1724 réponses à ce sujet

[Peter Thomas]

ViSeirA wrote...

So Peter, a quick question, in the demo (the one from the website not the TGS one), Archers seem to do massive amounts of damage, highly overpowered, also 2 Handed warriors in basic attacks do the same amount of damage as a S&B warrior, has that been addressed in more recent builds?

Damage numbers in that demo are very rough, not necessarily what is in the final game.

Per hit, bows do about 3.5x what a 2-handed weapon does. This is because they are a single target weapon and have a slower attack speed. In general, the DPS of a Rogue will be about double that of a Warrior, but it only applies to single targets, whereas a Warrior can affect multiple enemies. Mages have the same DPS as a Warrior, but only affect a single target, but their attacks are much easier to vary in damage type, bypassing armor/resistances.

DPS values for Rogues are actually higher for Dual Weapons than for Archery, but this is, in part, offset by the increased danger a Rogue is in by being in melee range. Archery does have an advantage in that all it's damage is applied at once, which is more likely to knock an enemy around with the force of the attack.

Here are some statistics for optimal basic attack chains with high-level weapons (to better show differences).

Style - Weapon Damage - Hits per Chain - Optimal Chain Duration - DPS - DPS compared to Two Handed

Weapon and Shield - 42 - 5 - 2.77s - 75.58 - 1.007
Two Handed - 48 - 5 - 3.2s - 75 - 1.0
Dual Weapon - 52 - 10 - 2.52s - 205.8 - 2.7
Archery - 166 - 5 - 5.58s - 148.5 - 1.98
Staff - 57 - 5 - 3.86s - 73.7 - 0.98

[Naitaka]

Peter Thomas wrote...

*snip

Weapon and Shield - 42 - 5 - 2.77s - 75.58 - 1.007
Two Handed - 48 - 5 - 3.2s - 75 - 1.0
Dual Weapon - 52 - 10 - 2.52s - 205.8 - 2.7
Archery - 166 - 5 - 5.58s - 148.5 - 1.98
Staff - 57 - 5 - 3.86s - 73.7 - 0.98

Is there a difference in damage between primary and secondary for a 2-handed warrior? Does it mean that I will have equal/higher DPS than Dual Weapon Rogue if I manage to hit more than 3 targets at the same time with my attack?

[Sabresandiego]

Peter Thomas wrote...

ViSeirA wrote...

So Peter, a quick question, in the demo (the one from the website not the TGS one), Archers seem to do massive amounts of damage, highly overpowered, also 2 Handed warriors in basic attacks do the same amount of damage as a S&B warrior, has that been addressed in more recent builds?

Damage numbers in that demo are very rough, not necessarily what is in the final game.

Per hit, bows do about 3.5x what a 2-handed weapon does. This is because they are a single target weapon and have a slower attack speed. In general, the DPS of a Rogue will be about double that of a Warrior, but it only applies to single targets, whereas a Warrior can affect multiple enemies. Mages have the same DPS as a Warrior, but only affect a single target, but their attacks are much easier to vary in damage type, bypassing armor/resistances.

DPS values for Rogues are actually higher for Dual Weapons than for Archery, but this is, in part, offset by the increased danger a Rogue is in by being in melee range. Archery does have an advantage in that all it's damage is applied at once, which is more likely to knock an enemy around with the force of the attack.

Here are some statistics for optimal basic attack chains with high-level weapons (to better show differences).

Style - Weapon Damage - Hits per Chain - Optimal Chain Duration - DPS - DPS compared to Two Handed

Weapon and Shield - 42 - 5 - 2.77s - 75.58 - 1.007
Two Handed - 48 - 5 - 3.2s - 75 - 1.0
Dual Weapon - 52 - 10 - 2.52s - 205.8 - 2.7
Archery - 166 - 5 - 5.58s - 148.5 - 1.98
Staff - 57 - 5 - 3.86s - 73.7 - 0.98

Apparently 2H is the lowest single target DPS in the game 

[Stardusk78]

Sabresandiego wrote...

Peter Thomas wrote...

ViSeirA wrote...

So Peter, a quick question, in the demo (the one from the website not the TGS one), Archers seem to do massive amounts of damage, highly overpowered, also 2 Handed warriors in basic attacks do the same amount of damage as a S&B warrior, has that been addressed in more recent builds?

Damage numbers in that demo are very rough, not necessarily what is in the final game.

Per hit, bows do about 3.5x what a 2-handed weapon does. This is because they are a single target weapon and have a slower attack speed. In general, the DPS of a Rogue will be about double that of a Warrior, but it only applies to single targets, whereas a Warrior can affect multiple enemies. Mages have the same DPS as a Warrior, but only affect a single target, but their attacks are much easier to vary in damage type, bypassing armor/resistances.

DPS values for Rogues are actually higher for Dual Weapons than for Archery, but this is, in part, offset by the increased danger a Rogue is in by being in melee range. Archery does have an advantage in that all it's damage is applied at once, which is more likely to knock an enemy around with the force of the attack.

Here are some statistics for optimal basic attack chains with high-level weapons (to better show differences).

Style - Weapon Damage - Hits per Chain - Optimal Chain Duration - DPS - DPS compared to Two Handed

Weapon and Shield - 42 - 5 - 2.77s - 75.58 - 1.007
Two Handed - 48 - 5 - 3.2s - 75 - 1.0
Dual Weapon - 52 - 10 - 2.52s - 205.8 - 2.7
Archery - 166 - 5 - 5.58s - 148.5 - 1.98
Staff - 57 - 5 - 3.86s - 73.7 - 0.98

Apparently 2H is the lowest single target DPS in the game 

Time to change your guide to a different class Mr. Scimitar? Es verdad?

[Sabresandiego]

 Nah, I enjoy the playstyle of 2h, regardless 

[The Elder King]

Sabresandiego wrote...


Apparently 2H is the lowest single target DPS in the game 

Yeah, but they have the larger AoE.

[Naitaka]

hhh89 wrote...

Yeah, but they have the larger AoE.

Hence my question about primary and secondary target. If a 2-handed warrior does full damage to everyone he hits, I can definately understand why the DPS is so low on a single target.

[Stardusk78]

Naitaka wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

Yeah, but they have the larger AoE.

Hence my question about primary and secondary target. If a 2-handed warrior does full damage to everyone he hits, I can definately understand why the DPS is so low on a single target.

I would assume he does; especially with Giant's Reach.

[The Elder King]

Naitaka wrote...

hhh89 wrote...

Yeah, but they have the larger AoE.

Hence my question about primary and secondary target. If a 2-handed warrior does full damage to everyone he hits, I can definately understand why the DPS is so low on a single target.

I think so. Hope that Thomas can clarify that.

[ViSeiRa]

Thanks Peter for this awesome explanation, that probably means 2 Handers are gonna be better at start/mid fight when enemies are clustered, near the end when just a few enemies are left they're gonna do lowest damage... looks like Cleave and Might are a must have if we wish to do some serious damage with 2 Handers, probably the entire Vanguard tree... at least while playing on Normal/Hard... having a 2 Hander in the party on Nightmare seems to be suicide.

[The Elder King]

ViSeirA wrote...

Thanks Peter for this awesome explanation, that probably means 2 Handers are gonna be better at start/mid fight when enemies are clustered, near the end when just a few enemies are left they're gonna do lowest damage... looks like Cleave and Might are a must have if we wish to do some serious damage with 2 Handers, probably the entire Vanguard tree... at least while playing on Normal/Hard... having a 2 Hander in the party on Nightmare seems to be suicide.

Especially Giant's Reach becomes useless, since with it there are more chances that your two-handed warrior hit the other companions.

[Taleroth]

I recall overhearing that melee AoE only does 1/10th FF.

[The Elder King]

Taleroth wrote...

I recall overhearing that melee AoE only does 1/10th FF.

Yes, it's like that.

[ViSeiRa]

hhh89 wrote...

ViSeirA wrote...

Thanks Peter for this awesome explanation, that probably means 2 Handers are gonna be better at start/mid fight when enemies are clustered, near the end when just a few enemies are left they're gonna do lowest damage... looks like Cleave and Might are a must have if we wish to do some serious damage with 2 Handers, probably the entire Vanguard tree... at least while playing on Normal/Hard... having a 2 Hander in the party on Nightmare seems to be suicide.

Especially Giant's Reach becomes useless, since with it there are more chances that your two-handed warrior hit the other companions.

I think my 2 Hander build is starting to form in my head right now, Bravery and its upgrades are a must, so this also means I get Taunt, which is a good aggro talent... 

hhh89 wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

I recall overhearing that melee AoE only does 1/10th FF.

Yes, it's like that.

Isn't that in regards to glancing blows? unless they're the same.

Edit: Just reviewed Peter's replies, a Glancing Blow is essentially a failed hit, it has nothing to do with FF... so that 1/10th doesn't apply to melee AOE.

Modifié par ViSeirA, 23 février 2011 - 08:11 .

[Rocambole4]

Also remember raw auto attack DPS doesn't mean as much as in DA:O. In the demo at least I used an ability every few seconds.



Other valid point - 2 hander wielding warriors have passive staggering chance; add the AoE nature od his white swings and you open some very interesting possibilities there. Merciless strikes and Maim for rogues sound nice, but what really draw my attention is chain lightning. AoE spell with +600% damage against AoE staggered enemies? Yummy.

[Sabresandiego]

Im pretty sure melee AOE "abilities" do 100% friendly fire damage and auto attacks do 1/10th. Im not sure though maybe Peter could clarify. If I use whirlwind on nightmare, and Isabella is in the killzone, will she take 1/10 damage or full damage?

[ViSeiRa]

I'm guessing full damage... that 1/10th is for glancing blows, which translates to a "miss".

[Sabresandiego]

ViSeirA wrote...

I'm guessing full damage... that 1/10th is for glancing blows, which translates to a "miss".

The 1/10th damage is also for hits on friendlies with standard melee attacks. I don't know if you can get glancing blows on friendlies. I also don't know whether melee abilities also cause 1/10th friendly fire damage, or 100%.

Modifié par Sabresandiego, 23 février 2011 - 08:33 .

[Peter Thomas]

Naitaka wrote...

Is there a difference in damage between primary and secondary for a 2-handed warrior? Does it mean that I will have equal/higher DPS than Dual Weapon Rogue if I manage to hit more than 3 targets at the same time with my attack?

If you hit 3 targets at once, you'll have a higher DPS than a Dual Weapon Rogue, yes. Each target in your arc gets a separate to-hit roll, though, so you'll need to have a decent Attack score. Each target hit has it's damage calculated based on the hit result, not based on if it was the primary target.

[Peter Thomas]

Sabresandiego wrote...

ViSeirA wrote...

I'm guessing full damage... that 1/10th is for glancing blows, which translates to a "miss".

The 1/10th damage is also for hits on friendlies with standard melee attacks. I don't know if you can get glancing blows on friendlies. I also don't know whether melee abilities also cause 1/10th friendly fire damage, or 100%.

Warrior AoE basic attacks do glancing blows to friendlies on Nightmare.

[Sabresandiego]

Peter Thomas wrote...

Sabresandiego wrote...

ViSeirA wrote...

I'm guessing full damage... that 1/10th is for glancing blows, which translates to a "miss".

The 1/10th damage is also for hits on friendlies with standard melee attacks. I don't know if you can get glancing blows on friendlies. I also don't know whether melee abilities also cause 1/10th friendly fire damage, or 100%.

Warrior AoE basic attacks do glancing blows to friendlies on Nightmare.

So does that mean non basic attacks like whirlwind do 100% damage to friendlies? Im assuming so since you said basic attacks.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

Is the "Magic" attribute still used to see if a spell beats spell resistance?

[koshindan]

Arcane Shield(Elemental Shield) gives 20 percent elemental resistance.
Elemental Aegis(Elemental Shroud) gives 60 percent elemental resistance.
Adamant gives 5 percent damage resistance.
Resolute gives 10 percent magic resistance.

All of these are passive or sustained abilities. My question is, how much of these stack? If alll of them do, and with whatever goodies we can expect from the Templar spec, can we expect a magic immune Templar build in this game too?

Edit: Not to mention equipment or increased resistance from a high magic stat.

Modifié par koshindan, 23 février 2011 - 08:43 .

[daverian]

After reviewing this, I have more faith in the new skill system.



I'm still a little confused/disappointed?



I am glad to see that a "version" of backstab still exists that was like dragon age. I actually had fun positioning my rogue around in battle in order to hit them from behind. It seems like here that it is more to do with the enemy focusing on another player and not the rogue being behind, but I guess it's a compromise.



I wish stealth would last longer. I used it often to scout out ahead and plan my attacks before just rushing in. Now, only 10 seconds?....



It still just seems like we aren't getting as many options for some reason. For example, this is like 32 base abilities for the mage to pick up, where in Origins they had like 64. Sure, some of them were never used and practically worthless, but it still seemed like that was a matter of opinion and I could choose to play that way if I wanted. It does seem like there is less. Now, there is the saying that "less is more." I think that saying works when less = higher quality, and I think the less here is higher quality, but at the same time less can also mean that the same build is always used and there isn't enough diversity between characters. Sure, the "specialization" classes can make up for this somewhat, but there is what, 3 per class? That's still a pretty small amount.



This also ties into things skill points for spotting traps, picking locks, making poisons, making traps, herbalism, etc. Where has that gone? This was another way to differentiate characters.....I heard/read that these, such as picking locks, was now tied into dexterity, and other things were tied into other skills. Well, I don't know what they are exactly yet, but we all know every rogue is going to go dex. So, this means every rogue is good at the same stuff...again, loss of different specializations for different characters. Just my thoughts though, I have yet to play the final game.

[Rocambole4]

Well, peter is answering questions, I have some...



The passive stagger gained with Sunder applies to all attacks or only white swings? Whirlwind with the Tornado upgrade start to seem very nice with chain lightning if it's with all attacks...



Also, can you automate the NPCs in your group to usa abilities based on stat, i.e. chain lightning if enemy is staggered, corrosive walking bomb if disoriented, etc? Or do you have to manualy cast it?



And talking about nightmare, what does full friendly fire on lightmare? All AoE attacks or only magic AoE? What about cdondition inducing AoE, like rogue's nades?



Thanks