127 réponses à ce sujet

[Arijharn]

 I'd rather try diplomacy to be honest first go, but if that fails... well, I'll always have Overlord.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

Stryfe16 wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

V-rex wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

I actually think the Geth should be under Quarian control. I'm not saying do it through war I mean under the cover of peace. The Quarians should propose peace with the Geth, but only to get closer and not be attacked on sight. The next part (which may take awhile due to developing the technology), would be to secretly expose the Geth to a virus that gets rid of their sentience and returns them to their original purpose: cheap labor. I think that is how it should end.

That's just.... terrible. Monstrous, heartless, cruel and despicable.

Are you seriously suggesting that the Quarians should go in under the pretense of peace, let those poor trusting Geth welcome them back onto the planet (that they have been maintaining for them no less) and then even though all conflicts are over, they should try to release a virus to destroy Geth sentience anyway?

That's even worse then just destroying them all in a war, because here the Quarians are willingly deciding to destroy them even though they haven't shown any signs of hostility, instead just wanting to turn them back into mindless drones for the Quarian's own convienience basically.
Man that's just.... evil.

Yes the Geth are different to organics, that doesn't mean you have the right to do stuff like that. As a side note, again, the virus might not be effective against the current Geth and the Geth would figure out what was going on really early on either during the virus's development or when the Quarians implement it against them... and they'll resist and they'll fight back (again) and the the 17 million Quarians would be reduced to zero.

And do you know what? If those were the circumstances of how the last of the Quarians got destroyed, I'd call that a one hundred percent positive result. Because clearly, the Qurians had no justification whatsover.

Trojan horse, my friend.

We know what tactic it is, the point is, is that doing something like this would prove the quarians are the most caprcious, self-serving, and despicable race in the galaxy. If this tactic failed and quarians ended up extinct, I'm not sure I would be capable of sympathizing with them. The quarians are a people stuck in the past, and the idea of them essentially destroying a sentient race for their own convenience is morally repugnant.

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

[Inquisitor Recon]

I would actually applaud the quarians for such an accomplishment as it would demonstrate for once that they are not completely and totally incompetent.

[Zulu_DFA]

James2912 wrote...

 Since we know its possible to enslave the entire Geth race using a virus, would you do so if you had the chance?
I know paragons would not because that would be "morally wrong," so I'm obviosly not asking paragon players.

No. I reckon, it's way far easier and more efficient to manipulate (control) the Geth through non-invasive technics, such as religion. All options of negotiating the Geth into cooperation should be explored before resorting to warfare, electronic or conventional. I am sure the "mind own business" approach will succeed in securing mutually beneficial cooperation between the Alliance and the Geth.

This doesn't mean all military options should not be researched and ready for deployment in case the "diplomacy" fails, even though the former could to an extent jeopardize the latter, if compromised.

That, and the former Council races may go to hell with their AI ban conventions, and take the Quarians with them.

[IndigoWolfe]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

*snip*

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

I find myself thoroughly in agreement with V-rex here. If my car started driving itself after it became sentient, I wouldn't wipe its brain, because it would have become its own being. Just because a subordonate doesn't do what I want them to because they've got other plans doesn't give me the right to wipe their minds either.

Despite being created by the quarians, the geth are of their own minds, just like another sentient species. If the quarians viewed themselves as the gods and masters of a sentient species and that they have the right to take away their sentience through deception, then I would also have to go with V-rex's opinion that they would be without a doubt the most despicable race in the galaxy.

[The Elite Elite]

If we could, I'd enslave the Geth so I could bring their forces against the Reapers. However, the Geth are far too dangerous to keep around. There's no telling if they might turn against organics again. So they get destroyed once the Reaper threat is eliminated.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

ReconTeam wrote...

I would actually applaud the quarians for such an accomplishment as it would demonstrate for once that they are not completely and totally incompetent.

I'm not a Quarian, and I came up with this plan. I should be a Quarian.... lol

[Ramirez Wolfen]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

*snip*

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

I find myself thoroughly in agreement with V-rex here. If my car started driving itself after it became sentient, I wouldn't wipe its brain, because it would have become its own being. Just because a subordonate doesn't do what I want them to because they've got other plans doesn't give me the right to wipe their minds either.

Despite being created by the quarians, the geth are of their own minds, just like another sentient species. If the quarians viewed themselves as the gods and masters of a sentient species and that they have the right to take away their sentience through deception, then I would also have to go with V-rex's opinion that they would be without a doubt the most despicable race in the galaxy.

Being sentient doesn't absolve you of your purpose.

[IndigoWolfe]

*snip*

Modifié par IndigoWolfe, 08 février 2011 - 04:06 .

[IndigoWolfe]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

*snip*

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

I find myself thoroughly in agreement with V-rex here. If my car started driving itself after it became sentient, I wouldn't wipe its brain, because it would have become its own being. Just because a subordonate doesn't do what I want them to because they've got other plans doesn't give me the right to wipe their minds either.

Despite being created by the quarians, the geth are of their own minds, just like another sentient species. If the quarians viewed themselves as the gods and masters of a sentient species and that they have the right to take away their sentience through deception, then I would also have to go with V-rex's opinion that they would be without a doubt the most despicable race in the galaxy.

Being sentient doesn't absolve you of your purpose.

That's garbage.

You could say that a human's 'true' purpose is to reproduce, but no one should have a say in when and how a person goes about that in his or her life.

Part of being sentient is about having a mind and freedom with which to make choices, and the geth are most certainly sentient.

Modifié par IndigoWolfe, 08 février 2011 - 04:08 .

[Ramirez Wolfen]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

*snip*

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

I find myself thoroughly in agreement with V-rex here. If my car started driving itself after it became sentient, I wouldn't wipe its brain, because it would have become its own being. Just because a subordonate doesn't do what I want them to because they've got other plans doesn't give me the right to wipe their minds either.

Despite being created by the quarians, the geth are of their own minds, just like another sentient species. If the quarians viewed themselves as the gods and masters of a sentient species and that they have the right to take away their sentience through deception, then I would also have to go with V-rex's opinion that they would be without a doubt the most despicable race in the galaxy.

Being sentient doesn't absolve you of your purpose.

That's garbage.

You could say that a human's 'true' purpose is to reproduce, but no one should have a say in when and how a person goes about that in his or her life.

Part of being sentient is about having a mind and freedom with which to make choices, and the geth are most certainly sentient.

The Geth acquired sentience by mistake. Also, they are the Quarians' creation. The Quarians are the ones who should decide what the Geth do.

[IndigoWolfe]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

*snip*

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

I find myself thoroughly in agreement with V-rex here. If my car started driving itself after it became sentient, I wouldn't wipe its brain, because it would have become its own being. Just because a subordonate doesn't do what I want them to because they've got other plans doesn't give me the right to wipe their minds either.

Despite being created by the quarians, the geth are of their own minds, just like another sentient species. If the quarians viewed themselves as the gods and masters of a sentient species and that they have the right to take away their sentience through deception, then I would also have to go with V-rex's opinion that they would be without a doubt the most despicable race in the galaxy.

Being sentient doesn't absolve you of your purpose.

That's garbage.

You could say that a human's 'true' purpose is to reproduce, but no one should have a say in when and how a person goes about that in his or her life.

Part of being sentient is about having a mind and freedom with which to make choices, and the geth are most certainly sentient.

The Geth acquired sentience by mistake. Also, they are the Quarians' creation. The Quarians are the ones who should decide what the Geth do.

The geth are the bastard child of technology and negligence. They aquired sentience by themselves. The quarians may have made the original platforms and programmed the first basic units, but they evolved into much more than that.

To expound on my opening metaphor, if a couple had a child without intending, the child, despite being of their own original creation, would be their own person. Claiming ownership or mastery over such an individual to an extent where they are only allowed to do your will is one thing and one thing alone; slavery.

[skcih-deraj]

Enslave no. Using project overlord and possibly other programs like it to keep them in check... yes.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

*snip*

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

I find myself thoroughly in agreement with V-rex here. If my car started driving itself after it became sentient, I wouldn't wipe its brain, because it would have become its own being. Just because a subordonate doesn't do what I want them to because they've got other plans doesn't give me the right to wipe their minds either.

Despite being created by the quarians, the geth are of their own minds, just like another sentient species. If the quarians viewed themselves as the gods and masters of a sentient species and that they have the right to take away their sentience through deception, then I would also have to go with V-rex's opinion that they would be without a doubt the most despicable race in the galaxy.

Being sentient doesn't absolve you of your purpose.

That's garbage.

You could say that a human's 'true' purpose is to reproduce, but no one should have a say in when and how a person goes about that in his or her life.

Part of being sentient is about having a mind and freedom with which to make choices, and the geth are most certainly sentient.

The Geth acquired sentience by mistake. Also, they are the Quarians' creation. The Quarians are the ones who should decide what the Geth do.

The geth are the bastard child of technology and negligence. They aquired sentience by themselves. The quarians may have made the original platforms and programmed the first basic units, but they evolved into much more than that.

To expound on my opening metaphor, if a couple had a child without intending, the child, despite being of their own original creation, would be their own person. Claiming ownership or mastery over such an individual to an extent where they are only allowed to do your will is one thing and one thing alone; slavery.

I don't know if it's slavery, the Geth aren't really people; They are just machines.

[IndigoWolfe]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

IndigoWolfe wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

*snip*

How would this be making thew Quarians despicable? All that they would be doing is getting the Geth back under their control, which is where they should be. Self-serving? The Geth are a creation of the Quarians. If your car started driving without you, would you not try to stop it? I believe that the Geth need to be back in the hands of the Quarians, their creators, masters, gods, if you will.

I find myself thoroughly in agreement with V-rex here. If my car started driving itself after it became sentient, I wouldn't wipe its brain, because it would have become its own being. Just because a subordonate doesn't do what I want them to because they've got other plans doesn't give me the right to wipe their minds either.

Despite being created by the quarians, the geth are of their own minds, just like another sentient species. If the quarians viewed themselves as the gods and masters of a sentient species and that they have the right to take away their sentience through deception, then I would also have to go with V-rex's opinion that they would be without a doubt the most despicable race in the galaxy.

Being sentient doesn't absolve you of your purpose.

That's garbage.

You could say that a human's 'true' purpose is to reproduce, but no one should have a say in when and how a person goes about that in his or her life.

Part of being sentient is about having a mind and freedom with which to make choices, and the geth are most certainly sentient.

The Geth acquired sentience by mistake. Also, they are the Quarians' creation. The Quarians are the ones who should decide what the Geth do.

The geth are the bastard child of technology and negligence. They aquired sentience by themselves. The quarians may have made the original platforms and programmed the first basic units, but they evolved into much more than that.

To expound on my opening metaphor, if a couple had a child without intending, the child, despite being of their own original creation, would be their own person. Claiming ownership or mastery over such an individual to an extent where they are only allowed to do your will is one thing and one thing alone; slavery.

I don't know if it's slavery, the Geth aren't really people; They are just machines.

That's were you and I disagree.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

And that's fine.

[Pacifien]

Please trim your quotes.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

Pacifien wrote...

Please trim your quotes.

'

That's why I didn't do a quote on my last post. Your profile picture was originally cute, but now it's just scary (everytime I see it, I get worried lol). Off-topic, but I had to say this lol, my next comment will be on topic.

[Kingthlayer]

I'd prefer to kill all the Geth rather then enslave them. Can't let anything get in the way of Human power.

[Ramirez Wolfen]

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...

I'd prefer to kill all the Geth rather then enslave them. Can't let anything get in the way of Human power.

But wouldn't an entire army of Geth be useful in human dominance?

[Pacifien]

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...
I'd prefer to kill all the Geth rather then enslave them. Can't let anything get in the way of Human power.

But wouldn't an entire army of Geth be useful in human dominance?

The geth will forever be an unknown quantity to humans as they had no part in geth design. It is unwise to enslave such a machine. Had humans had a part in geth design, some scientist who had read Asimov would have encoded the Three Laws of Robotics into the programming. Unless that scientist worked for Cerberus. Which is a cheap shot because Cerberus did design EDI. She does alright.

[James2912]

Pacifien wrote...

Ramirez Wolfen wrote...

Big Mac Heart Attack wrote...
I'd prefer to kill all the Geth rather then enslave them. Can't let anything get in the way of Human power.

But wouldn't an entire army of Geth be useful in human dominance?

The geth will forever be an unknown quantity to humans as they had no part in geth design. It is unwise to enslave such a machine. Had humans had a part in geth design, some scientist who had read Asimov would have encoded the Three Laws of Robotics into the programming. Unless that scientist worked for Cerberus. Which is a cheap shot because Cerberus did design EDI. She does alright.

Its true humans would have the hardest time enslaving the Geth because they know little about them. But as Overlord shows, we are at least gaining some ground in the area. My standpoint has been we know its possible to "brainwash" the Geth, the reapers attempted to do this, and true geth did this with the heretic geth. So the tech is out there, how long before the Reapers, the most advanced civilization we know  tries again and suceeds? Some are willing to take the risk that the Reapers would fail, but what I am saying is that a renegade does not take such chances as we have seen over and over again in ME. He/she deals with the problem permanently. There is risk involved but there is also great risk involved in possibly ceding the geth to the Reapers. I would say both sides have good reasons for why they believe what they believe, its really which risk do you want to take?

[Pro_Consul]

James2912 wrote...

So the tech is out there, how long before the Reapers, the most advanced civilization we know  tries again and suceeds? Some are willing to take the risk that the Reapers would fail, but what I am saying is that a renegade does not take such chances as we have seen over and over again in ME. He/she deals with the problem permanently. There is risk involved but there is also great risk involved in possibly ceding the geth to the Reapers. I would say both sides have good reasons for why they believe what they believe, its really which risk do you want to take?

But how would enslaving them to your service prevent the Reapers from coming along after you and enslaving them to their own side? I don't see the risk you are talking about in "ceding the geth to the Reapers". I mean, what can you do to stop them? Now if your argument were that a renegade should wipe out the Geth before the Reapers get another chance to indoctrinate them, that I would understand. Not saying I would necessarily agree, but I would understand it and give it serious thought. Maybe I'm just dense tonight. Had homemade Thai fish soup tonight and it has left me rather lethargic, I admit.

[GodWood]

I doubt it'd be possible but given the option I would.

[James2912]

Pro_Consul wrote...

James2912 wrote...

So the tech is out there, how long before the Reapers, the most advanced civilization we know  tries again and suceeds? Some are willing to take the risk that the Reapers would fail, but what I am saying is that a renegade does not take such chances as we have seen over and over again in ME. He/she deals with the problem permanently. There is risk involved but there is also great risk involved in possibly ceding the geth to the Reapers. I would say both sides have good reasons for why they believe what they believe, its really which risk do you want to take?

But how would enslaving them to your service prevent the Reapers from coming along after you and enslaving them to their own side? I don't see the risk you are talking about in "ceding the geth to the Reapers". I mean, what can you do to stop them? Now if your argument were that a renegade should wipe out the Geth before the Reapers get another chance to indoctrinate them, that I would understand. Not saying I would necessarily agree, but I would understand it and give it serious thought. Maybe I'm just dense tonight. Had homemade Thai fish soup tonight and it has left me rather lethargic, I admit.

You convinced me pro consul I have changed my plans I want to wipe out the Geth not enslave them, it is the safest bet.