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[Miri1984]

Ninotchka wrote...

Miri1984 wrote...

I wonder if it'll be dependent on your import. If you import a game where he died - he may well die when Justice is removed from him. If you imported one where he didn't, he might survive. And I suspect Anders doesn't want to get rid of Vengeance - I think he wants to turn him back into Justice. I hope that's possible, and that we can then separate the two (or leave them together a la Wynne).

Surely they wouldn't assume everyone who's going to play DA2 had the Awakening expansion pack. I mean it wouldn't be fair if you had neither Origins or, in particular, Awakening and had to lose him as a party member like that...

You actually get to make decisions about the world before you start DA2 even if you haven't played Origins/Awakening. I don't actually know what they are, but you apparently have options even if it's a completely new game. So watch out if one of those decisions (I don't know what they are!) have to do with upgrading Vigil's Keep! If you want Anders to live FORTIFY THAT BUGGER!

(I think the decisions are about who you make king and who defeats the archdemon from what I remember - so I doubt they'll arbitrarily kill Anders if you're new to the DA franchise when you play DA2 considering him dying in DA:OA is actually pretty difficult to achieve).

[isaggelos]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Well, Justice becoming more demonic was something you could tell throughout Awakenings. He starts to like it in the "real" world and wants more, which is pretty much what defines a demon.

I found that to be the interesting thing about Justice during awakenings.

Hmm hadnt thought it that way

[Roth]

Anders AND Justice in DAO2? This is brilliant!

[Ninotchka]

Miri1984 wrote...


You actually get to make decisions about the world before you start DA2 even if you haven't played Origins/Awakening. I don't actually know what they are, but you apparently have options even if it's a completely new game. So watch out if one of those decisions (I don't know what they are!) have to do with upgrading Vigil's Keep! If you want Anders to live FORTIFY THAT BUGGER!

(I think the decisions are about who you make king and who defeats the archdemon from what I remember - so I doubt they'll arbitrarily kill Anders if you're new to the DA franchise when you play DA2 considering him dying in DA:OA is actually pretty difficult to achieve).

I have always upgraded Vigil's Keep and always had Anders & Justice with me for the final showdown in the city of Amaranthine and with The Mother... surely that's a clear sign that they should be alive :innocent:

oh well I guess we'll find out soon enough

[Eudaemonium]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Well, Justice becoming more demonic was something you could tell throughout Awakenings. He starts to like it in the "real" world and wants more, which is pretty much what defines a demon.

I found that to be the interesting thing about Justice during awakenings.

This was one of the things I found so fascinating about Justice. he was in a semi-permanent state of existential crisis, constantly doubting his own nature. I'm really interested to see how his character has developed, and will continue to develop in DA2.

[Eudaemonium]

Ninotchka wrote...

I have always upgraded Vigil's Keep and always had Anders & Justice with me for the final showdown in the city of Amaranthine and with The Mother... surely that's a clear sign that they should be alive :innocent:

oh well I guess we'll find out soon enough

Unless you spare the Architect, in which case Justice will try and kill you. though you may be able to persuade him otherwise, I am unsure.

[Ninotchka]

Eudaemonium wrote...

Ninotchka wrote...

I have always upgraded Vigil's Keep and always had Anders & Justice with me for the final showdown in the city of Amaranthine and with The Mother... surely that's a clear sign that they should be alive :innocent:

oh well I guess we'll find out soon enough

Unless you spare the Architect, in which case Justice will try and kill you. though you may be able to persuade him otherwise, I am unsure.

Hey Eudaemonium

I have never spared the Architect....I should do it once though, for the achievement (if there is one), but not because my PC could make a deal with him like that...ever...that offer was a bit of a shocker:blink:

[moilami]

Dave of Canada wrote...

If Anders died and the spirit is all that sustains him, assuming Anders died in Awakening, removing it should kill him... right?

I think yes.


Edit: These things has not been explained in game accurately, so we can only
guess and make theories. So I would say older people are harder to
revive, especially if they has been sustained by a spirit. So Anders could be revived in theory. Wynne on the other hand died but got sustained, and possibly could not be revived at least as easily as Anders could be revived.

Modifié par moilami, 09 février 2011 - 08:10 .

[Josef bugman3]

Just read the description on the main site... bloody hell when did Justice become vengeance? And is Anders now just a freakin' abomination?

[Back2basics]

Im glad these two are in DA2, they were two of my favorites from awakening but like other people have said, since they can both possibly died depending on your choices in awakening does this mean they are only in DA2 if they didn't die? assuming you are importing? OR will there be some explanation for their resurrection in DA2. They're possible fates listed here>>> http://dragonage.wik...ogue_(Awakening)

[moilami]

Josef bugman3 wrote...

Just read the description on the main site... bloody hell when did Justice become vengeance? And is Anders now just a freakin' abomination?

It is not clear what Justice was in the first place. It could had been desire demon for example. Just that it pretended to be justice does not mean it was.

But if it was a spirit and now changed to Vengeance because of Anders anger, then it would mean spirits can change or it was never Justice but desire demon. So can spirits change?

About anders being an abdomination, I would not say so since Anders personality exists. Anders is rather living in some kind of symbiose with the demon.


Edit: And it is not said desire demons are evil. They can be strange creatures. Probably what is common with them with other demons is the desire to see the real world and not only the fade. So, is that all they desire? What does desire demons desire other than see the real world?

Edit: Possibly nothing on their own. I would say they would just amplify the desires of the person they posses. Examples: Connor went all silly, the girl possessed by desire demon in Shale dungeon appeared to went naughty, and templar in the circle tower went all daddy.

As a conclusion I would say Anders got what the world needs, that is some spark to fight for justice and freedom xD

Modifié par moilami, 09 février 2011 - 08:31 .

[Eudaemonium]

Ninotchka wrote...

Eudaemonium wrote...

Unless you spare the Architect, in which case Justice will try and kill you. though you may be able to persuade him otherwise, I am unsure.

Hey Eudaemonium

I have never spared the Architect....I should do it once though, for the achievement (if there is one), but not because my PC could make a deal with him like that...ever...that offer was a bit of a shocker:blink:

Hey Ninotchka

See, I actually always spare the Architect . Though my primary motive for doing so always seems to be "it will make things more dramatic later", rather than any of my characters actually doing it for in-game character reasons. That and I think he is awesome, if woefully underdeveloped. On my first game I actually had to kill half my party (Sigrun and Justice, wwwwhyyyyyy!!!?).

Regretably, that means I rarely, if ever, hear his battle theme, which is never played anywhere else.

[Aramintai]

Will Anders still have that cute little ser Pounce-a-Lot?

[The Elder King]

I don't think Justice in Awakening was a desire demon. The desire demon are called "desire" because they feed on the mortal's desire, as pride demon feed itself on pride, a wrath demon on wrath, an so on. Justice is corrupted by Anders's hate for the Chantry adn becames a Vengeance spirit (they caled him a demonic spirit in his official page), who probably feeds on Ander's hate of the Chantry and his desire of revenge.

[AtreiyaN7]

Josef bugman3 wrote...

Just read the description on the main site... bloody hell when did Justice become vengeance? And is Anders now just a freakin' abomination?

I expect that the person influences the Spirit to a degree. Wynne seemed to be fairly hard to corrupt; I assume that her being an essentially good person who had worked through most of her issues by that point in her life meant that the Spirit of Faith remained good.

When Justice was in Kristoff, Kristoff was extremely dead without the possibility of coming back - unlike Wynne who seemed to be fresh enough to be brought back whole. I think the dead host meant there was no significant emotional influence from the host body he was inhabiting. Because Anders is alive, I think it's a different situation. I can see how his anger towards the Templars and the Circle, coupled with his wild streak, could twist Justice into Vengeance.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 09 février 2011 - 08:39 .

[moilami]

hhh89 wrote...

I don't think Justice in Awakening was a desire demon. The desire demon are called "desire" because they feed on the mortal's desire, as pride demon feed itself on pride, a wrath demon on wrath, an so on. Justice is corrupted by Anders's hate for the Chantry adn becames a Vengeance spirit (they caled him a demonic spirit in his official page), who probably feeds on Ander's hate of the Chantry and his desire of revenge.

Yeah. That is the official story.

It makes sense. I just got a little bit sidetracked by desire demons.

[Miri1984]

 I wonder if the Justice-to-Vengeance transformation has happened BEFORE you meet him or you're with him when the transformation occurs? Because that would be... uber tragic to witness..

[The Elder King]

Miri1984 wrote...

 I wonder if the Justice-to-Vengeance transformation has happened BEFORE you meet him or you're with him when the transformation occurs? Because that would be... uber tragic to witness..

In my opinion it's already happened. If the official page is right, Justice is corrupted by Anders's hate, and now Anders fight against Vengeance to not be overturned. Probably when we meet him (in that mission), he lose control, and Vengeance emerges.

Modifié par hhh89, 09 février 2011 - 08:53 .

[ThatDancingTurian]

Miri1984 wrote...

 I wonder if the Justice-to-Vengeance transformation has happened BEFORE you meet him or you're with him when the transformation occurs? Because that would be... uber tragic to witness..

I'd prefer it happens afterwards. I wouldn't like to just hear about it off-screen. Plus, I want to see a nice, upbeat Anders at -some- point in the game. <3

[Erlemar]

Well let me ask about two situations:

1. Anders died defending the Warden's Keep.

2. I sent Anders to templars, so he didn't see Justice. They didn't become friends.



How this will influence DA2?

[Rogue-Element]

Yay Anders! Not quite as we expected him but I have to admit this is interesting.

Just please, pretty please tell me he's still voiced by Greg Ellis?

[Annie_Dear]

littlenikki wrote...

Has it been confirmed or touched upon if Anders will still be voiced by Greg Ellis?
If it is so, then  so hard

This! I've been wondering the same thing!

[Eudaemonium]

Erlemar wrote...

Well let me ask about two situations:
1. Anders died defending the Warden's Keep.
2. I sent Anders to templars, so he didn't see Justice. They didn't become friends.

How this will influence DA2?

Possible explanations:

1) Justice possesses his corpse, thus Anders is undead similar to Wynne.

2) Anders escaped the Templars and meets Justice later (possibly post-Awakening) and becomes friends then.

Annie_Dear wrote...

littlenikki wrote...

Has it been confirmed or touched upon if Anders will still be voiced by Greg Ellis?
If it is so, then ../../../images/forum/emoticons/love.png so hard

This! I've been wondering the same thing!

He'll be voiced by Greg Ellis, apart from when he's possessed, when his voice will become a composite of Ellis and Adam Leadbeater.

Maybe.

Modifié par Eudaemonium, 09 février 2011 - 09:04 .

[Sable Rhapsody]

Seriously, this gets better and better. I thought Justice was awesome and adored Anders. Now my evil Hawke gets a chance to further corrupt them both in her quest to bring the Chantry to its knees and break its metaphorical skull >