976 réponses à ce sujet

[Lyssistr]

coolide wrote...

 Being a bunch of babies and crying about it isn't going to change anything.

Quite a few DRM boycotts have done the job so far, why being such a pesimist?

[DanaScu]

MrDizaztar wrote...

instead of complainning about DRM, just buy the game legit

You buy the game legit.

You can't, due to circumstances beyond your control, connect to the internet when the game is supposed to phone home.

You can't play your legit copy.

[sarcasm]Gee whillikers. I can't imagine why people would be complaining about that. [/sarcasm]

The only thing different than the MEpc drm is this doesn't have a limit of five activations before you have to call EA to beg for another activation to play your legal copy.

[Xolramuh]

StingingVelvet wrote...

ejoslin wrote...

This type of DRM does encourage piracy. Or it at least encourages people to start using cracks, even if they purchase the game itself. Why not something like, well, a disk check and then if there is no disk, then require the online authentication every few days? This would make both the people who hate disk checks happy, and the ones who don't have stable internet or who travel a lot happy as well.

for people who compare it with outdated hardware -- that's not the same thing at all. Internet access is not required to play a single player game, and furthermore, not having internet access does not diminish the game (as would building a game that would run on a 10 year old system would).

There will be cracked and pirated copies available the day after the game is released, if not sooner. And if a middle aged housewife like me knows where they will be, then EVERYONE does. Making the game hard to almost impossible to play because of restrictive DRM in the legal copies for many people is a mistake.

Edit: While I am definitely not against DRM, I think a one-time authentication is plenty.  Allow it on a limited number of machines (even if that limited number is 1 or 2), and then if you want to install it on a different machine, deauthenticate it during the uninstallation.  yes, there will be people who figure out how to keep it installed, but that is no different than people who figure out how to crack the game to begin with.  

Great post, I agree 100%.

Agreeing with your agree.

[Greevar]

MrDizaztar wrote...

instead of complainning about DRM, just buy the game legit

Therein lies the problem. The only people that have to deal with this DRM are the people who pay for it. Why should the paying customers have to deal with something that doesn't improve the game for them in anyway and doesn't do with it's designed to do effectively? DRM doesn't give you more story, or better game play. So what do we as customers have in stake for DRM? Nothing, it gives us nothing. It gives us less than nothing. It forces us to run through the maze like a good little rat and pretend that it can't be any other way.

The people that want the game for free will just download a cracked copy and install that. Even Ubisoft's grand DRM scheme didn't last more than a month. Even casual copying from your friend's disc is easy to do if you get the DRM removed. I'm sure the developers at Bioware don't like having to put this software on their games either. They know it's a waste of time and money, but the publishers and the publisher's shareholders are rather unenlightened about technology, and the reality of the situation for that matter, so they demand that the developers try to stop the infringement.

[Tin Soldier]

Eurypterid wrote...

Mariquis wrote...

I would really appreciate if someone could explain to me how this is supposed to work. 
A) after installation we don't need the disk to play the game
We can only play it on 5 PCs in 24 hours
C) After the initial installation it checks in every say 10 days, and you can play offline between those checks.
So if I have 6 PCs that are not connected in any way how is it going to tell that I've played it on 5 or more systems when I don't use the disk unless it's actually checking something online?

You can only activate on 5 PCs in any 24 hour period. There's no limit to how many you can install and play on.

Are you sure?  Mr. Priestly's original post says:
- There is a limit to the number of unique/different PCs that can start/play the game within a time window [5 PCs in 24hrs].

[slimgrin]

coolide wrote...

They'll never find a solution if they never try anything. This may not be it, but it's a step in the right direction to preventing piracy.

You people are making this out to be a much bigger idea than it actually is. If it is such an issue, then just buy an Xbox and then you don't have to worry about it. Being a bunch of babies and crying about it isn't going to change anything.

Not buying the game will change things. 

By the way, I would love for them to explain why the DRM for ME2 and DA was inadequate. What brought on the stricter measures?

What really sucks is if they try this with ME3, I won't be getting that game either.

[coolide]

Seifz wrote...

coolide wrote...

Is being connected to the Internet such a inconvenience? You're connected right now.

For many, yes.  Connected right now is not equal to connected always.

You use the word many quite liberally.  I would estimate that close to 99% of the people in first world countries have Internet access.

[coolide]

DanaScu wrote...

MrDizaztar wrote...

instead of complainning about DRM, just buy the game legit

You buy the game legit.

You can't, due to circumstances beyond your control, connect to the internet when the game is supposed to phone home.

You can't play your legit copy.

[sarcasm]Gee whillikers. I can't imagine why people would be complaining about that. [/sarcasm]

The only thing different than the MEpc drm is this doesn't have a limit of five activations before you have to call EA to beg for another activation to play your legal copy.

What do you do when you lose your power?  Curse the gaming company for not providing a power generator with each game copy?

[coolide]

Majere wrote...

MrDizaztar wrote...

instead of complainning about DRM, just buy the game legit

It's only the legit customers that are affected by DRM.

The dummies who can't understand the more complex instructions on how to pirate the game are also affected.  As are the people who have to put in the numerous hours to find a crack for the game.  It's only the people who leech of everyone else and can understand the instructions who are unaffected.

[Reaverwind]

Greevar wrote...

MrDizaztar wrote...

instead of complainning about DRM, just buy the game legit

Therein lies the problem. The only people that have to deal with this DRM are the people who pay for it. Why should the paying customers have to deal with something that doesn't improve the game for them in anyway and doesn't do with it's designed to do effectively? DRM doesn't give you more story, or better game play. So what do we as customers have in stake for DRM? Nothing, it gives us nothing. It gives us less than nothing. It forces us to run through the maze like a good little rat and pretend that it can't be any other way.

Don't run the maze. Don't buy the game. There are other games to spend your money on.

[Seifz]

coolide wrote...

Seifz wrote...

coolide wrote...

Is being connected to the Internet such a inconvenience? You're connected right now.

For many, yes.  Connected right now is not equal to connected always.

You use the word many quite liberally.  I would estimate that close to 99% of the people in first world countries have Internet access.

I've posted multiple lists of reasons why you might not be able to connect to the Internet when the games wants to re-authorize.  I see no reason to do it again.

Besides, this is only one complaint against the DRM scheme.  There are many others and there are still many unanswered questions.  I can't imagine making a decision about this game without said answers.  For example, what data is being collected to identify which PC we're using?  Can I resell the game?  How many days between authorizations?  Etc.

[MingWolf]

Lyssistr wrote...

Is DRM hurting people who pay for their games or people who don't pay for their games?

 I don't pirate, it's a matter of perspective, nor will I pirate because of DRM, I'll simply skip the game. But honestly, does it make sense to have a cost premium on a technically inferior product (with additional limitations)?

  In the 80s (yeah a long time ago admittedly) people who payed for their games got maps, books and tons of **** to enhance their experience. Today it's like all they get is additional restrictions.

Considering that most of what I have experienced from Bioware's game factory up North has given me the value which I pay for, I suppose I can tolerate a reasonable DRM scheme that was presented to us on this thread.

However, I myself do tend to skip software/games with DRM.  If presented with two games with similar value, where one has DRM and one does not, and I could only choose one, then I would most definately choose the one without DRM.  As a customer, I hate buying anything with strings attached, even if its a few periodic checks to see if the software on my system is valid.  Also, is DRM really helping to deter piracy? 

Now, I understand that this isn't exactly the thread where we are supposed to be discussing DRM.  However, as a customer with the vain hope of wishing that some day, software and game developers would smarten up and get rid of DRM altogether, I feel that I should at least spend this minimal amount of bandwidth in expressing an opinion.  This is about the marketability of a product to the end customer.  As an end customer, I'm hesitant about taking out cash for anything with strings attached.  Why?  In has the potential of inconveniencing me, however subtle the effects are.  Having less DRM is probably good for business.  In fact, that is probably why some games out there are advertised as "DRM free."

[coolide]

Greevar wrote...

MrDizaztar wrote...

instead of complainning about DRM, just buy the game legit

Therein lies the problem. The only people that have to deal with this DRM are the people who pay for it. Why should the paying customers have to deal with something that doesn't improve the game for them in anyway and doesn't do with it's designed to do effectively? DRM doesn't give you more story, or better game play. So what do we as customers have in stake for DRM? Nothing, it gives us nothing. It gives us less than nothing. It forces us to run through the maze like a good little rat and pretend that it can't be any other way.

The people that want the game for free will just download a cracked copy and install that. Even Ubisoft's grand DRM scheme didn't last more than a month. Even casual copying from your friend's disc is easy to do if you get the DRM removed. I'm sure the developers at Bioware don't like having to put this software on their games either. They know it's a waste of time and money, but the publishers and the publisher's shareholders are rather unenlightened about technology, and the reality of the situation for that matter, so they demand that the developers try to stop the infringement.

It gives you a better game indirectly.  Increased sales equals an increased budget, which sometimes equals a better game.  Why do you think Half-Life 2 had an enormous budget?  Because Half-Life 1 sold so well.

[coolide]

Seifz wrote...
I've posted multiple lists of reasons why you might not be able to connect to the Internet when the games wants to re-authorize.  I see no reason to do it again.

Besides, this is only one complaint against the DRM scheme.  There are many others and there are still many unanswered questions.  I can't imagine making a decision about this game without said answers.  For example, what data is being collected to identify which PC we're using?  Can I resell the game?  How many days between authorizations?  Etc.

Those questions have been answered multiple times.  I see no reason why they should be answered again.

Modifié par coolide, 02 février 2011 - 03:27 .

[MrDizazta]

Can somebody please explain why including DRM ruins the game? All I see this as is EA/BioWare trying to protect their interests.

[Lyssistr]

MrDizaztar wrote...

Can somebody please explain why including DRM ruins the game? All I see this as is EA/BioWare trying to protect their interests.

 Ruin is relative, the point with DRM is that it often tends to be a hussle. One common problem is installing drivers without reason, another is reinstalling the game in the future, when the new windows OS won't happily install the drm driver without trouble, etc etc.

 The point is that this way, people who pay get the technically inferior product and people who pirate get the best thing.

Modifié par Lyssistr, 02 février 2011 - 03:32 .

[coolide]

Half-Life 2 not only required you to have an Internet connection to play it, but it also required you to download Steam. And I don't recall that game suffering as a result. Or anyone complaining.



Just be thankful they haven't made this game a MMORPG.

[MingWolf]

MrDizaztar wrote...

Can somebody please explain why including DRM ruins the game? All I see this as is EA/BioWare trying to protect their interests.

Say that after a long day of work, you decide to sit down on your computer to play a game.  It doesn't run because for some reason, your internet service provider is having a hiccup and cannot connect to the master server that resides with the game publisher to validate your software. 

Whether you'd be angry would depend on you.  I know a lot of people would be.  


Lets take a more concrete example.

Say you want to play Dragon Age: Orgins.  Little to your knowledge, your ISP is having hiccups and can't connect to the master server.  Your DLCs don't load.  After gaming for a couple hours, you notice that all your DLC equipment is stripped and Shale isn't there any longer.  You realized you just saved recently and your last save point is several hours back.  When you finally discovered what is going on, you realize that the only way to restore your stuff is to restore that old save point several hours back.  

Yeah, it happened to me, and I got slightly annoyed by that.  Thankfully its just the DLCs. 

[coolide]

If you guys don't accept DRM, then I can see computer games going extinct and them being exclusively made for consoles. There is just no way they can justify making games for an unprofitable system. If you want computer gaming to die, then keep on complaining about their efforts to reduce piracy and boycotting their products.

[Lyssistr]

coolide wrote...

If you guys don't accept DRM, then I can see computer games going extinct and them being exclusively made for consoles. There is just no way they can justify making games for an unprofitable system. If you want computer gaming to die, then keep on complaining about their efforts to reduce piracy and boycotting their products.

Well tbh, even though I'm not a big fan, playing on a console is better than installing that **** on your computer.

[coolide]

MingWolf wrote...

MrDizaztar wrote...

Can somebody please explain why including DRM ruins the game? All I see this as is EA/BioWare trying to protect their interests.

Say that after a long day of work, you decide to sit down on your computer to play a game.  It doesn't run because for some reason, your internet service provider is having a hiccup and cannot connect to the master server that resides with the game publisher to validate your software. 

Whether you'd be angry would depend on you.  I know a lot of people would be.  


Lets take a more concrete example.

Say you want to play Dragon Age: Orgins.  Little to your knowledge, your ISP is having hiccups and can't connect to the master server.  Your DLCs don't load.  After gaming for a couple hours, you notice that all your DLC equipment is stripped and Shale isn't there any longer.  You realized you just saved recently and your last save point is several hours back.  When you finally discovered what is going on, you realize that the only way to restore your stuff is to restore that old save point several hours back.  

Yeah, it happened to me, and I got slightly annoyed by that.  Thankfully its just the DLCs. 

That's hardly a concrete example.   Based on what I've read about their DRM, the statistical probability of that happening is insignificant.

[Eurypterid]

Tin Soldier wrote...

Eurypterid wrote...

You can only activate on 5 PCs in any 24 hour period. There's no limit to how many you can install and play on.

Are you sure?  Mr. Priestly's original post says:
- There is a limit to the number of unique/different PCs that can start/play the game within a time window [5 PCs in 24hrs].

I'm not sure why this seems so complicated. You can only install/activate on 5 unique PCs in a 24 hour period. After that 24 hour period rolls by, you can install on 5 more. The statement just above the one you quoted, from Chris Priestly's OP, clearly states there's no limit on the number of PCs you can install on. You're restricted to 5 PCs only in any consecutive 24 hour period.

[Reaverwind]

MrDizaztar wrote...

Can somebody please explain why including DRM ruins the game? All I see this as is EA/BioWare trying to protect their interests.

And doing a poor job of it. I'd have no problem with this were DA2 a multiplayer game or mmo. However, I buy SINGLE-player games to avoid login issues. And now Bioware/EA wants to implement them? Forget that - I might as well go back to mmo's. I hear SOE is bending over backwards to draw customers in.