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[Dirty_Dan]

jbblue05 wrote...

Zurcior wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Your forgetting Sheaprd is an ALliance marine he's on the most advanced warship in the Alliance and he has the full support of the Alliance.

Why in the heck would he want Alien mercenaries on his team. Those aliens don't have the same training as him. Shepard would be better off with Ash/Kaiden and other N7 marines.
The aliens were their for fan service and expanding the story

 It doesn't matter if he's with the Alliance at that point. He's a Spectre. He represents the entire galactic community, not just humanity. Why the heck would he not want capable alien combatants on his side? Why wait for other N7 Marines when s/he has warriors like Wrex?

 Fan service and expanding the story? Whaaa-?

You can't be serious Shepard has no idea of their combat capabilities.  With the stakes as high as they are SHepard doesn't have the luxury of  testing their combat capabilities.

You don't see how efficient in combat they are unless you take them in your squad.

Judging by your logic if Conrad had armor with kinetic barriers and a couple of weapons you might as well recruit him.also   

I would have no problem having Garrrus on my team if he was a spectre.

Garrus is a cop, one that showed his combat skills first hand in the Citadel Med center.

Wrex is a bountey hunter, and a well know one.

Tali handled herself well in the alley.

They needed Liara to find out where the Conduit is, whether she can fight or not.

He has seen their combat skills first hand or has a good reason to bring them. Plus he chose to bring them, he was not forced.

[didymos1120]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

Garrus is a cop, one that showed his combat skills first hand in the Citadel Med center.

Garrus is also turian, which means he's had plenty of military training, starting at age 15.

[Barquiel]

jbblue05 wrote...

I don't hate the Council, they just got wat they deserve.  They refused to let the Alliance help defend the CItadel in the impending attack .  Plus they don't help you clear out the rest of the enemies they just run away, not even waiting for confirmation that SOvereign and the Geth were defeated 

Destiny Ascension: Main Drives offline. Kinetic barriers down 40%.

The DA fought against the geth and is unable to maneuver (=assist the alliance) now.

What's so difficult to understand?

Modifié par Barquiel, 02 février 2011 - 12:43 .

[jbblue05]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

Garrus is a cop, one that showed his combat skills first hand in the Citadel Med center.

Wrex is a bountey hunter, and a well know one.

Tali handled herself well in the alley.

They needed Liara to find out where the Conduit is, whether she can fight or not.

He has seen their combat skills first hand or has a good reason to bring them. Plus he chose to bring them, he was not forced.

Garrus headshotted an unaware thug not wearing any armor. That's not impressive at all.

Wrex being a bounty hunter and working for a mysterious figure called the Shadow broker it is too risky to bring him on your ship.  Shepard and Wrex have different combat training and Wrex may not be a team player.

Tali wasn't impressive at all sh threw a grenade and ranned. If Shepard didn't show up she would likely be killed..

Shepard only has 1 good reason to recruit them "cool alien"

Unlike in ME2 Shepard has the luxury and full support of the Alliance.  Shepard has never worked with aliens with different combat trining .
ME2 did a much better job of having aliens as squaddies

[jbblue05]

Barquiel wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

I don't hate the Council, they just got wat they deserve.  They refused to let the Alliance help defend the CItadel in the impending attack .  Plus they don't help you clear out the rest of the enemies they just run away, not even waiting for confirmation that SOvereign and the Geth were defeated 

Destiny Ascension: Main Drives offline. Kinetic barriers down 40%.

The DA fought against the geth and is unable to maneuver (=assist the alliance) now.

What's so difficult to understand?

Its called you have engineers they are getting paid for a reason. Make an attempt to aid the Alliance.  The DA is dreadnought it was station on the Citadel to defend the Citadel from other dreadnoughts

Plus it doesn't matter the DA left ASAP.

[Dirty_Dan]

jbblue05 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

I don't hate the Council, they just got wat they deserve.  They refused to let the Alliance help defend the CItadel in the impending attack .  Plus they don't help you clear out the rest of the enemies they just run away, not even waiting for confirmation that SOvereign and the Geth were defeated 

Destiny Ascension: Main Drives offline. Kinetic barriers down 40%.

The DA fought against the geth and is unable to maneuver (=assist the alliance) now.

What's so difficult to understand?

Its called you have engineers they are getting paid for a reason. Make an attempt to aid the Alliance.  The DA is dreadnought it was station on the Citadel to defend the Citadel from other dreadnoughts

Plus it doesn't matter the DA left ASAP.

You really think that they are gonna fix a ship that size in time for a battle that, in your mind, is so quick that they do not even need to deal with a giant geth fleet attacking them

[Barquiel]

jbblue05 wrote...

Plus it doesn't matter the DA left ASAP.

How?

The main drives are offline! The ship is unable to leave the battle! Sure, they could repair it...in 5 minutes?

[Schneidend]

jbblue05 wrote...

Garrus headshotted an unaware thug not wearing any armor. That's not impressive at all.

He's also been receiving military combat training since he was 15 years-old, is a decorated marksman, and made that shot with a sidearm in a high-stress situation with a civilian's head right next to the head he was aiming for.

Wrex being a bounty hunter and working for a mysterious figure called the Shadow broker it is too risky to bring him on your ship.  Shepard and Wrex have different combat training and Wrex may not be a team player.

Wrex is a Battlemaster, the cornerstone of his race's entire military doctrine. His combat training makes him a match for several dozen non-krogan, and part of his role as a Battlemaster is leading other krogan.

Tali wasn't impressive at all sh threw a grenade and ranned. If Shepard didn't show up she would likely be killed..

And that grenade dispersed all three of her opponents and could have potentially allowed her to flee the room entirely unscathed. She is also fast enough with her tech to salvage data from a geth whose squad she herself defeated. Not to mention geth are notoriously difficult to hack, especially since they wipe their data upon being disabled.

Shepard only has 1 good reason to recruit them "cool alien"

And the fact that they're all highly skilled specialists?

[Asheer_Khan]

jbblue05 wrote...

Asheer_Khan wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

The DA has secondary weapons.
The council left the Alliance out to dry their cowards.

 Like Ancient Greek poverb says

"Nec Hercules contro plures"  (Even Hercules ass when enemys mass(in free translation))
So was in case of DA which was bombarded by Geth ships from ALL directions and her gunners were too busy to at least try to defend ship than worried what Sovieregin was doing.

To be honest i see now that your hatred toward Council completely blinded you what is somehow sad...

The DA has a crew of 10,000 which means lots of engineers.  I'm sure they could make repairs to get their guns back online.  Who knows maybe their guns  were still online.  Its obvious once you saved the Council they were planning on leaving from the start..

^ OK... i am not quite sure if you have even a slight idea about what you talking about.
How can you fix something under CONSTANT enemy bombardament causing one failure after another so its possible that emergency teams were FORCED to focus on keeping intact what remain from Kinetic barriers, secondary defense systems and most important thing ship LIFE SUPPORT... when main armament was at that moment off schedule.

And for last part of your post.
Of course they planning to withdraw themselfs from area of battle because DA was too heavy damaged to be useful in clearance from the remnants of the Geth fleet once Sovieregin was a history.

I don't hate the Council, they just got wat they deserve.  They refused to let the Alliance help defend the CItadel in the impending attack .  Plus they don't help you clear out the rest of the enemies they just run away, not even waiting for confirmation that SOvereign and the Geth were defeated

^Lord have Mercy... <_<  AND WHO was in first line agaist Shepard when comes to final pre Ilos stage?
Our "lovely" douchebag Udina who issued lockdown of the Normady puting everyone in DEADLY GRAVE  danger.
What if Shepard decided to obey his decision and then Sovieregin will show up right in front of the CItadel?

Beside i don't recall even single notion that Council forbid Alliance to participate in defence of the Citadel before Saren's attack, however i suspect that if 5'th fleet would be at the Citadel in moment of the attack consequences for them could be more tragic than losses during final battle because they would be exposed like rest of the Citadel fleet on full power of the Sovieregin (who known if Sovieregin would NOT focus his attention to get rid of the 5'th Fleet  before he would attach himself to Citadel Tower in first place?) and his Geth support.

Again DA was too heavy damaged to be effective at this stage and it was absolute imperative to take her OUT of combat zone because who would give guarantee that suddeny second wave of Geth ships don't jump out of nowhere on battle tired fleets?

Replys in bold.

[Dirty_Dan]

There was a human fleet at the Citadel, the 5th fleet is just the fleet at archturous. The reason they were late was because the mass relays to the citadel was shut off by Saren

[Asheer_Khan]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

There was a human fleet at the Citadel, the 5th fleet is just the fleet at archturous. The reason they were late was because the mass relays to the citadel was shut off by Saren

Yes, you right.

And i wonder if those Alliance casualties Shepard mention to miss punchie bag reporter were in relation to that squadron or 5th Fleet.

[jbblue05]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

There was a human fleet at the Citadel, the 5th fleet is just the fleet at archturous. The reason they were late was because the mass relays to the citadel was shut off by Saren

no their wasn't . only the Council races are allowed to have fleets on the CItadel.

[Dirty_Dan]

jbblue05 wrote...

Dirty_Dan wrote...

There was a human fleet at the Citadel, the 5th fleet is just the fleet at archturous. The reason they were late was because the mass relays to the citadel was shut off by Saren

no their wasn't . only the Council races are allowed to have fleets on the CItadel.

Humans were in the fleet, that was why Udina was telling you that this was a great triumph for humanity, and also why Shepard says he wants to be at the head of the fleet. Plus if you look at some codex entry it states that there is a human fleet stationed there at all times.

[jbblue05]

Asheer_Khan wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Asheer_Khan wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

The DA has secondary weapons.
The council left the Alliance out to dry their cowards.

 Like Ancient Greek poverb says

"Nec Hercules contro plures"  (Even Hercules ass when enemys mass(in free translation))
So was in case of DA which was bombarded by Geth ships from ALL directions and her gunners were too busy to at least try to defend ship than worried what Sovieregin was doing.

To be honest i see now that your hatred toward Council completely blinded you what is somehow sad...

The DA has a crew of 10,000 which means lots of engineers.  I'm sure they could make repairs to get their guns back online.  Who knows maybe their guns  were still online.  Its obvious once you saved the Council they were planning on leaving from the start..

^ OK... i am not quite sure if you have even a slight idea about what you talking about.
How can you fix something under CONSTANT enemy bombardament causing one failure after another so its possible that emergency teams were FORCED to focus on keeping intact what remain from Kinetic barriers, secondary defense systems and most important thing ship LIFE SUPPORT... when main armament was at that moment off schedule.

And for last part of your post.
Of course they planning to withdraw themselfs from area of battle because DA was too heavy damaged to be useful in clearance from the remnants of the Geth fleet once Sovieregin was a history.

I don't hate the Council, they just got wat they deserve.  They refused to let the Alliance help defend the CItadel in the impending attack .  Plus they don't help you clear out the rest of the enemies they just run away, not even waiting for confirmation that SOvereign and the Geth were defeated

^Lord have Mercy... <_<  AND WHO was in first line agaist Shepard when comes to final pre Ilos stage?
Our "lovely" douchebag Udina who issued lockdown of the Normady puting everyone in DEADLY GRAVE  danger.
What if Shepard decided to obey his decision and then Sovieregin will show up right in front of the CItadel?

Beside i don't recall even single notion that Council forbid Alliance to participate in defence of the Citadel before Saren's attack, however i suspect that if 5'th fleet would be at the Citadel in moment of the attack consequences for them could be more tragic than losses during final battle because they would be exposed like rest of the Citadel fleet on full power of the Sovieregin (who known if Sovieregin would NOT focus his attention to get rid of the 5'th Fleet  before he would attach himself to Citadel Tower in first place?) and his Geth support.

Again DA was too heavy damaged to be effective at this stage and it was absolute imperative to take her OUT of combat zone because who would give guarantee that suddeny second wave of Geth ships don't jump out of nowhere on battle tired fleets?

Replys in bold.

Once the Alliance saves the DA the crew aboard the DA could try to make repairs. and try to offer any assistance they were capable of but they were planning on leaving anyways.
When your under sonstant bombardent the first thing your going tto try to do  is repair the ship to 100%.

The DA didn't look that bad once the Alliance saved it.  It looks like it didn't suffer any superficial damage.. Maybe you should rewatch the SAve the Council clip.

I know you hate Udina but he was under orders from the COuncil and Alliance to stop SHepard from going to Ilos.

The Alliance  wasn't allowed at the battle of the CItadel all the Alliance casualties came from the 5th fleet and 63rd scout flotilla in which SHepard had to give them assistance to access the mass relay 

[jbblue05]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Dirty_Dan wrote...

There was a human fleet at the Citadel, the 5th fleet is just the fleet at archturous. The reason they were late was because the mass relays to the citadel was shut off by Saren

no their wasn't . only the Council races are allowed to have fleets on the CItadel.

Humans were in the fleet, that was why Udina was telling you that this was a great triumph for humanity, and also why Shepard says he wants to be at the head of the fleet. Plus if you look at some codex entry it states that there is a human fleet stationed there at all times.

The 8 cruisers that were lost were in the 5th fleet..
Only Council races are allowed to have fleets on the CItadel.
Udina doesn't tell you the Alliance is going to help defeat the CItadel.

[Dirty_Dan]

If your under bombardment with a wreaked ship with the leaders of the galaxy inside the first thing you are going to do is get out of bombardment.

And there was a fleet stationed at the Citadel, I believe the man who inspects your ship is the Admiral who leads it

Also when you beat all the missions Joker tells you that the council is staging a join speicies fleet to defend it, that includes humanity

Modifié par Dirty_Dan, 02 février 2011 - 01:47 .

[oldag07]

If you can stop Sovereign and save the council than it should promote more stability and that's if you metagame.

I hear all of this stuff about the "metagame", and how not saving the council in the end is not a proper risk. I sympathetic to the paragon side, say the metagame argument works both ways. If you let the council die, then you lose the support of the council races, possibly leading to a civil war. . . . an upstart race, 30 years in the council, wants to rule the galaxy.  come on. . . .In some respects the renegades get off easy. . . .

Modifié par oldag07, 02 février 2011 - 01:52 .

[Dean_the_Young]

I don't think saving the DA was a smart, or moral, choice, but certainly not on any argument that the DA didn't join the fight afterwards.



That the DA was made into a giant escape boat for the Council and was fleeing the battle far earlier, rather than serving as the defense focal point while something smaller, quicker, and far less relevant to the defense could take the Council...

[Dirty_Dan]

Well, in all honesty, an Admiral letting a commander that is on the ground and can not see what is going on in the battle decide what to do is pretty stupid to begin with

[jbblue05]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

If your under bombardment with a wreaked ship with the leaders of the galaxy inside the first thing you are going to do is get out of bombardment.

And there was a fleet stationed at the Citadel, I believe the man who inspects your ship is the Admiral who leads it

Also when you beat all the missions Joker tells you that the council is staging a join speicies fleet to defend it, that includes humanity

Admiral Mikhalovich inspects your ship and he's in charge of the 63rd scout FLotilla.

The 63rd Scout Flotilla makes up most of the 5th fleet

[Dirty_Dan]

jbblue05 wrote...

Dirty_Dan wrote...

If your under bombardment with a wreaked ship with the leaders of the galaxy inside the first thing you are going to do is get out of bombardment.

And there was a fleet stationed at the Citadel, I believe the man who inspects your ship is the Admiral who leads it

Also when you beat all the missions Joker tells you that the council is staging a join speicies fleet to defend it, that includes humanity

Admiral Mikhalovich inspects your ship and he's in charge of the 63rd scout FLotilla.

The 63rd Scout Flotilla makes up most of the 5th fleet

Guess I was worng then, still there is a fleet stationed there and it was still a joint speicies defence.

[jbblue05]

Schneidend wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Garrus headshotted an unaware thug not wearing any armor. That's not impressive at all.

He's also been receiving military combat training since he was 15 years-old, is a decorated marksman, and made that shot with a sidearm in a high-stress situation with a civilian's head right next to the head he was aiming for.

Wrex being a bounty hunter and working for a mysterious figure called the Shadow broker it is too risky to bring him on your ship.  Shepard and Wrex have different combat training and Wrex may not be a team player.

Wrex is a Battlemaster, the cornerstone of his race's entire military doctrine. His combat training makes him a match for several dozen non-krogan, and part of his role as a Battlemaster is leading other krogan.

Tali wasn't impressive at all sh threw a grenade and ranned. If Shepard didn't show up she would likely be killed..

And that grenade dispersed all three of her opponents and could have potentially allowed her to flee the room entirely unscathed. She is also fast enough with her tech to salvage data from a geth whose squad she herself defeated. Not to mention geth are notoriously difficult to hack, especially since they wipe their data upon being disabled.

Shepard only has 1 good reason to recruit them "cool alien"

And the fact that they're all highly skilled specialists?

Wow you know nothing about them unless you talk to them after you recruit them.

It makes no sense to recruit people off the streets when you can take full of advantage of the Alliance.
If Garrus, Wrex, and Tali were spectres  than it would be ok with recruiting them because spectres are the best of the best.

N7 marines are the best of the best in the Alliance SHepard would rather recruit them than people off the streets 100/100 times.  

You really think an N7 marine like SHepard would rather have a teenage quarian on pilgrimage,  a Krogan mercenary, or turian C-sec officer than an N7 marine or a fellow spectre?

[jbblue05]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Dirty_Dan wrote...

If your under bombardment with a wreaked ship with the leaders of the galaxy inside the first thing you are going to do is get out of bombardment.

And there was a fleet stationed at the Citadel, I believe the man who inspects your ship is the Admiral who leads it

Also when you beat all the missions Joker tells you that the council is staging a join speicies fleet to defend it, that includes humanity

Admiral Mikhalovich inspects your ship and he's in charge of the 63rd scout FLotilla.

The 63rd Scout Flotilla makes up most of the 5th fleet

Guess I was worng then, still there is a fleet stationed there and it was still a joint speicies defence.

It was joint Council species defense the 5th fleet were suppose to be  reinforcements.  Hence why they are waiting near the relay to eneter the CItadel

[Sentox6]

Dirty_Dan wrote...

Well, in all honesty, an Admiral letting a commander that is on the ground and can not see what is going on in the battle decide what to do is pretty stupid to begin with

It always struck me as a bit silly that Shepard got to dictate the strategic actions of the fleet. Especially with the possible political ramifications.

Spectre or no, an Alliance commander shouldn't be ordering an Alliance admiral around.

[Dirty_Dan]

jbblue05 wrote...

Schneidend wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Garrus headshotted an unaware thug not wearing any armor. That's not impressive at all.

He's also been receiving military combat training since he was 15 years-old, is a decorated marksman, and made that shot with a sidearm in a high-stress situation with a civilian's head right next to the head he was aiming for.

Wrex being a bounty hunter and working for a mysterious figure called the Shadow broker it is too risky to bring him on your ship.  Shepard and Wrex have different combat training and Wrex may not be a team player.

Wrex is a Battlemaster, the cornerstone of his race's entire military doctrine. His combat training makes him a match for several dozen non-krogan, and part of his role as a Battlemaster is leading other krogan.

Tali wasn't impressive at all sh threw a grenade and ranned. If Shepard didn't show up she would likely be killed..

And that grenade dispersed all three of her opponents and could have potentially allowed her to flee the room entirely unscathed. She is also fast enough with her tech to salvage data from a geth whose squad she herself defeated. Not to mention geth are notoriously difficult to hack, especially since they wipe their data upon being disabled.

Shepard only has 1 good reason to recruit them "cool alien"

And the fact that they're all highly skilled specialists?

Wow you know nothing about them unless you talk to them after you recruit them.

It makes no sense to recruit people off the streets when you can take full of advantage of the Alliance.
If Garrus, Wrex, and Tali were spectres  than it would be ok with recruiting them because spectres are the best of the best.

N7 marines are the best of the best in the Alliance SHepard would rather recruit them than people off the streets 100/100 times.  

You really think an N7 marine like SHepard would rather have a teenage quarian on pilgrimage,  a Krogan mercenary, or turian C-sec officer than an N7 marine or a fellow spectre?

2 things, 1) these all came about right when you met them or are facts about their culture. 2) If he wouldnt bring them along, then why did he bring them along?