169 réponses à ce sujet

[The Lesser Evil]

Sabariel wrote...

It doesn't sound overly charming to me either. The first option is the only one that doesn't make you sound like a dick.

Yeah, aside from misremembering that they picked the diamond instead of the aggressive option, I stand by most of what I said. The paraphrased line ('this is no time to mourn') and the fact that the death of your sister isn't really something to make light of, makes it questionable for me that the diamond icon is 'charming'.

[Magnum Opus]

The Lesser Evil wrote...
I am a retard. Can we pretend I never spoke?

(diamond still doesn't make sense for charming, though )

Don't worry, I think the game itself will present you with plenty of opportunities to question the accuracy of the intent icon, just as the lines they use for paraphrasing cause a few double-takes when the character opens his mouth.

Am hoping it'll clarify the responses, but sometimes I wonder if it'll really just add another layer of "that's not what I thought would happen" between me and the response.  The problem, as I see it, is that it's all so subjective:  What a Bioware writer finds "charming", someone else may very find dickish.

As always, though... have to see how it all comes out in the wash.

[upsettingshorts]

It is if it is the "most nicest" of all the options. And if it is, it is, and the wheel/icon has done its job.



I'm not sure the word "charming" is meant to be taken absolutely literally, I wouldn't be surprised if it's more of a vague concept - but I'd have to read the manual.

[The Lesser Evil]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

It is if it is the "most nicest" of all the options. And if it is, it is, and the wheel/icon has done its job.

I'm not sure the word "charming" is meant to be taken absolutely literally, I wouldn't be surprised if it's more of a vague concept - but I'd have to read the manual.

It's not the nicest option on the wheel, there's another demo video out by the same user where Fem!Hawke uses the top option (diplomatic), which is the nicest of the options available there.

And yeah, I don't think 'more of a vague concept' and 'not literal' really work for icons when you're paraphrasing things that might not fully cover what's actually going to be said.

God, I'm going to end up turning into Sylvius.

Modifié par The Lesser Evil, 19 février 2011 - 02:16 .

[Kileyan]

The Lesser Evil wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

It is if it is the "most nicest" of all the options. And if it is, it is, and the wheel/icon has done its job.

I'm not sure the word "charming" is meant to be taken absolutely literally, I wouldn't be surprised if it's more of a vague concept - but I'd have to read the manual.

It's not the nicest option on the wheel, there's another demo video out by the same user where Fem!Hawke uses the top option (diplomatic), which is the nicest of the options available there.

And yeah, I don't think 'more of a vague concept' and 'not literal' really work for icons when you're paraphrasing things that might not fully cover what's actually going to be said.

God, I'm going to end up turning into Sylvius.

Sylvious wrote........

My favorite character concept roleplays a hatred for diamonds from when she was a slave in a diamond mine, so I will never choose that option. Yet more limitations on my roleplaying.

Modifié par Kileyan, 19 février 2011 - 02:28 .

[Duncan Anderson]

The Lesser Evil wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

It is if it is the "most nicest" of all the options. And if it is, it is, and the wheel/icon has done its job.

I'm not sure the word "charming" is meant to be taken absolutely literally, I wouldn't be surprised if it's more of a vague concept - but I'd have to read the manual.

It's not the nicest option on the wheel, there's another demo video out by the same user where Fem!Hawke uses the top option (diplomatic), which is the nicest of the options available there.

How do you know that the diplomatic option is nicer than the charming one? Have you heard what the charming one is? (the actual line not the paraphrase)

Modifié par Duncan Anderson, 19 février 2011 - 02:30 .

[Adhin]

I can understand Diamonds = Charming. I think people are looking at it not being charming from a very scientific, cold view of it basically being a hard rock. Opposed to you know what it is to the majority of the world, a really shiny gem stone people get gitty over just 'seeing'. I don't get gitty, but a lot of the world does, people do a lot of stupid things just for diamonds and other shiny things. It charms them with its mystical charmy powers.

[NKKKK]

This conversation is now diamonds

[The Lesser Evil]

Duncan Anderson wrote...

How do you know that the diplomatic option is nicer than the charming one? Have you heard what the charming one is? (the actual line not the paraphrase)

If the paraphrasing isn't something to base your expectations of the actual line on, the paraphrasing failed horribly. If there is some magical way that "This is no time to mourn" leads to a nicer response than "She died bravely", I will eat the box that my copy of DAII arrives in. I really hope it's not made out of plastic.

Modifié par The Lesser Evil, 19 février 2011 - 02:34 .

[Duncan Anderson]

The paraphrasing isn't suposed to stand alone though, it works with the tone icon, "This is no time to mourn" is the underling meaning, but it is conveyed in a charming way, whatever that may be. I'm not saying you're wrong, just seems to be a little soon to be judging something we haven't heard.

[The Lesser Evil]

Duncan Anderson wrote...
I'm not saying you're wrong, just seems to be a little soon to be judging something we haven't heard.

I'm embracing the spirit of the Bioware forums. Jumping to conclusions based on next-to-nothing and going directly against what a developer said on the subject is pretty much required for that.

[GLaDOS-03]

Duncan Anderson wrote...

The Lesser Evil wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

It is if it is the "most nicest" of all the options. And if it is, it is, and the wheel/icon has done its job.

I'm not sure the word "charming" is meant to be taken absolutely literally, I wouldn't be surprised if it's more of a vague concept - but I'd have to read the manual.

It's not the nicest option on the wheel, there's another demo video out by the same user where Fem!Hawke uses the top option (diplomatic), which is the nicest of the options available there.

How do you know that the diplomatic option is nicer than the charming one? Have you heard what the charming one is? (the actual line not the paraphrase)

at 2:40

[Duncan Anderson]

Thats the diplomatic option, not the charming one.

[The Lesser Evil]

GLaDOS-03 wrote...



at 2:40

We haven't heard the 'charming' one though, have we? The one picked in the other video (that I thought was the charming one) was the aggressive response.

[GLaDOS-03]

I do know that, i'm just showing you that the diplomatic one is probably the nicest.

EDIT: if we assumed that it works the same way it does in mass effect, then the first one is the nicest.

Modifié par GLaDOS-03, 19 février 2011 - 03:12 .

[AtreiyaN7]

Does it really matter? They could use a fluffy pink bunny icon to represent charming responses so long as it's documented that fluffy pink bunny means charming. As for a diamond, it transforms into a beautiful, sparkling gem with an inner fire when cut. Sometimes people fixate way too much on a single characteristic of an object, like the diamond's hardness. The diamond icon could also conceivably be a winking reference to the Old Spice commercials too. in any case, now we know for sure that the icons will be explained in the manual.

[erock75]

Upsettingshorts:

"So when I play The Witcher for example, I hear the line as written with my internal voice (I don't read it out loud to myself, if that's what people are assuming) and then hear it with my ears when Geralt says it . I hate that."



I totally agree with you! I can't stand hearing the same line in-game that I just read in my head. I for one am thrilled about the paraphrase system. Voiced character is also making me happy. I can't wait for the 8th!!!

[Riona45]

GLaDOS-03 wrote...

I do know that, i'm just showing you that the diplomatic one is probably the nicest.

Maybe, although it does sound somewhat detached.  I agree with the OP that it's the kind of line you'd use to comfort a stranger.

[Kileyan]

erock75 wrote...

Upsettingshorts:
"So when I play The Witcher for example, I hear the line as written with my internal voice (I don't read it out loud to myself, if that's what people are assuming) and then hear it with my ears when Geralt says it . I hate that."

I totally agree with you! I can't stand hearing the same line in-game that I just read in my head. I for one am thrilled about the paraphrase system. Voiced character is also making me happy. I can't wait for the 8th!!!

Are people really arguing this? No one wants to read a 5 sentence dialog option, click it, then have your guy say exactly what you just read. Well, maybe some do, but like me, in that situation I'd hit escape to skip the talk 5 words in.

What Bioware is doing is trying to relate the gist of the response, MUCH better to what the players wants to say. They took a lot of criticism for earlier tries at this, where you would choose an option and your character would do or say outlandish things that had nothing to do with your intent.

I'm hoping this wheel and icons helps us direct our character to say something similar to what we mean. I think it looks good, and its the best they can do without performing an FBI style profile on us before we play the game.

[erock75]

I think it looks good too and I think it's a great solution to a difficult problem. We'll have to play it to see. However I'm not the kind of person that gets annoyed at the way systems are implemented or if the ground textures aren't "right". I'm always too busy saying "oohhh, what's this do, oh cool, wow what's that thing, oh awesome, hey lets kill stuff!" to worry about the myriad of flaws people here obsess over.

[GLaDOS-03]

Riona45 wrote...

GLaDOS-03 wrote...

I do know that, i'm just showing you that the diplomatic one is probably the nicest.

Maybe, although it does sound somewhat detached.  I agree with the OP that it's the kind of line you'd use to comfort a stranger.

Well, it's definitely not the way i would react if my brother died, but as you can see there's no better choice, so i'll choose the first one.

[Sanguinerin]

GLaDOS-03 wrote...

Riona45 wrote...

GLaDOS-03 wrote...

I do know that, i'm just showing you that the diplomatic one is probably the nicest.

Maybe, although it does sound somewhat detached.  I agree with the OP that it's the kind of line you'd use to comfort a stranger.

Well, it's definitely not the way i would react if my brother died, but as you can see there's no better choice, so i'll choose the first one.

But you don't know that the top, diplomatic option is the best option. When I'm being diplomatic (international relations is my degree), I'm generally being professional. It can be pleasant, but not caring or nice. That middle option just might be the middle ground. I don't want to be too professional and select the somewhat possibly detached option, and yet I also don't want to give off the impression that I never cared about my sibling. Something in-between just might be fantastic. Something like a middle option. I'll reserve my judgment for the actual playthrough, but you can't say what the best option is in any situation until you know what happens when each option is selected.

EDIT: So far, we've only heard the top and the bottom options, so perhaps trying out the middle option in the demo could be a good idea for you to test the waters for your actual playthrough? Just a thought.

Modifié par HallowedWarden, 19 février 2011 - 06:09 .

[GLaDOS-03]

HallowedWarden wrote...
But you don't know that the top, diplomatic option is the best option. When I'm being diplomatic (international relations is my degree), I'm generally being professional. It can be pleasant, but not caring or nice. That middle option just might be the middle ground. I don't want to be too professional and select the somewhat possibly detached option, and yet I also don't want to give off the impression that I never cared about my sibling. Something in-between just might be fantastic. Something like a middle option. I'll reserve my judgment for the actual playthrough, but you can't say what the best option is in any situation until you know what happens when each option is selected.

EDIT: So far, we've only heard the top and the bottom options, so perhaps trying out the middle option in the demo could be a good idea for you to test the waters for your actual playthrough? Just a thought.

True, but i just fail to see how could"This is no time to mourn" possibly be nicer than "She died bravely".