not lying to me to get me to watched their pg rated gogo dancers.

Well, to say something serious about this. Isn't it interesting how educated people watch the same content and come into very different conclusion about age rating?

darknoon5 wrote...

Just to clarify, in England ME1 is a 12 and ME2 is a 15. I'm pretty sure in Germany ME2 is a 16+, and in Australia as well.

So ME isn't an 18+ full stop, as some would like to quote, but I agree a content filter isn't really needed. Maybe a language filter if people can't take a bit of swearing but don't mind all the violence, which makes no sense to me.

Edit: I can't quote.

Modifié par ZLurps, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:20 .

[sth128]

ZLurps wrote...

Well, to say something serious about this. Isn't it interesting how educated people watch the same content and come into very different conclusion about age rating?

darknoon5 wrote...

Just to clarify, in England ME1 is a 12 and ME2 is a 15. I'm pretty sure in Germany ME2 is a 16+, and in Australia as well.

So ME isn't an 18+ full stop, as some would like to quote, but I agree a content filter isn't really needed. Maybe a language filter if people can't take a bit of swearing but don't mind all the violence, which makes no sense to me.

In Europe they generally have a greater tolerance of nudity and less tolerance on language and violence.

In North America the general consensus is reversed. Over here apprently violence is good but sex is bad.

[ZLurps]

sth128 wrote...

ZLurps wrote...

Well, to say something serious about this. Isn't it interesting how educated people watch the same content and come into very different conclusion about age rating?

darknoon5 wrote...

Just to clarify, in England ME1 is a 12 and ME2 is a 15. I'm pretty sure in Germany ME2 is a 16+, and in Australia as well.

So ME isn't an 18+ full stop, as some would like to quote, but I agree a content filter isn't really needed. Maybe a language filter if people can't take a bit of swearing but don't mind all the violence, which makes no sense to me.

In Europe they generally have a greater tolerance of nudity and less tolerance on language and violence.

In North America the general consensus is reversed. Over here apprently violence is good but sex is bad.

Oh, I'm aware of that, even though I weren't aware of ratings for this particular game.
I tried to put it there like "food for thought" kind of basis.

Edit: Just took my ME games from shelf and here ME1 is rated for 12+ years old: "Contains moderate violence and one moderate sex scene" ME2 is rated 18+ years old because of violence and swearing.

Modifié par ZLurps, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:31 .

[Phategod1]

rrp wrote...

the reason i bring it up is not becasue of the swearing i think the only curse word in the game was the d-word, i bring it up becasue of the alien dancers. seriously not all, including my wife, want to see that it is an unnessessary addition to the game. not all of us who play video games are pervs

The alien Dancers have clothes on which is something you see in edited for TV R rated movies. I doubt that will be taken out. but by the by you have no problem with shooting aliens in the faces and turning them into little red puddles, but Scantily clad Gyrating women have you in a tither? no offense but let me guess American? 

Modifié par Phategod1, 26 janvier 2011 - 07:27 .

[ianmcdonald]

sth128 wrote...

rrp wrote...

I agree filtering will block content, but the point you are missing is it is OPTIONAL! i am not censoring Bioware or the story for you or for anyone else i am censoring it for me. just like if i set up a web content filter i am not censoring anyone else i am blocking content for myself. a content filter would not change your gameplay it would not change the game it would not change the story it would not change the environments for anyone else a content filter is for the end user or consumer not for a mass of population or for all of the United States it is for one person and you can activate it or you don't have to it is optional. and you never know there may be some easter egg in ME3 that the "small population" of users could use a light saber if they push the right buttons in the right order.

So you want Bioware to set up a filter just for YOU? Did D-link (or whichever company your router belongs to) set up your web filter for you? No. Optional or not, it is censorship and you are asking for the ability to censor content for everyone. And how can censorship not change the gameplay, the story, or the environment?

If you censor the dancers in Chora's Den, now you have a very different ENVIRONMENT (with no dancers). The GAMEPLAY element of "sit up" and "lean back" would be gone. And the STORY of Ash telling Kaiden to close his jaw or Tali telling Shepard about dancers in her culture or Liara commenting on Asari exploitation would be erased.

And exactly how should Bioware censor these contents? Just erase those things? So you walk into a silent bar with no conversation and patrons sitting apparently staring at oddly shaped tables? In order to amend these oddities Bioware would have to change the entire scenario. And EA being a company in the profit business will probably ask Bioware to not include the club at all since "you can turn it off anyway and making a new scenario to accommodate the filter costs more money and time". This means the entire game would see dramatic changes in many places.

History is full of examples of censorship destroying artistic vision. One need look no further than the castrated statues of Rome. The Pope decided the nude statues were "immoral" and so ordered all of them castrated and put in place stone leafs. You are essentially asking Bioware to castrate Mass Effect and put in place a digital leaf.

Bingo. The artists and writers that work on Mass Effect work very hard to create a certain atmosphere and creating a certain type of experience. If people can't handle this type of experience, they probably should be playing the game at all.

Think of it this way: Movies on television are lame because they are edited down for time and "immoral" content and crammed into a different aspect ratio. This is not the way the people working on the film originally intended it to be experienced. Music on the radio sounds like crap because it's compressed almost beyond recognition and all "bad" words have been taken out. This not the way the artist originally intended it to be heard. It's the same with books, art, poetry, stand-up comedy, etc.

[idoless24]

Why would you need a content filter? Its rated M for a reason obviously. If you don't like it, don't buy it or just close your eyes at the "dirty" bits.

[uberdowzen]

rrp wrote...

in the first ME the dancers are optional. ME2 they are thrown in your face and unavoidable. all i am saying is can we make them optional again leave it up to the player. this is one atmosphere i not only avoid in real life, but would also like to avoid in my video games. i apologize for the pervs comment to anyone who takes offense i was merely making a stab at the people who stereotype gamers into being pervs.

They add to the tone. They're meant to make Omega feel dirty. Adding a content filter so that you don't have to see stuff like that is the begining of the long downward slope towards losing artistic merit. Why not add a filter to remove any political ideas you don't agree with or to remove anything which is morally questionable?

[JrayM16]

I don't mind the presence of a content filter, I just won't use it. But I think there is some merit to the arguments that such filters are dangerous. Let's use a hypothetical example. Let's say Bioware puts in a content filter for ME2 which turns off stuff like dancers or swearing or whatever. THey then look at how many people used it and find that 50% of people turned "objectionable" content off. They then decide to not bother with making that content in ME3 cause half their audience isn't going to see it.



This is all hypothetical of course and wouldn't happen that fast but there is a slippery slope danger here.

[Spartas Husky]

I would mind the precense of content filter. Is like asking. I want to play Dead Space without being scary so my son or daughter can play too. A game is made specifically for a certain audience. The audience. You bought it you play it, if those around you dont like it... well there is a reason why they didn't buy it.



I'm sorry but I agree without previous posts. Your point is to ask for a filter which affects the game in a negative way for everyone else just to appease whoever is near you that doesn't like it.

[N0touchi]

They aren't going to make a content filter. New thread.

[rrp]

i don't care if the hypothetical content filter doesn't block the dancers. i just think it should be optional. like in Mass Effect. i dont think i can make a point more clear than this. a content filter should block gore and language. if the dancers are blocked i would not care. but the point i am trying to make is it needs to be an option. and boo to me for being the only one in this thread who thinks so. Opinions matter no matter what they are, if you disagree or agree with them. and my opinion is this i do not like the dancers i dont like to see them i dont like to be forced to see them and to go into that enviroment. you can show a dirty enviroment or even a club enviroment without dancers, it happens in real life? do i need to go into a strip club to see a dirty environment? no! the arguments against a content filter make no sense it is not changing the game for anyone who does not use it, but it is improving the game experience for those who would like one. i may be the only one in this thread but i know i am not the only one in the world otherwise the term would not exist.

[Lumikki]

Yes, but isn't the question more does Mass Effect has enough "bad" content to be filtered in first place. Meaning to something to be worth while there has to be enough "work" for content filter to do. I never notice enough "bad" content in Mass Effect what would justify making content filter option. Don't get me wrong, I'm often asking content filter, when I feel like it's needed. How ever, does Mass Effect really even have need for it?

Argument agaist doesn't make sense? Yes it does if the content need to be change, it means more work for developers. More work means more time and money. So, to have something as option what only few people would ever use, is question waste of developers time and money. What they could use for something what majority really wants.

Of course creating content filter option could also have one other optional effect. It could also allow developers do more "bad" content, because content filter would be there for those, who doens't want to see them.

Modifié par Lumikki, 26 janvier 2011 - 11:25 .

[Spartas Husky]

Lumikki wrote...

Yes, but isn't the question more does Mass Effect has enough "bad" content to be filtered in first place. Meaning to something to be worth while there has to be enough "work" for content filter to do. I never notice enough "bad" content in Mass Effect what would justify making content filter option. Don't get me wrong, I'm often asking content filter, when I feel like it's needed. How ever, does Mass Effect really even have need for it?

I am just asking randomly here... what do you mean when there is a need for it?

Aren't games created for a certain audience? What you say ... makes it a bit hard to understand if I imagine it in dead space type of game... or GTA.

Now if your asking in the way COD did it... then ok I understand, is took skip something ranther than blatantly block a certain thing out to appease a minority... which saying minority is an overstatement.