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[.shea.]

Maelora wrote...

brain_damage wrote...

Maelora wrote...
I can see there being two outcomes really - either all are bi, or none of them are. 

Isabela's f/f romance has been confirmed by a game reviewer, so option two is out of the way.

Where? Sorry, but you're simply speculating.  Link to proof or it didn't happen.

This lazy thinking is what is going to get a lot of people annoyed in a weeks' time.

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/5627593/180#6273045 a german user emailed the editor of the magazine who reviewed DA2 and asked for clarification what the word 'aufgestockt/increased' meant in regards to s/s-romances. This is extremely similar to how the s/s romances were revealed in DA:O, no word from Bioware, just through leaks (reviews and leaked strategy guide).

Full translation of the editors reply is here: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/5627593/181#6273356

Modifié par Chouan, 02 mars 2011 - 12:53 .

[Pyrrhus of Epirus]

As they say, when you hear hoofbeats, think horses and not zebras. At this point, the most obvious conclusion is that they're all available to both genders, and people have to come up with explanations for why they're not, rather than visa versa, as would be expected. The part of me that is still really skeptical that all of them might be bi is starting to feel like the irrational one. It's not impossible or even improbable that they're just following the old DA:O model, but... it's the more complex answer. You have to jump through a few hoops, explain away quite a bit of evidence, etc.

Anyway, I'm not upset with the developers for being quiet on the issue, even if it turns out it's just one male and one female bi LI. I have faith that they're not only protecting their product, but also the integrity of the characters. There are people who will skip Isabela and Fenris is they're indeed the only bisexual ones, simply because... they're bi. There are people who would try to kill them off for it. Maybe BioWare is hoping that by staying silent and giving no indication of who it is, those people will give the characters a chance. Doubly so if they're all bisexual options. And the rest of us, well, we'll peek at the game guide and spread the news on the 8th.

I hope that BioWare feels the same that I do, in as much as me believing that it wouldn't be a large dent in their sales. Anyone who wouldn't play the game because there's homosexual content will feel exactly the same whether there's two or four or eight same sex romance options. People who know anything about Dragon Age will expect that content to be there, and the fraction of people who are deeply upset by homosexuality but are comforted enough by having a het-exclusive LI to still buy the game is probably very small.

Modifié par Pyrrhus of Epirus, 02 mars 2011 - 01:57 .

[catabuca]

Anyone wanting to know about the titbits of information and speculation many of us have been basing our theories about all-bi on is welcome to click on the big orange AUFGESTOCKT in my sig. It takes you to a post on the m/m thread that I am keeping updated with any and all crazy guessing HARD FACTS as and when we get it. Feel free to direct others asking the same thing there as well.

[catabuca]

More information added to my sig!post. Seems almost certain now Anders is a bi option. UK reviewer said he had to turn down "an offer" from Anders while playing as mHawke. Yes, one of those types of offers.

[Perles75]

catabuca wrote...

More information added to my sig!post. Seems almost certain now Anders is a bi option. UK reviewer said he had to turn down "an offer" from Anders while playing as mHawke. Yes, one of those types of offers.

Sounds strange... didn't the Devs say that the option to start the romance would have always been in the hands of the players and not from the companions?

[Maelora]

That's great news if true, catabuca.

[catabuca]

Perles75 wrote...

catabuca wrote...

More information added to my sig!post. Seems almost certain now Anders is a bi option. UK reviewer said he had to turn down "an offer" from Anders while playing as mHawke. Yes, one of those types of offers.

Sounds strange... didn't the Devs say that the option to start the romance would have always been in the hands of the players and not from the companions?

Well it still is. You can turn him down. In DAO your relationship could 'accidentally' trip the romance flag without you realising it just by being nice, or whatever. I think all the dev comments so far have meant is that your choice to enter into a relationship with them is now controllable by you more easily, by picking specific options that have the icon, and so on.

[Maugrim]

Perles75 wrote...

catabuca wrote...

More information added to my sig!post. Seems almost certain now Anders is a bi option. UK reviewer said he had to turn down "an offer" from Anders while playing as mHawke. Yes, one of those types of offers.

Sounds strange... didn't the Devs say that the option to start the romance would have always been in the hands of the players and not from the companions?

Not exactly.  There can be some flirting without prompting  (think Zevran's 'sex goddess' comment for example) but anything more extensive or for the NPC to view it as flirting/a romance requires a clearly marked player input response.

[silver-crescent]

Maybe the PSM3 guys accidentally flirted with Anders or something.

[catabuca]

Maelora wrote...

That's great news if true, catabuca.

I'm 99% certain Anders is a bi LI now. (Yes, yes, apart from teh 100% certain I am they all are, of course )

[Maugrim]

You know I didn't even care about Merrill as a F/F romance before those screenshots...some dumb modder is just trying to break my heart aren't they? 

*tries to keep the faith*

[catabuca]

silver-crescent wrote...

Maybe the PSM3 guys accidentally flirted with Anders or something.

Regardless of whether they flirted with him or not though, Anders clearly reciprocated and offered 'more' ... and the reviewer had the option to either say yes or say no.

[catabuca]

makenzieshepard wrote...

You know I didn't even care about Merrill as a F/F romance before those screenshots...some dumb modder is just trying to break my heart aren't they? 

*tries to keep the faith*

Oh makenzie ... never lose the faith, NEVER.

[Maelora]

catabuca wrote...

Maelora wrote...
That's great news if true, catabuca.

I'm 99% certain Anders is a bi LI now. (Yes, yes, apart from teh 100% certain I am they all are, of course )

I'm not doubting you at all, catabuca.

Just uneasy about how BW are handling this.

[MKDAWUSS]

catabuca wrote...

Maelora wrote...

That's great news if true, catabuca.

I'm 99% certain Anders is a bi LI now. (Yes, yes, apart from teh 100% certain I am they all are, of course )

Let's see if they behave as such to other NPCs and not just the PC. See if they're genuinely "bi" and not just tacked on as an afterthought bonus.

[catabuca]

@Maelora - I do agree the sexual orientation of characters would have been great to know, at least as released information on the forums. We know Isabela is bi (come on, we do know ... to deny it is some crazy paranoia right there), we know all 4 LIs are going to be available to opposite-gender Hawke, so the only missing piece of the puzzle is the m/m LI (or the fact that they all are s/s options).

The lack of confirmation, I'm absolutely positive, is not through any malice on BW's part. I strongly believe that DG et al can only release the information they're allowed to. Who decides that, further up the chain, well I can't guess their intentions, other than they probably haven't spent even one moment thinking it through, thinking about how holding that one piece of information back actually affects the people for whom that information is important.

[catabuca]

MKDAWUSS wrote...

Let's see if they behave as such to other NPCs and not just the PC. See if they're genuinely "bi" and not just tacked on as an afterthought bonus.

Let's see if all the straight characters in every BW game go around flaunting their straight sexuality, or 'behaving' straight towards other NPCs. Oh wait ...

What would it take for a character to be 'genuinely bi' for you? And how would that differ from the way you see 'genuinely straight' characters act in a BW game?

This 'tacked on' argument is getting really old.

[halokitty]

catabuca wrote...

Let's see if all the straight characters in every BW game go around flaunting their straight sexuality, or 'behaving' straight towards other NPCs. Oh wait ...

What would it take for a character to be 'genuinely bi' for you? And how would that differ from the way you see 'genuinely straight' characters act in a BW game?

Agreed.  A character doesn't need to be written any different if they are bisexual.  Whatever their sexuality, it doesn't really have a bearing on their personality, their morality, etc.  In some ways, the "tacked on" approach works better in that it means the character is defined first, before any notion of sexual politics come into play.  They are who they are, and the politics of sexuality are secondary.  It's a nice way to avoid stereotypes and cliches. 

[catabuca]

halokitty wrote...

Agreed.  A character doesn't need to be written any different if they are bisexual.  Whatever their sexuality, it doesn't really have a bearing on their personality, their morality, etc.  In some ways, the "tacked on" approach works better in that it means the character is defined first, before any notion of sexual politics come into play.  They are who they are, and the politics of sexuality are secondary.  It's a nice way to avoid stereotypes and cliches. 

Ah yes, but our understanding of privilege makes us realise that no character is just developed as a character without sexuality ... a character without a defined sexuality is straight until proven otherwise. That's where all this 'tacked on' crap comes from. The misguided notion that everyone is straight unless they have a reason to be gay. <_<

[Maelora]

And DAO Isabela did flirt with Leliana. So, not 'tacked on'. And maybe they're just into Hawke, not other NPCs? Not all bisexuals are amoral and adventurous. Just means you like both genders.

And yes, I see where you're coming from catabuca. But I don't see it as 'paranoid' in the wider context of Bioware. We both know gay romances are a battleground for someone at the company. Stuff gets cut, often at the last minute. Yes, Isabela is bisexual in the context of DAO. That doesn't necessarily follow tthat she's available for Ladyhawke as a full Paramour achievement romance in DA2. It should follow, yes, but I'm too cautious until it's been proved beyond doubt.

But yes; I'm feeling more positive now about them all being available for everyone.

Modifié par Maelora, 02 mars 2011 - 04:12 .

[Addai]

yukidama wrote...

Eh, I guess. It's just irritating as hell. Then again I guess they do have to tread carefully since homophobe money is just as green as that of the rest of us.

It could just as easily go the other way and if they said not all LIs are bi, people would start screaming about homophobia.  As overwrought as people get about these issues, it's no wonder that marketing says not to touch it with a ten foot pole.  They're probably trying to keep the focus on the game as an action game, talking about the combat changes etc.

@MorningBird, I can understand about people wanting what they want, but they can't possibly satisfy everyone's taste.  All the LIs being bisexual sounds like a perfect compromise unless you're a player who doesn't want a romance with a bisexual character, can't relate to a bisexual character, or it stretches your plausibility too far that Hawke is a bi magnet, or whatever.

[jlb524]

catabuca wrote...

halokitty wrote...

Agreed.  A character doesn't need to be written any different if they are bisexual.  Whatever their sexuality, it doesn't really have a bearing on their personality, their morality, etc.  In some ways, the "tacked on" approach works better in that it means the character is defined first, before any notion of sexual politics come into play.  They are who they are, and the politics of sexuality are secondary.  It's a nice way to avoid stereotypes and cliches. 

Ah yes, but our understanding of privilege makes us realise that no character is just developed as a character without sexuality ... a character without a defined sexuality is straight until proven otherwise. That's where all this 'tacked on' crap comes from. The misguided notion that everyone is straight unless they have a reason to be gay. <_<

Yes.

Plus, straight romances never feel tacked on for fanservice, oh no!

[Vitani]

Uhm...totally not sure if it has been asked but...

Will we have mutiple possible ways to start a romance with a character or do we need to trigger it at a specific moment? If I refuse to start being flirty right off the bat will the NPC iniciante a talk or something?

I am wondering beause hitting on someone I just meet seems awkward but with the 10 year timespan I imagine it won't be possible to start mid-story?

Was there any offical word on it?

[catabuca]

You could trigger at different points in Origins, I believe. I'm sure there must be several places to trigger it, even if they are all early on (say, in the first act or whatever).

I haven't seen any confirmation either way though.