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[Archereon]

Mash Mashington wrote...

SammyJB17 wrote...

WHAT IF THE SECRET COMPANION IS JUSTICE BACK OUTSIDE OF ANDERS?!?!??!?!?

no

I just had an amazing idea...

What if Ander's personal quest is a choice between exorcising (going into the fade or sending Bethany into the fade to destroy the demon) vengance, and killing Anders and giving Vengance a new host with no soul to resist it?

[ThatDancingTurian]

Archereon wrote...

I just had an amazing idea...

What if Ander's personal quest is a choice between exorcising (going into the fade or sending Bethany into the fade to destroy the demon) vengance, and killing Anders and giving Vengance a new host with no soul to resist it?

I'd think Vengeance would prefer Anders alive, so he doesn't have to deal with all of that worrisome decomposing.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Archereon wrote...

I just had an amazing idea...

What if Ander's personal quest is a choice between exorcising (going into the fade or sending Bethany into the fade to destroy the demon) vengance, and killing Anders and giving Vengance a new host with no soul to resist it?

Oh I'm sure it'll be something like that, or telling Anders to just let go and let Vengeance take up permanent residence.  Which might be more likely.  I'd hate to see Anders walking around as a corpse.

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 13 février 2011 - 01:54 .

[Archereon]

RinjiRenee wrote...

Archereon wrote...

I just had an amazing idea...

What if Ander's personal quest is a choice between exorcising (going into the fade or sending Bethany into the fade to destroy the demon) vengance, and killing Anders and giving Vengance a new host with no soul to resist it?

Oh I'm sure it'll be something like that, or telling Anders to just let go and let Vengeance take up permanent residence.  Which might be more likely.  I'd hate to see Anders walking around as a corpse.

If this really happens, I personally hope there's no "third option" of convincing vengance to leave Anders, or if there is, he remains a demonic entity rather than returning to being a spirit of justice.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Archereon wrote...

If this really happens, I personally hope there's no "third option" of convincing vengance to leave Anders, or if there is, he remains a demonic entity rather than returning to being a spirit of justice.

I really don't think they would have that option, especially since apparently Anders has a literal JUSTICE button on his hotbar.  I just think you'll get a chance to return Justice and Anders to their senses (whether through bloody violence or just a friendly talking-to) and renew his resolve to act for justice and not out of empty vengeance.

[catabuca]

Galagraphia wrote...

@catabuca, which one do you like better? If you start with f!Cousland you will have more approval from Anders and he'll tell your PC how awesome and lovely she is But, you know, in a friendly way, no cheating on Alistair XD

It may just have to be her then XD

I like both wardens equally to be fair. But Anders telling me how awesome I am? I think you've swayed me ;-)

[Rinji the Bearded]

catabuca wrote...

Galagraphia wrote...

@catabuca, which one do you like better? If you start with f!Cousland you will have more approval from Anders and he'll tell your PC how awesome and lovely she is But, you know, in a friendly way, no cheating on Alistair XD

It may just have to be her then XD

I like both wardens equally to be fair. But Anders telling me how awesome I am? I think you've swayed me ;-)

Anders> She was an excellent Commander... a fine, fine lady... hm. ♥
Hawke> So that persuaded you to leave the Grey Wardens then?
Anders> -feigns tears, sniffle- I-it never would have worked out.  She is a Queen and I am a Mage, no one would have understood!  I left for both of our benefits...
Hawke> ... I hope you at least left a note.
Anders> Yes.  I'm not completely heartless, what do you take me for?!

[LPPrince]

RinjiRenee wrote...

catabuca wrote...

Galagraphia wrote...

@catabuca, which one do you like better? If you start with f!Cousland you will have more approval from Anders and he'll tell your PC how awesome and lovely she is But, you know, in a friendly way, no cheating on Alistair XD

It may just have to be her then XD

I like both wardens equally to be fair. But Anders telling me how awesome I am? I think you've swayed me ;-)

Anders> She was an excellent Commander... a fine, fine lady... hm. ♥
Hawke> So that persuaded you to leave the Grey Wardens then?
Anders> -feigns tears, sniffle- I-it never would have worked out.  She is a Queen and I am a Mage, no one would have understood!  I left for both of our benefits...
Hawke> ... I hope you at least left a note.
Anders> Yes.  I'm not completely heartless, what do you take me for?!

Hawke- "An apostate."

Anders- "Oh......"

[catabuca]

XD

I really can't wait to meet Anders for the first time now.

[Jenova65]

catabuca wrote...

XD
I really can't wait to meet Anders for the first time now.

I loved Anders in Awakenings and he looks a bit more edgy in DA II 

Modifié par Jenova65, 13 février 2011 - 03:22 .

[Archereon]

Jenova65 wrote...

catabuca wrote...

XD
I really can't wait to meet Anders for the first time now.

I loved Anders in Awakenings and he looks a bit more edgy in DA II 

I'm personally hoping we have to choose between Anders and Vengance.  Either destroy Vengance in the fade, or break Anders will and allow Vengance to control Anders full time.

[syllogi]

Although Justice didn't really stand out too much to me in Awakening, he was still a full time member of my party, and he had a lot of potential for future development. I'll be sad if we don't have a chance to redeem Justice in some way. If it comes down to choosing between saving Anders and Justice, I will probably choose Anders, but I hope that's not the case.



My suspicion is that we will have to let the spirit go back to the Fade, whether we can change Vengeance back into Justice or not. I don't know what this will mean for Anders, but it seems like the logical outcome.

[Janele]

Aris Ravenstar wrote…

Ser Pounce makes the brave sacrifice for his best friend and becomes Vengeance's new host. This does not bode well for your mabari.

LOL. Oh my gosh, that would be absolutely hilarious. Poor Ser-Pounce-a-lot (and marabi), but the image that just gave me is great!

Knight of Phoenix wrote…

So I was kind of fooled by his exterior it seems. He does a pretty good job at controlling his emotions. Good for him. Well until Justice came along. But even here, he seems to be struggling to control him. Rather impressive, Uldred seemingly didn't manage (though it was a pride demon and in a moment of deesperation, so maybe kind of difference) .

Anders was always a really powerful mage. When you first meet him, he’s surrounded by darkspawn corpses. If you leave him at Vigil’s Keep and he dies, the epilogue slide says this “He is found dead with an arrow through his neck with hundreds of darkspawn dead in a circle around him; none were touched with a blade, but all were felled by magic.” He is one freaking powerful mage, so the being able to control the demon within? Definitely expected/possible.

Miri1984 wrote…

I very much doubt Anders would let Justice share his body without a damn good reason. Boy LIKES his freedom.

I agree with you. There had to be a series of catalysts- one to prompt the habitation question and have it actually accepted, another to cause the change from Justice to Vengeance. And maybe a third while we’re playing, to calm Vengeance down!

Molami wrote…

Sorry to say this, in case you don't want to hear it, but Justice was not very eager to let his previous body go.

No, he wasn’t. In my epilogue, at least, he only left when Aura refused to see him any longer because the body was decaying too much. *Shudder*

Modifié par Janele, 13 février 2011 - 05:24 .

[crotti]

Uh... I started drawing a picture of Anders, but I get the feeling that it is somehow... absurd?
I mean, the symbol of the Chantry being burnt...  I should do something different, no?

Before anyone believes that this is supposed to be finished as soon as I have drawn his face, the right hand and - of course - Ser Pounce-a-lot: No. As I have said, I just began - and since this is my first "real" picture with photoshop (or anything like that), plus I only have a mouse at the moment, I'm really slow and bad. Normally, I use mechanical pencils (I hope that this is the right name "xD)

http://i213.photobuc...chtfertigXD.jpg
(EDIT: since it is not even finished, I won't post it here directly. It's just too... bad X__x)
I think I will draw a new one...  <_<


When I watched the video of Anders, I thought that his "other side" was just Anders being angry or something like that. xD
I still don't get it... Is he still Anders or is it Justice who talks and acts? I mean - does Anders know what he is doing?

Modifié par crotti, 13 février 2011 - 05:45 .

[druplesnubb]

Janele wrote...
Anders was always a really powerful mage. When you first meet him,
he’s surrounded by darkspawn corpses. If you leave him at Vigil’s Keep
and he dies, the epilogue slide says this “He is found dead with an
arrow through his neck with hundreds of darkspawn dead in a circle
around him; none were touched with a blade, but all were felled by
magic.” He is one freaking powerful mage, so the being able to control
the demon within? Definitely expected/possible.

If he survives the attack the epilogue states something along the lines of him being seen as the sole reason the keep survived, killing hundreds of darkspawn with his magic. It doesn't say this about Velanna, even though the wording in the epilogue implies she  survived until somewhere at the end with "the surviving defenders" watching as she dies. Anders is probably way stronger than the balanced gameplay mechanics lets on (see also how Shale, despite being a golem, who are described in the codex as "each being an army" and are you know, gigantic stone/metal soldiers, being no stronger than Alistair or Oghren).

Modifié par druplesnubb, 13 février 2011 - 05:53 .

[syllogi]

crotti wrote...

When I watched the video of Anders, I thought that his "other side" was just Anders being angry or something like that. xD
I still don't get it... Is he still Anders or is it Justice who talks and acts? I mean - does Anders know what he is doing?

According to Jennifer Hepler, who wrote Anders in DA2, we still get to see the "old" Anders, but Justice will take over at certain points, and over time, he will become more and more obsessed with destroying the Chantry.

People have speculated about how this will work, but we'll see.  I think it would be a tragedy to make him completely different.

[Russalka]

Perhaps Vengeance is strong enough to force the whole party into the Fade, to play with and feed off the desire for revenge any companion might have.

Modifié par Russalka, 13 février 2011 - 06:03 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Janele wrote...

Knight of Phoenix wrote…

So I was kind of fooled by his exterior it seems. He does a pretty good job at controlling his emotions. Good for him. Well until Justice came along. But even here, he seems to be struggling to control him. Rather impressive, Uldred seemingly didn't manage (though it was a pride demon and in a moment of deesperation, so maybe kind of difference) .

Anders was always a really powerful mage. When you first meet him, he’s surrounded by darkspawn corpses. If you leave him at Vigil’s Keep and he dies, the epilogue slide says this “He is found dead with an arrow through his neck with hundreds of darkspawn dead in a circle around him; none were touched with a blade, but all were felled by magic.” He is one freaking powerful mage, so the being able to control the demon within? Definitely expected/possible.

I am not sure that necessarily translates into a strong willpower capable of resisting a demon, though the Harrowing definitely required us to fight.

I think it's also because Vengerance is just a weak demon by now. Not a pride or deire demon.

[Herr Uhl]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I think it's also because Vengerance is just a weak demon by now. Not a pride or deire demon.

I think he is a special case on his own. He was able to challenge the Baroness in the Fade, so I'd rank him pretty high.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Yes, people are seeming to make the generalization that OMG ANDERS IS POSSESSED AND EVIL AND AN ABOMINATION, or at least this is the tone I'm getting... Yes, Anders does want fight the Chantry (with good reasons, especially if you know his past), yes, he does have a spirit currently inhabiting his body and due to his negative emotions, Justice has seemed to transform into a demon of sorts... but is it really that black and white?



No. I trust Helper will make his story sympathetic, at least to some degree. This will mean that we will see a side of Anders that doesn't want to be that way. And he has to feel at least a little remorse, or else he would just let Vengeance take him over from the get-go. The demonic possession things are going to happen with more frequency as the story goes on, as I'm sure the situation with the Templars is going to become more and more of a big issue... and thus our relation with Anders, whether be friendly or otherwise, will bring us to a point where we are compelled to help him restore Justice or to fan the flames, essentially.



We will see the old Anders on most subjects that aren't directly involved with the Chantry. I really wouldn't worry about that.

[Galagraphia]

Yes, we all know Anders' surname is Norris!

*kidding*

Well, actually we know that he's a great mage who can't drink Oghren under the table.

Hmm, I've read again his description for Awakening and I think his new younger appearance suits him better.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Herr Uhl wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I think it's also because Vengerance is just a weak demon by now. Not a pride or deire demon.

I think he is a special case on his own. He was able to challenge the Baroness in the Fade, so I'd rank him pretty high.

Hmm, true. He was a powerful spirit, but could he have fought the demon in the blackmarsh on his own?

I wonder what class of demons Vengeance  would be classified as.

[Herr Uhl]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I think it's also because Vengerance is just a weak demon by now. Not a pride or deire demon.

I think he is a special case on his own. He was able to challenge the Baroness in the Fade, so I'd rank him pretty high.

Hmm, true. He was a powerful spirit, but could he have fought the demon in the blackmarsh on his own?

I wonder what class of demons Vengeance  would be classified as.

Well, if it was strictly a demon, rage would be closest (as it is pretty much justice + rage). But I doubt there has been many spirits that have turned demonic, so he'd have his own class.

[Russalka]

Some types of demons just might be more common and some unknown, and the strength of one could be tied to how much of the emotion it gets fed. Some emotions might be generally more powerful just because of their nature, like pride or desire. But that is only my take on it.

[panamakira]

I think it's evident enough what a powerful mage Anders is, besides some of the epilogue slides in Awakenings, the fact he can somehow coexist with a corrupted spirit is merit enough. The problem is how "bad" is it and how much control he has left.

Wynne was pretty powerful too but I think what let her coexist was that she was an undead or something and her strong sense of self-righteousness. Plus her spirit was virtue, so there was not too much tension there, but Justice is much more passionate and well....:?one thing let to the other....

I keep thinking though something bad happen to Anders and his contempt for the chantry got this bad~ After Awakenings~

Modifié par panamakira, 13 février 2011 - 06:59 .