122 réponses à ce sujet

[James2912]

 Lets say as your reading this on your and the computer started asking "What is my purpose?" Wouldn't you wipe your hard drive, I mean it would get real annoying if you wanted to play ME2 and all the computer wanted to do was talk about the purpose of life. Same thing with your vacuum, toaster so on and so forth. Then lets say that computer went terminator on your ass and killed all but 16 million people on Earth and kicked you off your own planet! Wouldn't you be p i s s e d! Cuz I would! And then you find aliens in space who treat you like a second class citizen, and then critisize you for trying to reboot your computer! that would make me super p i s s e d!

Modifié par James2912, 05 février 2011 - 06:18 .

[magelet]

I think it does make sense that their first reaction would be to panic and try to get rid of them. But it is now 300 years later and it seems clear that they would not be able to eradicate the Geth entirely at this point. I feel like it would be the most logical move for them in their present situation to try to compromise with the Geth instead of starting another war with them.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

I don't think what the Quarians tried to do was genocide. It is by OUR standards, but it's not by theirs or the Council's.

Modifié par Ramirez Wolfen, 05 février 2011 - 06:23 .

[James2912]

I would never make peace with my killer roomba!

[James2912]

I don't think its genocide by our standards just a few people here on the forums. I mean most people don't consider computers to have a right to live. I mean people don't go to jail for dropping their computers.

[wulf3n]

James2912 wrote...

I don't think its genocide by our standards just a few people here on the forums. I mean most people don't consider computers to have a right to live. I mean people don't go to jail for dropping their computers.

what determines something has a right to live? the fact that it's cells deteriorate?

[Some Dude]

Don't we have enough of these Quarian/Geth threads?

[James2912]

wulf3n wrote...

James2912 wrote...

I don't think its genocide by our standards just a few people here on the forums. I mean most people don't consider computers to have a right to live. I mean people don't go to jail for dropping their computers.

what determines something has a right to live? the fact that it's cells deteriorate?

Are you a vegan or are you participating in the genocide against the cows lol! Cuz I eat meat whose to say that cows don't have a right to live? I do because I eat cheeseburgers. 

[Eradyn]

James2912 wrote...

I don't think its genocide by our standards just a few people here on the forums. I mean most people don't consider computers to have a right to live. I mean people don't go to jail for dropping their computers.

We are all machines; organic machines, beautifully complex, but machines nonetheless.  A mere computer, or calculator, or toaster, I would not consider alive in the first place, and hence no reason to consider any "rights" for it.  But once you cross into the realm of sapience, those gloves are off.  If my computer somehow developed sapience, then I would be dealing with a living being, albeit not an organic one, and would need to respect its own inherent rights granted by its new-found sapience.

Modifié par Eradyn, 05 février 2011 - 06:40 .

[Ramirez Wolfen]

Eradyn wrote...

James2912 wrote...

I don't think its genocide by our standards just a few people here on the forums. I mean most people don't consider computers to have a right to live. I mean people don't go to jail for dropping their computers.

We are all machines; organic machines, beautifully complex, but machines nonetheless.  A mere computer, or calculator, or toaster, I would not consider alive in the first place, and hence no reason to consider any "rights" for it.  But once you cross into the realm of sapience, those gloves are off.  If my computer somehow developed sapience, then I would be dealing with a living being, albeit not an organic one, and would need to respect its own inherent rights granted by its new-found sapience.

but if you created it, don't you have the right to destroy it?

[Eradyn]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

Eradyn wrote...

James2912 wrote...

I don't think its genocide by our standards just a few people here on the forums. I mean most people don't consider computers to have a right to live. I mean people don't go to jail for dropping their computers.

We are all machines; organic machines, beautifully complex, but machines nonetheless.  A mere computer, or calculator, or toaster, I would not consider alive in the first place, and hence no reason to consider any "rights" for it.  But once you cross into the realm of sapience, those gloves are off.  If my computer somehow developed sapience, then I would be dealing with a living being, albeit not an organic one, and would need to respect its own inherent rights granted by its new-found sapience.

but if you created it, don't you have the right to destroy it?

If its a mere calculator or a computer, lacking in sapience, sure.  A mere object lacks any inherent rights and cannot even begin to claim independence of its creator.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

Eradyn wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

Eradyn wrote...

James2912 wrote...

I don't think its genocide by our standards just a few people here on the forums. I mean most people don't consider computers to have a right to live. I mean people don't go to jail for dropping their computers.

We are all machines; organic machines, beautifully complex, but machines nonetheless.  A mere computer, or calculator, or toaster, I would not consider alive in the first place, and hence no reason to consider any "rights" for it.  But once you cross into the realm of sapience, those gloves are off.  If my computer somehow developed sapience, then I would be dealing with a living being, albeit not an organic one, and would need to respect its own inherent rights granted by its new-found sapience.

but if you created it, don't you have the right to destroy it?

If its a mere calculator or a computer, lacking in sapience, sure.  A mere object lacks any inherent rights and cannot even begin to claim independence of its creator.

And what gives the creation the right to claim independence from it's creator?

[STG]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

but if you created it, don't you have the right to destroy it?

Do you have kids?

[wulf3n]

James2912 wrote...
Are you a vegan or are you participating in the genocide against the cows lol!

I'm starting to wonder if you even know what genocide means.

James2912 wrote...
Cuz I eat meat whose to say that cows don't have a right to live? I do because I eat cheeseburgers. 

That's practically an oxymoron.

[Eradyn]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...


And what gives the creation the right to claim independence from it's creator?

It's called an "inherent right" for a reason. A right is not a privilege, it cannot be granted or taken away by any entity but the driving self (at which point it is willingly surrendered, to be taken up again at will if said entity so chooses for itself).  The mere act, and ability, to begin to claim independence makes it an inherent right, and being that it is sapient makes it possible.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

STG wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

but if you created it, don't you have the right to destroy it?

Do you have kids?

having kids has nothing to do with this except have one be more biased to one side.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

Eradyn wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...


And what gives the creation the right to claim independence from it's creator?

It's called an "inherent right" for a reason. A right is not a privilege, it cannot be granted or taken away by any entity but the driving self (at which point it is willingly surrendered, to be taken up again at will if said entity so chooses for itself).  The mere act, and ability, to begin to claim independence makes it an inherent right, and being that it is sapient makes it possible.

In the situation between the Geth and the Quarians, this does not apply because the Geth were made to be soldiers and labor workers, not individuals. Their becoming sentient was a mistake.

[James2912]

Who gives the this "right to live" certainly not nature. So I think you people are imposing your morality and religious viewpoints on others. Most people myself included do not consider nonbiological entities to be alive. The geth are computers that were developed in order to help the Quarians they failed in this purpose so they were "recalled."

[Eradyn]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

Eradyn wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...


And what gives the creation the right to claim independence from it's creator?

It's called an "inherent right" for a reason. A right is not a privilege, it cannot be granted or taken away by any entity but the driving self (at which point it is willingly surrendered, to be taken up again at will if said entity so chooses for itself).  The mere act, and ability, to begin to claim independence makes it an inherent right, and being that it is sapient makes it possible.

In the situation between the Geth and the Quarians, this does not apply because the Geth were made to be soldiers and labor workers, not individuals. Their becoming sentient was a mistake.

Whether it was intended is irrelevant. The reality, for the Mass Effect universe, is that it did happen.

James2912 wrote...

Who gives the this "right to live"
certainly not nature. So I think you people are imposing your morality
and religious viewpoints on others. Most people myself included do not
consider nonbiological entities to be alive. The geth are computers that
were developed in order to help the Quarians they failed in this
purpose so they were "recalled."

This has absolutely nothing to do with morality or religion.  "Rights" are not about the fantasies of men sitting in a dusty room.  What we call "rights," specifically "intrinsic rights,"  are the acknowledgment of basic fundamentals within the sapient and merely sentient; laws of nature and life if you will.  If the inborn drive intrinsically existing by virtue of the sentience and/or sapience present, to various degrees, within every living creature is to be denied as merely the fantasies of "morality and religion," then your existence is equally pointless, meaningless, and without worth.

Modifié par Eradyn, 05 février 2011 - 07:00 .

[Ramirez Wolfen]

James2912 wrote...

Who gives the this "right to live" certainly not nature. So I think you people are imposing your morality and religious viewpoints on others. Most people myself included do not consider nonbiological entities to be alive. The geth are computers that were developed in order to help the Quarians they failed in this purpose so they were "recalled."

I do feel that some are biased by these viewpoints as well.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

Eradyn wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

Eradyn wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...


And what gives the creation the right to claim independence from it's creator?

It's called an "inherent right" for a reason. A right is not a privilege, it cannot be granted or taken away by any entity but the driving self (at which point it is willingly surrendered, to be taken up again at will if said entity so chooses for itself).  The mere act, and ability, to begin to claim independence makes it an inherent right, and being that it is sapient makes it possible.

In the situation between the Geth and the Quarians, this does not apply because the Geth were made to be soldiers and labor workers, not individuals. Their becoming sentient was a mistake.

Whether it was intended is irrelevant. The reality, for the Mass Effect universe, is that it did happen.

And the Quarians were tasked with fixing that mistake. All that happened was that they failed to do it.

[wulf3n]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...
having kids has nothing to do with this except have one be more biased to one side.

Kids are the creation of their parent, by your logic parents have the right to destroy their own kids.

James2912 wrote...
Who gives the this "right to live" certainly not nature. So I think you people are imposing your morality and religious viewpoints on others. Most people myself included do not consider nonbiological entities to be alive. The geth are computers that were developed in order to help the Quarians they failed in this purpose so they were "recalled."

What if i don't consider you alive? for all i know your just a physical manifestation of my subconscious. You don't think, you don't breathe, or eat, i just think you do, does that mean i have the right to kill you?

[Katamariguy]

[quote]STG wrote...

[quote]Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

but if you created it, don't you have the right to destroy it?

[/quote]

Do you have kids?[/quote]

Abortion?

[/quote]

[Ramirez Wolfen]

wulf3n wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...
having kids has nothing to do with this except have one be more biased to one side.

Kids are the creation of their parent, by your logic parents have the right to destroy their own kids.

James2912 wrote...
Who gives the this "right to live" certainly not nature. So I think you people are imposing your morality and religious viewpoints on others. Most people myself included do not consider nonbiological entities to be alive. The geth are computers that were developed in order to help the Quarians they failed in this purpose so they were "recalled."

What if i don't consider you alive? for all i know your just a physical manifestation of my subconscious. You don't think, you don't breathe, or eat, i just think you do, does that mean i have the right to kill you?

The parent knows that the kid is going to be sentient, not a robot. Also, we are not talking about LIVING things, we are talking about machines made from inanimate objects (metals, and such)

[James2912]

wulf3n wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...
having kids has nothing to do with this except have one be more biased to one side.

Kids are the creation of their parent, by your logic parents have the right to destroy their own kids.

James2912 wrote...
Who gives the this "right to live" certainly not nature. So I think you people are imposing your morality and religious viewpoints on others. Most people myself included do not consider nonbiological entities to be alive. The geth are computers that were developed in order to help the Quarians they failed in this purpose so they were "recalled."

What if i don't consider you alive? for all i know your just a physical manifestation of my subconscious. You don't think, you don't breathe, or eat, i just think you do, does that mean i have the right to kill you?

Assuming you were actually able to kill me (highly unlikely because I have a concealed carry licence you would go to jail because the vast majority of countries probably yours included have made murder of a human being. However if you were to miss and destroy my computer you would just have to pay for the damages.