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[tmp7704]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

I'll just have to hope Hawke realizes she shouldn't kiss her boyfriend when his eyes are glowing and he starts talking about how the blood will run through the streets and he is beyond mortals and whatnot.

That and hopefully Vengeance doesn't get turned on when Anders get... turned on too, i guess

[HolyJellyfish]

Dave of Canada wrote...
Demon Anders just eats people because it tastes awesome or something, all he needs is dwarven dipping sauce with 7 different elven herbal spices and he could open KIRKWALL FRIED HUMANS, as Colonel (S)Anders.

That's not the impression I got. I got the impression that Anders did it as a form of dark blood magic, specific to his demonic abilities. That it made him more powerful, berserk, etc. Mind you, once he attacked the Templar, boy blacked out. I think he went super saiyan.


We will have to see when the game comes out, but I still get the impression what he did was Blood Magic at its most toxic form.

[mellifera]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

yukidama wrote...

Your character did it as well, and they weren't out of their mind posessed by a demon when they did it either. They didn't go on about how delicious it tasted and then went on to eat some human flesh.

Plus, they drank a little bit of it out of a goblet. It's classy if it's in a goblet 

I lol'd.

So it's less gross if they're both doing it instead of just one of them? As for going on about how delicious it is, Anders doesn't do that either, given that it was Vengeance doing all that stuff.

Besides the point. The issue isn't Anders, it's that Anders is possessed by a demon who, when it assumes direct control, kills and eats people and thinks the blood of his enemies is delicious. If Anders struggles to but can't control it, there's a huge problem.

The reason it is different with the Wardens is because there is no pleasure derived from drinking what basically poisons and slowly kills you. Unless your Warden totally got off on that, then... issues.

[Dave of Canada]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

That's not the impression I got. I got the impression that Anders did it as a form of dark blood magic, specific to his demonic abilities. That it made him more powerful, berserk, etc. Mind you, once he attacked the Templar, boy blacked out. I think he went super saiyan.


We will have to see when the game comes out, but I still get the impression what he did was Blood Magic at its most toxic form.

I got the impression he killed the camp and then started eating their corpses, not eating the corpses while he's fighting off other guys. Him saying he liked the taste of blood simply... yeah.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 16 février 2011 - 09:49 .

[HolyJellyfish]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Trust me. If everyone joked, laughed, grew some thicker skin, and got a sense of humor over the whole subject, it'd blow away faster than dust in the wind.

Doesn't change the fact Anders is gonna rock on with his barack on.

I think we're supposed to be disturbed by the story, not laugh it off as some funny character quirk.  I mean of course we're talking about a video game character and it's very likely any such issues with a potential romance will be fixable given this is a Bioware game.  But I don't see how that story implies we're not supposed to take it seriously if we're going to discuss DA2's Anders as a character.

Not saying we aren't. But when the subject has been broughten up, it has almost always been through a humorous or dark joke post that has been reacted to poorly.

[ThatDancingTurian]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Drinking Darkspawn blood serves a purpose, though. They become Grey Wardens, they get to fight Grey Wardens and don't do it for the sake of doing it. The thought of "drinking the blood of those creatures" frightens Ser Jory.

It's also not cannibalism in the sense that it isn't the same species and from what we know at time, Darkspawn aren't sentient. Therefor, the Grey Warden ritual is more... "okay", rather than cannibalism for the sake of cannibalism.

Demon Anders just eats people because it tastes awesome or something, all he needs is dwarven dipping sauce with 7 different elven herbal spices and he could open KIRKWALL FRIED HUMANS, as Colonel (S)Anders.

Reasons don't matter, they're equally disgusting practices. To clarify, I brought up the darkspawn blood thing in regards to ick factor, not the moral dilemma. My opinions on that have already been written a few pages back.

tmp7704 wrote...

That and hopefully Vengeance doesn't get turned on when Anders get... turned on too, i guess

I really don't want to contemplate whether or not Vengeance has a sex drive or romantic inclinations seperate from Anders. IMO, it's Anders' body, he can do with it what he wants and Vengeance can go stew in the corner.

EDIT: ... IHU BWSN formatting.

Modifié par Aris Ravenstar, 16 février 2011 - 09:52 .

[Dave of Canada]

Mash Mashington wrote...

Yes it is disturbing. But I clearly remember Jennifer Hapler stating that when Anders is not Vengeance-crazed he is still his old self, which was pretty snarky and humorous.

She also said later on he can't focus on anything else except the Chantry. That's probably going to make ol'Anders go bye bye.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 16 février 2011 - 09:52 .

[upsettingshorts]

Mash Mashington wrote...

Yes it is disturbing. But I clearly remember Jennifer Hapler stating that when Anders is not Vengeance-crazed he is still his old self, which was pretty snarky and humorous.

Have you ever heard of dichotomy people? Isn't it what makes things so much more comflicted and interesting?

So no, i don't think 'disturbing' and 'funny' are mutually exclusive

I'm not sure where our perspectives on the character differ then.  I just think the dark and disturbing part is more compelling than snarky and humorous Anders I already met, quested with, and got to know.  Furthermore its introduction is a very big deal.  The new information is more interesting and, being new, more interesting to discuss.  When the game comes out and we get to see how it all fits together, we can discuss how... it all fits together.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 16 février 2011 - 09:53 .

[tmp7704]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Demon Anders just eats people because it tastes awesome or something, all he needs is dwarven dipping sauce with 7 different elven herbal spices and he could open KIRKWALL FRIED HUMANS, as Colonel (S)Anders.

I imagine Warden-Colonel Anders' Fried Elf could be quite a bit hit. Well, maybe not in Kirkwall but once he expands the chain to other parts of Thedas...

Modifié par tmp7704, 16 février 2011 - 09:53 .

[Herr Uhl]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Mash Mashington wrote...

Yes it is disturbing. But I clearly remember Jennifer Hapler stating that when Anders is not Vengeance-crazed he is still his old self, which was pretty snarky and humorous.

She also said later on he can't focus on anything else except the Chantry.

Maybe he has to indulge Venegance a bit to avoid him taking control?

[EighmyLupin]

I’m kind of excited that BioWare is making such a dark character especially one that’s a LI. They tend to make the males who are LI’s into all round “good guys” and any problems they have into cute “quirks” versus being something that’s a big scary deal. It'll be a nice change.

[syllogi]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Demon Anders just eats people because it tastes awesome or something, all he needs is dwarven dipping sauce with 7 different elven herbal spices and he could open KIRKWALL FRIED HUMANS, as Colonel (S)Anders.

And you know this about Vengeance how?  The story was from Anders perspective, and he did not know what happened when Vengeance decided to chow down.  Perhaps Vengeance was sickened by what he did afterwards as well.  We don't know anything about the spirit in it's new form, yet.

Many people have taken the story and are fixating on one sentence, in order to prove a point.  I'm pretty sure that the people in this thread who liked AwakeningAnders and want to help him in DA2 understand that his situation is pretty dire.

So, yeah, now that it has been established that Cannibalism=BAD, many times over, is it okay to talk about other aspects of his character?  Do we have permission from the self appointed moderators who keep harping on the fact that this is indeed a discussion thread?

[HolyJellyfish]

Dave of Canada wrote...


I got the impression he killed the camp and then started eating their corpses, not eating the corpses while he's fighting off other guys. Him saying he liked the taste of blood simply... yeah.

Really? Because if you read the story, between the time he drank Rolan's blood to when he finally 'woke up', he COMPLETELY blacked out. He didn't remember anything that had happened or how much time had passed, and when he finally came to, the amount of destruction was insane.

He's definitely not a full fledge abomination, either he wouldn't have as much assertion and control over himself as its hinted in the videoclip we saw and the summary of his character on the bios.

I'm pretty certain it was blood magic & berserker rage. Blood Magic is implied to be pretty cannibalistic.

[Minxie]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...
Demon Anders just eats people because it tastes awesome or something, all he needs is dwarven dipping sauce with 7 different elven herbal spices and he could open KIRKWALL FRIED HUMANS, as Colonel (S)Anders.

That's not the impression I got. I got the impression that Anders did it as a form of dark blood magic, specific to his demonic abilities. That it made him more powerful, berserk, etc. Mind you, once he attacked the Templar, boy blacked out. I think he went super saiyan.


We will have to see when the game comes out, but I still get the impression what he did was Blood Magic at its most toxic form.

Interesting...

So do we think Anders physically transformed into some kind of creature when this moment happened? I wondered if it was more than just him with glowing eyes, like it was something else entirely which scared Rolan so badly.

*thinks Anders is totally the Slayer now* 

[Dave of Canada]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Maybe he has to indulge Venegance a bit to avoid him taking control?

Considering his control over Vengeance is supposedly weakening over time, I suspect in the end the personalities will have merged to something where Anders will be about wanting to burn down the Chantry 100% of the time -or- he can barely control himself anymore and Vengeance takes over more of the time.

Which will result in more fresh meat for his fast-food chain!

[tmp7704]

Aris Ravenstar wrote...

I really don't want to contemplate whether or not Vengeance has a sex drive or romantic inclinations seperate from Anders.

Ahh sorry, that was "gets turned on" in the sense of "activates" for Vengeance. Alas, i can't resist cheap wordplay like that.

[Taleroth]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Blood Magic is implied to be pretty cannibalistic.

Blood Magic mainly manipulation of blood or using it as a power source, akin to lyrium.

[HolyJellyfish]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Maybe he has to indulge Venegance a bit to avoid him taking control?

Considering his control over Vengeance is supposedly weakening over time, I suspect in the end the personalities will have merged to something where Anders will be about wanting to burn down the Chantry 100% of the time -or- he can barely control himself anymore and Vengeance takes over more of the time.

Which will result in more fresh meat for his fast-food chain!

Or he could be the key to exorcising spirits / demons from mages, making the Chantry Police unnecessary.

I don't believe his character's path is so aligned that it goes only one direction - darkness. Bioware is very good at giving options

[namedforthemoon]

tmp7704 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Demon Anders just eats people because it tastes awesome or something, all he needs is dwarven dipping sauce with 7 different elven herbal spices and he could open KIRKWALL FRIED HUMANS, as Colonel (S)Anders.

I imagine Warden-Colonel Anders' Fried Elf could be quite a bit hit. Well, maybe not in Kirkwall but once he expands the chain to other parts of Thedas...

Throw in a side of Twice Roasted Mashed Babies and you got yourself a menu.

[HolyJellyfish]

Taleroth wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Blood Magic is implied to be pretty cannibalistic.

Blood Magic mainly manipulation of blood or using it as a power source, akin to lyrium.

Power source? Like drinking it? Because you can drink Lyrium.

Its a thought.

[dirtsa90]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Maybe he has to indulge Venegance a bit to avoid him taking control?

Considering his control over Vengeance is supposedly weakening over time, I suspect in the end the personalities will have merged to something where Anders will be about wanting to burn down the Chantry 100% of the time -or- he can barely control himself anymore and Vengeance takes over more of the time.

Which will result in more fresh meat for his fast-food chain!

Then it'll probably be a huge problem that my second Hawke (goody-two-shoes warrior) will try to romance him while picking the templar specialization.

Modifié par dirtsa90, 16 février 2011 - 09:58 .

[Herr Uhl]

Taleroth wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Blood Magic is implied to be pretty cannibalistic.

Blood Magic mainly manipulation of blood or using it as a power source, akin to lyrium.

Yeah, but the consumption of blood for Venegance in Anders body would probably be the same as drinking a lyrium potion. Seeing as how demons are the masters of that art.

Modifié par Herr Uhl, 16 février 2011 - 10:00 .

[obnoxiousgas]

I, uh, yeah. Cannibalism and mass slaughter is a bad thing. Bad. Circle and underline repeatedly in red marker bad. I know people's views on objective morality vary quite a bit, but I think we can accept that in this instance it is pretty damn immoral. I'd be pretty bewildered if ****** wasn't Jennifer Hepler's intention in that story to point out just how horrific abomination!Anders was/could be. On the other hand, I'd also be a bit surprised (and I should stop saying that on these boards because so often I end up surprised) if this subject came up early in the game. It seems more logical that Anders would reveal it later after you've gotten to know the character, so you can make a fairer judgement of whether or not Anders as he is at the moment is a risk your Hawke is willing to take.

Also I'm blathering, and I could be completely wrong and Anders talks about it in like the first conversation you have and everyone who wants to romance Anders has to basically act like this, else it'll be locked off to you forever. Additionally, Anders will persist in eating people over the course of the game, but if you romance him you will be treated to a touching scene á la Alistair's rose where he presents you a fresh templar carcass on which you two will dine by candelight. <3

[Taleroth]

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Blood Magic is implied to be pretty cannibalistic.

Blood Magic mainly manipulation of blood or using it as a power source, akin to lyrium.

Power source? Like drinking it? Because you can drink Lyrium.

Its a thought. 

 Blood has to actually come out to be useful to power spells.  Otherwise the spilling of your own blood would never work.  That's typically how it the practice starts.  Spilling some of your own blood then using that to power spells.

Ingesting it would defeat the purpose entirely.

Herr Uhl wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

HolyJellyfish wrote...

Blood Magic is implied to be pretty cannibalistic.

Blood Magic mainly manipulation of blood or using it as a power source, akin to lyrium.

Yeah, but the consumption of blood for Venegance in Anders body would probably be the same as drinking a lyrium potion. Seeing as how demons are the masters of that art.

That art being blood magic... or?

It's Dragons that are the actual masters of blood magic.

Modifié par Taleroth, 16 février 2011 - 10:04 .