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[Hero11N7]

you think there will actually be any reference to what happened to Jowan in later games?

[errant_knight]

Hero11N7 wrote...

you think there will actually be any reference to what happened to Jowan in later games?

You never know. He was intended to be a companion at one point, so threads of that may still come into play. I suspect that what we'd find out wouldn't be anything good, though.

[wickedgoodreed]

Finn makes an amusing Jowan reference in Witch Hunt if the warden is a mage. It seems as though as far as the other circle mages are aware Jowan was successful in his escape attempt (even though he was turned back over to the Circle in that playthrough). I suppose that rules out a Tranquil!Jowan living in the Tower scenario. I always just assumed he was shipped off to Aeonar.

[HolyAvenger]

He could've escaped again before they made him Tranquil or killed him.

[errant_knight]

HolyAvenger wrote...

He could've escaped again before they made him Tranquil or killed him.

Very true. If they want to bring him back, it wouldn't be hard. Unless you see the corpse, the could have lived, and sometimes when you did (Oghren if you killed him.)
Y'know, we're bound to see Aeonar at some point. Too potentially interesting not to.

Modifié par errant_knight, 12 février 2011 - 07:23 .

[wickedgoodreed]

HolyAvenger wrote...

He could've escaped again before they made him Tranquil or killed him.

Jowan seems pretty resigned and willing to accept whatever punishment he's sentenced to though, so I have my doubts about whether he'd make another escape attempt. But since we're talking about Jowan, it wouldn't surprise me if some sort of catastrophe just happened to occur while he was in the vicinity, thus unintentionally freeing him from his captors.

[Sarah1281]

@nenosronhir: Lily DOES give Jowan the benefit of the doubt. She asks if he's a blood mage and he denies it. She believes the word of a mage over that of the templars. She doesn't appear very comfortable with magic in general but she doesn't think it's evil, just blood magic. Lily finds out that Jowan was lying to her AND an evil blood mage and has less than a minute to make a decision. Her first reaction is 'get away from me' and now she feels like she's done something horribly wrong in trying to help a blood mage escape. Maybe if Lily would have had time to calm down, she would have gone with him but even had she not I don't see that as horrible of her. She loved him despite his magic which he couldn't help but he COULD have helped being a blood mage and that's almost universally feared and despised. No matter how much you love someone, there are some things that if they do you can't stay with them. Blood magic is one of Lily's and for all she knew, Jowan did kill them. They don't prove to be fine until Jowan's long gone, after all.

[LobselVith8]

Zombie Chow wrote...

The saddest part was that most of what he did was to avoid being made Tranquil (shown only in the Mage Origin), as was decideded by 1st Enchanter Irving and Gregoir.  But then again, what Jowan did after he escaped really proves that they were right and it would have been better for everyone if he was made Tranquil to begin with.

Greagoir decided his fate, Irving makes it clear that he didn't see the evidence in question and didn't have a say in the matter. Jowan made a mistake by trusting the Hero of River Dane, the person who emancipated Ferelden from Orlesian occupation thirty years ago, and he makes up for it when he's Master Levyn.

Modifié par LobselVith8, 12 février 2011 - 02:56 .

[mousestalker]

I think Lily gets locked up.



It's not just Jowan being a blood mage, It's that she asks him and he lies to her. To me, that's like your husband being accused of being a spy, asking him about it, him denying it. You believe him, defend him and then it turning out that he is a spy.



It's a deep level of deception there. And if he is willing to lie about being a blood mage, what else would he do? Would he be willing to control her mind?



Trust is at the heart of any relationship, especially if you are both giving up everything for love. Jowan has taken everything away from Lily and left her with nothing.

[frostajulie]

My mages never liked Lilly either because she was the winning competition or because she was a self righteous fearful little twirp who needed to stop barking like a chihuahua about the dangers of magic, get a clue lady your boyfriend is a mage.



However when Jowan just leaves without trying to save his friend leaving his supposed friend behind to an almost certain death that proves what a douchenozzle he is. I suppose he grows as a person, it is my hope that guilt about what he did to his friend, you know, abandoning them to die, eats away at his heart, but when you do play a mage his only concern is Lilly. My woobie mages make him run away. My angry bitter ones turn him over to the circle to be made tranquil taking bitter pleasure in sentencing him to a fate worse than death.

[Sarah1281]

You know, I've always been rather indifferent about Lily for most of the mage origin and then feel sorry for her after Jowan abandons her after lying to her. I just don't understand why she's so hated.

[mousestalker]

Sarah1281 wrote...

You know, I've always been rather indifferent about Lily for most of the mage origin and then feel sorry for her after Jowan abandons her after lying to her. I just don't understand why she's so hated.

A lot of gamers like Jowan. She's gets in the way of their romance/bromance. I am a great deal less fond of Jowan than most, so I feel sorry for her.

At least that's my theory.  

[Ashwraith]

If I recall correctly, at the end of the game, if you saved the Circle of Magi and spared Jowan, he can be seen marching to Denerim with the rest of the magi. So perhaps his fate wasn't quite as dire as one might think- I have a feeling he dies, no matter what you do, but going down in a blaze of glory against the Darkspawn has to be better than 'made Tranquil' or 'executed by Templars'.

Amirite or amirite.

[LobselVith8]

Ashwraith wrote...

If I recall correctly, at the end of the game, if you saved the Circle of Magi and spared Jowan, he can be seen marching to Denerim with the rest of the magi. So perhaps his fate wasn't quite as dire as one might think- I have a feeling he dies, no matter what you do, but going down in a blaze of glory against the Darkspawn has to be better than 'made Tranquil' or 'executed by Templars'.
Amirite or amirite.

I think it's a generic NPC that simply looks like him, because I've seen him even when I released Jowan and he never returned to the Circle of Magi. I understand that some people are angry because he lies and he leaves, but given that staying would mean that he would be given a lobotomy or killed, I don't see what other choices he had. The mage either betrayed Jowan or unknowingly helped a blood mage (and I suppose stayed because the mage is Irving's star pupil and cares about his or her mentor), and Lily refuses to have anything to do with him because he's a blood mage. I rather he found peace as Levyn than end up as an emotionless slave of the Chantry to craft magical items on demand.

[Hero11N7]

wickedgoodreed wrote...

Finn makes an amusing Jowan reference in Witch Hunt if the warden is a mage. It seems as though as far as the other circle mages are aware Jowan was successful in his escape attempt (even though he was turned back over to the Circle in that playthrough). I suppose that rules out a Tranquil!Jowan living in the Tower scenario. I always just assumed he was shipped off to Aeonar.

Finn was referring to Anders.

[White_Buffalo94]

He is executed, either by Arl Eamon or the Circle if you don't make him run away after you unlock him

[wickedgoodreed]

Hero11N7 wrote...

wickedgoodreed wrote...

Finn makes an amusing Jowan reference in Witch Hunt if the warden is a mage. It seems as though as far as the other circle mages are aware Jowan was successful in his escape attempt (even though he was turned back over to the Circle in that playthrough). I suppose that rules out a Tranquil!Jowan living in the Tower scenario. I always just assumed he was shipped off to Aeonar.

Finn was referring to Anders.

No, Finn was referring to Jowan.

Finn references Jowan at the statue of Eleni Zenovia if the warden mentions remembering it from the magi origin.

[Hero11N7]

do you think the chanters board quest needs to be completed for Jowan's story to be flagged as finished? and if so which choice is better, send him off to the tower or play it "safe" and just execute him on the spot?

[Hero11N7]

wickedgoodreed wrote...

Hero11N7 wrote...

wickedgoodreed wrote...

Finn makes an amusing Jowan reference in Witch Hunt if the warden is a mage. It seems as though as far as the other circle mages are aware Jowan was successful in his escape attempt (even though he was turned back over to the Circle in that playthrough). I suppose that rules out a Tranquil!Jowan living in the Tower scenario. I always just assumed he was shipped off to Aeonar.

Finn was referring to Anders.

No, Finn was referring to Jowan.

Finn references Jowan at the statue of Eleni Zenovia if the warden mentions remembering it from the magi origin.

Interesting. may need to look that up

[Aluvious]

He gets a far happier ending if you force him to escape from Redcliffe. Since his phylactery is destroyed, the templars won't find him, and he operates under a new identity saving refugees in his travels.

[Last Darkness]

Jowan dies in all scenarios unless when you first meet him in the Cell in Redcliff and free him and tell him to leave and never return. He survives and makes amends under a new idenity in this scenario only. All others he dies (The Templars wont make any Blood Mage Tranquil, its just not done no matter what you say or defend)

[Hero11N7]

I'm playing on the console so since that means I can't complete the side quest does that mean Jowan living free won't be "flagged"?

[maxernst]

mousestalker wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

You know, I've always been rather indifferent about Lily for most of the mage origin and then feel sorry for her after Jowan abandons her after lying to her. I just don't understand why she's so hated.

A lot of gamers like Jowan. She's gets in the way of their romance/bromance. I am a great deal less fond of Jowan than most, so I feel sorry for her.

At least that's my theory.  

I'm with you mousestalker.  I don't love Lily particularly, but Jowan lies to her--and me--point blank about being a blood mage.  That annoyed me when I was playing the mage origin because if he's such a great friend of mine, surely he knows I don't place much stock in what the Chantry says.  I'd still have helped him, but  I don't appreciate being asked to risk my neck under false pretenses.  Hell, he could have saved me the bother of having to go into the Fade and deal with a demon to learn blood magic.