663 réponses à ce sujet

[slimgrin]

It was rather easy to buy SC2 without understanding the DRM, because, lets face it, it wasn't that clear at release, nor on the box. So I bought it without reading the fine print.

It's not like devs want to put this stuff in bold red letters on the front of the package.

In the end, it's nothing but greed and being petty, and I won't support it. I'm surprised the devs at Bioware are so comfortable with this type of practice.

Modifié par slimgrin, 05 février 2011 - 01:34 .

[Deadmac]

I have a simple and direct solution, which another company had utilized. When the company Quark released 'Quark Xpress 4.0, their software could only be activated and used with a dongle. It is a simple key in which needs to be attached to the computer, so you can use a registered copy of the product. Maybe a USB version of the dongle could be made.

Modifié par Deadmac, 05 février 2011 - 01:45 .

[berkos2]

but its not like sc2. sc2 is largly mulitplayer game, uses activation for creating account only one time, and you can play singleplayer in offline if you need to

[Deadmac]

Guess what?
http://www.dinkeydon...com/dongles.php

Someone has already came up with the concept. Instead of implementing an intrusive DRM system, BioWare/EA could use a dongle key for copyright protection purposes. When the dongle is attached to the computer (via usb port), the software will need to access it at random intervals. Activate the product and dongle online once, and then the dongle will take over from there. No need for your computer to call out to the server at random. If anything happens to a person's dongle (no jokes here please), BioWare/EA can charge a light fee for replacement. As a result of bringing in some revenue from lost or damaged dongles, they will be able to make up the cost of lost revenue due to software pirates. Its win-win. Consumers keep their freedom, and the company gains back some loss income.

Heck, this could also allow the game to work without it needing to access the dvd.

All BioWare/EA has to do is encrypt the dongle software.

If they think about this creatively, BioWare/EA could also sell designer dongles. If you want the top of the dongle to look like a dragon, elf, or mage, you can buy a customzed version through the online store.

Modifié par Deadmac, 05 février 2011 - 02:08 .

[HolyMoogle]

Nah, dongles don't sound good to me. How long do they last? At what point does EA stop providing replacements? No thanks.



Somebody at Bioware just tell an EA exec: The only people DRM hurts are the people legitimately paying for the game. People who download the pirated version don't have to worry about it at all. How much clearer can you get?

[Ryzaki]

I just realized something. I have my comp set to Japan Locale does this mean that DRM wouldn't let me play my game until the release date in Japan?

[ZaroktheImmortal]

[wulfsturm]

slimgrin wrote...

It was rather easy to buy SC2 without understanding the DRM, because, lets face it, it wasn't that clear at release, nor on the box. So I bought it without reading the fine print.

It's not like devs want to put this stuff in bold red letters on the front of the package.

In the end, it's nothing but greed and being petty, and I won't support it. I'm surprised the devs at Bioware are so comfortable with this type of practice.

Yes, BioWare is responsible for EA's DRM.

<_<

[ZaroktheImmortal]

wulfsturm wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

It was rather easy to buy SC2 without understanding the DRM, because, lets face it, it wasn't that clear at release, nor on the box. So I bought it without reading the fine print.

It's not like devs want to put this stuff in bold red letters on the front of the package.

In the end, it's nothing but greed and being petty, and I won't support it. I'm surprised the devs at Bioware are so comfortable with this type of practice.

Yes, BioWare is responsible for EA's DRM.

<_<

Well then blame EA then.

[Lyssistr]

Deadmac wrote...

Guess what?
http://www.dinkeydon...com/dongles.php

Someone has already came up with the concept. Instead of implementing an intrusive DRM system, BioWare/EA could use a dongle key for copyright protection purposes. When the dongle is attached to the computer (via usb port), the software will need to access it at random intervals. Activate the product and dongle online once, and then the dongle will take over from there. No need for your computer to call out to the server at random. If anything happens to a person's dongle (no jokes here please), BioWare/EA can charge a light fee for replacement. As a result of bringing in some revenue from lost or damaged dongles, they will be able to make up the cost of lost revenue due to software pirates. Its win-win. Consumers keep their freedom, and the company gains back some loss income.

Heck, this could also allow the game to work without it needing to access the dvd.

All BioWare/EA has to do is encrypt the dongle software.

If they think about this creatively, BioWare/EA could also sell designer dongles. If you want the top of the dongle to look like a dragon, elf, or mage, you can buy a customzed version through the online store.

Why would dongles be any good, dongles just stop the pirates, true DRM needs to frustrate legitimate users, break gameplay and make the game unplayable two OS releases down the line .

[AlanC9]

What are the advantages of a dongle? On my rig that would be worse than DA2's system, and somewhat more annoying than DAO's disc check since my USB ports aren't very accessible the way I've got things set up

[StrikeQ]

Lyssistr wrote...

Deadmac wrote...

Guess what?
http://www.dinkeydon...com/dongles.php

Someone has already came up with the concept. Instead of implementing an intrusive DRM system, BioWare/EA could use a dongle key for copyright protection purposes. When the dongle is attached to the computer (via usb port), the software will need to access it at random intervals. Activate the product and dongle online once, and then the dongle will take over from there. No need for your computer to call out to the server at random. If anything happens to a person's dongle (no jokes here please), BioWare/EA can charge a light fee for replacement. As a result of bringing in some revenue from lost or damaged dongles, they will be able to make up the cost of lost revenue due to software pirates. Its win-win. Consumers keep their freedom, and the company gains back some loss income.

Heck, this could also allow the game to work without it needing to access the dvd.

All BioWare/EA has to do is encrypt the dongle software.

If they think about this creatively, BioWare/EA could also sell designer dongles. If you want the top of the dongle to look like a dragon, elf, or mage, you can buy a customzed version through the online store.

Why would dongles be any good, dongles just stop the pirates, true DRM needs to frustrate legitimate users, break gameplay and make the game unplayable two OS releases down the line .

It wouldn't stop them for long. And while probably not as bad as some of the worst DRM, it still isn't a good alternative.

Make good, complete games for a decent price (Gaming industry in general) and it'll do far more than any DRM in regards to pirates and second hand sales

[coolide]

Your guys' ignorance is astonishing. All I hear is false propaganda. You all clearly have the Internet and an EA account since you're posting here. So what's the big deal? You guys are here basically 24/7, so is Internet access that big of a deal? Some pirates who have spread this propaganda have you all trippin' balls over what is what.



Get an XBox if it's such a big deal. They're far better than computers anyway.

[ZaroktheImmortal]

coolide wrote...
Get an XBox if it's such a big deal. They're far better than computers anyway.

Better than your computer, maybe. I've upgraded my computer enough that most games I can play at the highest settings.

[ZaroktheImmortal]

[quote]coolide wrote...
So what's the big deal? You guys are here basically 24/7, so is Internet access that big of a deal?quote]

And what if their server goes down? Or if we lose our internet connection? If someone doesn't have their internet connected does that mean they shouldn't be able to play the game they paid for? But it's okay for Xbox fans. They don't have to worry about jumping through all these hoops to play the game they paid for.

[Seifz]

ZaroktheImmortal wrote...

wulfsturm wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

It was rather easy to buy SC2 without understanding the DRM, because, lets face it, it wasn't that clear at release, nor on the box. So I bought it without reading the fine print.

It's not like devs want to put this stuff in bold red letters on the front of the package.

In the end, it's nothing but greed and being petty, and I won't support it. I'm surprised the devs at Bioware are so comfortable with this type of practice.

Yes, BioWare is responsible for EA's DRM.

<_<

Well then blame EA then.

BioWare is EA.  You shouldn't separate the two.

[slimgrin]

coolide wrote...

Your guys' ignorance is astonishing. All I hear is false propaganda. You all clearly have the Internet and an EA account since you're posting here. So what's the big deal? You guys are here basically 24/7, so is Internet access that big of a deal? Some pirates who have spread this propaganda have you all trippin' balls over what is what.

Get an XBox if it's such a big deal. They're far better than computers anyway.

I've had my share of issues with online DRM, as many here have. It would be pointless to recount them.

This topic is also about principle. What are customers willing to submit to? Buying an Xbox, is for me, out of the question. It will never happen.

Modifié par slimgrin, 05 février 2011 - 04:41 .

[Seifz]

coolide wrote...

Your guys' ignorance is astonishing. All I hear is false propaganda.

All you hear is what you want to hear, I'm guessing.  The arguments against this DRM are based in fact, not propaganda.

You all clearly have the Internet and an EA account since you're posting here. So what's the big deal? You guys are here basically 24/7, so is Internet access that big of a deal?

For many, it is a big deal.  Understand that "here right now" is not equivalent to "here all the time".  There are many situations in which the game might require a reauthentication check and you'll be without a connection.

1.  Players who live in areas with little or no Internet penetration.
2.  Players who are deployed overseas in or with the military.
3.  Players who have monthly bandwidth caps and have been cut off for overuse.
4.  Players who have lost their connections because of ISP maintenance, government control, storms, or other uncontrollable factors.
5.  Players who travel and might not have a connection at their destination.
6.  Players who have a connection but can't reauthenticate because EA's servers are down.

Those are just six possibilities and I'm sure that you could think of more if you thought about it for a moment.

Besides that, the requirement that we tie our activation key to our EA account violates all sorts of rights guaranteed to us by law.  In addition, nobody from BioWare or EA seems willing to tell us precisely what information they plan to collect each time the game phones home to tell them which computer you're on.  That's a huge invasion of privacy.  You're free to find the other DRM topic for more details.

Some pirates who have spread this propaganda have you all trippin' balls over what is what.

I have never pirated and will never pirate software, games, movies, music, or anything else.  I am not against this DRM because I encourage piracy.

That said, I have no qualms with circumventing the EULA and downloading a cracked executable once I've legally purchased and installed the game.  I'm not going to suffer invasions of my privacy and ridiculous restrictions on when and how I play while the freeloaders get to play in peace.

Get an XBox if it's such a big deal. They're far better than computers anyway.

Your 360 is inferior to my PC in absolutely every metric except cost and size.

[In Exile]

berkos2 wrote...

but its not like sc2. sc2 is largly mulitplayer game, uses activation for creating account only one time, and you can play singleplayer in offline if you need to

That's not something you'd expect if you haven't followed the development of the game, though.

[kirkonacid]

I think the DRM seems fairly reasonable. I'm only worried that it will want to authenticate when I don't have access to the internet and then I'll be out of luck. Other than that, I see no issues.

[slimgrin]

crusadeonacid wrote...
 I'm only worried that it will want to authenticate when I don't have access to the internet and then I'll be out of luck. Other than that, I see no issues.

That is the issue. That's what makes this form of DRM unfair.

Why would you accept that?

[Seifz]

slimgrin wrote...

crusadeonacid wrote...
 I'm only worried that it will want to authenticate when I don't have access to the internet and then I'll be out of luck. Other than that, I see no issues.

That is the issue

That's one of the issues.  There are many more!

[In Exile]

Seifz wrote...
Besides that, the requirement that we tie our activation key to our EA account violates all sorts of rights guaranteed to us by law.  In addition, nobody from BioWare or EA seems willing to tell us precisely what information they plan to collect each time the game phones home to tell them which computer you're on.  That's a huge invasion of privacy. 

You're wrong. I understand you're sentiment, but insofar as fact is concerned...

Privacy law is very messy right now, especially with regard to data collection. It's not entirely clear to what extent a particular consumer has to be informed re: data collectionf or that data to be justifiably collected.

As well, first sale rights in the US are also a confused when it comes to software. To begin with, it isn't clear that first sale even applies,  because you're not actually talking about a sale transaction but rather a licensing agreement. Or rather, this is what the software companies will want to argue. How it stands up in court is anyone's guess.

Morally speaking, your sentiment is perfectly reasonable. But as of right now it isn't clear what rights consumers have when it comes to electronic IP, which is precisely why EA can do these things.

If this is something very important to you, the appropriate course of action would be to focus on what you can do to clarify these rights legally, i.e. via pushing your representative for clear legislation on the issue. Otherwise, until you have a landmark case in court, there won't be any precedent and everyone will run wild.

Also, usual disclaimer, I'm not a laywer, this is not legal advice but a personal take, if you want to understand your legal rights see an accredited lawyer, etc. etc.

[mcneil_1]

I say we wait and find out if bioware are going for the periodic phone in version.
Looking at it, solidshield without the phone in mode seems almost like the cerberus network <_< (I wonder if it was a test run)