450 réponses à ce sujet

[Sereiphiel]

jeweledleah wrote...

people. I would like for you to attempt to think outside the box (pun NOT intended)

what exactly is pleasure? its our brain's interpretation of neurochemical impulses. erogenous zone is touched, impulse travels via network of nerves to the pleasure centers of the brain - we feel good. what do asari do? they meld nervous systems and they send impulses directly to the brain. you do not need to physically touch a specific part of the body to receive the impulse if you can send it directly.

case in point there was this experiment done with rats when they connected electrodes to rats pleasure centers and then they placed a button in rats cages. pressing the button activated the electrodes, rats felt orgasm. poor animals killed themselves with pleasure but the point of that was - no physical stimulation of penises or vaginas was made.

now - humans are tactile creatures. judging by far too many asari ignoring my Shepards personal space - asari are pretty tactile as well. so it does make sense for them to enjoy touching in general. however, it doesn't mean that they have to receive penetration and it doesn't mean that if they get together with a male that possesses something like a penis - that those males need to actually penetrate anything. touching and impulses directly to the brain = pleasurable experience for all, and possibly babies if asari chose to take it that far.

Lastly - Liara saying: "this...was amazing", to either Shepard. EITHER one. no penis or penetration of any sort necessary. why was she so impressed? because it was her first time melding for pleasure, she's not used to the sensation, all she knew before was the exhausting melding for information (exhausting for her, simply because she wasn't used to it - she actually tells you that in game). As for azure? its possible that its actual external erogenous zone. Asari do like touching don't they, so it makes sense for them to enjoy variety of touching even before melding - but other then it being located in lower region of the body - we don't know what it is.

Arousal, especially in species as mentally inclined as asari doesn't have to happen through touch. humans can get exceptionally aroused from mental stimulation alone and we're a physical species, asari? its no wonder in Shadow broker Liara shifts into pre meld state so quickly with Shepard, she just reunited with a person she loves most in entire universe and they have been reminiscing O_O

You are completely missing the fact we don't know if touching was involved too.  Clearly it is a melding of minds and arousal of the senses without the use of touch, but it is logical to assume that Shepard "touches" too.  But we don't know...since Bioware hasn't exactly focused on details of Asari intimacy in the ME Universe.  Also have to understand that Shepard is still a human, so he would most likely resort to human pleasures, i.e. penetration.  For all we know, Shepard and Laira could be moving and touching while the "mind melding" is going on at the same time, it's not exactly logical to rule out this possibility.  I never once pointed out that it wasn't a melding of minds, I merely pointed out that it is possible for penetration or touching to occur and it is.

Still losing faith here, thanks guys.

Modifié par Sereiphiel, 16 février 2011 - 10:13 .

[jeweledleah]

touching was involved because we see them hug and kiss. its pretty obvious that some sort of touching was involved, hard to miss it in a cut scene. we just don't know just how much of that touching was involved and how much of it was necessary vs them just well enjoying touching in addition to melding.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 16 février 2011 - 10:12 .

[Sentox6]

Sereiphiel wrote...

You are completely missing the fact we don't know if touching was involved too.  Clearly it is a melding of minds and arousal of the senses without the use of touch, but it is logical to assume that Shepard "touches" too.  But we don't know...since Bioware hasn't exactly focused on details of Asari intimacy in the ME Universe.

Still losing faith here, thanks guys.

There is clearly touching occuring during melding in the ME1 sex scene.

Why are you losing faith? What are you even trying to assert in the first place?

Sereiphiel wrote...
Also have to understand that Shepard is
still a human, so he would most likely resort to human pleasures, i.e.
penetration.

So, as I see it, your problem with everyone else is that they're making assumptions, and yet...

Modifié par Sentox6, 16 février 2011 - 10:13 .

[Sereiphiel]

jeweledleah wrote...

touching was involved because we see them hug and kiss. its pretty obvious that some sort of touching was involved, hard to miss it in a cut scene. we just don't know just how much of that touching was involved and how much of it was necessary vs them just well enjoying touching in addition to melding.

That's what I've been trying to say for the last 10 posts, apparently this concept is difficult to understand.  Could have possibly gone as far as penetration.

Modifié par Sereiphiel, 16 février 2011 - 10:16 .

[Kaltrec]

I'd say there was alot of "touching" being done in that ME 1 scene. Also in LotSB they mention applying pressure at some point

[Sereiphiel]

So, as I see it, your problem with everyone else is that they're making assumptions, and yet...

Nope.  And it's not "everyone".

[Sereiphiel]

Kaltrec wrote...

I'd say there was alot of "touching" being done in that ME 1 scene. Also in LotSB they mention applying pressure at some point

Yes, and we don't know how far the "touching" actually went.

Shepard couldn't move much during the "Prothean" mind meld because of the massive amount of information that was present.  It is more than possible that when the mind melding was solely for pleasure or intimacy that Shepard would be able to move around while enjoying the high of the mind melding experience.

Not that it matters since it's a fantasy based game, but it is interesting to speculate on.

Modifié par Sereiphiel, 16 février 2011 - 10:19 .

[Pwener2313]

In the ME1 sex scene, Liara clrearly goes down on Shepard. Both male and female. So...... there are alot of things that can be said or it. Did she give him a bj? Do Asari get wet? Do they have a poop hole? So many questions.... a japanese Asari sex game would help in situations like these. Any thoughts on it BW?

[Xilizhra]

Sereiphiel wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Actually, the discussion over anal sex is completely irrelevant. The only reason humans enjoy it is because the genitalia or organs associated with them are near that area. If asari don't have erogenous zones located there, it wouldn't help at all.

*sigh* it's like talking to high schoolers. It is not irrelevant at all, since the Asari have an anus and we actually don't know how much touch or penetration is involved whenever Shepard has intercourse with Liara, since the scene always blacks out before it begins.

I think you're missing my original point. It's true that the actual sex scene's evidence is inconclusive. However, we have no reason at all to believe that penetration did take place; all evidence for it is circumstantial.

Also, ad hominems are generally a bad idea.

[Sereiphiel]

Xilizhra wrote...

Sereiphiel wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Actually, the discussion over anal sex is completely irrelevant. The only reason humans enjoy it is because the genitalia or organs associated with them are near that area. If asari don't have erogenous zones located there, it wouldn't help at all.

*sigh* it's like talking to high schoolers. It is not irrelevant at all, since the Asari have an anus and we actually don't know how much touch or penetration is involved whenever Shepard has intercourse with Liara, since the scene always blacks out before it begins.

I think you're missing my original point. It's true that the actual sex scene's evidence is inconclusive. However, we have no reason at all to believe that penetration did take place; all evidence for it is circumstantial.

Also, ad hominems are generally a bad idea.

Yes, and we don't know how far the "touching" actually went.

Shepard
couldn't move much during the "Prothean" mind meld because of the
massive amount of information that was present.  It is more than
possible that when the mind melding was solely for pleasure or intimacy
that Shepard would be able to move around while enjoying the high of the
mind melding experience.

Not that it matters since it's a fantasy based game, but it is interesting to speculate on.

ad hominem accusation is a bad defensive strategy.

[Sentox6]

Xilizhra wrote...

Also, ad hominems are generally a bad idea.

Verbal abuse is not an ad hominem per se.

Though it's not particularly laudable either.

Modifié par Sentox6, 16 février 2011 - 10:22 .

[jeweledleah]

Xilizhra wrote...

I think you're missing my original point. It's true that the actual sex scene's evidence is inconclusive. However, we have no reason at all to believe that penetration did take place; all evidence for it is circumstantial.

Also, ad hominems are generally a bad idea.

basicaly this.

you know, its a sign of a very uncreative or inexperienced mind to think that men must penetrate something when having sexual encounter.  trust me, they do not.  there are plenty, PLENTY of alternatives for a man to enjoy themselves without sticking tab a into slot b (or C, or D)  and thats' even without the benefit of direct pleasure impulses shared via melding

Modifié par jeweledleah, 16 février 2011 - 10:24 .

[Aedan_Cousland]

Thessia is an eezo-rich planet, so its native lifeforms pretty much had biotics from the get-go. They apparently evolved to use it for genetic recombination, which would make sexual reproduction model essentially redundant before it could become all that widespread.

We don't know enough about the native life forms of Thessia to speculate on how early in their evolution the Asari or their animal ancestors, developed the ability to reproduce through some sort of biotic mind meld. The Asari may very well be an exception on Thessia, with other vertebrates reproducing sexually, and the mind meld being a recent evolutionary development.

Modifié par Aedan_Cousland, 16 février 2011 - 10:30 .

[Sereiphiel]

Sentox6 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Also, ad hominems are generally a bad idea.

Verbal abuse is not an ad hominem per se.

Though it's not particularly laudable either.

Not verbal abuse, unless the individual feels the claim is legitament.  "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."

[Sereiphiel]

jeweledleah wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I think you're missing my original point. It's true that the actual sex scene's evidence is inconclusive. However, we have no reason at all to believe that penetration did take place; all evidence for it is circumstantial.

Also, ad hominems are generally a bad idea.

basicaly this.

you know, its a sign of a very uncreative or inexperienced mind to think that men must penetrate something when having sexual encounter.  trust me, they do not.  there are plenty, PLENTY of alternatives for a man to enjoy themselves without sticking tab a into slot b (or C, or D)  and thats' even without the benefit of direct pleasure impulses shared via melding

ad hominem accusation is a bad defensive strategy.

I said it's a possibilty and I didn't say "men must penetrate to have a sexual encounter" nor was it an implication.  Now you're just taking words out of my mouth.  In fact, I didn't even say it was impossible for there to be no penetration involved.

Modifié par Sereiphiel, 16 février 2011 - 10:30 .

[Sentox6]

Sereiphiel wrote...
Not verbal abuse, unless the individual feels the claim is legitament.  "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me."

I laughed. A lot.

It's a clever spin though, if not a little juvenile in nature. By your definition, anyone who wants to object to a gratuitous insult must implicitly agree that it's true. Heh.

[jeweledleah]

Sereiphiel wrote...

I said it's a possibilty and I didn't say "men must penetrate to have a sexual encounter" nor was it an implication.  Now you're just taking words out of my mouth.  In fact, I didn't even say it was impossible for there to be no penetration involved.

and I quote

Also have to understand that Shepard is still a human, so he would most likely resort to human pleasures, i.e. penetration.

you're making it sound like a natural progression of the encounter for male shepard....except its not.  Liara is not human.  Shepard for all we know could have had asari sex before, heck if you took certain conversation option with shiara - Shepard DID have asari sex, very recently.  why would he most likely resort to human pleasures?

we don't know much about specifics of asari sex or even asari physiology, but assuming that sex with them will most likely involve penetration is well....a little too human.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 16 février 2011 - 10:37 .

[tmk]

jeweledleah wrote...

touching was involved because we see them hug and kiss. its pretty obvious that some sort of touching was involved, hard to miss it in a cut scene. we just don't know just how much of that touching was involved and how much of it was necessary vs them just well enjoying touching in addition to melding.

Yep, but everyone knows there must have been penetration because it's "logical" (case in point here - Sereiphiel, even though the last few pages were about how that's not logical to assume). It's likewise logical to assume that asari go for the krogan because it's equally logical to assume that krogan have huge twin penises. And so forth.

Which is pretty much what we were talking about earlier. When you put the game in context of contemporary culture, "it's not technically explained" easily becomes "it's heavily implied that lesbians totally go for penetration when it's an option".

Which is why I think these "unfortunate implications" should be considered when content is added to the game, especially content related to controversial stuff (and the whole deal with asari sexuality is some of the most controversial subjects in the game).

I personally wouldn't go as far as saying that ALL asari should be paired either with other asari or human/quarian women, but it would be kinda nice to see at least one or two such pairings (that don't fall apart horribly, that is). And no, femShep/Liara by itself is not really sufficient because "everyone knows" that femShep is just an extra and Liara is only f/f option so that the male audience could enjoy girl-on-girl action. Having another female/asari pairing would kinda give more ammo to the case that the game acknowledges that sort of thing as more than pandering.

And as far as touching goes, I'm guessing some is required since, again, melding supposedly involves skin contact. How necessary it is for actual sexual stimulation is an open question, however.

[Sentox6]

I just can't see any substantial justification for that interpretation.

90% of the Salarian race is male, and Krogan females are segregated (and closed off from outsiders) on Tuchanka, so obviously you're going to primarily observe males of their species paired with Asari in practice.

Off the top of my head, that leaves us with an Asari/human male pairing referenced in Illium, and a couple of Asari/Asari pairings. This isn't remotely near enough evidence to start making accusations of a systematic agenda to imply that Asari prefer men when given the option.

Yes, some of the content is probably there to pander to a certain demographic. If this is such a problem, then I'm assuming that masculine chauvinism must have been erased from all other corners of society while I wasn't looking, and this is all that's left.

Modifié par Sentox6, 16 février 2011 - 11:32 .

[Aedan_Cousland]

It has been awhile since I read Retribution, but if I remember correctly didn't Grayson's session leave him exhausted? I seem to remember him trying to catch his breath or sweating afterwards, which would imply physical exertion and not just a mind f**k.

*But* it has been awhile and I may just be confusing that scene with another where he is suffering from Red Sand withdraw. I'll have to dig up my paperback.

Modifié par Aedan_Cousland, 16 février 2011 - 11:26 .

[tmk]

Sentox6 wrote...
Off the top of my head, that leaves us with an Asari/human male pairing referenced in Illium, and a couple of Asari/Asari pairings. This isn't remotely near enough evidence to start making accusations of a systematic agenda to imply that Asari prefer men when given the option.

Well off the top of my head we have Blue Rose of Illium, Aethyta's parents, Consort's affair with Septimus, and possibly something between Wrex and Aria (Benezia/Saren probably doesn't apply even if there was anything between them).

Sentox6 wrote...
Yes, some of the content is probably there to pander to a certain demographic. If this is such a problem, then I'm assuming that masculine chauvinism must have been erased from all other corners of society while I wasn't looking, and this is all that's left.

My point is, it wouldn't look so chauvinistic if asari were shown to be more than just pandering. Just because it won't erase chauvinism in one fell swoop doesn't mean it should be reinforced.

[Sentox6]

tmk wrote...

Well off the top of my head we have Blue Rose of Illium, Aethyta's parents, Consort's affair with Septimus, and possibly something between Wrex and Aria (Benezia/Saren probably doesn't apply even if there was anything between them).

I was discounting the Blue Rose because of the fact that an Asari/female Krogran relationship would be essentially impossible and certainly never observable.

I did forget about the consort and Septimus, although that's basically a prostitute and a high ranking military officer (the latter of which I gather would usually be male).

All I'm trying to say is that it seems logical to me that you would observe quite a lot more Asari/male pairings in practice, for a variety of reasons. I would certainly like to see more Asari/female pairings, don't get me wrong. I just don't think there's enough evidence for people to start making claims of the Asari being created to reflect the idea that "all women need a penis", to put it in uncouth terms.

Modifié par Sentox6, 17 février 2011 - 07:45 .

[tmk]

And all I'm trying to say that without actually showing at least one or two working asari/female pairings, those who already have the idea can point at the game as "proof". Which would be harder to do if they had a more fair representation.

Modifié par tmk, 17 février 2011 - 10:36 .

[Scimal]

tmk wrote...

And all I'm trying to say that without actually showing at least one or two working asari/female pairings, those who already have the idea can point at the game as "proof". Which would be harder to do if they had a more fair representation.

LotSB DLC.

Third video set.

You get to see the Asari Councilor mackin' with Il-Jilani.

There's also a pair on Samara's recruitment mission that I suspected might be involved, since the two were just watching the cars go by on the balcony.

Don't forget Samara's loyalty mission. Morinth's victim was a young woman.

If you do play FemShep, you can nail Liara, romance Morinth, go after Samara, and Shiala gives you the ol' winky-woo.

It may not be as apparent as Asari/Male pairings because you interact with so few on anything other than a superficial level, but the Asari + Female relationships are there.

Really, the homosexual male options are probably the most-lacking.