77 réponses à ce sujet

[brent2605]

I think there should be some decisions that backfire for both paragon and renegade choices.

[Ryzaki]

Uh sure. Just let some renegade decisions backfire too.



Shep Sue hasn't gotten any comeuppance regardless of paragon/renegade.

[xxprokillazxx]

that alot of people die in earth by destroying the collector base and losing all that technoligy.

[Zulu_DFA]

I expect the Rachni queen to bite you from behind, if it's alive, but that's about it. The "wrong" renegade decision is to send Legion to Cerberus. The rest will have just cosmetic effect.

[AdmiralCheez]

Name a renegade decision that actually backfired, as in REALLY messed you up.

[Lunatic LK47]

Brodyaha wrote...

Hello all,

So, this may seem blunt, but I would like some paragon decisions to bite Shepard in the butt in ME3.

Why?  Well, I think renegades don't really get the kudos they deserve in the Mass Effect universe.  Paragon decisions seem to be perceived as being the high path of sorts, seen more as doing the right thing, in my opinion.  Decisions such as destroying the base, rewriting the geth, and saving the council are all paragon decisions.

Decisions such as killing the rachni, destroying the geth, and letting the council die are all renegade, and they seem to leave Shepard worse off.  I think renegade decisions are seen as more ruthless, more lawless, more evil, and not seen as the pragmatic decisions they can be.

But what if a paragon decision was to backfire?   What if the rachni decide to take over the galaxy?  What if the council doesn't take action on earth, and the Alliance has to defend earth alone without the support of the alien races?  What if the Collector Base ends up being a major weapon to defeat the Reapers, despite what your squadmates tell you about TIM's ego?

What paragon decision would you want to see backfire in ME3?

Ever wonder why I hated Fallout 3? It had bull**** moments of "Either keep the status quo, or you'll FUBAR everything," making the game a collosal waste of my time.

[Batlass8]

I'd actually really like to see rewriting the geth turn out to be a terrible idea. I spent all my time worrying that the 'returned' geth would corrupt the original geth. That should happen. And, bonus, then if you told the quarians not to go to war with the geth, they'll be beyond pissed at Shepard.



Also, I'd like Sidonis to show up as a Reaper lackey or something if you spared him. Partially to bite paragon!Shep in the rear, but also partially so Garrus can have a TOLD YOU SO moment.

[omgodzilla]

Destroying the collector base should  definitely bite Shepard in the ass. I mean come on, its ridiculous to have every Paragon option be the best choice in the fight against the Reapers. Saving the Rachni could also be a big negative. I can't really see them trying to take over the galaxy again but it would have to create alot of tension with the other races if you let them live. Especially with the Krogan, maybe they won't help you if you decide to ally with the Rachni.

Letting Balak go free at the end of Bring down the sky could also cause problems. Obviously it wouldn't be very major since its just a dlc but Balak is a terrorist after all so he could be involved in a side mission or 2 in ME3.

I really do hope that there are Paragon options that make things hard for you. It would go a long way in making me feel like less of an idiot when playing as a Renegade.

Modifié par omgodzilla, 04 février 2011 - 12:40 .

[Ryzaki]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Name a renegade decision that actually backfired, as in REALLY messed you up.

None have. Shep Sue has an immunity to realistic consequences.

There should've been a war for the human led council nonsense. More people should have died than were saved in the case you saved the Council.

BW won't make anyone suffer because you'll get a bunch of QQing for oneside or another.

And if rewriting the heretics backfire My Paragon Shep could care less. He blew them up. Always has always will. They're only 5% of the population anyways and the True Geth can easily replace them.

As for the Rachni Queen I don't actually think that should backfire unless giving Cerberus the base backfires. In both cases Shepard took a heavy gamble.

I want the scales to be even. If Paragon Shep has to deal with indoctrinated rachni, Renegade should have to deal with indoctrinated Cerberus scientists.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 04 février 2011 - 12:45 .

[EternalPink]

Quarrians - all go settle a new world, dismantle there fleet and destroy all there weapons in a mass tree hugging orgy - i.e useless allies in a fight



Geth - now that they've got the heretics back so theres no immediate threat to them from mechanicals and they've made nice with one organic they see how killing organics is wrong and destroy all there weapons in a electric tree hugging orgy - i.e useless allies in a fight

[Batlass8]

EternalPink wrote...

Quarrians - all go settle a new world, dismantle there fleet and destroy all there weapons in a mass tree hugging orgy - i.e useless allies in a fight

Geth - now that they've got the heretics back so theres no immediate threat to them from mechanicals and they've made nice with one organic they see how killing organics is wrong and destroy all there weapons in a electric tree hugging orgy - i.e useless allies in a fight

And now I'm imagining the quarians and the geth as ewoks...

[AdmiralCheez]

Ryzaki wrote...

AdmiralCheez wrote...

Name a renegade decision that actually backfired, as in REALLY messed you up.

None have. Shep Sue as an immunity to realistic consequences.

Precisely.

[kimbabini]

I am not concerned about the Rachni... more the Krogans. I chose to keep the data but not to continue research. I figure that was as -inthemiddle- as it gets. Paragons that chose to help the Krogan might end up

destroyingtheirwholerace

[Xilizhra]

Ask for better outcomes for Renegade decisions, not punishments for Paragon ones.

[Collider]

No "gotcha!" moments, please.

[jbblue05]

Shavon wrote...

I agree with brent2605.

An easy one to backfire for paragons, potentially, could be allowing the Rachni Queen to live in ME1. The Reapers used the Rachni in the past to start the destruction on the galaxy, only stopped by the krogans. Who's to say the Reapers won't get to them again?

A decision that will most certainly backfire for the renegades is encouraging the war between the geth and the quarians. They sacrifice two potential groups of allies for the war against the reapers instead of the decimated numbers that remain as a result of the war.

The Rachni attacked on their own free will they are not innocent victims.  Bioware wants you to think they are super nice paragons that were wronged

The quarians are idiots if they let a human's opinion determine whether they go to war or not.

.

[Zubie]

This is a new and exciting topic

[kimbabini]

Yes it is easygame88

[EternalPink]

Shavon wrote...

I agree with brent2605.

An easy one to backfire for paragons, potentially, could be allowing the Rachni Queen to live in ME1. The Reapers used the Rachni in the past to start the destruction on the galaxy, only stopped by the krogans. Who's to say the Reapers won't get to them again?

A decision that will most certainly backfire for the renegades is encouraging the war between the geth and the quarians. They sacrifice two potential groups of allies for the war against the reapers instead of the decimated numbers that remain as a result of the war.

people that are at war or happen to be planning to go to war have lots of weapons, paragon options that make the universe a peace loving place mean people don't need weapons since Shepard will come save them from anything nasty

[technikr]

You are right, Paragon is aligned with choices that favor ethic choices of morality and that polarization of ideas should not determine outcome, rather the complete considerations of all sides so that misunderstandings do not come from emotions nor prejudices.



Now, whether or not past paragon decisions lead to bad outcomes is content that the story writers of mass effect 3 will have to determine to us.



A 'paragon' decision made at one moment of time will not necessarily guide an outcome that upholds to a 'paragon' code.



example: I release the rachni. They flourish. They expand. As their population increases and time passes, factions within the starting population are created due to differentiating ideologies existent in their culture. One faction adopts xenophobic agendas.



Now whether or not I want scenarios of 'paragon decisions backfiring' to occur in mass effect 3? Im impartial. Let some paragon choices have bad outcomes. If they're completely consistent in the lore of the game, then so be it.



But this all depends on how Bioware has implemented their Paragon/Neutral/Renegade systems and how they've integrated it into their development policy.



Do they define Paragon as always doing the right thing? Is the right thing beneficial to shepherd? If this is true, Paragon actions that lead to paragon decisions must lead to more paragon situations in the situation of commander shepherd. This is vice-versa with renegade.



So we'd have to really establish what paragon/renegade choices mean to the mechanics of bioware's storyline progression and what were they intended as factors. Before we could begin weighing in how our choices affect the lore.

[Ryzaki]

Shavon wrote...

Or, you know, we could keep conersation going on this thread without bringing in the whole "Shepad is a Mary Sue"

But whatever.

And how pray tell is Shep not a sue? By virtue of being a PC he's a sue.

It's not that big of a deal. I don't know why people act like a Mary Sue is automatically a horrible character.