502 réponses à ce sujet

[Zulu_DFA]

All right, since this thread has been successfully derailed by the Cerberus haters, the only suitable course of action is that we immediately go to debating if Cerberus is evil, or rather it is inept?

[Whatever42]

Choosing between the paragon council/alliance and the renegade cerberus is like trying to choose between dumb and dumber but I honestly can't decide which faction is more incompetent.

[jbblue05]

Project Trapdoor is a great Cerberus success.

Being able to neutralize Biotics will knock those damn Asari off their pedestals.

[Barquiel]

Yes...it's too bad the asari know everything about it  :innocent:

[Jagri]

2175 CE - Cerberus covertly contacts Michael Moser Lang, a political dissident on Earth, and provides him with funding to purchase weapons. Cerberus continues to monitor him after contact ends. One year later, Lang assassinates United North American States president Enrique Aguilar and Chinese People's Federation premier Ying Xiong. The resulting political shuffle benefits Cerberus' shell companies and plans for the Systems Alliance Parliament.

Many still argue about this being a terrorist act. The US Department of Defense states "the calculated use of unlawful violence or threat of unlawful violence to inculcate fear; intended to coerce or to intimidate governments or societies in the pursuit of goals that are generally political, religious, or ideological.”

1st Unlawful violence was clearly used in the very public assassination of two countries leaders.
2nd Intimidation/Fear has been debated however the political shuffle did lead to...
3rd Furthering the goals of Cerberus which are political and ideological.

Now its just establishing the fear factor as it were but generally when the public has resisted the passing of a military bill or plan and suddenly changes its mind after a assassination of leadership I would have to say fear/intimidation played some part in its passing.

Back on topic!

I don't see Anderson being put in a position to be killed in the next Mass Effect unless done so by the Reapers. It wouldn't make sense for Shepard to turn on him since Anderson has always given him/her his support. It was limited in Mass Effect 2 but I get the feeling if anyone was to believe in Shepard despite his dealings with Cerberus it would be Anderson.

Modifié par Jagri, 14 février 2011 - 08:25 .

[Zulu_DFA]

Barquiel wrote...

Yes...it's too bad the asari know everything about it  :innocent:

Too bad all the Asari that know about it work for the Humans, and not for "those idiots on the Council". Probably has something to do with said Asari having been ostricized for their entire life.

[aeetos21]

Shepard said it best at the end of ME2: "You can fall in line or step aside, but don't get in my way." Given the events of ME1 and ME2 I think that one would apply to every single race/organization. Once more bringing back the narrow mindedness that is the concept of holding a vendetta at a time when the galaxy is at stake.

People ****ed nonstop about going around performing loyalty missions in ME2 while colonies were disappearing but now are contradicting themselves entirely by saying: "Oh we need to go after Anderson or Cerberus, they need to pay for what they've done."

So even though I chose to destroy the base and give TIM the finger (as many of you know from other threads) that doesn't mean I won't take any means necessary to make people fall in line. If they don't help me then they better stay out of my way. If they do attempt to screw up my plans then they're fair game, just like the reapers. Human, asari, turian, or whatever makes no difference. The mission is what matters.

Modifié par aeetos21, 14 février 2011 - 08:35 .

[jbblue05]

Barquiel wrote...

Yes...it's too bad the asari know everything about it  :innocent:

Too bad Cerberus can still deploy it and the Asari have no way to counter it.

[Jagri]

jbblue05 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Yes...it's too bad the asari know everything about it  :innocent:

Too bad Cerberus can still deploy it and the Asari have no way to counter it.

Just hope it doesn't provoke the STG to come up with a disease to neuter humanity.

[DarkSeraphym]

Jagri wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Yes...it's too bad the asari know everything about it  :innocent:

Too bad Cerberus can still deploy it and the Asari have no way to counter it.

Just hope it doesn't provoke the STG to come up with a disease to neuter humanity.

I wouldn't worry about that. The only reason they did that to the Krogan was because their ability to replenish numbers was one of their greatest weapons. From my understanding of the Krogan, I don't think human's can reproduce nearly as many numbers as the Krogan can (in a set amount of time) or have them mature at the same rate that Krogan can. The STG would be better off creating some kind of biological weapon to deal with humanity's stronger points then our rather long gestation period and the amount of time it takes for a human being to mature.

Modifié par DarkSeraphym, 14 février 2011 - 08:53 .

[AkiKishi]

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

I thought their intention was to recover the target? Was their intention to terrorize the Quarians to achieve some sort of political goal?

I love how everyone is a terrorist these days.

If you are not law enforcement or sanctioned millitary for a state then engaging in those operations is an act of terrorism.

If someone steals something from you , you go to the authorities you don't gather your mates and blow up their house.

[Inverness Moon]

Anderson's actions, while having good intention, have dealt a severe blow to the only organization other than Shepard's crew that is doing jack **** to attempt to stop the reapers. That makes me really annoyed with him.

BobSmith101 wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

I thought their intention was to recover the target? Was their intention to terrorize the Quarians to achieve some sort of political goal?

I love how everyone is a terrorist these days.

If you are not law enforcement or sanctioned millitary for a state then engaging in those operations is an act of terrorism.

If someone steals something from you , you go to the authorities you don't gather your mates and blow up their house.

The only reason that would be considered an act of terrorism is because ignorant people throw the word around too easily. Intent decides whether or not something is terrorism.

Modifié par Inverness Moon, 14 février 2011 - 09:17 .

[Wulfram]

My Shepard's more pissed at Anderson for staging a coup after the council's death. Treacherous bastard.

[Zulu_DFA]

DarkSeraphym wrote...

Jagri wrote...
Just hope it doesn't provoke the STG to come up with a disease to neuter humanity.

I wouldn't worry about that. The only reason they did that to the Krogan was because their ability to replenish numbers was one of their greatest weapons.

The only reason the genophage worked, was that the Krogans were too dumb to effectively contain it, and/or work out a cure afterwards. And they lacked their own "Cerberus" (aka intelligence).

Humanity can't be "neutered" or subjected to any other half-assed "solution". It can only be wiped out. But we'll see how it goes for the Reapres first.

[Dean_the_Young]

Treacherous to who? Anderson isn't sworn to Shepard, nor is the Alliance sworn to subservience to the Council races.

[Inverness Moon]

It's nice to see some of the heavy-hitters (Zulu, Dean) in here, and not surprising either.

[jbblue05]

Jagri wrote...

jbblue05 wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

Yes...it's too bad the asari know everything about it  :innocent:

Too bad Cerberus can still deploy it and the Asari have no way to counter it.

Just hope it doesn't provoke the STG to come up with a disease to neuter humanity.

Not if we do it to them first

[Dean_the_Young]

tonnactus wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Fair enough, they experimented on Rachni, not realizing how intelligent they were.

And why they didnt realize that? Did the rachni nearly defeated the council races with some magic and not starships?
The rachni are clearly a intelligent race.

The Rachni Queens are clearly intelligent: the Rachni soldiers may well have been mindless drones, part of a hive mind.

[wolfsite]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

tonnactus wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Fair enough, they experimented on Rachni, not realizing how intelligent they were.

And why they didnt realize that? Did the rachni nearly defeated the council races with some magic and not starships?
The rachni are clearly a intelligent race.

The Rachni Queens are clearly intelligent: the Rachni soldiers may well have been mindless drones, part of a hive mind.

All the Rachni soldiers encountered were taken from the queen before they could learn.  The Queen herself stated that they were mindless because they were taken before they could be tought (any organic being can suffer the same fate).  That implies that there is a form if individualism among the Rachni, thus making the conversation being able to go either way since there is only so much factual information and everything else being opinion and speculation, thus can not be used in a valid arguement.

Update: I should go into my reasoning.

On one side you can say that since each Rachni can be tought and in sense educated, they can each develop most other species being able to make choices and decisions as they mature.

On the other side you can say they are influenced by the Queen thus have no real intelligence of there own and merely are drones more or less.

Right now the main information is there for each side to use to support a theory however it has become somewhat diluted by opinion and perseptions that some people have taken as fact, thus I feel more factual information is needed before a conclusion can be drawn.

But then even Samara said you can put three humans in a room and they can come out with six different oinions on something.

Modifié par wolfsite, 14 février 2011 - 09:36 .

[Dean_the_Young]

Inverness Moon wrote...

It's nice to see some of the heavy-hitters (Zulu, Dean) in here, and not surprising either.

You calling me fat, Inve?

[/False Offense]

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 14 février 2011 - 09:29 .

[tonnactus]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

The Rachni Queens are clearly intelligent: the Rachni soldiers may well have been mindless drones,

Wrong.They bypassed the security systems of the cerberus station without the help of the queen and used automatic freighters to get to different destinations.

Modifié par tonnactus, 14 février 2011 - 09:31 .

[Inverness Moon]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Inverness Moon wrote...

It's nice to see some of the heavy-hitters (Zulu, Dean) in here, and not surprising either.

You calling me fat, Inve?

[/False Offense]

Yes, you can't seem to stop filling yourself up with logic. 

[Asheer_Khan]

tonnactus wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

The Rachni Queens are clearly intelligent: the Rachni soldiers may well have been mindless drones,

Wrong.They bypassed the security systems of the cerberus station without the help of the queen and used automatic freighters to get to different destinations.

Like that memo at the station says "Screw the Rachni... they ARE TOO INTELIGENT..." and that was in relation to clones...

So if cloned ones were able to hijack automated freighter i already can imagine how inteligent those which were born and grown under Queeen's care will be.

[Dean_the_Young]

tonnactus wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

The Rachni Queens are clearly intelligent: the Rachni soldiers may well have been mindless drones,

Wrong.They bypassed the security systems of the cerberus station without the help of the queen and used automatic freighters to get to different destinations.

Thus disproving their prior operating assumption. However, until they could discover this, they could not act on this knowledge, as it did not exist before.

You can't know something before you learn it.

[Bailyn242]

Vaenier wrote...

Ramus Quaritch wrote...

Vaenier wrote...

Are you sure they are for humans as a species or humans as a government [ak the Alliance], because Mass Effect makes them the same thing. Everything in the Galaxy is divided by race, because Bioware likes to keep everyone seperate by physical apperance. So, we know Cerberus works for the Alliance, does it not make sense that their goals are to increase the power of the Alliance itself, not humans in general? I really wish Bioware would make factions and not just divide by races. It would be alot more interesting.

I agree with you that there should be factions or nations that have multiple races.  I wish we saw more of the Hanar and the Drell together.  As for humanity vs. the alliance, Miranda has referred multiple times to Cerberus forwarding the interests of humanity.  The Illusive Man also makes a similar statement.  

I know their statements, but my point still stands. When you refer to the Turian government as an organisation, you just call it the Turians. Same goes for every other government in the galaxy. Humans are the only ones with a special name. But they could be called by just humanity also like everyone else.

Also, Cerberus does not hate other aliens, nor do they try anything to hurt them. All they do is try to make the Alliance stronger. Everything they have done is to either make Alliance military stronger, or to get the Alliance more political power in the Galaxy. And that is just what government does, it likes to get power.

lol, its name is already set up to replace the Council. It is the "Alliance" as in an alliance of races. government likes power, it will try. Its almost like governments have a mind of their own, not really people pushing them, just ideas.

Turian Government is referred to as the Turian Heirarchy, not the Turians.