178 réponses à ce sujet

[LPPrince]

The Lesser Evil wrote...

Cyr8 wrote...

The spiders completely ran past my tank as if they didn't see me and beelined it to my mage and rogue. I guess it makes sense because whenever I encounter a group I immediately go kill the mage first, but really?

Spiders shouldn't be allowed to employ any kind of strategy. They should really just be banned from any video game ever because they are f-ing freaky, but if they have to be in it there shall be NO strategies. They're horrible enough as it is, add overwhelm (already there) and strategic thinking (potentially there) and... gah. My mind just refuses to accept any of this.

Seems the greater of two evils defeated the lesser of two evils, ironically.

[Raygereio]

Aldandil wrote...
I can imagine that practically everyone hated overwhelm and scatter shot. I'm not sure that means they are supposed to be taken out. However, that conclusion is not as unreasonable as I first thought, though..

It comes down to good design. Giving an enemy a move that stuns the player can be very dangerous. On the one hand it does increase the difficulty. On the other hand if the player doesn't have any ways of defending against it, then it just get's annoying fast.

Now, overwhelm in theory is fine as there are ways of defending against it. That said; giving enemies the ability to stunlock the player - as overwhelm was in my experience as enemies with overwhelm always came in hordes and always used it in tandem - is inexcusable poor design.

Modifié par Raygereio, 18 février 2011 - 10:54 .

[valleyman88]

If anything the game needs more of these types of attacks. Overwhelm was one of the few enemy abilities you actually had to react to.

[Teknor]

That's right overwhelm is overwhelmingly good.

[stujlaird]

Huh. Maybe it's 'cos I was only playing on Normal, but I never found overwhelm that big a deal; they pin one of your team, you shift tactics to either heal the victim and keep them alive, or get them off. The one that got me - for a while, at least - was crushing prison; the only good counter I could find was forcefield - really good, what with the explosion and all... but when I first started to run into enemy mages spamming it, I didn't have forcefield - hey, first playthrough; bad choices, OK. So, since I was a ranger, I sent the bear in first to draw the spell out, then attacked, and focused on killing their mage before they could do it again. Still managed to lose injured teammates to it a fair few times, even after getting forcefield; unlike the big, obvious dog-pile effect of overwhelm, it took me a while to get good enough at spotting when someone suffered it fast enough to counter before they went down



Bottom line, any disabling effect can suck big time if it hits you at a bad moment, but them's the breaks.

[Raygereio]

stujlaird wrote...
Huh. Maybe it's 'cos I was only playing on Normal

At normal it's used sparingly. At higher difficulties it's downright spammed at you.

[LPPrince]

To be honest, I think the PC needs an Overwhelm type talent.



Basically, a talent that only works on enemies similar in size to the PC and sacrifices defense for extreme offense.



Specifically warriors and rogues(although I guess it could work for mages as well). Let me try to work it out-



Warrior version(Sword and Shield only)- The warrior shield bashes an enemy, knocks them to the ground, throws themselves on top of them, and proceeds to repeatedly bash them with the shield for however many seconds until getting up.



Rogue version(Dual Daggers only)- The rogue sweeps the feet of the enemy, knocking them to the ground, throws themselves on top of them, and proceeds to repeatedly machine gun stab them with their daggers for however many seconds until getting up.



Mage version(Staves only LOLOLOL)- The mage uses a strong force to hit the enemy, knocking them to the ground, conjures up stone fists from the sky and proceeds to repeatedly smash them with their stone fists for however many seconds until getting up.



High rish, high reward. Me likey.

[Face of Evil]

The only time I really hated Overhwelm was with Shadow Wolves. Ain't nothing worse than strolling along and then getting pounced on from nowhere.

"Wait … where's that growl coming from, I don't see anything, OH MAKER HELP ME IT'S EATING MY FAAAAAAAAACE".

Modifié par Face of Evil, 18 février 2011 - 11:20 .

[Tleining]

i usually had my Rogue/Legionnaire Scout cast "Strenght of Stone", that worked against it. And whenever one my companions was overwhelmed i would free them with critical shot. Worked pretty well.

[The Lesser Evil]

LPPrince wrote...

To be honest, I think the PC needs an Overwhelm type talent.

*snip*

The PC just needs to drop their weapon, lunge at an opponent and start gnawing.  It might seem ridiculous, but it's not when you consider that a human's jaw muscles can provide enough force to rip through flesh with relative ease.

[Face of Evil]

The Lesser Evil wrote...

The PC just needs to drop their weapon, lunge at an opponent and start gnawing.  It might seem ridiculous, but it's not when you consider that a human's jaw muscles can provide enough force to rip through flesh with relative ease.

I think Anders has that ability now.

[LPPrince]

Face of Evil wrote...

The Lesser Evil wrote...

The PC just needs to drop their weapon, lunge at an opponent and start gnawing.  It might seem ridiculous, but it's not when you consider that a human's jaw muscles can provide enough force to rip through flesh with relative ease.

I think Anders has that ability now.

That thought is a bit disturbing. Although probably not to Andersmancers.

[crimzontearz]

uh.....Lokai?



you do realize ANY freezing/knockback/stun effect WILL de fact stop overwhelm?



yes it is a ridiculously cheap move and it is NOT given to the party members (save for dog) but it is not THAT bad

[Reapers239]

The Lesser Evil wrote...

Can it be taken away from spiders at least? Spiders completely freak me out already, so much that when I fight them I usually try not to look at my screen. If one of them uses overwhelm on my character, I just completely lose it. I can't handle a spider jumping on my PC and gnawing wildly.
Nerf spiders!

lol omg, spiders are a sweet fight, i just wishes they were alot bigger. felt like i was fighting shelob......

[moilami]

lordlokai wrote...

Seriously i'm a LONG standing bioware fan and i love most if not all of there past games but playing DA: O through finally(had it since launch but i always got bored or got a new game) i find that while i have FINALLY made it further into the game... i am totally put off by enemies can INSTANTLY slaughter anyone in your group at will. This one ability totally kills the game for me. I wouldn't mind if was some kind of defense but by the time you " cast " any kind of spell to CC the guy they either A: resist it or B: its to late. I do not and can not STAND abilities in any game that instantly SLAUGHTER your characters with no defense at all! at least in D&D are saves or spells that can grant reistsances NOPE not in DA: O! YOU just die! i am sorry but if this ability exists in DA 2 in same form its in DA: O i have no desire to play it. Its ridiculas ability has no place in the game its quite often diffcult enough with out giving enemies an ability to insta gib anyone they choose! lets forget it if are for of them and they aren't bunched up! cause they will use overwhelm on every one of your characters and you die.

I wanna know name of the guy who decided this ability was a good idea so i can kick him in the nuts -.-

/rant off!

I know the feeling. It is annoying. Happened to me many times.

(But it is part of the game. Consider doing something before they can do that to you. And please BioWare don't remove stuff what requires players to pay some attention.)

Edit: Also if you get overwhelmed you can use your warrior or mage or rogue to CC/interrupt it. So if there are macaberi or, shades spiders save your CC for emergency.

Modifié par moilami, 18 février 2011 - 12:46 .

[Veex]

Scattershot is so much worse. Trying to kill Cautherian at Arl Howe's estate in Denerim on nightmare is tiresome.

[Face of Evil]

Veex wrote...

Scattershot is so much worse. Trying to kill Cautherian at Arl Howe's estate in Denerim on nightmare is tiresome.

I don't even bother. It's not worth the effort, not when breaking out of Fort Drakon is so easy.

[moilami]

Veex wrote...

Scattershot is so much worse. Trying to kill Cautherian at Arl Howe's estate in Denerim on nightmare is tiresome.

To be honest every CC what happens to your toons is annoying. Anyway that fight is pretty interesting. With hexer/blood mage it becomes easy.

[moilami]

Face of Evil wrote...

Veex wrote...

Scattershot is so much worse. Trying to kill Cautherian at Arl Howe's estate in Denerim on nightmare is tiresome.

I don't even bother. It's not worth the effort, not when breaking out of Fort Drakon is so easy.

Heh, well, I think teaching them a lesson is very much worth the effort. I am very glad there is possibility to do it instead of automatical inprisonment. Would suck big time if the game took control of my char and made it surrender.

Modifié par moilami, 18 février 2011 - 01:08 .

[Dayshadow]

I agree with the OP. Not so much that it doesn't exist at all, but it is extremely cheap.  Especially against mages and rogues.

It's not so much that they can overwhelm it's the fact that it is too overpowered.  I recall a random fight in awakening against 10 shadow werwolves and all they did was overwhelm. Once one was done another one hooped on right afterwards. That's when it gets ridiculous. If not for the fact that I was playing a 2-hander and been able to attack them all at once when I finally got a chance to come up for air I would have lost.  That that was pure luck.

Another thing I hate if when they come out of stealth and instantly overwhelm.  Or they overwhlem, you manage to knock the damn thing off, but then its buddy insta warps over and takes the other's place continuing the damage uninterrupted. Cheap is cheap. I can't fight Flemeth without Shale because she literally does the bite n grab thing to any regular humanoid tank as if it was her auto-attack.

Alistari is down. Rez him. Flemeth stops attacking Shale. "overwhlems" Alistair. Flemeth continues fighting Shale.
Alistair is down, Rez him. Flemeth stops attacking Shale. "overwhlems" Alistair. Flemeth continues fighting Shale.
Alistair is down, Rez him. Flemeth stops attacking Shale. "overwhlems" Alistair. Flemeth continues fighting Shale.
Alistair is down, Rez him. Flemeth stops attacking Shale. "overwhlems" Alistair. Flemeth continues fighting Shale.
Alistair is down, Screw it, let him lie there.

Modifié par Dayshadow, 18 février 2011 - 01:27 .

[Eveangaline]

I liked it...except during the mage origin.

[yummysoap]

Pause the game the second it happens, get a mage to cast forcefield and then watch all of your problems fly away. Unless your character is very low on health they won't die in the first few seconds.

EDIT: Though I'll admit Awakening did take it a bit far. Never had much of a problem in Origins, though.

Modifié par yummysoap, 18 février 2011 - 01:43 .

[Dubya75]

Raygereio wrote...

Dubya75 wrote...
Or you need to play at a lower difficulty level.

Well, the game can get downright unfair at certain points at higher difficulties. I like challenge in my games, but I cursed the sadist resposible for the final boss fight in Awakening in every single language I know (8 if, anyone's curious).

Getting instantly surrounded by hordes after of hordes of grubs - each one of them ignoring the tank because the mages had the audacity to cast a spell, made me hate the overwhelm move with every fibre of my being. Sure, there's a counter measure agains overwhelm; but you run out of those pretty fast when there are 50+ grubs around you all standing in line to start humping you.

Well, if you end up succeeding after multiple attempts, then it's so much more rewarding right? 
(PS - I don't think anyone cares about how many languages you can speak, but thanks for sharing )

[Rimfrost]

I liked this ability but it did kill my mage many times. As other have said what you need to do is switch to another party member and have them rush/stun the creature so that it let's go. Sometimes that's not possible. Your fighters have defensive modes that should protect them in the first place and mages if they get rushed should be squishy.



The good thing is that DA2 seem to give mages better ability to push enemies around so you should hopefully be able to stop this before it happens better.

[astreqwerty]

rly op??dao is one of the easiest rpgs out there even in nightmare