268 réponses à ce sujet

[LordShrike]

I don't think cost apply in a scenario where Reapers are recognized as a threat. So it was a little (stupid) point in complaining about it... What it comes down to is specialists in any civilization. Senior systems analyst in IT(DN firing systems) will never be replaced by Senior systems analyst in IT(VI speech systems). And Construction capability, DN capable shipyards will not be built in few years.(guessing it few years since Shep isn't that much older.)

And no, by all means let's include QEC in ME, easier to explain all those "holes"...

Did it just get colder in here? Oh, it's already there... So anything in ME is not a hole; Just a QEC effects.

Just thinking about it makes head hurt.

[LordShrike]

Double post. Must be QEC.
Hmm.

Modifié par LordShrike, 23 février 2011 - 11:23 .

[KenKenpachi]

LordShrike wrote...

@KenKenpachi:
So what you are getting is that you know better than BW writers? Maybe you do. Achievement unlocked.
You said you have a solution. To what? Condensed down all that comes to: "i know better, use destroyers." Use destroyers to what? I know that DEs are superior from DNs(IRL), So, What?
I fail to see how this reflects any way to current topic or the OP. If you were just laying down the work for your point, then please, continue.
Or, was this just argument for the arguments sake? Little clarification could help.
EDIT: Did not see the freight train there. Nice Ninja work Zlurps.

-sigh- it was pointed at an argument a few pages back on whats better to use the frigate or the cruiser, and all the back and forth bickering on the two. A destroyer is a multirole platfrom that can handle several roles from escort, strike, fleet defense, and act as a defesnive screen.  Destoryers though I'm going on Real Ocean going Navies the same rolls should and are reflected, so with the "weak" frigates, and the "Too big" cruisers I pointed out a class of ship that lies inbetween is in fact open to naval planners.

As to the bioware comment, I was not directing it at them, however such a thing is not implausable to not happen as during the 19th to the 21st century various naval concepts were taken up and droped off left and right. In fact the concept of the Destoryer Vanished from many Navies during the interwar periods as it has in many smaller world navy's today where frigates form the back bones or capital ships of many smaller Navies. When Nations are at peace Military forces tend to be cut back, rather unwisely imo.  So overall it was ment to be informative to that past going on's. If you read back a few pages you'll see it, I felt no need to qoute it as honestly the last few pages have been off topic, not my problem that.

Modifié par KenKenpachi, 23 février 2011 - 11:35 .

[LordShrike]

 @KenKanpachi:Okay, so you know: "Few pages back" is last century to me. (i did re-read them now.) So apologies if "Feelings" were hurt.(totally alien concept to me, these "feelings".)
So; point valid. (Achievement unlocked.)
BTW, why not go Lighthugger class? All the bonuses of DN with no failures of FRI. 

Modifié par LordShrike, 23 février 2011 - 11:49 .

[ZLurps]

@KenKanpachi
It is good point you made now that I see it in context. I have read entire thread but I can remember only so much and felt bit puzzled too. I was just thinking how this relates to ME universe and that I don't recall the codex well enough to argue for or against.

Modifié par ZLurps, 23 février 2011 - 11:50 .

[KenKenpachi]

No feelings weren't hurt I'm used to having to go into great detail with crap with those around me all the time. Its just...hmm. tiresome at times. As to the pages back comments not really surprised, alot of people are like that, not ment as a bad comment however.



And Pft lighthuggers Give me and ISD from Star Wars any time man. Lol god that would be overkill against a reaper, seen this guy over at a site called stardestoryer.net, he went into all sorts of calculations and what not with the amount of power even one of those have.

[Urazz]

adam_grif wrote...

5. That the council believes that the Reapers are real, believes that there are still more of them out there, but does not publicly acknowledge this and wouldn't let Shepard into the loop because of his Cerberus connection.

Sovereign wasn't actually that impressive in size terms, and its guns are actually only tiny fractions of of its (two kilometer) Length. From visuals it looks like Sovereigns main guns are less than 100 meters long, at the tip of each tentacle. Assuming that Reapers can damage other Reapers, this means that the council should be able to - in theory - build Reaper strength guns on cruiser chassis without too much of a problem. Assuming power generation is a concern they can still load them onto Dreadnought chassis designed solely to generate enough power to fire the guns.

Whether this is happening or not is unknown, and I doubt Bioware really thought about stuff like this when they were making the game. We know that the Turians at least do have Thanix guns in their possession now, although whether they are only the kind that exists on the SR2 (i.e. tiny) or not is yet to be seen, along with then number of them that exist. The Alliance put the Javelin missile system into service since ME1, and the Batarians apparently have some sort of big orbital mirror death ray thingamajig.

As to why they aren't literally trying to build more Reapers, it might be because they can't (i.e. building regular 1KM dreadnoughts is hard enough, and doubling the size + a significantly larger core + fancy new guns just isn't possible) or they recognize that, although advanced, it is not an optimal design for combat and they want to build more specialized versions for their navies that are purely combat designs (don't need to land on planets = smaller core, only need guns = smaller size overall for example).

I doubt we'll find out until ME3. The fact that the Geth never came out with another Sovereign or even another ship with Thanix gun technology (despite the Turians trivially reverse engineering it to fit on FIGHTERS, of all things) should mean that it is blindingly obvious that the Geth do not have the cability to replicate more of them. For this reason I'm partial to believing that the council does, in fact, realize it's not Geth tech. If in ME3 it turns out that the council really does believe the crap that they are spewing about the Reapers not being real, that will leave a VERY bad taste in my mouth.

Errr....I thought the Turians couldn't get the Thanix Cannon to work yet as they didn't have any reactors strong enough to use it on frigates or fighters?  Hence why the Normandy was able to use it with it's Tantalus core.  It has a bigger reactor than other frigates.

[LordShrike]

Yes, well, Star destroyers are really not that OP compared to angsty teenage kid with issues. (According to this Manga/Anime i keep hearing about.) Nor, well written.

Glad that got cleared about, It just that it's been mostly about Reaper glorification for the last pages.

It's odd that reasonable arguments get injected. =)

[KenKenpachi]

Meh its an internet forum, how often is anything reassonable on those?



As to Anime based ships, not part of the OP's but I'ld take the Macross Fortress. I mean hell its a giant Aircraft Carrier/spaceship, that turns into a giant mech and can punch things. Not too mention that cannon. But ehh doubt it'ld be even possible to make something like that. As to reapers, yeah alot of glory considering I found one with a huge ass hole in its side. As the Arnie says.... "If It bleeds you can kill it.".

[LordShrike]

Killing the Derelict Reaper was stroke of Douglas Adams luck, Target and Weapon were more than light year apart. So it took more than year for MA shot to make that distance. Smells like luck to me...
Macross... Let's keep that out of this shall we? OP is fine, OMGWTF-OP is an other thing entirely.
Arnie was wrong, If it can bleed, it must be hit before it does that. Take a gander at my post few pages back...
EDIT: Anyone got any idea why this thread some time looks as Red and sometimes Blue on the forum page? 'Cause thats tripping.

Modifié par LordShrike, 24 février 2011 - 12:27 .

[KenKenpachi]

Hmm. Well in all fairness he pretty much only killed ole predie by as a Vietnamese General once said about the American's , Grab them by the Belt Buckle. I'm honestly thinking short of you finding a super weapon or some hidden new age ship building going on, that well if the reapers can be pinned and IF we can mass our whole fleet we can win. *as I think all the Reapers you've met have been BSing you like Bagdad Bob. But I think it will be more like a game of Future Pirates where we take MASSIVE losses trying to ram and then send sabatoge teams aboard, I mean they are living giant machines and they must have a power core. Though given what we've seen of Reapers I wonder if they are little more than Smart Ships, in which case we would be sending bomb teams aboard only to fight whatever passes as a "Crew". Or concentrating fire on one at a time, though that may work I think it will favor the reapers far more than us.

Honestly I'm expecting that what ever fleet we get even if you keep the station and make your own reapers or anti reaper weapons, it will be like Poland VS Germany, 1940. I'm expecting though it may be well predicatble Shepard will find some sort of Super Weapon, or lead the Reapers into a trap like a supernova, its still more likely than us just kicking the reapers around. The Tech we've seen so far isn't up to par. Its horses versus tanks, so unless some mighty damn good goodies are being worked on, I think this will all play out with Shepard. Though the tech on the SR2, if its shared between the various powers it may give an edge, then again it might not, in the Real World when most modern nations (namely Russia) sells military hardware to another nation they dumb it down so if its turned on them no big deal. For all we know what might hurt the collectors might just make the Reapers mad. Remains to be seen.

Though on a side note a Space based Pirates ahoy!, does sound rather amussing.

Modifié par KenKenpachi, 24 février 2011 - 12:38 .

[LordShrike]

@KenKenpachi:

THIS ONE UNDERSTANDS, GIVE IT A COOKIE, FLESHLING. -HARBRINGER.

Somehow i get this urge to give you a cookie KenKenpachi, So, Here you go. (gives a cookie.)

Always saw the collectors as a third world country myself, somehow, so my thinking is that blowing up/keeping CB did not hurt Reapers in the least. Just helped Council races/Cerberus. SR-2 might be impressive but it also is very expensive, so the tech in it might not play any role in 3 at all.

Quite interested in how are you going to trap a Reaper, those thing are OLD.(needs gothica font.)They were not born yesterday.

[Moiaussi]

LordShrike wrote...

Killing the Derelict Reaper was stroke of Douglas Adams luck, Target and Weapon were more than light year apart. So it took more than year for MA shot to make that distance. Smells like luck to me...
Macross... Let's keep that out of this shall we? OP is fine, OMGWTF-OP is an other thing entirely.
Arnie was wrong, If it can bleed, it must be hit before it does that. Take a gander at my post few pages back...
EDIT: Anyone got any idea why this thread some time looks as Red and sometimes Blue on the forum page? 'Cause thats tripping.

Lol where are you getting the technical specs for the weapon? Or even battle details? The reaper could have been hit closer to the weapon and brought down by smaller weapons once it was wounded badly enough.

It could have limped into the gas giant to hide.

The weapon itself could have been FTL.

The projectile might have been cloaked somehow or the Reaper's sensors blinded and either way the Reaper been caught in port.

That is the fun thing about leaving the details out as a writer. You can come up with answers later if you need them and if you never need them, just leave it unexplained.

[Moiaussi]

LordShrike wrote...

I don't think cost apply in a scenario where Reapers are recognized as a threat. So it was a little (stupid) point in complaining about it... What it comes down to is specialists in any civilization. Senior systems analyst in IT(DN firing systems) will never be replaced by Senior systems analyst in IT(VI speech systems). And Construction capability, DN capable shipyards will not be built in few years.(guessing it few years since Shep isn't that much older.)
And no, by all means let's include QEC in ME, easier to explain all those "holes"...
Did it just get colder in here? Oh, it's already there... So anything in ME is not a hole; Just a QEC effects.
Just thinking about it makes head hurt.

Cost is only irrelevant if you have unlimited resources to work with (including time). If that was the case, though then the Reaper threat wouldn't even exist, since unlimited time equates to them never coming. Specialists and facilities are just different aspects of cost. You can alway train more and/or build more, given time and resources. It is just as likely that there are limited resources as limited time.

[LordShrike]

@Moiaussi:

1post:Technical specs of the weapon are irrelevant.Glendagon(or something similiar) codex entry states it was a Mass Accelerator weapon. TIM does not correct that when he says they found both.

MA weapons have a preset limitations; they cannot go FTL and projectiles cannot contain any fragile components(no FTL or stealth). It is also my belief that the "death" was imminent.(argue all you want.) Also, blinding a Reaper would be something i don't see as a possibility.(for a year.) Other points might hold true.

2post:You think like a gud'damn Capitalist. Me? I'm a gud'damn Communist. so what i'm thinking here is that confirmed Reaper threat will make all considerations of cost irrelevant. Time is limited, yes, even more reason to ignore all metaphysical concepts of currency that make capitalist society function. So in other words; Everything is Nationalized, including people and personal belongings.

[ZLurps]

Intermission before Part III: QEC and propaganda.

I posted earlier how losing control of mass relays means each star cluster is left on their own defending their systems. If there is functional QEC network between clusters information about nature of threat can be shared and via shared research effective offensive weapons and defenses perhaps developed.

However there is one factor that may change things. So called Dark switches may allow traffic and communications between clusters for galactic races.

There are 2 news items mentioning Dark switches in Cerberus Daily news. Link to remaining ones below.
http://www.cerberusd....com/?tag=tr-15

I could swear I saw something else about Dark switches in CDN too, but I couldn't find anything else. Hmm... my memory is probably playing tricks on me...

Anyway, this means that mass relays can be manipulated outside from the Citadel. It's interesting because when the Reapers get to the first mass relay in galaxy, the next stop is likely to be Citadel where they will take control of mass relay network. However, galactic races that know how to operate those Dark switches may be able to open mass relays again, even Reapers have control of Citadel.
That means that Reapers are also likely to manipulate relays even they wouldn't have control of Citadel.

Anyway, even research on Dark switches would lead into something, in the war against Reapers QEC technology would still matter, because Reapers are likely to be able to listen all communications over relay network and break all encryption methods used by galactic races. But QEC, that is a different thing.

Modifié par ZLurps, 25 février 2011 - 06:33 .

[LordShrike]

Finally have the energy to respond.(FF XIII does that to you, it eats SOULS!(pun))
Lessee here now... That really is not much to go on. Those dark switches could be nothing of importance in the long run. "Infamous control mechanism" suggest that it indeed maybe something to account for, but without more than few CDN posts that indirectly link to it... No.
I'm running out of ideas for a new posts in this regard slowly but surely. I doubt my random doodles of mathematics could make anything intresting to read, so thats out of the picture.
If you have anything intersting to ponder please do so. Kinda curious as to where we are at this thread currently anyway. I think that it has to contain something from the OP, so i'm heading there to read it now. Hopefully sparking something related in my underused brainpan. This is too good of a thread to let die without a fight. And maybe the OP won't then be so vexed with us "Lunatic Fringe." =)

[LordShrike]

 /Initiate high efficiency brain functions until argument worthy reply has been compiled.
@Zacarius2s OP:
Maybe the Council is unable to make a efficient response because of political opposition? Exactly because the Veil is unknown, political opposition will argue why do anything to something that cannot be confirmed on any sources. Maybe the Council is just as vexed about this whole state of affairs as Shep? I mean they would have to play according to the playing field, wich has been waylaid by antiwar protestors, political opportunists and those hoping for a place in the Council. If they start proclaiming that the Reapers are coming and that ship building quotas must be increased to meet the threat, they will be replaced by those gloryhogs faster than you can say "Geth". And those succeeding the original councilors would have no knowledge of the Reapers at all. Maybe they are doing nothing obvious to counter the threat because publicly acknowledging it would mean that the next Council would do absolytely nothing to it. Political realities must factor in to it.
Well that's one way to look at it any way... Toughts?

Modifié par LordShrike, 27 février 2011 - 08:23 .

[Moiaussi]

LordShrike wrote...

@Moiaussi:<br />
1post:Technical specs of the weapon are irrelevant.Glendagon(or something similiar) codex entry states it was a Mass Accelerator weapon. TIM does not correct that when he says they found both.<br />
MA weapons have a preset limitations; they cannot go FTL and projectiles cannot contain any fragile components(no FTL or stealth). It is also my belief that the "death" was imminent.(argue all you want.) Also, blinding a Reaper would be something i don't see as a possibility.(for a year.) Other points might hold true.<br />
2post:You think like a gud'damn Capitalist. Me? I'm a gud'damn Communist. so what i'm thinking here is that confirmed Reaper threat will make all considerations of cost irrelevant. Time is limited, yes, even more reason to ignore all metaphysical concepts of currency that make capitalist society function. So in other words; Everything is Nationalized, including people and personal belongings.

It was a mass accelerator weapon of unknown specs that they can't reproduce. If they 'cannot go FTL', then neither can any starship. They are all using mass effect based propulsion.

As for 'not being possible for a year' or any given period of time, what has that got to do with the price of tea? I was talking about the weapon when it actually was built and fired. As I said, we have no clue the details of the battle. We don't know how or precisely when or where the Reaper was actually hit, only that it was believed hit by said weapon. And it was the remains of the weapon, not an intact functional weapon.

What has communism have to do with the availability of raw materials? Communism and capitalism are different methods of allocating resources. Neither magicly makes everything abundant. If you are going to start babbling about such topics, learn some basic economics so you at least have a clue. Frankly, I think everyone should. Personally I have no problems with socialistic systems, given sufficient labour efficiency to maintain them. We aren't there yet, but by the time of ME? Who knows? That still doesn't mean infinite resources.

And frankly, your pet preferences aside, ME is VERY capitalistic. Governments in ME even make their soldiers aquire gear on the side, with money earned on missions supplemented by whatever they salvage. This seems true of the Alliance, Council and Cerberus. That is more capitalistic than RL, not less.

[LordShrike]

Humm. Knew i should have added more details to that 2nd part... I was sudoing that one by a friend while simultaneously playing FF. That is what my friend condensed from a 30 minute rant i bursted in, It has very little of the point remaining of what i was trying to say. And now i cannot remember what i was trying to say back then. Alcohol might have been involved. Still, i stand by it. Even if it does not make any sense. (even to me.)
And i don't wish to dig on that matter any deeper.
As to the whole weapon debate; Too many unknowns, anything related to that thing is pointless. But! FTL requires a Eezo core, that thing is fragile. And i simply refuse believe that any weapon would have that kind of thing in its shells. Kamikazeing a frigate would make more sense, if you are trying to FTL something dead. And besides. Only that much damage from a FTL slug? Nah-hah, Reaper would be expanding gas cloud if it got hit by something FTL.

[KenKenpachi]

LordShrike wrote...
Quite interested in how are you going to trap a Reaper, those thing are OLD.(needs gothica font.)They were not born yesterday.

I've been pondering that for some time actully and I have some idea's but I feel none of them are really all that realistic, or possible.

I was at first thinking maybe you could build a gravitational well, like say an Imobilizer Frigate like the Empire in Star Wars, however two problems shoot a hole in this. One I don't see Shepo's team or any nation state building such a device, the technological edge just isn't in place for it. And more importantly I don't think it would do a damn thing. We seen Sovie just fly out of a gravity well (Eden Prime) like a bat out of hell, and jump out of system very close to the planet. To me that pretty much goes SCREW YOU GRAVITY WELL! And thus Useless.

2nd is Shepard pisses of the Reapers SOOO Badly they send everything after him. And he goes to an unstable star and basically somehow has it to go supernova. But Thats like the Covie sending everything after MC. It just didn't and won't happen, no matter how much of a pain in an ass you are, no one with a shred of being able to think what-so-ever, would do something so stupid. And though the Reapers may be liars, they don't seem stupid. Even in Star Wars the Empire didn't send but a fraction of the Fleet to Endor. I don't think the Reapers will be the reverse and just go OH NOES IT BE SHEPARD!!! And then rush him.

On the other hand I could see the supernova happening if say, if the Cithidal is set to explode, or another systems star, if say a tempting military target is presented such as the bulk of whatever allied ships Shepard can get. Problems are, one in the Cithidals case its like keeping the US Army in DC, the Russians invade and we fight them there in some Saddam Mother of all battles type deal battle, and then set off like a 100 megaton Nuke in DC. Most soldiers while willing to fight to the death if need be or to do ones duty, will not just line up and drink the Kool-aid so to speak. Nevemind the whole goverment and capital is just gone. So yeah you beat the Reapers, but gee, your military is gone and if someone else wants to take a shot at you, well gee, might as well throw up the white flags. In either case, I just don't see Soldiers lining up and jumping into a volcano, nevermind well this ending sucks. Shepard CAN NOT live.

The only other version of a trap I can see working is all based on superweapon concepts, be it the Beings of light, the possible frozen civiliaztion, a huge ass MAC cannon, Dark Energy its self, or a programming virus. Basicly have something that can kill the reapers go WOOOO LOOK WHAT I GOT, and ring the dinner bell, if its a significant threat they will throw everything at it that they can. They'ld have too. Its like if terroist stole an Ohio class Missile Submarine with its launch codes, the US and its Allies would throw everything it had at it, because of the threat it contains. You have no Choice here, its, throw everything at it. Or watch alot of you and yours die. Of course the Reapers could win in such an event but I'll Metagame here and say unless you screw up baddly you'll win.

I also see the Reaper Base as well useless. Its like if I went back in time and gave **** Germany a Eurofighter Typhoon, and a Leopard 1 Tank. Even though Germany at the time could build Tanks like the Panther and Tiger, and Jets like the ME-262. And I threw all the plans to them they would not be able to build replacements for those I gave them or even be able to maintane them. Same if I gave Attila the Hun blue Prtints for an AK-47. Sure we will LEARN from it but well, learning that takes time isn't any good if your door is being kicked in then and now. And I highly doubt thats the only Reaper base/construction facility, That or the Reapers are as stupid as modern Earth Governments. Heck I doubt we even seen the last of the reapers. And even if the base is destroyed we could gain slavage from it, and though not as good as a working one, salvage has provided technological advances.

Maybe I'm lowering the bar too much on the R&D of the Mass Effect Races, but a common trend I noticed was a lack of motivation its like, well we got these jump gates and all this cool stuff left by a race that just vanished, were cool now. Like the Asari who pretty much just use what they have for thousands of years or so it seems. I mean if it were me it would be, Well now lets see about making our ships jump without the gates, and better high powerd weapons.

But this is not so far out there so to speak, like today, our technological progress short of tech junkie crap is a joke.  Such as the potential offerd in Helium 3 for our energy needs which is in huge supply on the moon, and surprise surprise, our nukes give them off as they rot. So gee a pratical use for nukes at last! Or how currently short of the Chinese space exploration and development is at a stillbirth. Funny enough most technological progress on Earth tends to result purely from War. When we are at peace its time to kick up our feet on the table and drink.

But thats off topic.

On the subject of firing weapons while in FTL, I think unless those weapons could move FASTER than the ship that was in FTL, at best it would hit the reaper at about the same time as the ship, and if faster then its pratical except figuring out how to make it "Fall" out of FTL travel and hit the reaper, better yet inside the reaper, there are SEVERAL problems with getting this to work however. If the weapons are at normal speed well it would have the same effect as why they don't fire weapons in hyperspace in Star Wars, it wll just fall back on and hit the ship.

On the other hand short of problems of logistics, targetting data, and information processing I think its fully plauseable to make a "Fireship" or an advanced missile System, that travels at point blank range and then pops out at point blank range and detonates. Problem is that the council races have banned all WMD's so unless they are welling to bend the rules or Humanity still has its high yield stockpiles of nukes rotting away, any such missile would have to be exceadingly large to have enough convential firepower to bring down a reaper. a High Yield multi 100 megaton atomic device imo stands a much better chance. But with those "gone" It would take more time to build than we may have. And throwing away a limited Number of ships packed full of explosives seems unwise unless humanity at the very least with its waisted capacity to wage war just massively expanded to quickly provide the hulks needed. Given the Militant nature of the Turians they have to be running at capacity I'ld wager, the other races just don't have the stomach, or the political will for such a build up.

It remains to be seen if Humanity does. Given our seemingly Liberal and democractic form of Future goverment in ME I highly doubt it short of a radical taking over. It would be like the modern US having a draft, the goverment that did so would quickly fall. Even if in danger that is not a sure fire proof we would. As in WW2 the US Military and our greatest generation provided the Military with only 25% just walking in and saying sign me up. 75% were drafted. Authoratarian states have always had less problems just going, well your going to fight and if you come back will shoot you (Ala Russia).

None of the Races really are in a position to mount a fight, most ships seem to be built along the lines of Show of Force (like Cruisers) or peacekeeping (Frigates) and we have yet to see the all important ground forces. Its like in a topic on the Off topic board I still maintane the UNSC of Halo would stand a better  chance than the Alliance with all of its allies. At least is forces don't depend on jump gates, are armed to the Teeth and number in the at least tens to hundreds of millions if not billions with the use of a Draft.  And more importantly show significant manuverability and a willingness to die if need be to win. (such as UNSC destoryers ramming cruisers they could not match toe to toe, or blowing there own reactors to take out a few more ships.)

Short of its all on Shep, superweapons, or sheer luck or stupidity on the part of the Reapers, the ME universe just doesn't have the military capacity and a limited political will. Various racial differences, will still prove problamatic, and even after the reaper threat is gone it will just fallow like the cold War.

I see the Alliance as Russia, or a Reverse America so to speak in WW2. It will be what has to swing the ballance of forces, and has the potential and speed to do so (So like the US) In the end everyone will be like WE LOVE YOU HUMANS!!! After our millions if not billions of dead save the day (Russia). But with a large standing Army I doubt we will go back into the box or be pushed around (Both). So in the end everyone will forget what we've done and come to fear,, hate and not trust us. (Cold War). Funny enough that happens to a player who lets the council die.

[LordShrike]

@KenKenpachi:
You pretty much sniped yourself with that wall of text on most parts.(Not all of it, of course.) This part is the one that grabbed my attention somehow:
"On the subject of firing weapons while in FTL, I think unless those weapons could move FASTER than the ship that was in FTL, at best it would hit the reaper at about the same time as the ship, and if faster then its pratical except figuring out how to make it "Fall" out of FTL travel and hit the reaper, better yet inside the reaper, there are SEVERAL problems with getting this to work however. If the weapons are at normal speed well it would have the same effect as why they don't fire weapons in hyperspace in Star Wars, it wll just fall back on and hit the ship."
As far as i understand it, Eezo creates a bubble where FTL is capable. Should something leave that bubble it decelerates instantly to 99.99....% of light speed, and continues to decelarate as per physics. It also makes a lot of sense... Wich is directly related to the next part i tought was intresting:
The "fireship" scenario. Problem with FTLing "fireship" is it's accuracy, you must calculate actual position of target BEFORE the jump. And thats nightmare. Think more: Textbook saturation barrage might work IF you have enough of them and IF your math is solid. Still you'd have to cover a lot of ground... Just tought of something that might remove one dimension out of THAT equasion... You did a shining job on that post. Deserves cookies, lots of cookies.
Now, about that theory.(Reaper, how i wish i had 3D skillz...)
Bear with me, this might get messy as i try to explain this. And i need to dumben it down a bit, so the technical details might be lacking.(and representation...)
Make a wall of probes. Point them to a Reaper. Engage FTL. Kill FTL BEFORE projected area of presence. Now, every probe has a proximity sensor, as they move, as a wall, across the area of projected presence they will hit anything in there. Hopefully that something is a Reaper. And since it's space they will move at high % of light speed. It should be easy enough to reproduce since every probe that does not hit is reclaimable. Okay, easier than i thinked... IF you understood that, that is...

[Moiaussi]

LordShrike wrote...

Humm. Knew i should have added more details to that 2nd part... I was sudoing that one by a friend while simultaneously playing FF. That is what my friend condensed from a 30 minute rant i bursted in, It has very little of the point remaining of what i was trying to say. And now i cannot remember what i was trying to say back then. Alcohol might have been involved. Still, i stand by it. Even if it does not make any sense. (even to me.)
And i don't wish to dig on that matter any deeper.
As to the whole weapon debate; Too many unknowns, anything related to that thing is pointless. But! FTL requires a Eezo core, that thing is fragile. And i simply refuse believe that any weapon would have that kind of thing in its shells. Kamikazeing a frigate would make more sense, if you are trying to FTL something dead. And besides. Only that much damage from a FTL slug? Nah-hah, Reaper would be expanding gas cloud if it got hit by something FTL.

The frigate would require a much bigger core. If it is being used as a bullet, you are going to want 'cheap', since it is gone after the shot is made. Besides, they might have found a way to give the projectile a temporary mass field.
In ME2, we already have that as a biotic power, so there is obvious precident in game.

The whole 'speed of MA weapons' thing is really not that well thought out even for the weapons we already know about. Combat has to occur really quite close for them to be useful.

[LordShrike]

@Moiaussi:
This weapon conversation is just reaching for things now... But, i'll play... That weapon has to be massive? No? So the shell is likely already size of a FRI. Hence, if you could do it, and place core(not happening) in that thing it would not save any "money" in doing so. And i still stand by my last statement: "Reaper would be expanding gas cloud if it got hit by something FTL." Biotic powers are different from mechanically induced fields, thats what the game tells us. I'm sticking with it.
"Combat has to occur really quite close for them to be useful."
N.O.
Combat occurs between factions with MASSIVE calculation power between them. And if you can do that kind of math, range is naturally preferred to CC. The whole "speed of MA weapons" is not "not that well thought", it is a bloody fact IRL.
EDIT: That and this are two different words, i wish my brain would belive that...

Modifié par LordShrike, 27 février 2011 - 06:33 .

[Moiaussi]

Why does the shell have to be the size of a frigate? Higher velocity works much more effectively than higher mass. The size of the weapon needed to achieve the higher velocity does not neccessarily relate to projectile size.

As for 'doing the math' it is not so much the math, but the fact that at some of the ranges talked about, it is minutes to hours for a projectile to reach its target. That is more than enough time for the other captain to arbitrarily change course and your unguided lump of iron simply miss. To 'do the math' you need to know information they don't have, such as where the target will be when the shell gets to it.

If the enemy ship is using 'evasive maneuvers', it might be able to analyze its movements for a pattern, but frankly space combat relies entirely on the target not being able to see the projectile. If they could see it, they would often have time to simply get out of the way. Heck, worst case they could out run it.

As for the reaper being vaporized by such a projectile, that is a completely arbitrary assessment on your part of the Reaper's defences, not to mention your assumption that a massive weapon must de facto fire a massive projectile. Keep in mind that the majority of the Alliance fleet as well as the surviving Council fleet were firing on Sovereign, which at the time was a stationary ideal target, yet not seeming to make a dent in its shielding. Reapers are not like the Collector garbage scow. The Reapers have bloody impressive sheilding.