74 réponses à ce sujet

[Mad Bohemian]

social.bioware.com/project/1822/
This is a good Mod. One may have to "tinker" with the party picker, remove and add people or him but always accept the four people. To level him up click on him, punch the "c" key, then level up.
Hope this doesn't confuse you.

[HighSpeedDirtuk]

Elthunder wrote...

Ser Kory wrote...

Don't even pump con, you should have a healer, let her do her job.

How do you heal someone thats already dead, con also adds to Physical resistant.

No, you should surely have a fair amount of con, not by far as high as the main stats like str and dex if a warrior for example, but you should absolutely spend a point in it now and again.

Those tat says con is a waste of points are clueless tbh.

I seem to get by with just the con bonus from the fade. Dex is a much better way to spend points. Dont really need too much health if the enemy can not hit you.

[Doriath]

The only characters you ever need to spend points in constitution are tanks. Even so, a PC or Alistair tank can get away with 20 and the lifegiver ring if you can afford it. That means you only need to spend 7 or 8 points in constitution by endgame, if that.

Also, there are others way to increase physical resistance. Hale runes come to mind.

On topic, Dog is decent in the early parts of the game as a melee damage dealer but once you have Ogren or any of the other melee damage dealers equipped well, they outperfom Dog because they have more available talents and access to specializations.

Modifié par chrisnabal, 30 janvier 2011 - 04:48 .

[SniperWolfMandy]

I still love dog regardless of whether or not Oghren can out preform him... come on dog is your most loyal companion!

[OBakaSama]

Dog is good to have about.



Oddly I remember having had one bugged playthrough early on where Dog actually got skill points, so I was able to give him some talents in the Warrior category. Never happened again though which is a shame because that would have turned him into the killing machine a Mabari should be.

[termokanden]

Dog is useful because of two things: Overwhelm and the AoE stun. Both are overpowered abilities. Apart from that, he might not be greatest party member. But he's definitely always useful.

[Cutlass Jack]

Dog is far superior to Oghren. He doesn't drink all your beer and brings you cake and pantaloons!

[Elhanan]

Dog can be quite useful, as he is the fastest member of the party. Just be sure to keep an eye out for his special locations on the maps.

[PlayingWithKnives]

[quote]HighSpeedDirtuk wrote...

[quote]Elthunder wrote...

[quote]Ser Kory wrote...

Don't even pump con, you should have a healer, let her do her job.[/quote]

How do you heal someone thats already dead, con also adds to Physical resistant.

No, you should surely have a fair amount of con, not by far as high as the main stats like str and dex if a warrior for example, but you should absolutely spend a point in it now and again.

Those tat says con is a waste of points are clueless tbh.

[/quote]

I will say it again con is a wasted useless stat and if im clueless for saying it then so be it, but please enlighten me as to how its not.
here i will compare dex to con

Dexterity

• Increases melee attack score by 0.5 per each point
  above 10.
• Increases ranged attack score by 1.0 per each point
  above 10.
• Increases damage from piercing weapons (per
  weapon-specific attribute modifiers).
• Increases defense by 1 per each point above 10.
• Increases physical
  resistance by 0.5 per each point above 10

Con

• Increases health
  by 5 per each point above 10.
• Increases physical
  resistance by 0.5 per each point above 10.

so the only benefit i get from con is health.. I could have all the health i wanted but without any defence it means nothing unless you enjoy chugging different ranks of health poltice down on every cooldown

Maybe im just old fashioned but im from the school of  stacking avoidance and mitigation to stop the incoming damage as much as i can in the first place.

[Elthunder]

To PlayingWithKnives

If this is the case, then they have surely made that stat wrong, and as Im abit tired today because of a cold, I cba to check if you'r numbers are right or not.

Still does dex aply to 360 degrees, and also stay the same defencewise no matter how many attackers you got on you, otherwise that stat will be of less use in situations with greater numbers of enemies, while con won't be effected by the enemy numbers.

If that is the case you can't compare those stats like you have, but I don't know if it behaves like that in this game.

I think why I don't care enough to check it out better for myself is because it really dosn't matter much, as I have been able to get trough the game about 5 times, and even went trough both origins and Awakening on Hard. I have played on Nightmare, but gotten to tired of the game, as Im basically playing for the story, so I probably wont play trough everything at that diff level.

I actually only bother to finetune things if Im playing an online game, because unless you can't play trough the game when it comes to singleplayer games, there is really no point in haveing the perfect stats etc, it's not like you can show it off to anyone, especially when you can just cheat and get better things that way, but I guess Im getting abit sidetracked now ;D

I haven't even bothered with runecrafting, I just smack on afew thats buyable or if I find some on the main character ;D

Modifié par Elthunder, 31 janvier 2011 - 02:38 .

[PlayingWithKnives]

My comparison is accurate i took it from the dao wiki but its exactly the same as the ingame tooltips.

dex and def stats are the same regardless of any number of mobs on you, that dosnt change anything.

[termokanden]

I agree that con is a waste of points (in ALMOST all cases, will get back to that).



Dex does always apply and doesn't somehow drop if many people are attacking you. In fact, with a high enough dex, you cannot even be hit by normal attacks. On the other hand, con just gives you slightly more health. Since it comes at a cost of both damage AND being hit more, it's just not worth it.



Con is definitely underpowered. I think they realized that when they made Awakening and tried to fix it. The Guardian specialization has an ability called Guardian's Shield that reduces damage per hit based on your constitution. So with a high enough con, you won't take any damage for a while. Sadly Awakening is pretty easy and you don't really need this.

[PlayingWithKnives]

Additional i will also back up my case with other facts
Attack
A numerical value that is used to determine whether a physical attack succeeds in impacting, though not necessarily damaging, an enemy.

AttackValue = 60 + 0.5 * {(Strength - 10) + (Dexterity - 10)} + AttackBonuses

Equipment, skills, spells and talents provide bonuses to Attack.
Attack Roll

For most attacks (including activated Talents), an attack roll against the target's Defense is performed. If the attack roll is successful, the attack connects.

When the attacker's Attack value is the same as the defender's Defense value, the hit probability is 54%. Each point of attack increases this by one point (up to 100%), each point of defense decreases this probability by one point (at 0, attacks with attack rolls will always miss).
E.g.,
at 100 Attack:
Defense       Hit Probability in %
50                  100
75                   79
100                 54
125                29
150                 4
154                 0
200                 0

So by purely stacking dex which gives you defence and completly ignoring con you have the abilty to basicaly remove the chance of being hit by a melee attack entirely

Modifié par PlayingWithKnives, 31 janvier 2011 - 02:44 .

[Elthunder]

PlayingWithKnives wrote...

Additional i will also back up my case with other facts
Attack
A numerical value that is used to determine whether a physical attack succeeds in impacting, though not necessarily damaging, an enemy.

AttackValue = 60 + 0.5 * {(Strength - 10) + (Dexterity - 10)} + AttackBonuses

Equipment, skills, spells and talents provide bonuses to Attack.
Attack Roll

For most attacks (including activated Talents), an attack roll against the target's Defense is performed. If the attack roll is successful, the attack connects.

When the attacker's Attack value is the same as the defender's Defense value, the hit probability is 54%. Each point of attack increases this by one point (up to 100%), each point of defense decreases this probability by one point (at 0, attacks with attack rolls will always miss).
E.g.,
at 100 Attack:
Defense       Hit Probability in %
50                  100
75                   79
100                 54
125                29
150                 4
154                 0
200                 0

So by purely stacking dex which gives you defence and completly ignoring con you have the abilty to basicaly remove the chance of being hit by a melee attack entirely

That is rather messed up though, there should be a hard cap if such a thing is possible, then again I suppose alot of things in single player games are very unbalanced, my thoughts comes from Online games, there they constantly fix things like this.

Then maby raise the cap for higher diff settings, and for mods I guess the modmaker themselfs would have to set a resonable cap.

To me it seems both con and dex is flawed, because you would have a harder time evading and defending against several enemies, but your Constitution/hitpoints will never change, and therefore not be effected.

Modifié par Elthunder, 31 janvier 2011 - 03:34 .

[PlayingWithKnives]

I didnt design or develop the game so out of my hands... what kind of set me off is the fact that i had stated that con was a wasted useless stat,and it was mentioned that any1 who said this was clueless, so i obviously didnt take kind to this.



I have listed facts and figures to back up my so called cluelessness.

an example of an ingame scenario would be 2 identically geared SnS warriors 1 specced with heavy dex and 1 specced with heavy con,

the con tank will indeed have a high health pool but without the massive defence gained from the dex attribute he will die alot faster than the dex tank. because he is unable to avoid the damage in the first place.

[USArmyParatrooper]

Without crunching numbers, my own anecdotal experience has shown that Dexterity is a better "survival" stat than Constitution, and as a bonus it also increases attack.

But keep in mind this is only vs. melee attacks, which is the lion share of the damage you tend to take. So while a high Dex rogue, for example, has the overall survivability of a well built tank.... getting caught up in things like a fireball or rocks hurled by Golems can really hurt you bad.

Overall I much prefer to pump Dex vs. Con, but pumping Con is certainly not without merit for certain builds. For Shale (she actually *needs* high Con for better large crystals) and for 2H warriors... I would say pumping STR and CON accompanied by massive armor makes a very nice combo.

When playing with Shale I have found that my high Dex, base Con rogue and Shale with base Dex high Con are often the last two standing in tough battles. No doubt, Dex and Con are both viable choices for survivability - depending on your class and build.

Edit: I forgot to mention that using Dex instread of Con for survivability ialso allows you to heal using weaker potions. I'm sure we've all experienced Shale, at Higher levels needs at least a Greater potion, and preferably a Potent one to bring her health back to safe levels.

Modifié par USArmyParatrooper, 31 janvier 2011 - 04:23 .

[Ace Attorney]

USArmyParatrooper wrote...

Without crunching numbers, my own anecdotal experience has shown that Dexterity is a better "survival" stat than Constitution, and as a bonus it also increases attack.

But keep in mind this is only vs. melee attacks, which is the lion share of the damage you tend to take. So while a high Dex rogue, for example, has the overall survivability of a well built tank.... getting caught up in things like a fireball or rocks hurled by Golems can really hurt you bad.

Overall I much prefer to pump Dex vs. Con, but pumping Con is certainly not without merit for certain builds. For Shale (she actually *needs* high Con for better large crystals) and for 2H warriors... I would say pumping STR and CON accompanied by massive armor makes a very nice combo.

When playing with Shale I have found that my high Dex, base Con rogue and Shale with base Dex high Con are often the last two standing in tough battles. No doubt, Dex and Con are both viable choices for survivability - depending on your class and build.

That is why a good S&S Warrior Tank will take Templar and Stack Spell Resist along high Dex 

[USArmyParatrooper]

For your viewing pleasure, a Rogue soloing the Harvester on nightmare without taking any damage. Not sure about the details of his build, but he comments that he stacked his PC with 100% dodge.



The power of not getting hit!

[PlayingWithKnives]

yes agreed shale does need con for his crystal items. as far as the spell mental resistant goes dex and con do nothing for you, this mental resistance (spell resistance) is achieved through the willpower and magic attribute again both give you 0.5 per point.. through items gear runes etc its possible to get a very high mental resistance

[USArmyParatrooper]

PlayingWithKnives wrote...

yes agreed shale does need con for his crystal items. as far as the spell mental resistant goes dex and con do nothing for you, this mental resistance (spell resistance) is achieved through the willpower and magic attribute again both give you 0.5 per point.. through items gear runes etc its possible to get a very high mental resistance

But what Con does give you is a buffer against ALL types of damage.

So let's say Shale and a base Con rogue both get hit a fireballl (just an example).... while Shale might be able to stand up and start swinging, you're praying your rogue can stand up and drink a health potion before he gets hit again.

[Elthunder]

yeah, well, sorry about the clueless parth, sometime unessesary things just come out when I write, because in this case it was right, but in any well maintained game, you would never get these results, because especially not getting any penalty by facing multiple foes is silly, high con would be whats saving you and/or let the healers have time to heal you. neglecting to have very high con would be devestating in alot of similar games.

1 on 1 is another thing, sure, the higher con would make you survive longer, but the one haveing the highest defence would, depending on skill also ofcourse in the end win.

Modifié par Elthunder, 31 janvier 2011 - 04:58 .

[termokanden]

Well in DAO base con is enough to survive with proper tactics/healing. That's why it's not a good investment. Spending the points somewhere else will improve your character's effectiveness in combat. Spending points on con just means you have more HP than you actually need.

Modifié par termokanden, 31 janvier 2011 - 05:20 .

[shatteredstar56]

The dog is useful until you get Oghren, or Shale. Then he ceases to be useful in battle, but I do prefer to use him over Sten, since he has abilities like Charge and Shred that are absolutely wonderful, if he's got a mage covering his back.

[Tinkerbell04]

Elthunder wrote...

yeah, well, sorry about the clueless parth, sometime unessesary things just come out when I write, because in this case it was right, but in any well maintained game, you would never get these results, because especially not getting any penalty by facing multiple foes is silly, high con would be whats saving you and/or let the healers have time to heal you. neglecting to have very high con would be devestating in alot of similar games.

1 on 1 is another thing, sure, the higher con would make you survive longer, but the one haveing the highest defence would, depending on skill also ofcourse in the end win.

Okay - so you're sorry about stating PlayingWithKnives is clueless, yet you insist that you are right and he is wrong. Perhaps read the other posts on this thread and you may realise that, like PlayingWithKnives, the rest of the playing community realise that Dex = Good, and  Cons = Unnecessary.

It may just make your time ingame that little bit more fun.
Enjoy.

[Elthunder]

Tinkerbell04 wrote...

Elthunder wrote...

yeah, well, sorry about the clueless parth, sometime unessesary things just come out when I write, because in this case it was right, but in any well maintained game, you would never get these results, because especially not getting any penalty by facing multiple foes is silly, high con would be whats saving you and/or let the healers have time to heal you. neglecting to have very high con would be devestating in alot of similar games.

1 on 1 is another thing, sure, the higher con would make you survive longer, but the one haveing the highest defence would, depending on skill also ofcourse in the end win.

Okay - so you're sorry about stating PlayingWithKnives is clueless, yet you insist that you are right and he is wrong. Perhaps read the other posts on this thread and you may realise that, like PlayingWithKnives, the rest of the playing community realise that Dex = Good, and  Cons = Unnecessary.

It may just make your time ingame that little bit more fun.
Enjoy.

No, I said it was right, but you just could'nt see that it was meant as you were right, Im Swedish and write rather fast usually so some words might come out wrong, usually people se trough them though.

Also [ it ], was meant for his calculations, and research of how the game handled things statwise.

So no, I wasn't contradicting my own statement, I just put it in a way that could be missunderstood, like it seems it did.

Don't think this will be the case in any well maintained and regularely patched game though, because it's very porly made and should have been fixed, but as you can still play trough the game without this knowlage I guess it dos'nt really matter, as I have pumped con to the extreme at times and still havent had the slightest problem when playing trough the game, maby it's because I have played games like this longer then I can even remember, and this is by far the easiest one I have played. Baldurs Gate 2 + Throne of Bhaal was alot more challenging.

I have actually gotten lazy because it's so easy, I usually just jump into fights at times I don't paus atall, and if I had played like that in the BG games etc, I would'nt have gotten far.

in BG 2 you had to dispell all kinds of magic all the time, or you had no chance really, atleast in the harder encounters.

Also if a teammate died, you had to res him, and if the main char died, it was game over, so this games rules have made it beyond easy, and the harder settings really don't make up for this, sure it gets alot harder, but it's still not the same by far.

The game is great, but I liked the old rules.

And to the Enjoy the game alittle more parth
Heh, I have played trough the game about 5 times including the expansion, the fun is not really there anymore tbh, this is a game all about the story and I have played all races so I have more or less seen everything there is to see, even without the dex knowlage I haven't had any problems so... ;D

Modifié par Elthunder, 31 janvier 2011 - 08:35 .