76 réponses à ce sujet

[Doctor_Jackstraw]

Been thinking about this and the only way I can see them doing this without a comic book where you get to pick who gets to die would be to apply certain restrictions to the availability of cast members from the second game into the third.  Logical steps I can see for the survivor makeup of the default shepard into 3 is as follows:

• Only recruit from the initial release crew (no Zaeed and Kasumi)
• Sell Legion to Cerberus (legion is a special case in that part of his enjoyment is in the conversations where you figure out what the **** his existence comprises of, something that would be difficult to convey in the opening of mass effect 3)
• No Normandy Upgrades (This allows for some pruning of the cast in a tier list set up by the developers ahead of time that would follow a chain of logic
• All loyalty missions completed, without it everyone would just end up dead without having those 3 other guys to help soak up deaths.

So with those restrictions the sequence of deaths for the default Mass Effect 2 playthrough would go as follows...
STARTING CREW:  Miranda, Garrus, Jacob, Mordin, Jack, Grunt, Samara, Thane, Tali
Number of permittable deaths under these conditions:

• Jack gets cut up by a laser upon entering the relay
• Tali gets blown up by the engine blowing up
• Thane gets crushed by random debree
• Without any tech specialist it falls on jacob to get shot in the face with a rocket
• The normandy crew, with such a small group (Miranda, Garrus, Mordin, Grunt, Samara) you can rationalize not sending someone to escort them, also if someone hasn't played me2 the normandy crew won't mean anything to them.

That leaves 5 survivors, as there would be enough suitable roles to survive the next set of death checks, and still leave a decent ammount of notable characters to import into 3.  Miranda, Garrus, and Mordin are probably the 3 most important to the second game, while grunt and samara don't really have much importance they'd allow you to have SOMEONE to talk to in those default playthroughs if you venture to tuchunka or asari space.


Or i could be way off.  anyone else got any suggestions on who will be involved in the default newgame in 3?

[armass]

Im not 100% sure about this but Miranda seems to survive even if shes unloyal, so she's my best bet.

[Homey C-Dawg]

I'd guess just Jacob and Miranda. I don't like either of them, but I know Bioware does, and Miranda's "plot armor" during the SM indicates to me that they wanted Miranda to live through most playthroughs (you have to intentionally try to get her killed or she lives).

Maybe Garrus and Tali too, just as fan service.

Who would I "want" to be default survivors? Mordin, Garrus, Tali, Grunt, Legion.

[ForgottenWarrior]

I thing nobody from the crew will survive in default newgame in ME3. It make a reason to buy ME2. Business is business...

[Layzr]

jacob, miranda, garrus, tali

[flem1]

Miranda and Garrus.  Mordin is important, but fragile.  Grunt could have been left in the tank (though if you did, how the hell did you hold the line?).  And Samara will be done after the mission unless you're a Paragon anyway (and default Shep is a renegade schmuck).

Modifié par flem1, 27 janvier 2011 - 01:48 .

[flem1]

Homey C-Dawg wrote...

I'd guess just Jacob and Miranda. I don't like either of them, but I know Bioware does, and Miranda's "plot armor" during the SM indicates to me that they wanted Miranda to live through most playthroughs (you have to intentionally try to get her killed or she lives).
Maybe Garrus and Tali too, just as fan service.
Who would I "want" to be default survivors? Mordin, Garrus, Tali, Grunt, Legion.

Jacob will die in the tubes if you go with the default suggestions.

Modifié par flem1, 27 janvier 2011 - 01:52 .

[shoggoth1890]

Miranda, Tali, Garrus, Mordin, Grunt, Thane, and despite bulletpoint number 2, Legion. Broke from the number rule, but providing detail why.



Legion still has far too much to add to be killed (or sold) off. For example his apparent emotionally driven decision to use Sheps armor to patch himself up, and to serve as a device for resolution of the geth storyline.



Thane is likely to survive the mission, so they can have him die during ME2.



As many pointed out, Miranda is hard to kill off.



Grunt's end would be far too anti-climactic to his storyline.



Tali and Garrus dying would ****** off too many fans and it would be a financially questionable move.



Mordin is just a hunch



Which ones will be in the squad, I can't say on any

[Bluko]

Eh I'm guessing Shepard would re-activate Legion, but that Legion would get blown up by the engine instead of Tali. That way you still have Tali as Tech specialist still. So Jack gets cut by laser, Legion gets blown up by engine, and Thane gets crushed by debris.

Legion will probably just have another Geth take his place easily in ME3, since they are all Geth.

But yes I think the No-Upgrades seems sensible since this is something a lot of people would probably pass on, while also making the mission somewhat deadly. So at the Collector Base Tali would hack the doors. Miranda, Jacob, or Garrus can lead the fire teams. Mordin or anyone could provide escort.  And Samara will get you thru the seeker swarms.So at the end you could have Miranda, Jacob, Tali, Garrus, Samara, Mordin, and Grunt. If you leave Garrus and Grunt behind the line would probably hold with no deaths. I assume Miranda and Jacob go with default Shepard to the Reaper.

That way at the end Chakwas is still alive, though you probably got there too late to save all the crew. Probably only part of the crew survives.

So survivors are:
Miranda
Jacob
Garrus
Tali
Mordin
Samara
Grunt

Seems pretty reasonable and leaves the fan-favorites of Garrus and Tali around for ME3 cameos. Do have to remember it is possible there are people who might play ME1, but not ME2 so it's good to have them in the default. Also allows Chakwas to be around.

Modifié par Bluko, 27 janvier 2011 - 02:02 .

[AdmiralCheez]

I was about to post the exact same thing Bluko was, except maybe argue that Mordin died "holding the line" so we get an even and balanced squad of six for the default, one of each class. They many not recruitable again, however, but I am hoping Bioware is willing to put in the extra effort to at least put some of the ME2 squad back on the Normandy.  I'd like it if they all came back for at least the Epic Final Battle/a handful of missions, but I'm not going to freak out if they can't make room on the disks for all 17 possible surviving squadmates.

I will, however, flip out and refuse to buy the game if EVERYONE from ME2 gets cameo'd.  That shows a serious lack of integrity and balls on BW's part.

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 27 janvier 2011 - 02:22 .

[shoggoth1890]

Bluko wrote...

Legion will probably just have another Geth take his place easily in ME3, since they are all Geth.

Good point.

[lazuli]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

I was about to post the exact same thing Bluko was, except maybe argue that Mordin died "holding the line" so we get an even and balanced squad of six for the default, one of each class. They many not recruitable again, however, but I am hoping Bioware is willing to put in the extra effort to at least put some of the ME2 squad back on the Normandy.  I'd like it if they all came back for at least the Epic Final Battle/a handful of missions, but I'm not going to freak out if they can't make room on the disks for all 17 possible surviving squadmates.

I will, however, flip out and refuse to buy the game if EVERYONE from ME2 gets cameo'd.  That shows a serious lack of integrity and balls on BW's part.

And foresight.

[Homey C-Dawg]

flem1 wrote...

Homey C-Dawg wrote...

I'd guess just Jacob and Miranda. I don't like either of them, but I know Bioware does, and Miranda's "plot armor" during the SM indicates to me that they wanted Miranda to live through most playthroughs (you have to intentionally try to get her killed or she lives).
Maybe Garrus and Tali too, just as fan service.
Who would I "want" to be default survivors? Mordin, Garrus, Tali, Grunt, Legion.

Jacob will die in the tubes if you go with the default suggestions.

Thats true. I learned early to disregard any advice given by Jacob or Miranda on the SM. Especially Miranda, since every suggestion she makes is the wrong choice.
I was actually quite surprised that I couldn't send her into the pipes when she's clearly half tech (sentinel) whereas Jacob and Thane could be sent in despite being biotics with no tech abilities. Damn Miranda plot armor.

[lazuli]

Homey C-Dawg wrote...
I learned early to disregard any advice given by Jacob or Miranda on the SM. Especially Miranda, since every suggestion she makes is the wrong choice.
I was actually quite surprised that I couldn't send her into the pipes when she's clearly half tech (sentinel) whereas Jacob and Thane could be sent in despite being biotics with no tech abilities. Damn Miranda plot armor.

This is exaggeration.  Miranda only suggest one "wrong choice."  Well, two, if you count not wanting to help the crew return.

[InHarmsWay]

lazuli wrote...

Homey C-Dawg wrote...
I learned early to disregard any advice given by Jacob or Miranda on the SM. Especially Miranda, since every suggestion she makes is the wrong choice.
I was actually quite surprised that I couldn't send her into the pipes when she's clearly half tech (sentinel) whereas Jacob and Thane could be sent in despite being biotics with no tech abilities. Damn Miranda plot armor.

This is exaggeration.  Miranda only suggest one "wrong choice."  Well, two, if you count not wanting to help the crew return.

Three. Said any biotic should be able to handle the bubble. That's three out of three suggestions completely wrong.

////////////////

I'm thinking along the lines of this (must assume Shepard lives, so this ensures that).

No side quests done.
No DLC
No charms/intimidation/interrupts

No Spectre status
No mention of Zaeed or Kasumi
No upgrades, ship or otherwise

Recruitment, Loyalty, ect.
Mordin: Daniel dead, Maleon dead, scout dead, genophage cure is destroyed
Garrus: The kid joined the mercenaries and was killed by Garrus, Sidonis dead
Grunt: Awakened, thresher maw not killed
Jack: Aresh dead
Miranda: killed friend, did not reunite with sister, Shepard sided with her in the argument between her and Jack
Tali: Veetor given to Cerberus, Kal dead, Exiled, did not tell Admiralty board to go to war or not
Samara: Elnora lives, Morinth dead
Thane: workers dead, son in jail
Jacob: father left to rot on planet
Legion: sold to Cerberus


Final run (don't ask why, but I think Tali and Garrus will be part of your squad during the fight[original story characters]):
Jack dies - lack of ship armor.
Thane dies-lack of shields
Grunt dies-lack of thanix cannon

This is who is left alive after getting to the base:
Jacob, Tali, Miranda, Garrus, Mordin, Samara


Tali went through vents
Miranda as team lead
Jacob as Escort (went through right away so all crew is alive)
Samara as biotic
Miranda as team lead

Garrus, Mordin and Samara left to hold line
Tali and Miranda goes with Shep
Mordin dies while holding the line

Base is destroyed

Who's alive at the end?
Tali, Garrus, Miranda, Jacob and Samara(who will likely leave by me3)

This
leaves the character in ME3 with the two original ME characters, and
the two main ME2 characters to start off with at the beginning of ME3.
Liara and Ashley/Kaiden will add onto the squad.

This leaves you with this squad list:

Jacon, Miranda, Tali, Garrus, Ashley/Kaidan, Liara

That's 6 characters for ME3.

[lazuli]

InHarmsWay wrote...

Three. Said any biotic should be able to handle the bubble. That's three out of three suggestions completely wrong.

That's the only one I count as a wrong choice.  I save my crew each time, but I'm willing to give her the benefit of the doubt on that one.

[Zulu_DFA]

@ OP:



You should check out this.

[vanslyke85]

IMO if I were Shepard I would try to recruit every single surviving member of both crews that served with me. If BW is true to realism every surviving member that is able to tag along with you should be there. These are the only people in the galaxy that have fought the collectors and beaten them, seen collectors and what they are capable of in person, had first-hand experience in everything to do with Reapers/Collectors. Every single one of them knows what to expect and I would be a moron not to at least drop them a line to see if they can help. I know it's not realistic for BW to have every ex-crewmate in ME3 for writing and animation purposes but still...we can dream can't we??

[RAF1940]

shoggoth1890 wrote...

Tali and Garrus dying would ****** off too many fans and it would be a financially questionable move.

This is the only thing of which we can be certain.

[AdmiralCheez]

Mezzil wrote...

No loyality missions completed. All squadmates dead. Why does Bioware need to care about that an importable playthrough of ME2 there has to have two squad members alive?

Because that level of failure is too much, even for Default Shep.

Interesting analysis you linked to, Zulu.  Looks like people are coming to similar conclusions.

[The Unfallen]

InHarmsWay wrote...

lazuli wrote...

Homey C-Dawg wrote...
I learned early to disregard any advice given by Jacob or Miranda on the SM. Especially Miranda, since every suggestion she makes is the wrong choice.
I was actually quite surprised that I couldn't send her into the pipes when she's clearly half tech (sentinel) whereas Jacob and Thane could be sent in despite being biotics with no tech abilities. Damn Miranda plot armor.

This is exaggeration.  Miranda only suggest one "wrong choice."  Well, two, if you count not wanting to help the crew return.

Three. Said any biotic should be able to handle the bubble. That's three out of three suggestions completely wrong.

////////////////

I'm thinking along the lines of this (must assume Shepard lives, so this ensures that).

No side quests done.
No DLC
No charms/intimidation/interrupts

No Spectre status
No mention of Zaeed or Kasumi
No upgrades, ship or otherwise

Recruitment, Loyalty, ect.
Mordin: Daniel dead, Maleon dead, scout dead, genophage cure is destroyed
Garrus: The kid joined the mercenaries and was killed by Garrus, Sidonis dead
Grunt: Awakened, thresher maw not killed
Jack: Aresh dead
Miranda: killed friend, did not reunite with sister, Shepard sided with her in the argument between her and Jack
Tali: Veetor given to Cerberus, Kal dead, Exiled, did not tell Admiralty board to go to war or not
Samara: Elnora lives, Morinth dead
Thane: workers dead, son in jail
Jacob: father left to rot on planet
Legion: sold to Cerberus


Final run (don't ask why, but I think Tali and Garrus will be part of your squad during the fight[original story characters]):
Jack dies - lack of ship armor.
Thane dies-lack of shields
Grunt dies-lack of thanix cannon

This is who is left alive after getting to the base:
Jacob, Tali, Miranda, Garrus, Mordin, Samara


Tali went through vents
Miranda as team lead
Jacob as Escort (went through right away so all crew is alive)
Samara as biotic
Miranda as team lead

Garrus, Mordin and Samara left to hold line
Tali and Miranda goes with Shep
Mordin dies while holding the line

Base is destroyed

Who's alive at the end?
Tali, Garrus, Miranda, Jacob and Samara(who will likely leave by me3)

This
leaves the character in ME3 with the two original ME characters, and
the two main ME2 characters to start off with at the beginning of ME3.
Liara and Ashley/Kaiden will add onto the squad.

This leaves you with this squad list:

Jacon, Miranda, Tali, Garrus, Ashley/Kaidan, Liara

That's 6 characters for ME3.

/Thread

[AdmiralCheez]

Mezzil wrote...

The default is for newbies who did not play previous games. They won't know default Shepard is failure, so it doesn't matter.  

Bioware won't neuter such a potentially large audience.  My money's on a at least four surviving ME2 squaddies.