272 réponses à ce sujet

[Sjofn]

Elsariel wrote...

Legbiter wrote...

No emo runs for my Hawke. Also, men should in general keep the blubbing in front of women to an absolute minimum. Say, once or twice per lifetime. Women want men to be honest about and in touch with their emotions the same way the IRS wants you to be honest about your income. Too much wibbling and they take it as a subconscious sign to start seeking greener pastures.

I call BS.  My husband weeps more than I do and he's every bit a man and I love him for it.  I love how men think all women don't want men who display emotion.  I'm here to say that not all women feel that way.  I love that my man is comfortable enough with his masculinity to shed some tears.  My man is not weak or wimpy or effeminate or emo. 
He's 100% man.  He's himself. 

You can't fool him, he's onto our Estrogen Fueled Hive Mind where all women say they want one thing and universally want another. The good times are over! Our secret is out!

[raziel3080]

Sjofn wrote...

Elsariel wrote...

Legbiter wrote...

No emo runs for my Hawke. Also, men should in general keep the blubbing in front of women to an absolute minimum. Say, once or twice per lifetime. Women want men to be honest about and in touch with their emotions the same way the IRS wants you to be honest about your income. Too much wibbling and they take it as a subconscious sign to start seeking greener pastures.

I call BS.  My husband weeps more than I do and he's every bit a man and I love him for it.  I love how men think all women don't want men who display emotion.  I'm here to say that not all women feel that way.  I love that my man is comfortable enough with his masculinity to shed some tears.  My man is not weak or wimpy or effeminate or emo. 
He's 100% man.  He's himself. 

You can't fool him, he's onto our Estrogen Fueled Hive Mind where all women say they want one thing and universally want another. The good times are over! Our secret is out!

* has known about this thing with women for years...considering he grew up in his grandmother's house with his mom and her 3 sisters for the better part of his childhood*

Yeah, I would say your secret is out...though I don't cry a whole lot period...unless it's an absolute tear jerker of movie(which I'm probadly being asked(forced) to watch)....

I can also say I've seen both sides of this sorta thing...so the "emo" thing is okay...but I don't think I'm gonna be having my 'male' hawke(s) doing these kinds of runs more than once...the female(s) on the other hand...we will see..it's always interesting for me to play a game like this from the role of a female...

[ThatDancingTurian]

I was turned off when Thane cried in his romance cut scene. I don't think it was because he's male, I just thought it seemed forced. I just don't know if games can pull of that level of emotion that easily. I've seen lots of movies and shows with women -and- men crying and I've had it really move me. But someone posted a link on an earlier page of some scene from a game that made them cry, but when I watched it I was just torn between cringing and laughing.



I say if you can't make it believable, don't attempt it. Better to leave it out than risk it not working, because if it isn't done perfectly it goes straight to narm.

[tmp7704]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

I was turned off when Thane cried in his romance cut scene. I don't think it was because he's male, I just thought it seemed forced. I just don't know if games can pull of that level of emotion that easily.

Now that you mention ME2, if i'm not mistaken Jack's crying during her romance scene was received rather favourably.

As far as DA goes, Alistair comes pretty close to it too couple of times.

[ThatDancingTurian]

tmp7704 wrote...



Now that you mention ME2, if i'm not mistaken Jack's crying during her romance scene was received rather favourably.



As far as DA goes, Alistair comes pretty close to it too couple of times.

I've seen Jack's cut scene and I guess the fact that it wasn't awkward or off-putting to me should give it points.



Alistair's post-Ostagar dialogues worked for me probably because he -didn't- cry. He didn't have a poorly animated single stream of tears to ruin the drama of his grief. He didn't need to cry for you to know he was hurting inside. The fact that he was just barely holding it at bay made it -more- emotional to me.

[tmp7704]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Alistair's post-Ostagar dialogues worked for me probably because he -didn't- cry. He didn't have a poorly animated single stream of tears to ruin the drama of his grief. He didn't need to cry for you to know he was hurting inside. The fact that he was just barely holding it at bay made it -more- emotional to me.

Yeah, the restraint worked rather well in this case; just the same though it was pretty obvious display of emotion. I think it wasn't the only approach that could've worked, and in any case it'd be nice option to have for the PC in some situations.

[Collider]

tmp7704 wrote...

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Alistair's post-Ostagar dialogues worked for me probably because he -didn't- cry. He didn't have a poorly animated single stream of tears to ruin the drama of his grief. He didn't need to cry for you to know he was hurting inside. The fact that he was just barely holding it at bay made it -more- emotional to me.

Yeah, the restraint worked rather well in this case; just the same though it was pretty obvious display of emotion. I think it wasn't the only approach that could've worked, and in any case it'd be nice option to have for the PC in some situations.

I agree completely.
I do want to play a player character who is able to feel sorrow, remorse, etc. Not infallible and completely stoic.

[tmp7704]

Collider wrote...

I do want to play a player character who is able to feel sorrow, remorse, etc. Not infallible and completely stoic.

There's instance of that in DAO if you go with the option of killing Connor -- the PC returns to the others and is rather obviously depressed about the whole thing.



ironically enough most people probably won't see it, with the ideal solution being available and generally preferred.

[ThatDancingTurian]

Collider wrote...

I agree completely.
I do want to play a player character who is able to feel sorrow, remorse, etc. Not infallible and completely stoic.

Oh I agree, I don't want a character who's as stone faced as Shepard was. My only concern is not whether the character should be sad, just whether or not the crying would be pulled off in a way that doesn't make me roll my eyes.

But yeah, I think I'll be disappointed if Mama Hawke and one of the siblings are both standing their bawling their eyes out and Hawke does the typical hero thing and doesn't emote at all just because he/she is the leader and has to keep them together or something. That's not something actual people do.

Speaking of Connor, man... I tried killing him and I had to reset before I even got to that part, because Isolde just made me feel so bad I decided to revert and get the stupid Circle to help instead. And I don't even like Isolde.

[Collider]

Oh I agree, I don't want a character who's as stone faced as Shepard was. My only concern is not whether the character should be sad, just whether or not the crying would be pulled off in a way that doesn't make me roll my eyes.

Indeed, they could potentially mishandle it. They even did so in ME2, in my opinion. Wasn't terrible, but I'd prefer they didn't employ the same methods for Hawke in DA2.



Of course, I do want to see Hawke be able to be emotionally expressive by option, as you say.

[tmp7704]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Speaking of Connor, man... I tried killing him and I had to reset before I even got to that part, because Isolde just made me feel so bad I decided to revert and get the stupid Circle to help instead. And I don't even like Isolde.

In my playthrough i had my character back down at the last moment and then Isolde had that moment of wrestling with herself and eventually admitted/realized that's the only way and asked to be the one to do it, being mother and all. For all the badmouthing her VA gets, she really pulled that one off

[Sjofn]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Alistair's post-Ostagar dialogues worked for me probably because he -didn't- cry. He didn't have a poorly animated single stream of tears to ruin the drama of his grief. He didn't need to cry for you to know he was hurting inside. The fact that he was just barely holding it at bay made it -more- emotional to me.

You really have to give Alistair's voice actor a lot of credit for that. He was really, really good at the "barely keeping tears in check" voice.


EDIT: And yes, the one time I killed Connor I was depressed for hours afterwards. The best part was I triggered it by accident (I went into Arl Eamon's room to click on a book, whoops!). I decided not to reload because I liked it from a story standpoint, but I still felt awful about it. And then! Alistair loses it on me back at camp! It was terrible. 

Modifié par Sjofn, 02 février 2011 - 06:58 .

[raziel3080]

tmp7704 wrote...

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

Speaking of Connor, man... I tried killing him and I had to reset before I even got to that part, because Isolde just made me feel so bad I decided to revert and get the stupid Circle to help instead. And I don't even like Isolde.

In my playthrough i had my character back down at the last moment and then Isolde had that moment of wrestling with herself and eventually admitted/realized that's the only way and asked to be the one to do it, being mother and all. For all the badmouthing her VA gets, she really pulled that one off

That scene that you posted tmp, is one I have never seen, because I usually always went the circle route as well(though everytime I did get to that and part and meet Isolde...I SOOOOOOOO wanted smack her(kinda wished we had 'renegade' interrupt right there to do just that).] So, I can see where you are coming from Aris. There was thread on here wanting them to NOT a situation like that where you 'get' out of it by going to the circle for help. I kinda agree with that assessment because what's to stop the demon from sending those undead monsters to destroy the rest of redcliffe as it stood at that point...

The 'stoic' behavior...if that behavior can happen in that situation... it should be by player's choice...either through some sorta dialog option or by virtue of your previous dialog responces...since that is apparently how the dialog wheel in DA 2 will work. Though I can already see argument against this would be by having that choice made from your earlier choices you could possibly have someone with a 'sarcastic' or humorous(as the devs put) look on their face at the point should their be a piece of plot in the storyt like that...

[AlexXIV]

tmp7704 wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Because they are actors. Actors cry alot actually.

Actors play characters. That may involve crying if the character is supposed to be sad and such reaction was deemed appropriate.
When you play RPG, you play a character too. That may involve making the character cry if such reaction is deemed appropriate.

These are very similar, overall.

edit: 'ed

Well it's just my opinion really. I don't think heroes should cry. I know they do, but my heroes don't. For all I care there could be an option to make your PC cry, but please then make it really optional because my PC won't display emotion in that fashion in public.

Edit: I guess it is something personal. Nobody seen me cry since I was like 16 and even then it was because of a girl. Doesn't mean I don't have emotions and that I don't cry when nobody is looking, but public display of weakness aka crying in front of other people is just something I won't do under no circumstances, so I can't really relate to a so-called hero doing it. Even if I see 'heroes' cry in movies I always find it cheesy.

But that's just me I guess.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 02 février 2011 - 07:10 .

[Pedonecrophile]

Alanosborn1991 wrote...
In all of the Bioware games I have played, KOTOR, Mass Effect, Dragon Age there is no option for your character to break down and cry in. To show how bad it is that your family has been murdered/ galaxy is about to be destroyed, friend/ someone you loved has died and it was your fault/ decision.

[commanderVal]

Is it just me or did nobody else see the Cousland warden's face contort when he/she saw his/her father in a pool of his own blood in the larder? Or Isolde's many expressions when Connor was possessed? The graphics in Dragon Age doesn't really support such expressions but they made do. I was satisfied with what I saw Alistair do and while an occassional manly tear is fine for my warden or my Hawke, I don't think anyone who is a leader will bawl in front of his/her party. That will definitely affect morale and the question leader's ability to command.
Consider this: When we go up to Haven for the urn of sacred ashes, Sten questions our tactics. If The Warden broke down at some point, I don't doubt Sten would have saved him/her the embarrassment with a neat swing of his blade. Unless you're in a party where you're not the leader, crying is not an option.

[tmp7704]

AlexXIV wrote...

For all I care there could be an option to make your PC cry, but please then make it really optional because my PC won't display emotion in that fashion in public.

Oh, definitely; think this thread shows pretty clear that such sort of display being anything but optional... would be received pretty badly by rather large group

edit: in fact i'd probably be somewhat miffed by it myself, since it's not something that'd fit all kinds of characters i may choose to play. Still, as long as it's option... gimme gimme gimme.

Modifié par tmp7704, 02 février 2011 - 07:20 .

[In Exile]

tmp7704 wrote...
ironically enough most people probably won't see it, with the ideal solution being available and generally preferred.

That really bugged me, because my PC was all ''This is neccesary and the best option.'' It just really broke character for me to get stuck with that reaction. 

The option to cry isn't bad per se... but it has to be well marked as an option so it isn't out of character.

[tmp7704]

In Exile wrote...

That really bugged me, because my PC was all ''This is neccesary and the best option.'' It just really broke character for me to get stuck with that reaction. 

Hmm but did that belief about the necessity completely prevent your character from simply feeling sorry for the mother who just lost her child? I mean, i suppose if the character was also either devoid of empathy or too self-absorbed to even consider that aspect, i could see the reaction to be character-breaking. But otherwise... dunno. Necessity just doesn't rule out regret, imo.

Modifié par tmp7704, 02 février 2011 - 07:27 .

[AlexXIV]

tmp7704 wrote...

In Exile wrote...

That really bugged me, because my PC was all ''This is neccesary and the best option.'' It just really broke character for me to get stuck with that reaction. 

Hmm but did that belief about the necessity completely prevent your character from simply feeling sorry for the mother who just lost her child? I mean, i suppose if the character was also either devoid of empathy or too self-absorbed to even consider that aspect, i could see the reaction to be character-breaking. But otherwise... dunno. Necessity just doesn't rule out regret, imo.

Well crying is always associated with feeling sorry. Or not crying is associated with lack of empathy. But that's not true, you can look sad, hug her, say something nice, whatever. Nowadays it is fashion to cry everywhere to show that you are good person or something. Tbh I have seen the biggest ****s I know break into tears. It doesn't really mean anything aside from being able to hold back the tears. Or wanting it to begin with.

[tmp7704]

AlexXIV wrote...

Well crying is always associated with feeling sorry. Or not crying is associated with lack of empathy. But that's not true, you can look sad, hug her, say something nice, whatever.

Aye, that scene in question doesn't have the Warden crying i think, it just makes them appear sad about what have just happened. The way i read In Exile's post, he was upset that the character was shown having this sort of emotion at all while the character's belief was that's something that had to be done... and i just didn't really see any inherent conflict between such belief and the display, hence the question to clarify what sort of character it was.

[koshiee]

i want the option to ****** continuously, even in battle.

[da0Xeffect]

I would like to see the options on the wheel:

(shed one tear)

(breakdown and cry)

[commanderVal]

koshiee wrote...

i want the option to ****** continuously, even in battle.

like this?

[FellowerOfOdin]

Deathwurm wrote...
Real Men aren't afraid to Cry!

You "Real Men" are awesome, makes us REAL MEN look better