196 réponses à ce sujet

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

Let's turn the question around. Why are real cities so full of people?

[Revan312]

Yrkoon wrote...
You are expected to do nothing, least of all think.

I'm still offering you a Kleenex for your tears though.

Your the most annoying poster I've seen in a while.. gah..

Modifié par Revan312, 17 février 2011 - 01:11 .

[Blacklash93]

Yrkoon wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...
It is not one or the other. The people on the streets don't need lines. If the engine can handle it, placing a non-interactive NPC in the environment shouldn't take much effort.

Oh great idea there.  Bring on the the mimes and the inanimate people things!

You're just twisting my words. You know exactly what I mean.

It works in AC and GTA. Obviously I don't expect the sheer number of NPC's here at all, but you know what I mean.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 17 février 2011 - 01:12 .

[Yrkoon]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Yrkoon wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

Yes, a few of the backalley (regular) roads that make up Lowtown. Backalleys have stairs apparently that directly lead up to the front steps of a pub, too. What's supposed to make me think the other sections will be differrent?

You are expected to do nothing, least of all think.

I guess common logic isn't thinking isn't considered thinking now?

Was it too much of a stretch to think that the "backalleys" of Lowtown are actually normal roads?

Wild speculation on something as of yet unknown  (have you played the game?) should not be mistaken for "logic"

[Blacklash93]

Backalleys don't have stairs that lead to the front door of a pub. Nor are they usually as wide open. Nor do they have shops lining them.

That's not logic?

Modifié par Blacklash93, 17 février 2011 - 01:14 .

[JrayM16]

The stupid. It burns!

[Yrkoon]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Backalleys don't have stairs that lead to the front door of a pub.

Says who?

 Nor are they usually as wide open.

They aren't.  Not in the livestream  they weren't  

 Nor do they have shops lining them.

Eh?  what shops did you see in the  lowtown footage?

[Walker White]

Blacklash93 wrote...

It works in AC and GTA. Obviously I don't expect the sheer number of NPC's here at all, but you know what I mean.

One of the reasons it works in AC is because that is a substantial part of their game engine.  BioWare spends more time on things like dialogue or combat.  You get trade-offs.

AC has a notion of a generic character that it loads on the fly as you get nearby.  You can see them pop into existence if you are watching.  And they disappear from existence when you get too far away.  This is a major architectural difference from what BioWare does.  This is not a change easily made.

[Blacklash93]

Dear Yrkoon:

I give up. You win. This is going nowhere. I'm tired of explaining all this to you. I'm bored. Congratulations.

I'm sure you feel really good right now.

Sincerely yours

Modifié par Blacklash93, 17 février 2011 - 01:22 .

[mariosgh]

In Origins Denerim was one of the biggest disappoinment for me. I'm really sad that Kirkwall would also be so lifeless, empty city. Lively Athkatla was on of the reasons why i loved BG2.

[JrayM16]

Blacklash93 wrote...

I give up. You win. This is going nowhere. I'm tired of explaining all this to you. I'm bored. Congratulations.

I'm sure you feel really good right now.

And here I thought I was going to jump into another angry thread and fight to the death.

[Phoenixblight]

Slidell505 wrote...

Phoenixblight wrote...

Slidell505 wrote...

Phoenixblight wrote...

They can't exactly do that there are hardware and software restrictions to get the 30FPS. I honestly can't remember a game that had a city that was actually full of people. Hmmm

AC, GTA, RDR, Oblivion, Fallout, I could go on.

AC : I will give you that
GTA: it only seemed like a city because of the atmosphere but there actually wasn't a lot of npcs granted its a lot more Bioware games but still nothing to what a real city would seem like. 
RDR: The cities weren't full of people but that was the point its the Wild West. 
Fallout: Not really but its a post apocalyptic world. 

As a previous poster had said its the engine most likely won't allow enough npcs to be around, it is 5+ years old. Hopefully DA3 uses a new engine. But even so none of Bioware games have had cities that seemed city like outside of cutscenes. 

. Also yes, DA desperately needs an engine update. There's no reason DA2 should only look sligtly better than a game from six years ago.

Actually there is a reason 2 years is not enough time to create an entirely different engine. Its kinda why Rockstar spent 100 million dollars in the development of the engine used in GTA and RDR and it also is the reason why there was such a long period between the GTA on the last Gen systems and the newer systems. 

[Wishpig]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

Let's turn the question around. Why are real cities so full of people?

Because they're cities?

[KenKenpachi]

Hmm always could do like a few games I've seen add a whole lot of NPC's in the foreground and as you move down the street they vanish showing only important NPC's. I mean it would give the illusion of activity at the very least and allow you to have no clutter. But tis too late for that DA2 is gone gold.

[jomonoe]

It's all part of the Bioware charm, lol. It's just something that you gotta accept in Bioware games. They bad at making people look like they have lives. Which is kind of funny considering how good they are at making party members feel alive.

[werewoof]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Dear Yrkoon:

I give up. You win. This is going nowhere. I'm tired of explaining all this to you. I'm bored. Congratulations.

I'm sure you feel really good right now.

Sincerely yours

You're gonna get butthurt over a discussion about whether or not there's enough static NPCs in a city in a video game? Alrighty then.

[TheStrand221]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Dear Yrkoon:

I give up. You win. This is going nowhere. I'm tired of explaining all this to you. I'm bored. Congratulations.

I'm sure you feel really good right now.

Some people agree with you.  Not to mention you showed considerable restraint in the face of an endless, rude tirade.  I commend you sir!

DA2 will be a great game, but like the OP I think AC spoiled me so the cities might seem a bit lifeless.  If they don't. more power to Bioware.  I also think part of what made AC's NPC crowds so great is that they actually reacted to the player's "high profile" actions.  Not that that would be applicable to DA2's gameplay.

My personal ideal would be a number of non-interactive NPCs that would add atmosphere, and well fleshed out interactive NPCs.  I suspect Bioware doesn't have the former because their game engine isn't optimized for it and/or as a design choice they didn't want to include non-interactive characters of that type.

[Blacklash93]

Back to real discussion:

I realize the DA2 engine might not be able handle it, I'm just worried Kirkwall will end up feeling sterile. I don't want a ton of NPC's for the sake of it. I only want enough to make Kirkwall feel decently populated. I just want Kirkwall to feel authentic since most of the game will take place in it.

And I don't believe being aware of the tech limitations will make it excusable or ignorable, as in something that doesn't detract from the game.

Some people might not value what I do with videogame atmosphere, but I'm sure many others do. I made this topic to express that and maybe bring the issue to Bioware's attention, for whatever good it will do.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 17 février 2011 - 01:30 .

[Veex]

I'll reserve judgment until I actually get into Kirkwall. I will say that a little more NPC movement, whether they're just patrolling a rigid path or something, would be nice. Orzammar for example would have felt a little more lively with some nobles or dusters moving about here and there.

[slimgrin]

Yet another question asked that can't be answered till we play the game.

If it's any comfort to people, Denerim wasn't the best depiction of a city I've seen in a game, but it certainly wasn't lifeless. 
 

[werewoof]

Blacklash93 wrote...

Back to real discussion:

I realize the DA2 engine might not be able handle it, I'm just worried Kirkwall will end up feeling sterile. I don't want a ton of NPC's for the sake of it. I just want Kirkwall to feel authentic since most of the game will take place in it.

And I don't believe being aware of the tech limitations will make it excusable or ignorable, as in something that doesn't detract from the game.

Some people might not value what I do with videogame atmosphere, but I'm sure many others do. I made this topic to express that and maybe bring the issue to Bioware's attention, for whatever good it will do.

Well, you don't need a ton of NPCs for that. For instance, I thought the environment for Fallout 3 was great, not because of a lively town full of NPCs, but because of the ambient music playing in the background and the sound effects.

[Blacklash93]

tiktac wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

Dear Yrkoon:

I give up. You win. This is going nowhere. I'm tired of explaining all this to you. I'm bored. Congratulations.

I'm sure you feel really good right now.

Sincerely yours

You're gonna get butthurt over a discussion about whether or not there's enough static NPCs in a city in a video game? Alrighty then.

No, I'm finally moving on from that argument because I'm VERY tired of it.

[AtreiyaN7]

JrayM16 wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

I give up. You win. This is going nowhere. I'm tired of explaining all this to you. I'm bored. Congratulations.

I'm sure you feel really good right now.

And here I thought I was going to jump into another angry thread and fight to the death.

Well now, I think you can still possibly look forward to a death-match. I'll provide sporks for the combatants - really BIG sporks!

[JrayM16]

AtreiyaN7 wrote...

JrayM16 wrote...

Blacklash93 wrote...

I give up. You win. This is going nowhere. I'm tired of explaining all this to you. I'm bored. Congratulations.

I'm sure you feel really good right now.

And here I thought I was going to jump into another angry thread and fight to the death.

Well now, I think you can still possibly look forward to a death-match. I'll provide sporks for the combatants - really BIG sporks!

Excellent.