190 réponses à ce sujet

[Harid]

obsessedwjpn wrote...

You all realize that this game is in a fantasy setting and things like changing clothes, going to the bathroom, all that stuff is something that should matter not so much in a game that does not take place in the real world. Besides, if we do want to be realistic, in the medieval period and the renaissance people bathed very little and most people did not have the kind of money to own multiple sets of clothing. Most of the time they wore very similar things everyday.

Doesn't really matter?  In these games we do have the money to own multiple sets, and it hurts no one giving people the choice to make their companions wear whatever will make their parties run more effciently, or, wear what you choose to roleplay the character as, and removing that choice is removing some of the RPG from the game.

Don't bring up real world correlations.  We don't have things like magic in the real world.

[crimzontearz]

Soul Reaver wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

aside for a solely aestetic point of view the lack of customizable clothing changes nothing and one of the most acclaimed RPGs out there handled it exactly the same way

Niether ME2 nor Planescape Torment took place 10 years

so far, aside for Varric and maybe Isabela all the vanilla companions change clothes between time jumps, still I am talking on a purely gameplay point of view

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

aside for a solely aestetic point of view the lack of customizable clothing changes nothing and one of the most acclaimed RPGs out there handled it exactly the same way

A game which was, in my opinion, quite bad.

not quite the point Sylvius,The point is that PST did not lack on the tactical point of view just because you could not customize clothings, the only "shortcomings" if you want to call them that were aestetic ones

at which point the whole thing becomes pretty much subjective, I am totally ok with static outfits as long as they make sense and thank GOD for the latest appearance package for ME2 where miranda will actually have ARMOR

[Harid]

crimzontearz wrote...

Soul Reaver wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

aside for a solely aestetic point of view the lack of customizable clothing changes nothing and one of the most acclaimed RPGs out there handled it exactly the same way

Niether ME2 nor Planescape Torment took place 10 years

so far, aside for Varric and maybe Isabela all the vanilla companions change clothes between time jumps, still I am talking on a purely gameplay point of view

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

aside for a solely aestetic point of view the lack of customizable clothing changes nothing and one of the most acclaimed RPGs out there handled it exactly the same way

A game which was, in my opinion, quite bad.

not quite the point Sylvius,The point is that PST did not lack on the tactical point of view just because you could not customize clothings, the only "shortcomings" if you want to call them that were aestetic ones

at which point the whole thing becomes pretty much subjective, I am totally ok with static outfits as long as they make sense and thank GOD for the latest appearance package for ME2 where miranda will actually have ARMOR

You are ok with paying money for something that should have been in the game from jump?  That would have been in the game if we had a fragment of the armor choosing from ME1?

This is stuff that should be in the game from release.  Not nickel and dimed in a costume pack down the line.

You keep using this word aesthetics, but it's not purely truth in this case.  Yes, in Mass Effect, where it is purely aesthetic, but not in DA:O where armor has stats on it that strengthen certain builds.

Modifié par Harid, 05 février 2011 - 01:05 .

[Herr Uhl]

crimzontearz wrote...

not quite the point Sylvius,The point is that PST did not lack on the tactical point of view just because you could not customize clothings, the only "shortcomings" if you want to call them that were aestetic ones

Combat was the worst part of that game.

[Ryzaki]

I don't think I would care so much if so many of BW's armor designs weren't so ugly.

But they are.

And in ME2 this is made even worse by the fact that they had nothing else to wear and I had to look at ridculous outfits (either in designor) or just plain ugly ones.

Of course I got lucky a few times and saw some "meh" oes but the 'ugh." vastly outnumbered them.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 05 février 2011 - 01:06 .

[crimzontearz]

Herr Uhl wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

not quite the point Sylvius,The point is that PST did not lack on the tactical point of view just because you could not customize clothings, the only "shortcomings" if you want to call them that were aestetic ones

Combat was the worst part of that game.

never said it was well implemented, merely said it had tactical options just not through armor

[Harid]

Ryzaki wrote...

I don't think I would care so much if so many of BW's armor designs weren't so ugly.

But they are.

And in ME2 this is made even worse by the fact that they had nothing else to wear and I had to look at ridculous outfits (either in designor) or just plain ugly ones.

Of course I got lucky a few times and saw some "meh" oes but the 'ugh." vastly outnumbered them.

Don't forget having your ****** hanging out in the vacuum of space.

[Sylvius the Mad]

crimzontearz wrote...

not quite the point Sylvius,The point is that PST did not lack on the tactical point of view just because you could not customize clothings, the only "shortcomings" if you want to call them that were aestetic ones

I thought you were talking about ME2 (a game I very much dislike).  PST (an excellent game) did lack custom appearances.

I would argue that the games are different in kind, howerver, as each PST companion was a unique type.  There was only one Modron.  There was only one Githzerai.

DA2 (and ME2) feature companions of types seen throughout the world.  Isabela (or Jack) is not the only female human, so I see no reason why she can't wear clothing for female humans.

at which point the whole thing becomes pretty much subjective, I am totally ok with static outfits as long as they make sense

I think static outfits on their own are a silly idea that add nothing to the game, but I'll accept them if they don't restrict our ability to customise our characters' armour-related statistics.

In DAO, I could put Leliana in Massive Armour.  If I can increase Isabela's stats to approximate massive armour, I won't have substantive complaints.

[crimzontearz]

Harid wrote...

You are ok with paying money for something that should have been in the game from jump?  That would have been in the game if we had a fragment of the armor choosing from ME1?

This is stuff that should be in the game from release.  Not nickel and dimed in a costume pack down the line.

You keep using this word aesthetics, but it's not purely truth in this case.  Yes, in Mass Effect, where it is purely aesthetic, but not in DA:O where armor has stats on it that strengthen certain builds.

yeah....

1: a DIFFERENT team develops  DLC items, they are not a DIFFERENT budget and therefore I am totally ok with paying for it

2: you will be able to strenghten your build through the addition of (now more effective) amulets, runes, belts, rings and even weapons....just not armor.

[Ryzaki]

Harid wrote...


Don't forget having your ****** hanging out in the vacuum of space.

*sighs* I was trying to forget.

If you're going to have outfits that break the setting at least have the damn outfit be pretty.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 05 février 2011 - 01:15 .

[Harid]

crimzontearz wrote...

Harid wrote...

You are ok with paying money for something that should have been in the game from jump?  That would have been in the game if we had a fragment of the armor choosing from ME1?

This is stuff that should be in the game from release.  Not nickel and dimed in a costume pack down the line.

You keep using this word aesthetics, but it's not purely truth in this case.  Yes, in Mass Effect, where it is purely aesthetic, but not in DA:O where armor has stats on it that strengthen certain builds.

yeah....

1: a DIFFERENT team develops  DLC items, they are not a DIFFERENT budget and therefore I am totally ok with paying for it

2: you will be able to strenghten your build through the addition of (now more effective) amulets, runes, belts, rings and even weapons....just not armor.

1) DLC issue avoids the question I put forth.  But parrot what Bioware says, sure.

2) Yeah, and I could make them better with armor.  Or they could be wearing the type of armor I choose for them to be wearing.   Unfortunately, I cannot do either, and I have gained nothing to make up for it.  What happens if I want to put Aveline in Heavy armor and the game defaults me to Massive?  Too damn bad!  I am not going to applaud that issue, it's something that should not be there in the first place.  I should be the one who determines what my companions wear, not Bioware.  They are not their own people if I can choose how they level and I can assume direct control of them in combat.

Modifié par Harid, 05 février 2011 - 01:14 .

[crimzontearz]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

not quite the point Sylvius,The point is that PST did not lack on the tactical point of view just because you could not customize clothings, the only "shortcomings" if you want to call them that were aestetic ones

I thought you were talking about ME2 (a game I very much dislike).  PST (an excellent game) did lack custom appearances.

I would argue that the games are different in kind, howerver, as each PST companion was a unique type.  There was only one Modron.  There was only one Githzerai.

DA2 (and ME2) feature companions of types seen throughout the world.  Isabela (or Jack) is not the only female human, so I see no reason why she can't wear clothing for female humans.

at which point the whole thing becomes pretty much subjective, I am totally ok with static outfits as long as they make sense

I think static outfits on their own are a silly idea that add nothing to the game, but I'll accept them if they don't restrict our ability to customise our characters' armour-related statistics.

In DAO, I could put Leliana in Massive Armour.  If I can increase Isabela's stats to approximate massive armour, I won't have substantive complaints.

uhmmmm, well I can argue that aside for wings and tails Fall from Grace and your little thiefling  could wear the same clothes as normal human females, Dakkon also is not that much different from a human male ...but the point is that, as you pointed in your second paragraph, I am talking about gameplay, and as it was explained to us you will be able to improve your character stats through items such as amulets and runes and whatnot, I am sure you will be able to turn Isabela into a rogue tank

now with that in mind IU dislike ME2's outfits solely when they become ridiculous (let's see Jack's, Miranda's and Samara are the worst offenders followed by Grunt's and Vanilla Thane's)

[Fenn_]

Ryzaki wrote...

Harid wrote...


Don't forget having your ****** hanging out in the vacuum of space.

*sighs* I was trying to forget.

I actually did not notice that but I honestly don't pay to much attention to breast was it  Samara?

Modifié par Fenn , 05 février 2011 - 01:15 .

[Harid]

Fenn wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

Harid wrote...


Don't forget having your ****** hanging out in the vacuum of space.

*sighs* I was trying to forget.

I actually did not notice that but I honestly don't pay to much attention to breast was it  Samara?

Samara/Jack/to a lesser extent, Miranda, Jacob and Thane.

[Ryzaki]

Fenn wrote...
I actually did not notice that but I honestly don't pay to much attention to breast was it  Samara?

And Jack.

Yeah and Thane/Miranda. (I always forget Thane and Jacob because I don't take them anywhere with me.)

And Samara has some ugly outfit that makes her look like a blueberry. Jack's wouldn't be so bad if her tattoos weren't so low res and looking like a damn mess.

And that nipple belt needed to go. Give her a damn shirt or have her topless. The nipple belt was just retarded.

Thane's...is just urgh.

And Jacob is wearing a skintight outfit...why exactly? To show off his top heavy body? Yay.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 05 février 2011 - 01:19 .

[Fenn_]

oh okay thanks I think I see what your talking about now. The Jacob thing drove me crazy no guy is built like that.

Modifié par Fenn , 05 février 2011 - 01:20 .

[crimzontearz]

Harid wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

Harid wrote...

You are ok with paying money for something that should have been in the game from jump?  That would have been in the game if we had a fragment of the armor choosing from ME1?

This is stuff that should be in the game from release.  Not nickel and dimed in a costume pack down the line.

You keep using this word aesthetics, but it's not purely truth in this case.  Yes, in Mass Effect, where it is purely aesthetic, but not in DA:O where armor has stats on it that strengthen certain builds.

yeah....

1: a DIFFERENT team develops  DLC items, they are not a DIFFERENT budget and therefore I am totally ok with paying for it

2: you will be able to strenghten your build through the addition of (now more effective) amulets, runes, belts, rings and even weapons....just not armor.

1) DLC issue avoids the question I put forth.  But parrot what Bioware says, sure.

2) Yeah, and I could make them better with armor.  Or they could be wearing the type of armor I choose for them to be wearing.   Unfortunately, I cannot do either, and I have gained nothing to make up for it.  What happens if I want to put Aveline in Heavy armor and the game defaults me to Massive?  Too damn bad!  I am not going to applaud that issue, it's something that should not be there in the first place.

ok, first off....it's really that simple, most of the items Bioware put forth as DLC were NOT supposed to be in the vanilla game...want proof? ok

we asked for a laser-sight gun AFTER the game released, and one popped up in DLC
we asked for a Geth weapon that was not the pulse rifle? the GPS pops up in DLC
I PERSONALLY started a thread about a locust hammerburst-like weapon and said it would be an asset and some people seemed to agree....pop comes the Mattoc rifle in a DLC pack.
people complained about Garru's beaten armor? and an alternative armor is produced for DLC without the hole
we asked for intelligent non fanservicy armor for Miranda because the original outfit was ridiculous? whopps, there we go with it.
weasked for DLC armor that was not "one piece" and we got it

and so on and so forth

I doubt  all the DLC packs were meant to be in the game from start but hey I can cue in the X-files theme song while we talk about conspiracies

now

you are a chock-full of CRPG's commonplaces aren't you?

just because CRPGs in the past let you play little pony princess dressup that does not mean it's a good thing.....or a bad one. In all years I have played TT RPGs from DnD to VtR my DMs/STs never allowed me to up and tell NPC companions exactly what to wear or what weapons to use unless I could objectively order them to because I had authority over them in some way

is that the case in DA2? I don't think so

[Mikey_205]

I'm not too bothered by it. I really hated how some of the gear looked in Dragon Age on companions especially leather armor. I also understand how it could be difficult to improve.

I'd rather have customisable outfit choices which aren't stat linked and stats done on invisible rings and amulets. Of course I'm not keen on having no outfit choice at all esp if they milk us by doing new outfits as DLC.

Someone's comment about Planescape was pretty true the fact you couldn't equip different armor did rob from the game tactically if you compare it to the wealth of magical items in Baldurs Gate. Equipment choices in general were extremley limited.

Basically what I hope they preserve is the tactical depth that we did get from armor by making the rings and trinkets diverse and interesting with significant effects and that they dont rob us of that awesome feeling of obtaining a new piece of equipment. I won't be cool if the rings are as bland as +1 def and + magic.

[Harid]

crimzontearz wrote...

Harid wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

Harid wrote...

You are ok with paying money for something that should have been in the game from jump?  That would have been in the game if we had a fragment of the armor choosing from ME1?

This is stuff that should be in the game from release.  Not nickel and dimed in a costume pack down the line.

You keep using this word aesthetics, but it's not purely truth in this case.  Yes, in Mass Effect, where it is purely aesthetic, but not in DA:O where armor has stats on it that strengthen certain builds.

yeah....

1: a DIFFERENT team develops  DLC items, they are not a DIFFERENT budget and therefore I am totally ok with paying for it

2: you will be able to strenghten your build through the addition of (now more effective) amulets, runes, belts, rings and even weapons....just not armor.

1) DLC issue avoids the question I put forth.  But parrot what Bioware says, sure.

2) Yeah, and I could make them better with armor.  Or they could be wearing the type of armor I choose for them to be wearing.   Unfortunately, I cannot do either, and I have gained nothing to make up for it.  What happens if I want to put Aveline in Heavy armor and the game defaults me to Massive?  Too damn bad!  I am not going to applaud that issue, it's something that should not be there in the first place.

ok, first off....it's really that simple, most of the items Bioware put forth as DLC were NOT supposed to be in the vanilla game...want proof? ok

we asked for a laser-sight gun AFTER the game released, and one popped up in DLC
we asked for a Geth weapon that was not the pulse rifle? the GPS pops up in DLC
I PERSONALLY started a thread about a locust hammerburst-like weapon and said it would be an asset and some people seemed to agree....pop comes the Mattoc rifle in a DLC pack.
people complained about Garru's beaten armor? and an alternative armor is produced for DLC without the hole
we asked for intelligent non fanservicy armor for Miranda because the original outfit was ridiculous? whopps, there we go with it.
weasked for DLC armor that was not "one piece" and we got it

and so on and so forth

I doubt  all the DLC packs were meant to be in the game from start but hey I can cue in the X-files theme song while we talk about conspiracies

now

you are a chock-full of CRPG's commonplaces aren't you?

just because CRPGs in the past let you play little pony princess dressup that does not mean it's a good thing.....or a bad one. In all years I have played TT RPGs from DnD to VtR my DMs/STs never allowed me to up and tell NPC companions exactly what to wear or what weapons to use unless I could objectively order them to because I had authority over them in some way

is that the case in DA2? I don't think so

1)I stated that if you had a fragment of the armor choices you had in Mass Effect 1 in Mass Effect 2 you would not have to buy appearance packs, and you launch into a pointless dlc tirade that I never mentioned, and never commented on.  Keep up your strawmans, son.

2)You can command your allies in combat.

You can command your allies what stats to raise.

You can command your allies to pick locks and disarm traps.

You can command your allies what skills to learn.

But commanding them what armor to wear.

Farfetched.

I love you apologists. Like I said initially.  If you are going to use the argument that your companions are "Their own people" then I should not be able to do **** with them.

Modifié par Harid, 05 février 2011 - 01:29 .

[crimzontearz]

Harid wrote...

1)I stated that if you had a fragment of the armor choices you had in Mass Effect 1 in Mass Effect 2 you would not have to buy appearance packs, and you launch into a pointless dlc tirade that I never mentioned, and never commented on.  Keep up your strawmans, son.

2)You can command your allies in combat.

You can command your allies what stats to raise.

You can command your allies to pick locks and disarm traps.

You can command your allies what skills to learn.

But commanding them what armor to wear.

Farfetched.

I love you apologists.

nope you said that they are nickle and diming us for stuff that should have been already in the game so either 1: you want full armor customization for your team mates and it is not gonna happen in ME2 or B: you are implaying  the material in the DLC was ripped from the game or should have been given to us for free from the start even if made with a different budget. Either way your arguments is silly, Bioware went with a specific design choice and you do not like it and apparently you feel ripped off...I'd suggest to make your complain and deal with it because it is not going to change and no one is ripping you off

also, you can direct your party in combat, you van choose their weapons and choosing the level up are purely arbitrary decisions in the dev's part and the first 2 are given to you SOLELY for tactical gameplay purposes and not because indeed your companions are your little subordinates


finally, anyone who has known me for a while on this board will tell you I am far from an apologist

[Harid]

crimzontearz wrote...

Harid wrote...

1)I stated that if you had a fragment of the armor choices you had in Mass Effect 1 in Mass Effect 2 you would not have to buy appearance packs, and you launch into a pointless dlc tirade that I never mentioned, and never commented on.  Keep up your strawmans, son.

2)You can command your allies in combat.

You can command your allies what stats to raise.

You can command your allies to pick locks and disarm traps.

You can command your allies what skills to learn.

But commanding them what armor to wear.

Farfetched.

I love you apologists.

nope you said that they are nickle and diming us for stuff that should have been already in the game so either 1: you want full armor customization for your team mates and it is not gonna happen in ME2 or B: you are implaying  the material in the DLC was ripped from the game or should have been given to us for free from the start even if made with a different budget. Either way your arguments is silly, Bioware went with a specific design choice and you do not like it and apparently you feel ripped off...I'd suggest to make your complain and deal with it because it is not going to change and no one is ripping you off

also, you can direct your party in combat, you van choose their weapons and choosing the level up are purely arbitrary decisions in the dev's part and the first 2 are given to you SOLELY for tactical gameplay purposes and not because indeed your companions are your little subordinates


finally, anyone who has known me for a while on this board will tell you I am far from an apologist

So, in a nutshell 1) gotta keep my strawman up because the dude's been clear on his intentions, and 2) don't got nothing on his entire argument, so I'll take bits and pieces from it and twist it so I can be correct in some way.

Got it.  Done with you.

[crimzontearz]

Harid wrote...

crimzontearz wrote...

Harid wrote...

1)I stated that if you had a fragment of the armor choices you had in Mass Effect 1 in Mass Effect 2 you would not have to buy appearance packs, and you launch into a pointless dlc tirade that I never mentioned, and never commented on.  Keep up your strawmans, son.

2)You can command your allies in combat.

You can command your allies what stats to raise.

You can command your allies to pick locks and disarm traps.

You can command your allies what skills to learn.

But commanding them what armor to wear.

Farfetched.

I love you apologists.

nope you said that they are nickle and diming us for stuff that should have been already in the game so either 1: you want full armor customization for your team mates and it is not gonna happen in ME2 or B: you are implaying  the material in the DLC was ripped from the game or should have been given to us for free from the start even if made with a different budget. Either way your arguments is silly, Bioware went with a specific design choice and you do not like it and apparently you feel ripped off...I'd suggest to make your complain and deal with it because it is not going to change and no one is ripping you off

also, you can direct your party in combat, you van choose their weapons and choosing the level up are purely arbitrary decisions in the dev's part and the first 2 are given to you SOLELY for tactical gameplay purposes and not because indeed your companions are your little subordinates


finally, anyone who has known me for a while on this board will tell you I am far from an apologist

So, in a nutshell 1) gotta keep my strawman up because the dude's been clear on his intentions, and 2) don't got nothing on his entire argument, so I'll take bits and pieces from it and twist it so I can be correct in some way.

Got it.  Done with you.

oh, I do, you are starting from CRPG commonplaces that were given to you because when you play a CRPG you are fundamentally alone as opposed to "playing with your group". Just because certain CRPGs handled things one way that does not mean all CPRGs should. You may not like it, if you do not, complain about it, which you are, but yours is merely an opinion

you know maybe you should just head over to the Skyrim or TW2 boards.....just saying 

[obsessedwjpn]

Wow, people are so negative about the outfits in the Bioware games. I enjoyed ME2 outfits for the teammates and I like how the characters are dressed in Dragon Age 2. I thought they were very artistic and pretty.

And to Harid, not all of us believe magic doesn't exist in the real world so please don't assume that everyone thinks the same. That is your opinion, not the absolute.

Modifié par obsessedwjpn, 05 février 2011 - 02:24 .

[Anzer]

Harid wrote...

1)I stated that if you had a fragment of the armor choices you had in Mass Effect 1 in Mass Effect 2 you would not have to buy appearance packs, and you launch into a pointless dlc tirade that I never mentioned, and never commented on.  Keep up your strawmans, son.

2)You can command your allies in combat.
You can command your allies what stats to raise.
You can command your allies to pick locks and disarm traps.
You can command your allies what skills to learn.
But commanding them what armor to wear.
Farfetched.

I love you apologists. Like I said initially.  If you are going to use the argument that your companions are "Their own people" then I should not be able to do **** with them.

1. You do not have to buy appearance packs.

2. You can command them to wear specific rings.
You can command them to wear specific belts.
You can command them to wear specific amulets.
You can command them to use specific weapons.

[Nonoru]

Wait,they will keep the same clothes ? Aww..