137 réponses à ce sujet

[Evil Johnny 666]

I agree with pretty much everything, though I would've added a couple of things. It's great to see websites acknowledging ME2 problems.

[nevar00]

On come on, an Elcor teammate would be great! What is wrong with you people? Just think of an elcor with Zaeed's personality:

"Completely enraged: burn you son of a b*tch."
"With great anger and sorrow: aaaaahhhhhhhhhhh"

Being able to romance it would be even better...

"Cautiously: Sneaking into the Captain's Quarters, heavy risk. Seductively deep: But the priiiize..."

Modifié par nevar00, 19 février 2011 - 08:44 .

[Reiisha]

As for ammo, the writer makes a good point: The codex makes a big point about the coolant clips being universal, yet there's seperate gauges for every weapon.



At first i was very adamant that the heat system would be brought back, though the ammo can work if they try this:



All weapons share in the same 'coolant' pool. Some weapons use more coolant per shot (snipers, shotguns) than others. This also adds more possibilities for weapon mods, for example, making weapons use less ammo, or do more damage and in return use more ammo - Things like that.

[Ahglock]

kregano wrote...

vader da slayer wrote...
6. No coolant clips
--"And for God’s sake call it ammo, you’re not fooling anyone with the nonsensical coolant concept.
" obviously they fooled you. the THERMAL clips (again did this guy even listen to the game?) make 100% sense and are a logical progression of technology. the only thing they did wrong was not allowing for normal heat build up (which btw Im still trying to figure out how a railgun/magnetic accelerator generates any heat) ala ME1.

This is what a modern day railgun discharge looks like:


The giant plume of flame is plasma from the round tearing up the inside of the barrel moving at supersonic velocities. To create that much plasma, we're talking about several thousands of degrees in any measuring system, and all it takes is the fricition of the round moving through the barrel.

The point is apparently so far above your head it is almost pointless to comment. He isn't arguing about what the codex says.  The point is if it
acts like a duck, quacks like a duck, just effing call it a duck.  To
try and pretend it isn't an ammo system is farcical in the extreme. 

[b1n0ry]

They forgot Liara and Miranda making out.

[SalsaDMA]

Ahglock wrote...

kregano wrote...

vader da slayer wrote...
6. No coolant clips
--"And for God’s sake call it ammo, you’re not fooling anyone with the nonsensical coolant concept.
" obviously they fooled you. the THERMAL clips (again did this guy even listen to the game?) make 100% sense and are a logical progression of technology. the only thing they did wrong was not allowing for normal heat build up (which btw Im still trying to figure out how a railgun/magnetic accelerator generates any heat) ala ME1.

This is what a modern day railgun discharge looks like:


The giant plume of flame is plasma from the round tearing up the inside of the barrel moving at supersonic velocities. To create that much plasma, we're talking about several thousands of degrees in any measuring system, and all it takes is the fricition of the round moving through the barrel.

The point is apparently so far above your head it is almost pointless to comment. He isn't arguing about what the codex says.  The point is if it
acts like a duck, quacks like a duck, just effing call it a duck.  To
try and pretend it isn't an ammo system is farcical in the extreme. 

The problem with your anology being that it isn't a duck, but a sparrow.

My apoligies that you have a hard time grasping that lorewise Mass Effect guns at the current timeline actually have 2 counters. 1 for the amount of rounds left, and one for the heat sinks left from thermal clips. The game engine chooses not to display the amount of rounds left because it would be silly to display a number of around 4000 rounds per clip.

It would be technically wrong to call heat sinks from thermal clips for 'ammo', as there is lorewise already one such component in the weapons.

So to put it in other words: you're the one things went over the head off, appearantly.
Especially since the comment that was commented on was about 'what makes heat in weapontype X', and not 'why not call it ammo' which is what you seem to be replying to.

One might wonder: Did you even read the text you quoted when replying?

[Sentox6]

The problem with your anology being that it isn't a duck, but a sparrow.

My apoligies that you have a hard time grasping that lorewise Mass Effect guns at the current timeline actually have 2 counters. 1 for the amount of rounds left, and one for the heat sinks left from thermal clips. The game engine chooses not to display the amount of rounds left because it would be silly to display a number of around 4000 rounds per clip.

It would be technically wrong to call heat sinks from thermal clips for 'ammo', as there is lorewise already one such component in the weapons.

The point is that, no matter how much lore you wrap it in, ME2's system works just like your standard ammo system in every shooter ever. The game's only specific variation is that ammo pickups are universal, but it's not unique in that, either.

I'm not saying BioWare somehow has to invent a system that hasn't been done before. But lore should always be secondary to gameplay in a videogame, so when we're discussing ways to improve a game, let's call things for what they are. My guns have counter for many shots I can make, I shoot them, I pick up refills. It's an ammo system. The question is, is this the best system for ME? All this pseudo-scientific posturing doesn't get us anywhere.

[Sereiphiel]

ehhhhh, the top 15 list is a hit and miss at best.

Point 16: lmao

Point 15: Mass Effect 1 started with male Shepard on the cover, they have to keep the same Shepard on the box.

Point 13: True, there are no Elcor in Shepard's crew, but there is a large variety of other species involved, enough for me.

Point 12: Nothing wrong with at least 1 character not being able to die like Shepard. Technically Shepard did die, but the point is generally understood.

Point 11: I agree, there should be more class abilities available. Bioware has already promised to input richer RPG features into ME3 though.

Point 10: I agree that the other characters from Shepard's crew should be given more dialogue, but they all have a part to play in the game. Wrex: muscle, Tali/Legion: hackers etc.,.. Plus the character variety makes for more interesting gameplay overall, especially with the personal quests.

Point 9: Cerberus was a necessity, without Cerberus there would be no Shepard in ME2. The Alliance practically crucified Shepard after his death for the sake of the Council, which is in serious denial about the Reapers due to ego mind you (takes me back to Point 1).

Point 1: The Council has faith, but they are in serious denial. Pride is the reason for the Council's lack of faith in Shepard concerning his Reaper claim. Bioware is making it a point for the Council to be afflicted with pride and fear.

Point 8: I thought about that one before, a overall reduced cover system for the game would make for a nice change in pace. Doesn't have to be a significant reduction, but a reduction nonetheless would be nice.

Point 7: Saren and Sovereign were alone with the Geth, made it easier for them to hide. However, the Collectors were intentionally hunting Shepard and humans, made them stick out like sore thumps. In ME3 the Reapers are going to be everywhere, not just Earth. In ME2, Shepard was recruiting extra hands to help them survive the suicide mission, he needed the expertise of the other characters to survive, but I do agree that the story shouldn't happen in a few brief bursts.

Point 6: The coolant clip makes the gameplay slightly more challenging imo.

Point 5: No.

Point 4: Agreed.

Point 3: It won't just be about defending Earth, there will be more than enough Reapers to keep more than one solar system busy.

Point 2: Agreed.

Modifié par Sereiphiel, 20 février 2011 - 02:15 .

[implodinggoat]

I agree with most everything with a few exceptions. In no specific order...

1; Liara is not one of the most dull characters in the series. Bioware just missed an opportunity in ME2 and developed her character in a bizarre way which clashed with her established character. ME3 needs to play more on the nerdy hotty angle which made her so endearing in ME1 particularly her awkwardly humorous nerdy foot in mouth moments.

2: An Elcor squad mate is just a bad idea. Elcor are entertaining in small doses; but as an ally who's around for the whole game the charm would wear off rather quickly and by the end of the game you'd just be sick of their emotionless monotone.

3: Getting rid of cooling clips is a bad idea. They force you to use your ammo wisely and give the guns more variety by allowing some to be more ammo thirsty than others.

BUT: The game should automatically gather any thermal clips in the immediate area for you after you finish clearing out the enemies. Having to run around to gather ammo during combat or aim precisely to conserve it is fun and challenging; but running around an area you've already cleared to refill your ammo is dull as dishwater.

4: I think the variety of weapons in ME2 is pretty good, they just need to be balanced so that you don't end up with weapons who have a distinct feel and could feel a unique tactical role; but who become obsolete compared to late game weapons, the Avenger being the best example.

I'd recommend weapon upgrades specific to a single gun model which you acquire throughout the game to help balance early game weapons with late game weapons. You'd still get the thrill of getting better guns; but you could do so without rendering your other guns obsolete. I'd suggest 2 weapon specific upgrades for early game guns, 1 upgrade for guns you get early on and none for late game weapons or more powerful DLC guns.

5: I think the Mass Effect 2 cover system is pretty good. Vaulting over cover by accident can be annoying; but its not that bad. Maybe just make vaulting require a combination of a directional movement towards the cover and holding down the take cover button (like sprinting) rather than just a quick press.

6:  I also think the class powers are all pretty good.  The Soldier's adrenaline rush isn't particularly creative; but its fun and useful and since Soldier is my preffered class I'd be irritated if they cut it.

I think the Sentinel's tech armor is a good power; but it might be more fun if you could automatically detonate it with a second press of the Y button letting you stun nearby enemies at will at the cost of losing your protection.  Also if they added this ability I think a reduction in the cooldown should also be added if you voluntarily drop the tech armor rather than having it go down as a result of damage absorbtion.

The Engineer's combat drone is kind of weak.  I like the power; but I think it should be a more standard tech power not a class power unless they tweak it.

Modifié par implodinggoat, 20 février 2011 - 03:43 .

[Ahglock]

SalsaDMA wrote...

The problem with your anology being that it isn't a duck, but a sparrow.

My apoligies that you have a hard time grasping that lorewise Mass Effect guns at the current timeline actually have 2 counters. 1 for the amount of rounds left, and one for the heat sinks left from thermal clips. The game engine chooses not to display the amount of rounds left because it would be silly to display a number of around 4000 rounds per clip.

It would be technically wrong to call heat sinks from thermal clips for 'ammo', as there is lorewise already one such component in the weapons.

So to put it in other words: you're the one things went over the head off, appearantly.
Especially since the comment that was commented on was about 'what makes heat in weapontype X', and not 'why not call it ammo' which is what you seem to be replying to.

One might wonder: Did you even read the text you quoted when replying?

Every one including the web site author understands that according to the lore there is thousands of rounds of ammo in each gun and the thing is called a heat sink counter.  The point the person made, which given the start of the quote chain was about the terms used is pointing out that it is an ammo system.  They can try to make it lore friendly with all of the silly everyone changed over in 2 years crap, and it is a "heat sink" they are not fooling anyone. It is an ammo system, it is just called a heat sink system. The author of the 15 things as an aside basically said, call a spade a spade. And that is what some people jumped on. He also pointed out things like it isn't as universal as advertised since you can't swap ammo(heat sinks). Whether you think it is boring/lame to run around and collect ammo after a fight is a personal opinion. I never have come close to running out even without me scouring the battlefield so it is not much of an issue, but maybe if I was obsessed with always being full ammo it would get irritating.

As for reading quoted text, 

So following a chain
person 1: And for God’s sake call it ammo, you’re not fooling anyone with the nonsensical coolant concept.
person 2: " obviously they fooled you. the THERMAL clips (again did this guy even listen to the game?) make 100% sense and are a logical progression of technology. the only thing they did wrong was not allowing for normal heat build up (which btw Im still trying to figure out how a railgun/magnetic accelerator generates any heat) ala ME1"(basically calling the kotaku person dumb because its called a heat sink system because of heat.
Person 3: cool rail gun photo which I probably should have cut out since it was just answering person 2's question about how railguns create heat, but it was a damn cool photo. Yeah it was irrelevant to my point, and might have been a bit unclear about what I was responding to, but ah well I didn't think it was that complicated.  But then again I didn't think people were actually fooled by the heat sink system being anything but a ammo system. 

[implodinggoat]

It always struck me as odd that the explanation for the switch to thermal clips in ME2 was so poor when a perfectly good explanation existed.



Namely ME2's removal of the sabotage ability from ME1 which allowed you to overheat weapons. Countering omni tool sabotage is a damn good reason for the near universal adoption of a new ammo system particularly if they included a line about tech advances which allowed omni tools to permanently incapacitate weapons using the old overheat system.



The explanation the codex provides is weak since being able to put more rounds on target in a short amount of time hardly seems more beneficial than having a weapon which will never run out of ammo, particularly when you consider the fact that you could upgrade ME1 weapons to the point that they would never overheat even if you kept your finger on the trigger for hours on end.

[SalsaDMA]

Ahglock wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

The problem with your anology being that it isn't a duck, but a sparrow.

My apoligies that you have a hard time grasping that lorewise Mass Effect guns at the current timeline actually have 2 counters. 1 for the amount of rounds left, and one for the heat sinks left from thermal clips. The game engine chooses not to display the amount of rounds left because it would be silly to display a number of around 4000 rounds per clip.

It would be technically wrong to call heat sinks from thermal clips for 'ammo', as there is lorewise already one such component in the weapons.

So to put it in other words: you're the one things went over the head off, appearantly.
Especially since the comment that was commented on was about 'what makes heat in weapontype X', and not 'why not call it ammo' which is what you seem to be replying to.

One might wonder: Did you even read the text you quoted when replying?

Every one including the web site author understands that according to the lore there is thousands of rounds of ammo in each gun and the thing is called a heat sink counter.  The point the person made, which given the start of the quote chain was about the terms used is pointing out that it is an ammo system.  They can try to make it lore friendly with all of the silly everyone changed over in 2 years crap, and it is a "heat sink" they are not fooling anyone. It is an ammo system, it is just called a heat sink system. The author of the 15 things as an aside basically said, call a spade a spade. And that is what some people jumped on. He also pointed out things like it isn't as universal as advertised since you can't swap ammo(heat sinks). Whether you think it is boring/lame to run around and collect ammo after a fight is a personal opinion. I never have come close to running out even without me scouring the battlefield so it is not much of an issue, but maybe if I was obsessed with always being full ammo it would get irritating.

As for reading quoted text, 

So following a chain
person 1: And for God’s sake call it ammo, you’re not fooling anyone with the nonsensical coolant concept.
person 2: " obviously they fooled you. the THERMAL clips (again did this guy even listen to the game?) make 100% sense and are a logical progression of technology. the only thing they did wrong was not allowing for normal heat build up (which btw Im still trying to figure out how a railgun/magnetic accelerator generates any heat) ala ME1"(basically calling the kotaku person dumb because its called a heat sink system because of heat.
Person 3: cool rail gun photo which I probably should have cut out since it was just answering person 2's question about how railguns create heat, but it was a damn cool photo. Yeah it was irrelevant to my point, and might have been a bit unclear about what I was responding to, but ah well I didn't think it was that complicated.  But then again I didn't think people were actually fooled by the heat sink system being anything but a ammo system. 

You do realize that if you want to respond on something person 2 writes, then replaying to person 3 instead of 2, including his quotes, is not only counter-intuitive but flat out wrong as far as communication goes?

It's like this:
Sue: I like pie.
Ellen: Pie is ok, but did you see that red car over there? That is one sweet looking car.
Jennifer: Gosh! That sure is a sweet car Ellen. I wonder how fast it will go.
Jack: Jennifier, you obviously have no clue about pies as I like the taste of them!

Notice anything?

[kregano]

implodinggoat wrote...
The explanation the codex provides is weak since being able to put more rounds on target in a short amount of time hardly seems more beneficial than having a weapon which will never run out of ammo, particularly when you consider the fact that you could upgrade ME1 weapons to the point that they would never overheat even if you kept your finger on the trigger for hours on end.

The ability to have guns never overheat is a physical impossibility produced by a gameplay mechanic. And the fact of the matter is that the guns never lost their huge ammo count, which was never represented in the games to begin with. In both games, there was a preset number of rounds one could fire before the gun overheated and in ME2's case, you ejected the heat sink instead of enduring ME1's beeping overheat meter.