522 réponses à ce sujet

[Randy1012]

Heck, I'm actually tempted to go back and do a completely new playthrough just to get that armor for Miranda. And I've already beaten the dang game six times.

I do hope that the new armor for Miranda is a sign that we'll get some kind of compromise for ME3. Have the squad wear unique, custom casualwear while hanging out onboard the Normandy, then put them in unique, custom armor when they leave to join Shepard on a mission off the ship. I don't see why that would be so difficult.

[GameBoyish]

I remember it being said that their outfits ain't customisable in ME3.



But here's to hoping for unique armor and unique casuals in ME3!!!



Seriously, watching Samara's exposed boobs of steel versus a heavy fire is just disturbing...



I believe the casual outfits can get as fanservice-y as possible but firefights require protection.

[Val Seleznyov]

Babli wrote...

I give up. I cant argue and use common sense and logic.

It's not difficult. Just pay attention my posts and you'll soon figure it out.

[Randy1012]

TriviaAeducan wrote...

I remember it being said that their outfits ain't customisable in ME3.

If you're referring to my post (if not, then I apologize in advance), I didn't mean I want customizable outfits for squadmates. By 'custom' I just meant their own unique casualwear and armor that you won't see on any NPCs.

[Babli]

Val Seleznyov wrote...

Babli wrote...

I give up. I cant argue and use common sense and logic.

It's not difficult. Just pay attention my posts and you'll soon figure it out.

Now you are definitely trolling.

[GameBoyish]

Val Seleznyov wrote...

Babli wrote...

Val Seleznyov wrote...

I find it interesting that the only people that bring up Miranda's overt sexualism are the codex zealots and armour fundamentalists.

I'm capable of looking at Miranda and seeing past that -- seeing what her outfits really say about her as a human being. But like i said in another thread, i just have a more enlightened attitude on women and equality.

Nice speech man. I wonder what girls/women on this forum think about your..ehm...enlightened view

I'm sure that many of them would agree with me.

Most of you are completely missing the point though. It's not about putting a woman in skintight clothing. I'd feel the same way if Miranda's outfit was a tracksuit.

It is established that she's good at what she does, and that she takes pride in her appearance. She's confident enough that her desire to look the way that she wants to look entices her to disregard battlefield practicality to a small extent.

Putting her in armour is a total disregard for her confidence, combat ability and desire to look a certain way. That's not a good message for women.

First and foremost I am a woman and I highly disagree with you.

I am pretty sure mere "confidence, combat ability and desire to look a certain way" does not give me any form of protection from gunshots.

Sure, I am confident enough to go out in a catsuit (they are awesome, though hard to wear) but it does not protect me from getting wounded.

Not a good message for women...?

*woman plays ME1*

Woman: OMG she has to wear armor! Women have to wear armor??? Oh woe is me! Why can't she just wear her favourite outfit instead..? Why.... WHY??????

*woman runs of crying*

Woman: MY SELF ESTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Phaedon]

Babli wrote...

Val Seleznyov wrote...
As i've already stated, armour isn't a necessity for a firefight in the ME universe.

Wrong.
Armor produces kinetic barriers. Without these barriers you have absolutely no protection in combat.

Actually, that's incorrect. The barriers are produced by a generator.

[darknoon5]

Phaedon wrote...

Babli wrote...

Val Seleznyov wrote...
As i've already stated, armour isn't a necessity for a firefight in the ME universe.

Wrong.
Armor produces kinetic barriers. Without these barriers you have absolutely no protection in combat.

Actually, that's incorrect. The barriers are produced by a generator.

Spoiler warning






















Iirc, doesn't Liara have a shield on without wearing armour in LoTSB? That's how she avoids getting assassinated. Surely that shows you don't need armour to have shields.

Modifié par darknoon5, 06 février 2011 - 02:48 .

[Phaedon]

Iirc, doesn't Liara have a shield on without wearing armour in LoTSB? That's how she avoids getting assassinated. Surely that shows you don't need armour to have shields.

Nah, that was a biotic power. Afaik, the generator can be embedded on your armour, but that isn't necessary.

Modifié par Phaedon, 06 février 2011 - 02:50 .

[darknoon5]

Phaedon wrote...

Nah, that was a biotic power. Afaik, the generator can be embedded on your armour, but that isn't necessary.

I'm sure Vasir says the assassin didn't count on her kinetic barrier? It's not like she could produce a biotic barrier at all times.

[Phaedon]

darknoon5 wrote...
I'm sure Vasir says the assassin didn't count on her kinetic barrier? It's not like she could produce a biotic barrier at all times.

That was her biotic bubble, probably.

Color changed for spoilers.

Modifié par Phaedon, 06 février 2011 - 02:52 .

[Ieldra]

Val Seleznyov wrote...
Well, technically it wasn't "sacrificed" because it wasn't present within the series at that time. It was just nonexistent. The drab full-body armours were certainly not visually stimulating. This was addressed in ME2, and to revert back to the ME1 way of doing things would be a huge mistake.

How many times do we have to correct you: having armor doesn't mean they have to be drab or less individual. They made a very individual armor for Miranda, for instance. She looks hot in it. And powerful. As it should be. I want individual outfits, but they should be practical too, and protective in combat.

As for the question of "Is it necessary for combat": We're not talking about your standard firefight between gangs here, these are fights between high-level professionals, who can blow your head off at 100 metres if you so much as stick your head out of cover at the wrong moment. As you say, rule no. 1 of firefights is "don't get hit", but - well, things don't always go that way, and if you get hit, armor mitigates the damage. If ME2 consisted, for instance, of stealth missions with the occasional firefight in-between, then I'd agree that armor would be more of a hindrance. But that's not what we've got. We have open combat missions where several bullets fly past your head every second, and where our team members are in as much danger of getting hit as Shepard is. To say armor won't be of any use is imbecile.

As for our earlier disagreement, it's no surprise to me that the distinction between "stylish sexy" and "cheap sexy" escapes you. Admittedly there is some leeway for taste here, but Miranda's default outfit definitely straddles the line with the way it draws the eye to her "assets". When Enyala made her comment, I could only think "you have a point". As for what that says about me - I disagree with outfits that reduce women to their "assets". Take that as you want. I should note that in that out-of-game picture that shows Miranda walking in front of two scientists***, don't know where it's from, she doesn't have the same problem in spite of wearing the same outfit. It's a matter of art style. ME2 is too much "in-your-face" about it.

*** I've been told it's the cover of issue #4 of ME:Redemption.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 06 février 2011 - 03:08 .

[Ieldra]

Correction in terms:

There are "kinetic shields" created by generators and "biotic barriers" created by a biotic power. Technically, a "biotic barrier" is also a "kinetic barrier" because it stops material objects like a kinetic shield does. That may account for the use of "kinetic barrier" in dialogue.
In spite of that, if you speak of a barrier, it's always the one created by biotic powers. Shields and barriers do exactly the same thing. Only the means by which they are produced vary.

The biotic bubble we see in the SM does the same thing again, only in a bigger sphere and limited to objects with a lower kinetic energy - since only the swarm is kept out but bullets still pass.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 06 février 2011 - 03:06 .

[Aeowyn]

This thread is awesome. And like Ieldra have stated, you can still wear unique but PROPER armour for combat. Running around in high heels and skintight suits, and suits with ridiculous cleavage when you're in COMBAT is stupid. I say casual clothing for when you're aboard the Normandy, proper armour for when you're outside.



And Val, it's so nice and sweet to see how you think of us women. Shame you have no idea what you're talking about.

[darknoon5]

Phaedon wrote...

darknoon5 wrote...
I'm sure Vasir says the assassin didn't count on her kinetic barrier? It's not like she could produce a biotic barrier at all times.

That was her biotic bubble, probably.

Color changed for spoilers.

Spoiler warning (Can't get colours to change)











Below is a quote from ME Wiki

"Bullet Holes in Window: Tela will say that the rifle used to do that
wasn’t standard issue, and while Liara’s kinetic barriers stopped the
bullets, they still penetrated the glass."


Also, from the codex:

Kinetic barriers are repulsive mass effect fields projected from tiny emitters.

Modifié par darknoon5, 06 février 2011 - 03:20 .

[Val Seleznyov]

Ieldra2 wrote...

How many times do we have to correct you: having armor doesn't mean they have to be drab or less individual. They made a very individual armor for Miranda, for instance. She looks hot in it. And powerful. As it should be. I want individual outfits, but they should be practical too, and protective in combat.

As for the question of "Is it necessary for combat": We're not talking about your standard firefight between gangs here, these are fights between high-level professionals, who can blow your head off at 100 metres if you so much as stick your head out of cover at the wrong moment. As you say, rule no. 1 of firefights is "don't get hit", but - well, things don't always go that way, and if you get hit, armor mitigates the damage. If ME2 consisted, for instance, of stealth missions with the occasional firefight in-between, then I'd agree that armor would be more of a hindrance. But that's not what we've got. We have open combat missions where several bullets fly past your head every second, and where our team members are in as much danger of getting hit as Shepard is. To say armor won't be of any use is imbecile.

As for our earlier disagreement, it's no surprise to me that the distinction between "stylish sexy" and "cheap sexy" escapes you. Admittedly there is some leeway for taste here, but Miranda's default outfit definitely straddles the line with the way it draws the eye to her "assets". When Enyala made her comment, I could only think "you have a point". As for what that says about me - I disagree with outfits that reduce women to their "assets". Take that as you want. I should note that in that out-of-game picture that shows Miranda walking in front of two scientists***, don't know where it's from, she doesn't have the same problem in spite of wearing the same outfit. It's a matter of art style. ME2 is too much "in-your-face" about it.

*** I've been told it's the cover of issue #4 of ME:Redemption.

In a squad of 12, it doesn't matter how personalised individual armour is. It will be less personal, and in many instances would unecessarily betray the personalities and impair the visual characterisation of the likes of Thane, Samara and Mordin. You're not correcting anyone; just trying to justify what you want to see.

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say with the last paragrah. I haven't said much about my thoughts on Miranda's default outfit (what she's wearing is totally unrelated to my argument), and what i have said certainly doesn't imply that i find it especially sexy.

I do find it interesting that you can't look at Miranda without being drawn to her "assets". That's your failing, though. Not the designers, and certainly not mine.  Women shouldn't have to wear full body armour just to prevent you leering over them.

Modifié par Val Seleznyov, 06 février 2011 - 03:43 .

[Sidney]

Ieldra2 wrote...

As for the question of "Is it necessary for combat": We're not talking about your standard firefight between gangs here, these are fights between high-level professionals, who can blow your head off at 100 metres if you so much as stick your head out of cover at the wrong moment. To say armor won't be of any use is imbecile.

Really there's not much evidence that armor does work. Most "armored" foes - all thosemercs in some sort of armor don't show an armor rating and all powers still apply to them. Shep's armor doesn't have an armor rating anywhere, all it does is provide boosts to other elements like health or shields or storm speed.

There are "armored" things like Scions but those are not just wearing plain old armor in the same vein.

[Val Seleznyov]

Aeowyn wrote...

This thread is awesome. And like Ieldra have stated, you can still wear unique but PROPER armour for combat. Running around in high heels and skintight suits, and suits with ridiculous cleavage when you're in COMBAT is stupid. I say casual clothing for when you're aboard the Normandy, proper armour for when you're outside.

And Val, it's so nice and sweet to see how you think of us women. Shame you have no idea what you're talking about.

I don't think that you really understand what i'm saying.

I'm not making any sweeping generalisations about what a woman should be... just that the type of woman that Miranda is should be respected and not changed just to fit the misguided notion that everyone needs to wear combat armour.

Modifié par Val Seleznyov, 06 février 2011 - 03:40 .

[Aeowyn]

But how would Miranda change at all if she was wearing armour? A woman's intellectuality and personality does not all of a sudden blend out just because she's forced to wear a hardsuit in combat.

[Val Seleznyov]

Aeowyn wrote...

But how would Miranda change at all if she was wearing armour? A woman's intellectuality and personality does not all of a sudden blend out just because she's forced to wear a hardsuit in combat.

What i take from Miranda is that she is extremely capable, extremely confident, and believes strongly in image.

Her proficiency in combat coupled with her confidence results in her making concessions when it comes to practicality, in order to sate her desire to look the way she wants to.

This says a lot about her and should be respected. We shouldn't be doing anything to remove that confidence, and she shouldn't have to cover up because perverts like ieldra cannot avert their gaze.

[Ieldra]

Val Seleznyov wrote...

Aeowyn wrote...
But how would Miranda change at all if she was wearing armour? A woman's intellectuality and personality does not all of a sudden blend out just because she's forced to wear a hardsuit in combat.

What i take from Miranda is that she is extremely capable, extremely confident, and believes strongly in image.

Her proficiency in combat coupled with her confidence results in her making concessions when it comes to practicality, in order to sate her desire to look the way she wants to.

This says a lot about her and should be respected. We shouldn't be doing anything to remove that confidence, and she shouldn't have to cover up because perverts like ieldra cannot avert their gaze.

Actually, no. Miranda would not make concessions to practicality in order to project a sexy image in a combat situation. That's unprofessional and stupid, it could cost her her life. Miranda is dutybound, professional and practical, sometimes more than is good for her. What you're saying is that Miranda is overconfident to the point of stupidity. With that attitude, she wouldn't have survived the "most dangerous and demanding operations" she has led for Cerberus.

What you're doing here is character derailment to justify the art style you prefer.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 06 février 2011 - 03:56 .

[Xeranx]

As Val's alluded to the more skimpy you dress (as a woman) the more intelligent you become.  So you women need to lose the conservative covering to get what he's on about. 
[/sarcasm] 

Modifié par Xeranx, 06 février 2011 - 03:57 .

[darth_lopez]

i wouldn't necessarily say we need a similar KotOR scene, but i get what you're getting at. Every Time We walked Vacuum outside that opening scene Certain Squadmates Seemed Unprepared and like they should be dead. At least in KotOR we had everything logically justified. There is a distinct Problem when a portion of a sci-fi game negates a factor taken into account in all other exsting sci-fi's including it's predecessor.. The dangers of the vacuum of space are only ignored in Childrens Cartoons, and in some instances star wars but it has a legit excuse relative to it's own universe :the Force.



ME 3 Needs Squad Mates with Helmets. We are at War and I don't want strippers on my Luxury Stealth Battle Cruiser until the game is over.