6655 réponses à ce sujet

[sassperella]

Miri1984 wrote...

A happy ending with Anders is pretty much impossible already, I think, considering what he's done. At most we can have a settled, content ending, but the boy's going to need A LOT of therapy.

Mind you, every character in every RPG ever probably finishes their big quest and then breaks down into a puddle of PTSD. We just don't get to see that bit

I think if you read the ending of the story, Anders seems unaware of the actual fight. I think it's Vengeance that does the killing not Anders. Anders is guilty of letting Justice in and maybe in completing his transformation to Vengeance through his feelings toward the chantry, I'm with the school of thought that Justice was already on the way to becoming vengeance at the end of Awakening. Conner in DA Origins killed almost a complete village and we forgave him saying it was the demon that possessed him. I think Anders made a really stupid decision out of friendship, loneliness and fear and is now regretting it.

I really hope we can turn Vengeance back to Justice and save them both, but I really think it's going to be down to a choice of save Justice and lose Anders or keep Anders/Vengeance or slay Anders/Vengeance. It really doesn't bode well for a happy ending I agree.

[Threeparts]

Miri1984 wrote...

A happy ending with Anders is pretty much impossible already, I think, considering what he's done. At most we can have a settled, content ending, but the boy's going to need A LOT of therapy.

Mind you, every character in every RPG ever probably finishes their big quest and then breaks down into a puddle of PTSD. We just don't get to see that bit

This! Seriously! I can't imagine any of my Wardens having a happy, normal life after everything they've been through, even disregarding the effects of the taint.
You start out the year by having family or friends killed in front of you, or commiting heinous crimes, and being forcibly conscripted by a man you don't even know. Then you're dragged across the country to a war you have nothing riding on, are forced to drink darkspawn blood or be murdered, and are sent into a tower full of darkspawn slaughtering the people on your side.
You're saved by a Witch of the Wilds, only to be told that your entire army was wiped out because the national hero turned traitor and has now put out a bounty on the heads of any surviving Grey Wardens, and you're one of them and so's this guy that you only met the day before and now you have to somehow gather up all the races of Ferelden and inspire them to fight for you, while you and your companions are being hunted like animals.
Seriously, the stuff of nightmares, and that's before running into werewolves, broodmothers, abominations, the fade, undead, and the zillion other things that want to kill you.

Man, adventurer's lives suck. I feel sorry for Hawke, considering what that family is in for over the next decade.

[Wynne]

*raises hand* I am a firm believer in the 3rd option. It's the only way it feels right to me. In real life, I always look for a better option than the obvious, especially if the choice seems to have negative consequences on both sides. It's woven through my entire personality to look past the obvious Yes/No, the binary approach to a choice. I liked the way they did it in DAO, where you could choose by default, one way or another, what ending you got. It was awesome. You had the feeling your actions mattered whether you knew how they mattered or not.



I wouldn't mind if Anders *can* die in your arms, but I would really hate it if that's the only outcome possible. Same with Fenris, really. I despise tragedy even more than I despise sappy endings; I like bittersweet, I like unexpected, I like poignant, I like positive, I even like negative... but I hate an extreme which is unaffected by my choices, and which feels excessive.



I doubt they'd do that, though. I mean, choice is one of the things they're emphasizing in DA2; there'd have to be a really good story reason (and maybe there is, I don't know) for you to have no options on how to deal with Anders. I would expect that you can encourage Anders in several directions; acceptance of Justice vs. rejection, and/or maybe Justice vs. Vengeance.



I kinda want to keep them together, though. I like each on their own, but the idea of them together is even cooler to me. It adds a foreboding, ominous sort of drama which is great, but if you could get them to integrate without going mad, sort of like Wynne and her spirit, it could be epic.



I might later disagree with myself, but at the moment I feel like Anders=good, Justice=good, Anders + Justice = a balanced and terrific personality as long as Justice doesn't go batspit insane. Admittedly, therein lies the rub... I cross my fingers and hope.



It might be interesting if you do end up having to choose between Anders and Justice. There've been choices between options before, but never between two spirits in the same body!



Well, regardless, the idea is awesome, because I'm speculating in twenty directions and I still don't know what to think. Which I love.

[Miri1984]

These are the options I'm speculating we might have:



1. Let Justice/Vengeance take over Anders completely - giving you some sort of massive power boost but turning him evil.

2. Bring Justice back to himself, but at the cost of his and/or Anders' life.

3. Kill Justice leaving Anders free of him completely.

4. Have the two of them continue to coexist with the probability of Anders going insane after long term exposure.

[AtreiyaN7]

Miri1984 wrote...

These are the options I'm speculating we might have:

1. Let Justice/Vengeance take over Anders completely - giving you some sort of massive power boost but turning him evil.
2. Bring Justice back to himself, but at the cost of his and/or Anders' life.
3. Kill Justice leaving Anders free of him completely.
4. Have the two of them continue to coexist with the probability of Anders going insane after long term exposure.

Well, I'm going to cling to Wynne as an example of the possibility of peaceful coexistence, albeit in her case, she said the Spirt weakened when she used her special ability. It might die eventually, and if its energies are sustaining her, then maybe she'll die when it does. Oh well, I guess that's not entirely comforting - meh.

[Rinji the Bearded]

I really think Anders could live peacefully with Justice... it would just require a confrontation of his own feelings. Let's try not to think TOO negatively people! You'll worry yourselves to death! LOL.

[ErichHartmann]

I would honestly sacrifice Anders to give Justice redemption if the choice presents itself.

[Miri1984]

@ErichHartmann I think Anders would pick that option himself

[Taleroth]

RinjiRenee wrote...

I really think Anders could live peacefully with Justice... it would just require a confrontation of his own feelings. Let's try not to think TOO negatively people! You'll worry yourselves to death! LOL.

It shouldn't be too hard.

The spirits and demons of the fade are speculated to be a coallescing of a shared idea or concept of a group of people.  

Can a man handle a desire for justice on a significantly larger scale than average without going insane?  Certainly.  He just needs some sort of higher order management of justice position.

Spend his time SIGNING PAPERWORK FOR JUSTICE

Modifié par Taleroth, 16 février 2011 - 01:52 .

[Vicious]

It would seem Anders is destined for great and terrible things.

[panamakira]

Ugh~ I just read that IGN spoiler about DA:O characters in DA2. I don't like the sound of the Anders' blurb!!

"He's also still considered an Apostate by the Mage's Chantry, and seems
to have a newly developed aversion to the Grey Wardens."

Seriously Bioware, why? At this point it's useless to mention how you roleplayed your Warden. The Order in Ferelden is working with the Chantry. Great!

[sassperella]

ErichHartmann wrote...

I would honestly sacrifice Anders to give Justice redemption if the choice presents itself.

Anders - guilty of combining with Justice who may or may not have been already beginning to turn to the vengeance path (read the awakenings conversations there is definitely evidence that he might be straying). Foolish at the very least, but Anders did not forsee the outcome.

or Justice who turned to full on demon and slaughtered templars and grey wardens, admittedly in self defense but he enjoyed it and who knows what else he's capable of.

I think Vengeance has gone too far, if he can be redeemed along with Anders then OK but if it's a choice - sorry bluey but you lose

[Threeparts]

Vicious wrote...

It would seem Anders is destined for great and terrible things.

His is a high and lonely destiny. 


ETA: I'm with you there, sassperella. I'd like to save Justice if possible, but if it comes down to choosing between the two of them, I'm going with Anders. He may have been foolish and short-sighted, but he already has a life sentence with the Grey Wardens and the taint. Justice, as a spirit of the Fade, really has no place in the real world, and it's unfair to any living person to have to serve as a host to him when the possible consequences are so dire.

Modifié par Threeparts, 16 février 2011 - 01:55 .

[Browneye_Vamp84]

panamakira wrote...

Ugh~ I just read that IGN spoiler about DA:O characters in DA2. I don't like the sound of the Anders' blurb!!

"He's also still considered an Apostate by the Mage's Chantry, and seems
to have a newly developed aversion to the Grey Wardens."

Seriously Bioware, why? At this point it's useless to mention how you roleplayed your Warden. The Order in Ferelden is working with the Chantry. Great!

*falls on knees and screams in horror*

[Rinji the Bearded]

Taleroth wrote...
 It shouldn't be too hard.

The spirits and demons of the fade are speculated to be a coallescing of a shared idea or concept of a group of people.  

Can a man handle a desire for justice on a significantly larger scale than average without going insane?  Certainly.  He just needs some sort of higher order management of justice position.

Indeed.   This is all sounding like a personal quest for him later on.

[Sialater]

My Wardens retired.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Browneye_Vamp84 wrote...

panamakira wrote...

Ugh~ I just read that IGN spoiler about DA:O characters in DA2. I don't like the sound of the Anders' blurb!!

"He's also still considered an Apostate by the Mage's Chantry, and seems
to have a newly developed aversion to the Grey Wardens."

Seriously Bioware, why? At this point it's useless to mention how you roleplayed your Warden. The Order in Ferelden is working with the Chantry. Great!

*falls on knees and screams in horror*

Ahaha... You read his blurb on the LI thread right?  He has a very good reason to having an aversion to Grey Wardens.   Also, nothing indicated that YOUR Warden was directly involved.  Didn't most Awakening epilogues say that the Warden stepped down from the seat of Commander?

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 16 février 2011 - 01:56 .

[Miri1984]

panamakira wrote...

Ugh~ I just read that IGN spoiler about DA:O characters in DA2. I don't like the sound of the Anders' blurb!!

"He's also still considered an Apostate by the Mage's Chantry, and seems
to have a newly developed aversion to the Grey Wardens."

Seriously Bioware, why? At this point it's useless to mention how you roleplayed your Warden. The Order in Ferelden is working with the Chantry. Great!

Your warden has buggered off by the time this happens. That's how I see it in any case. Every single epilogue slide for Awakenings has the warden disappearing after a period of time. 

[upsettingshorts]

Easy: Anders got transferred to the command of a different Grey Warden than The Warden. Problem of character continuity solved.

Also what is the consensus of the thread on Anders eating people?

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 16 février 2011 - 01:56 .

[panamakira]

I don't know but if I'm given the choice, I won't think twice about killing Justice/ Vengeance as long as I can save Anders. There's no use in keeping a corrupt spirit like Vengeance loose with a body. I either get a sane mage back or I don't. I don't need the spirit/demon!

[leggywillow]

I think Origins did an excellent job of providing a "3rd option" ending without sacrificing the gravity of the story.  I hope the Anders romance follows in the same vein:  You can get your "mostly happily ever after" ending if you want, or you can go all out and get the most emo-tastic and depressing ending the history of the world.  Hopefully it will be up to you, just like in Origins.

I really, really liked having those options in Origins.  My Queen Cousland lived happily ever after with Alistair, although sometimes worrying in the darkest hours of the night if she did the right thing.  At the other end of the spectrum, my Mahariel died fighting the Archdemon after Alistair dumped her.  She felt betrayed and horrified... she got over her heartbreak at losing Tamlen and gave herself to a shemlen man of all things, only to be used and tossed aside (in her eyes).  Honestly, that ending is probably more heartbreaking for Alistair than her.  He has to live the rest of his life knowing that she died believing he didn't love her and never did.  Talk about depressing.    That was my only playthrough that made me cry.

Hopefully we get to make choices like that in DA2.  If we're pigeonholed into the dark and tragic unhappy ending, that will really be a bummer.

[Sialater]

Gross, but he was hardly in control.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Easy: Anders got transferred to the command of a different Grey Warden than The Warden. Problem of character continuity solved.

Also what is the consensus of the thread on Anders eating people?

Omnomnomnom.

[Browneye_Vamp84]

RinjiRenee wrote...

Browneye_Vamp84 wrote...

panamakira wrote...

Ugh~ I just read that IGN spoiler about DA:O characters in DA2. I don't like the sound of the Anders' blurb!!

"He's also still considered an Apostate by the Mage's Chantry, and seems
to have a newly developed aversion to the Grey Wardens."

Seriously Bioware, why? At this point it's useless to mention how you roleplayed your Warden. The Order in Ferelden is working with the Chantry. Great!

*falls on knees and screams in horror*

Ahaha... You read his blurb on the LI thread right?  He has a very good reason to having an aversion to Grey Wardens.   Also, nothing indicated that YOUR Warden was directly involved.  Didn't most Awakening epilogues say that the Warden stepped down from the seat of Commander?

It reminded me of the Witch Hunt dlc.  if you are a Dalish elf the mage cannot use your blood cause of the taint, so the other elfs blood is used.

[Taleroth]

Eating people is eww. Unless Justice finally gave him that fire spell he kept waving around but never actually had.



Raw meat is no good.