529 réponses à ce sujet

[Jackalofdeath]

Fan service sells, it is disgusting really. If you go to the nexus for Dragonage and look at the top 10 mods downloaded, they are all sex mods, sex animation mods, nude character mods, jiggling boob mods. Its all very disturbing, perverted, etc etc. There is a time and place for everything, when i load up a game, I like to play a game,, not stare at some disgusting sex simulator for nerds and virgins who never have done it before.



Seriously, with all this fanservice, they could have developed so much more of the core game instead,

[TJPags]

Jackalofdeath wrote...

Fan service sells, it is disgusting really. If you go to the nexus for Dragonage and look at the top 10 mods downloaded, they are all sex mods, sex animation mods, nude character mods, jiggling boob mods. Its all very disturbing, perverted, etc etc. There is a time and place for everything, when i load up a game, I like to play a game,, not stare at some disgusting sex simulator for nerds and virgins who never have done it before.

Seriously, with all this fanservice, they could have developed so much more of the core game instead,

You realize those are user created mods, right?

So, Bioware didn't make them, fans did.  And how does that have anything to do with Bioware over-sexualizing Isabela?

[Jackalofdeath]

Reading comprehension, dude.

[TJPags]

Jackalofdeath wrote...

Reading comprehension, dude.

Coherency, dude.  You should try it. 

[Giantdeathrobot]

 It means there's a fanbase for that sort of thing, and Bioware seems to know it very well, what with putting at least one Ms. Fanservice per game since Jade Empire (possibly excluding Mass Effect 1). Doesn't bother me that much even if I think there's better ways of making a character sexy than putting her in the skimpiest/most revealing outfit possible.

[Ryzaki]

Giantdeathrobot wrote...

 It means there's a fanbase for that sort of thing, and Bioware seems to know it very well, what with putting at least one Ms. Fanservice per game since Jade Empire (possibly excluding Mass Effect 1). Doesn't bother me that much even if I think there's better ways of making a character sexy than putting her in the skimpiest/most revealing outfit possible.

Uh...who exactly was Ms. Fanservice in Jade Empire? DawnStar? She wasn't dressed any more revealing than the Female PC (heck most of the time the FPC had less clothing on) or Furious Ming (no shirt, elaborate tatoos, tight pants) Tiger shen (Might as well not had a shirt, buldging muscles, a bit ugly in the face though). Lu was fully dressed yeah but Lu was kinda fugly. 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 13 février 2011 - 05:24 .

[TJPags]

Giantdeathrobot wrote...

 It means there's a fanbase for that sort of thing, and Bioware seems to know it very well, what with putting at least one Ms. Fanservice per game since Jade Empire (possibly excluding Mass Effect 1). Doesn't bother me that much even if I think there's better ways of making a character sexy than putting her in the skimpiest/most revealing outfit possible.

Have you seen some of the outfits that were created by modders?  Yup, more revealing than anything Bioware put in the game.  And hell, there were mods that made Sir Gilmore - who exists in the HN origin only - a full time companion, and romanceable too, I think.

Modders changed Wynne so that she was younger and hotter.

Putting an attractive character, male or female, into the game doesn't do that.  People who want that in their game do that.

So, if Isabela being dressed as she is - and hey, I think it's ridiculous too, but not because it's overly sexual, simply because it makes no sense given what she'll be doing - makes it 'fanservice' and ruins the game for someone, well . . . not sure what to say about that.

[LPPrince]

Fanservice is perfectly fine to an extent.



I don't see how Bioware overstepped the boundary, thus I don't think this is a valid argument.



The women in DAO surely weren't over-sexualized, and from the little bit I've seen of DA2, the same holds true.



I mean, you can probably count on one hand every "over-sexualized" female in DAO, and I didn't have a problem with any of them.



Hell, I especially fancied The Lady of The Forest. Thought she was cool, and I liked her model(since she didn't really have an outfit).

[Yrkoon]

Jackalofdeath wrote...

 There is a time and place for everything, 

Indeed.    Playing a  dark sexy fantasy (bioware's descriptor of DA2, not mine) is not the time  or the place for scantily clad, deadly rogues.  Not at all.

Giantdeathrobot wrote...

 It means there's a fanbase for that sort of thing, and Bioware seems to know it very well, what with putting at least one Ms. Fanservice per game since Jade Empire (possibly excluding Mass Effect 1). Doesn't bother me that much even if I think there's better ways of making a character sexy than putting her in the skimpiest/most revealing outfit possible.

Well of course there's a fanbase for that sort of thing.  It's called the  gamer-who-doesn't-give-a-damn fan base.

There's also a fanbase for clean,  wholesome moral goodness.  It's called Church.

Both are totally fine, until one side decides to overstep its bounds and tell the other what's 'best'.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 13 février 2011 - 05:42 .

[Amioran]

twincast wrote...
Again nothing against people comfortable with their own sexuality, but putting a big bull's eye on your vagina doesn't feel realistic for anyone but hookers and the wet dreams of immature heterosexual males.

What can I say, you should go to India where these things are depicted in scultures everywhere in very crude ways, without masks or ipocricies, and actually are considered holy things. Tantra is sex and tantra is lascivious, vulgar and extremely frank, as it can be sex. In tantra the woman is respected as holy, in solar religions as christianity that are overly concerned about sex woman is considered less than the male.  The vagina is the bosom of the devil for the muslims, for the tantra it is the bosom of creation. Ponder about it.

But sure, all tantras are for "hookers and the wet dreams of immature heterosexual males", or maybe it is because you are offended by an holy act and cannot believe that anybody can not drool over it emotionally as you do? Get over your issues and why you are emotionally attracted/repulsed by a thing, whatever. This you should do. If you have a reaction about a natural thing, either "vulgar" (in the opinion of the society you live in) or anything, then something is amiss in you and not balanced in you, and the problem doesn't really lie on the thing you see.

There's nothing wrong with an act of nature in itself, the wrong is only on how it is perceived. If there's morbosity it's not in the depiction but in the beholder. Never exchange the two as if they have a connection or as if they are the same.

Modifié par Amioran, 13 février 2011 - 10:39 .

[JamesMoriarty123]

Man, arguments like this are totally invalid and pointless. You don't see male characters who are slightly balding, have a bit of a beer belly and are generally just average people. You also don't see male characters without rippling biceps and six packs.



That's because these people are characters in a game, not REAL people. If you're that insecure about yourself that you have to hope for some average woman character to be created so you can romance her and feel like you've accomplished something, you're in a bad place. Go out, meet some people, learn how to socialise.



Also, good looks and depth aren't mutually exclusive. In games or in real life. I know some interesting good looking women and some extremely boring plain women, stereotypes are not 100% proof.



Gah, this has gone off the rails a bit, basically all I wanted to say was, get over it. I'm all for a bit of fan service, afterall, it's a game, I ain't gonna marry it.

[Exodusith]

Its a fantasy game. If anything its not sexualised enough for most people. You know how fantasies go...



There are far worse examples of sexualisation across the media. Hell, most magazine covers have a half naked woman on. Those who are offended by a game and virtual characters, seriously need to take their protests back to the real world where there are far more pressing related issues to worry over.

[ByakuShiki]

Jademoon121 wrote...

The women in DA2 look more feminized than in DAO, but I don't think they're over-sexualized. Aveline and Merrill aren't wearing tight tops that show off their huge tracts of land, and only Isabella is wearing things that are "risque". Personally though, I agree with you. Over-sexualized women(or men) in video games just ruin the realism, which does get annoying VERY fast.
I want my warrior femHawke incased in 120 lbs of wrought steel and iron, not a metal bikini.

Dragon Age is set in a fantasy world too much realism kills fantasy

[ByakuShiki]

Exodusith wrote...

Its a fantasy game. If anything its not sexualised enough for most people. You know how fantasies go...

There are far worse examples of sexualisation across the media. Hell, most magazine covers have a half naked woman on. Those who are offended by a game and virtual characters, seriously need to take their protests back to the real world where there are far more pressing related issues to worry over.

I agree with you completely
it's just a game let us have our fun and fantasy in peace:whistle:

[Rockworm503]

A_y0ner_ wrote...

Skokes wrote...

"Overly" sexualized is an interesting value judgment. What level of sexualization is right?

I'm of mixed feelings on the matter myself. On one hand, it can be difficult to take games seriously when characters (male and female) are strongly exaggerated (and, for me at least, a little difficult to identify with them). I think that there's a place for exaggeration, but I'm not sure that games that seek to elicit emotional reactions deeper than visceral thrills are that place.

On the other, there's a problematic knee-jerk reaction to sexuality that often feels puritanical. There's a lot to be said for creating a highly-stylized fantasy world, and part of fantasy, for better or worse, is fantastically idealized characters.

Sex in games is in a really strange place right now. It's caught between a contingent that wants boobies now, dammit, another that thinks sex has no place in what is essentially a medium of toys, another that thinks sex should be treated in games as it is in film and other media (despite the fact that games aren't films or other media), another that would love to have sex and nudity in games but don't feel the tech's up to speed yet to do it justice, and others besides. It's kind of reflective of the state of gaming as a whole as it grows as a medium and strives for mainstream acceptance.

Which is perhaps a more serious response than the OP was looking for.

I think that's a good point. I know this is a fantasy game but I want to appreciate itd world as some sort of artistic expression, not a substitute playboy magazine for underage teenagers.

It makes me wonder what kind of audience video games are trying to market to. I can recall how Dead Space 2 was being advertised as something you buy because its cool to play in spite of how your mother would be horrified to be see you playing it. Now is that really the targeted audience? Made me think twice about buying Dead Space 2 just as Isabella's outfit made me think twice about buying DA2

I'm sorry I know this is an old post but I gotta comment on this.  If you stress so much on the marketing than I'm amazed you can enjoy any game.

[My Avatar is a Lizard]

This thread became stupid long ago....Let it die.

[My Avatar is a Lizard]

JamesMoriarty123 wrote...

Man, arguments like this are totally invalid and pointless. You don't see male characters who are slightly balding, have a bit of a beer belly and are generally just average people. You also don't see male characters without rippling biceps and six packs.

That's because these people are characters in a game, not REAL people. If you're that insecure about yourself that you have to hope for some average woman character to be created so you can romance her and feel like you've accomplished something, you're in a bad place. Go out, meet some people, learn how to socialise.

Also, good looks and depth aren't mutually exclusive. In games or in real life. I know some interesting good looking women and some extremely boring plain women, stereotypes are not 100% proof.

Gah, this has gone off the rails a bit, basically all I wanted to say was, get over it. I'm all for a bit of fan service, afterall, it's a game, I ain't gonna marry it.

QFT

[AlanC9]

Jackalofdeath wrote...
Seriously, with all this fanservice, they could have developed so much more of the core game instead,

This is just dumb. They've got to do some kind of appearance for Izzy. You really think the outfit she's got now took more development time than a look you would have liked better?

[Dark-sider77]

Its obvious that Izzy doesn't have pants on because she is afraid of shleets, Oghren told her about them one time, and she hasn't worn pants since.

[Sylvianus]

A fantasy game isn't reality. A game did not intend to comply strictly with basic code set on the resemblance with reality. Yeah the heroines are very sexy so what ?  Yes, the heroes are often muscular, beautiful, so what ?

  A hero, a heroine, companions who will accompany us throughout the game, will very often beautiful, sexy and everything you want. And it would be hypocritical to pretend you don't want to. I have eyes , and also I think Bioware, we can see the excitement you have for these characters to look so beautiful. Guys like women.

   You don't do it there, stop playing video games.

We even see an impatience evident in this field, for players who openly express almost fanatical support for those they would like to romanticize.

You tell me it's because you like their personality ? Well, no, it does have the physical appearance that you caved, since nobody has played the game.

One can complain really annoying details in particular (Bethany and Isabella, for example), I will, i understand,  but we begin to philosophize negatively on the overall appearance of the all characters in a game, more beautiful than those that we see in reality, it's going too far there. A game is first made to please, get us out of our daily lives, and we surprised a lot of things.

If any, as well listen better, if there is not that much, we will not be offended either.
Want to see absolutely large, the ugly, buttons, etc., go out to you.

Seriously, it's a game, a fantasy game, break, enjoy it all.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 14 février 2011 - 01:30 .

[PrinceOfFallout13]

i feel way too much hipocresy on this topic



besides is just a rogue pirate no other female in the game dresses like that

[Sylvianus]

besides is just a rogue pirate no other female in the game dresses like that

This. People are deliberately forget what Isabella, his personality and Rebel pirate thug, its libertine spirit, to go completely in the direction they want.

  For me, the way she is wearing is totally credible for what it represents. She could wear anything, as she can wear that. It is part of the RP.

In addition, as you have said is the only well dressed, I saw no other woman like that.

Modifié par Sylvianus, 14 février 2011 - 02:02 .

[Lotion Soronarr]

thepiebaker wrote...

um i would definately believe isabella would do just that. think about it... you're a woman fighting a guy, he gets distracted by your cleavage, which means hes not paying attention to the fight and therefore easy to kill. would a pirate be honorable enough not to take advantage of the opportunity, especially when its KILL OR BE KILLED? hell its a cold day in hell when i expect a rogue to do anything honorable in battle.

That wouldn't work really in real life.

For one, you're adding a big vulnerabiltiy to yourself to execuate an insane strategy that might work only on exceptionally stupid individuals.

[Ellestor]

Saibh wrote...

Actually, I'm pretty pleased. Only Isabela seems overtly sexualized, and hey--that's the kind of person she is. That's the kind of person she was in DAO, that's the kind of person she is now. What do I care if she has the most gargantuan rack since Ivy Valentine? It's only her.

I'm really, really happy they scaled the breast size down from their previous models. I don't see it as every women being overly sexualized. I mean, yeah, Bethany's showing a lot of cleavage, but Isabela wears no pants, Varric's shirt is half open, and Fenris and Merrill wear no shoes.

Yes, it's something very good that comes out of the decision to give each companion their own outfit. When you remove the need to accomodate the possibility for each companion to wear every piece of armor the PC can, you simultaneously remove the need to make everyone so similar. That's how ME2 was able to have such different models where ME1's were homogenous across the board.

[Felfenix]

Sylvianus wrote...

besides is just a rogue pirate no other female in the game dresses like that

This. People are deliberately forget what Isabella, his personality and Rebel pirate thug, its libertine spirit, to go completely in the direction they want.

  For me, the way she is wearing is totally credible for what it represents. She could wear anything, as she can wear that. It is part of the RP.

In addition, as you have said is the only well dressed, I saw no other woman like that.

Because the ONE pirate rogue who's combat experience doesn't go beyond barfights and duels isn't wearing a platemail burqa, it means that EVERY woman in DA2 is oversexualized fanservice. Have you SEEN Aveline, or jeez, that default warrior armor FemHawke starts in that's exactly the same as MaleHawke's? SO oversexualized and fanservice-y.