976 réponses à ce sujet

[abc_maelstrom]

If my money isn't wanted, so be it, but I can only hope that wisdom eventually prevails. I had been looking forward to purchasing this game as I have most Bioware titles over the last 15 years, but it sounds like this is going to go the same route as Mass Effect did for me - I never did purchase/play it (ME2, on the other hand...)



I dislike DRM as a whole (and lest anyone ask, I make my living writing software), but will tolerate most forms of it - even those annoying CD checks. One form I will not tolerate is one that forces me to be online - even if it's something as simple as "phone home once a month". Why not take the Stardock approach (no DRM, controlled patch availability via registration)? Doing this hasn't hurt their sales at all.



Anyway, those who unethically steal this software aren't affected by this unfortunate decision and I'm really sick of being punished for wanting to keep game developers gainfully employed. I guess that I'll just have to find something else to spend my money on.

[Seifz]

Fadook wrote...

This is all so baffling to me. People rage against DRM in games and the majority of developers/publishers ignore them. Now one developer lets you remove disc checks, install the game on as many computers as you want and says there'll be no SecuRom. In return, all they ask is that you log in when you install the game and every few days if you're playing offline.

For what purpose?  Once we've authenticated our copy, why do we need to continue logging in every few days?  What information are they collecting when they do this?  How often do we need to do this?  Does this DRM scheme prevent us from reselling the game?  What DRM software is installed and is it uninstalled entirely when we uninstall the game?

There are way too many unknowns here.  Besides, a disc check is infinitely better than this system for me.  This system only helps EA, and not much.

Please name these places where people can legally buy a copy of Dragon Age but are geuninely going to have problems accessing the internet.

1.  Anyone deployed overseas, such as active military members and supporting civilians.
2.  Anyone living in a rural area with weak or no Internet penetration.
3.  Anyone who's lost their connection because of a storm, ISP failure, bandwidth limitations, etc.
4.  Anyone who travels frequently and doesn't know when he'll have a connection.

Those are just four examples.  I bet that you could think of more if you tried.

EDIT:  5.  EA's servers are down for any reason.

Modifié par Seifz, 01 février 2011 - 10:44 .

[monika26]

I'm sorry Bioware, but I find this level of DRM unacceptable. The fact that the game has to re-authorize itself every few days just isn't acceptable to me, especially for $60! I was really looking forward to DA2 too, but I just can't accept those restrictions. I have canceled my DA2 SE pre-order.



Perhaps I will buy the game on Steam when it's around $30 or so, but there's no way I'm paying $60 for a game with this kind of DRM.

[Arcanon7]

Assassin's Creed 2 teaches us DRM is bad for those who actually buy the game, and doesn't stop piracy...I even downloaded the crack to play AC2 since the Ubisoft servers melted down. I just don't see the point of it.

[Mudface67]

Paying Customer: -



Pays £30.



"Thank you for buying the game. We will now check if you're a pirate"

*Copy activated*



*x days later*

"Are you a pirate now?"

*copy authenticated*



*x days later*

"How about now?"

*copy authenticated*



*x days later*

"I bet you pirated this, didn't you?"

*copy authenticated*



*x days later*

"Are you a pir......"

*error- cannot connect to server. terminating*



Repeat ad nauseam.



Pirate: -



Plays game for free.

[Marciel]

Lawliet89 wrote...

Marciel wrote...

To put it bluntly:
I see no difference to the "disarmed" system from ubisoft(requires login every time you start,timer to revalidate), which is for me unacceptable.DA:O was acceptable because only the DLC was DRM(execpt for an Disk check).So i will hold off my sale unless Steam(where i don't havw to revalidate after x days) goes down with it's price(and it will go down).The only thing is, i will miss is the boxart/DVD boy from the retrail version.I really hope bioware will be a bit more trusting to it's paying costumer and use the DA:O system making no disk check optional(like dungeons).If i remember correctly, Bioware tried to use an revalidation after 10 days in Mass effect 1.People were very angry.Securom or not it' the same shameful method

I believe Steam needs a "handshake" after a certain period of time. So it's not that different from the one they are using.

Nope Steam doesn't do that.In fact only third party DRM (like the current bioware system) want to revalidate.My Steam Account on the laptop hasn't been connected since early 2006.Steam saves all licences in an encrypted database.

[Gringbot]

cancelled preorder.



you know what would have been considerate? if you announced this before the whole "PREORDER BEFORE JAN __ AND GET UPGRADED VERSION"



if I would have known, i would have bought it on steam, but I got a retail version. now its too late to switch.



but NOT ONLY THAT, the DRM in its current state is UNACCEPTABLE. what makes you people think that punishing your paying customers is the right thing to do? the only thing this does is ENCOURAGE piracy. this has been PROVEN at this point. what makes you people so dense?



also, i have to say, the amount of commercialism and "special deals" and preorder bonuses, and exclusives, and all this extra junk that doesn't come with the stock version of the game gets on my nerves. what ever happened to selling a complete game?



btw, bioware, you are completely shooting your own foot here. its nerds that are your most loyal customers, its nerds who got you where you are, and yet here you are insulting our intelligence over and over again.



every game release is one step farther down the dark side of game making. where getting the product into peoples hands is more important then the product as it stands and what it represents, the quality of your company as a whole. its elitist nerds that see the quality in your games that keep you in business. when your games are sold in this ridiculously convoluted pile of activation codes and DRM, it reflects the quality of your work. and in my mind makes it look like a complete mess.



every release from you guys gets more corporate and less meaningful. remember, you sell EXPERIENCES, not just software. and these things end up reflecting on the experience in a very negative way.



up yours.

[Cheiron the Centaur]

I'm with Seifz on the privacy issue. I really value my privacy, and I don't like ANY company collecting information off my computer and saving it for whatever purpose. Which is why I still haven't accepted EA's updated policy (from approx. a year ago), and why I can no longer login to DAO. And DA2 is definitely no reason for me to change my views there.



However, given how DRM in DAO worked, I did have faith in Bioware and expected them to have something similar in DA2, in other words... I expected to be able to play the disc-based game without requiring an internet collection, and without the need to give EA an online approval to their user and privacy policy. I'm still waiting for a definite confirmation from Chris or Fernando stating that that is indeed what I need to do to be able to play the game. Because if it is, then I see no other option than to cancel my pre-order and wait for The Witcher 2 instead.

[Arcanon7]

Gringbot wrote...

cancelled preorder.

you know what would have been considerate? if you announced this before the whole "PREORDER BEFORE JAN __ AND GET UPGRADED VERSION"

if I would have known, i would have bought it on steam, but I got a retail version. now its too late to switch.

but NOT ONLY THAT, the DRM in its current state is UNACCEPTABLE. what makes you people think that punishing your paying customers is the right thing to do? the only thing this does is ENCOURAGE piracy. this has been PROVEN at this point. what makes you people so dense?

also, i have to say, the amount of commercialism and "special deals" and preorder bonuses, and exclusives, and all this extra junk that doesn't come with the stock version of the game gets on my nerves. what ever happened to selling a complete game?

btw, bioware, you are completely shooting your own foot here. its nerds that are your most loyal customers, its nerds who got you where you are, and yet here you are insulting our intelligence over and over again.

every game release is one step farther down the dark side of game making. where getting the product into peoples hands is more important then the product as it stands and what it represents, the quality of your company as a whole. its elitist nerds that see the quality in your games that keep you in business. when your games are sold in this ridiculously convoluted pile of activation codes and DRM, it reflects the quality of your work. and in my mind makes it look like a complete mess.

every release from you guys gets more corporate and less meaningful. remember, you sell EXPERIENCES, not just software. and these things end up reflecting on the experience in a very negative way.

up yours.

This.
But I'm not sure this is Bioware's fault, they are the developers, might have been EA's idea.

[Dendens]

Gringbot wrote...

cancelled preorder.

you know what would have been considerate? if you announced this before the whole "PREORDER BEFORE JAN __ AND GET UPGRADED VERSION"

if I would have known, i would have bought it on steam, but I got a retail version. now its too late to switch.

Except for the fact that you can switch.....cancel your current preorder then preorder on steam

[Gringbot]

Dendens wrote...

Gringbot wrote...

cancelled preorder.

you know what would have been considerate? if you announced this before the whole "PREORDER BEFORE JAN __ AND GET UPGRADED VERSION"

if I would have known, i would have bought it on steam, but I got a retail version. now its too late to switch.

Except for the fact that you can switch.....cancel your current preorder then preorder on steam

im talking about the signature edition with the free DLC, i wont get those bonuses if i switch.  unless somehow im wrong.

[Seifz]

Arcanon7 wrote...

This.
But I'm not sure this is Bioware's fault, they are the developers, might have been EA's idea.

BioWare is part of EA, now.  Their leaders are VPs of EA, they're all paid by EA, etc.  Separating the two is pointless.

You can say that it's not the fault of any programmers, artists, designers, or writers and I'd agree with you, there.  But  excusing BioWare entirely isn't right.

Modifié par Seifz, 01 février 2011 - 11:01 .

[Seifz]

Gringbot wrote...

Dendens wrote...

Gringbot wrote...

cancelled preorder.

you know what would have been considerate? if you announced this before the whole "PREORDER BEFORE JAN __ AND GET UPGRADED VERSION"

if I would have known, i would have bought it on steam, but I got a retail version. now its too late to switch.

Except for the fact that you can switch.....cancel your current preorder then preorder on steam

im talking about the signature edition with the free DLC, i wont get those bonuses if i switch.  unless somehow im wrong.

The Steam version doesn't have the Signature Edition stuff.  You won't get the bonuses if you switch, but you'd not have gotten them if you went with the Steam route before the deadline, either.

[Dendens]

Gringbot wrote...

Dendens wrote...

Gringbot wrote...

cancelled preorder.

you know what would have been considerate? if you announced this before the whole "PREORDER BEFORE JAN __ AND GET UPGRADED VERSION"

if I would have known, i would have bought it on steam, but I got a retail version. now its too late to switch.

Except for the fact that you can switch.....cancel your current preorder then preorder on steam

im talking about the signature edition with the free DLC, i wont get those bonuses if i switch.  unless somehow im wrong.

/irrelivant.

Whether this information had been released prior to Jan 11th, or after, you couldn't get the SE on steam. So your options are still the same

[Gringbot]

Seifz wrote...

The Steam version doesn't have the
Signature Edition stuff.  You won't get the bonuses if you switch, but
you'd not have gotten them if you went with the Steam route before the
deadline, either.

huh... interesting. thank you.  guess my opinion still stands for the most part.

[StingingVelvet]

Mudface67 wrote...

Paying Customer: -

Pays £30.

"Thank you for buying the game. We will now check if you're a pirate"
*Copy activated*

*x days later*
"Are you a pirate now?"
*copy authenticated*

*x days later*
"How about now?"
*copy authenticated*

*x days later*
"I bet you pirated this, didn't you?"
*copy authenticated*

*x days later*
"Are you a pir......"
*error- cannot connect to server. terminating*

Repeat ad nauseam.

Pirate: -

Plays game for free.

Bingo.

Paying customers should not get more hassle, less functionality and greater restriction.

[Holy_Shielder]

Gringbot wrote...

cancelled preorder.

you know what would have been considerate? if you announced this before the whole "PREORDER BEFORE JAN __ AND GET UPGRADED VERSION"

if I would have known, i would have bought it on steam, but I got a retail version. now its too late to switch.

I know right? I can't believe I didn't relise this sooner, it was a classic buttering up technique, I knew all these accumulating "early preorder" bonuses were too good to be true. It only because of this extremely long time I have had to wait that is slightly stopping me from cancelling, YET, which I'm sure was EA's plan right from the beginning, but I think over a littlle more time of pondering this type of hasel, even that wont be enough to save them from me cancelling.

[BTCentral]

SilverMoonDragon wrote...

Clarity around the Dragon Age 2 DRM seems vague. I have a few questions for anyone who knows;
1-I understand that you don't need a disk check. But, instead of online checks can you use the disk instead?
2-Would the online checks work with dial up internet?
3-Where specifically would need to make an account so you can online check DA 2?
4-When you online check DA 2 do you need to stay connected during the time your actually playing the game?
5-Does anyone know for sure how long the gap will be between online checks when you play offline?

Thank-you

1. No.
2. Yes.
3. It'll be your EA account, or in other words the one you use to login here.
4. No, it will validate and reset the counter to check again in X days - then you can go back to playing offline.
5. BioWare have not specified yet, it does not sound like this has actually been decided.

Hope this helps

Modifié par BTCentral, 01 février 2011 - 11:16 .

[KIrving]

Well the upside is I no longer feel a need to be on the fence about a decision to buy DA2 anymore. My internet connection is too dodgy for periodic login online authentication and I can't afford to upgrade my internet provider. Stable Internet access is so freaking expensive in Australia.



I have managed with a few games that required a one off online activation if I attempt such things in the early hours of the morning, although activation of a game recently with steam made me develop new gray hairs and realize that I just didn't know enough curse words to express my frustration.

[ToJKa1]

Seifz wrote...

ToJKa1 wrote...

Deadmac wrote...
Since the consumer exchanges money for a product, the consumer now owns the product in which is purchased. When I bought the game "Dragon Age: Origins", BioWare's ownership over my copy expires. Regardless about the legal notices they release with the game, I now own the game and the privacy to use it as to how I see fit.

Again, do you have to register a toaster oven, lamp, pillows, and sneakers before using them?

There is a difference between buying software and products. A product you do own, software you do not. When you buy software, you are really only buying a license to use it, which is limited by the terms of the EULA. Nowadays there exists technology to enforce the EULA, such as Steam. The medium (the discs) and packaging are products that you do own.

Most EULAs contain provisions that violate Fair Use laws and other consumer protection laws, such as those against making personal archival copies.  In addition, just about every EULA violates contract law.  I don't think that 99% of EULAs would stand up in court, if challenged.

Since this is the Internet, I must mention that I am not your lawyer and this is not legal advice.

There is atleast one case where US court ruled that EULA was binding. It was Autodesk's software IIRC.

Edit: found  a link http://www.gamespot....ws/6275683.html

Modifié par ToJKa1, 01 février 2011 - 11:25 .

[Shadowjedi01]

well this is good news.

I like the no-disc playablity.

[Lord Moths]

Well.... I´m disagree for the condition of DRM, because that i don´t buy this game.