602 réponses à ce sujet

[Slayer299]

Okay, time to throw my 2 cents in after having read the first 14 pages and the first issue;

If this is an indication of Mac Walters view of the Mass Effect universe, that he can just re-write parts he doesn't like or just feels like changing than its time to start seriously worrying about what the story of ME3 is going to even *look* like. Because I wasn't impressed by what he did for the story of ME2 which was one that I found to be seriously *underwhelming*.

[Mir5]

"maybe... maybe it's FULLY EVOLVED"

I really would love to hear Mac Walters' definition of evolution. I don't know who is throwing this "essence of species" -grade BS in this set but I assume that it all goes through him, right?

Modifié par Mir5, 20 février 2011 - 05:55 .

[didymos1120]

Mir5 wrote...

"maybe... maybe it's FULLY EVOLVED"

Where's that from?

[Zulu_DFA]

didymos1120 wrote...

Mir5 wrote...

"maybe... maybe it's FULLY EVOLVED"

Where's that from?

Evolution #1.

[Tasker]

Christ... I thought my expectations for ME3 were already as low as I thought they could get.

Guess I was wrong.

You know, if this was a TV series it would have a "Bible", a book containing all of the history and specifics of the universe so to avoid any mistakes with consistancy and contradictions.

I take it Bioware didn't make one of these for Mass Effect?

Ah, that's right, why go to all that effort when you've got Wiki.

Well that's just poor.

Modifié par Orkboy, 20 février 2011 - 07:22 .

[JamieCOTC]

Just wanted to say one thing. I am a fan of comics and I haven't come across a video game yet to compare to some of the best comics written, let alone some of the more recent Hollywood movies (despite them being based on comics). I haven't read Evolution, but I did read Redemption and I hate to say it, but Walters is a hack. Redemption read like cliff notes on the events that happened while at the same time feeling padded.

On the subject at hand, like I said, I haven't read Evolution, but it's not uncommon for a writer to take the reigns from another and make sweeping changes, whether they come from higher up or just out of ego. The real trick is to keep the continuity while giving the piece its own voice. That's something not every writer can do. And who's to say most of the changes didn't come from higher up the food chain? Is Walters truly to blame? I dunno. I just know he's not a very good comics writer.

On the subject of retconning itself, it just depends on the circumstances. Sometimes it is for the better. Klingons would have had bumpy heads had Roddenberry had the budget.

Modifié par JamieCOTC, 20 février 2011 - 07:24 .

[Tasker]

mrsph wrote...

People blame Walters because he is the biggest target to use as a scapegoat.

With something like like the comic, people blame Walters because HE WROTE THE **** THING.

When it comes to the game, people blame Walters because even if he doesn't write it, everything has to be approved by him, if something gets included and it's a pile of crap, then it's his fault as he let it through.

[Remus Artega]

people blame him because he is the one who is signed under it

[AdmiralCheez]

mrsph wrote...

And Drew has also horribly mangled the story if you've read the novels.

Like 99% of this stuff isn't going to be mentioned in the game anyway outside of one or two lines.

This.

I learned my lesson with the Starcraft novels/comics: stick to the games and ignore other media, lest you be severely disappointed.

However, Drew's suckage does not change the fact that Mac sucks.  I mean, really, you two, stick to videogames.

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 20 février 2011 - 07:36 .

[AllenShepard]

Mir5 wrote...

"maybe... maybe it's FULLY EVOLVED"

I really would love to hear Mac Walters' definition of evolution. I don't know who is throwing this "essence of species" -grade BS in this set but I assume that it all goes through him, right?

Humanity at the time of Shanxi, had no knowledge of Turian physiology. For all we knew, they could go into cocoons and come out as dragons. While Walters makes mistakes, I can't understand crucifying him for things like this.

Modifié par AllenShepard, 20 février 2011 - 07:38 .

[Vengeful Nature]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

Mir5 wrote...

"maybe... maybe it's FULLY EVOLVED"

Where's that from?

Evolution #1.

That's not true. It can't be. Even Mac Walters is better than that.



*Entering Stage 1: Denial*

[Kusy]

Ok, Drew's books were writen as they were writen (the second one was decent tho). But what he wrote in the books was building on the already estabilished lore. Right now every expanded universe release to Mass Effect series is building over whatever was before.



Nobody in this thread is saying that Mass Effect 1 had incredible story - the story was good for a video game. Just as Mass Effect 2 story was really enjoyable and nice for a video game. It doesn't change the fact that they were suposed to be parts of one story. If one part contradicts another it doesn't work out too well for both those parts.

[ifander]

Even Bungie had their own Halo-bible written in-house that they consulted when writing stories, and Halo isn't renowned for its story, rather its gameplay (the lore is actually very good, only most people aren't bothered with finding out about it). If this stuff about Walters using the Wiki is true then it doesn't bode well for the series.

[AdmiralCheez]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Ok, Drew's books were writen as they were writen (the second one was decent tho). But what he wrote in the books was building on the already estabilished lore. Right now every expanded universe release to Mass Effect series is building over whatever was before.

Nobody in this thread is saying that Mass Effect 1 had incredible story - the story was good for a video game. Just as Mass Effect 2 story was really enjoyable and nice for a video game. It doesn't change the fact that they were suposed to be parts of one story. If one part contradicts another it doesn't work out too well for both those parts.

Good point.  That's what frustrates me the most, in fact.

It seems like since Drew got bored and left, Mac used that as an excuse to make everything the way he wanted it.

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 20 février 2011 - 07:55 .

[darknoon5]

Mr.Kusy wrote...

Ok, Drew's books were writen as they were writen (the second one was decent tho). But what he wrote in the books was building on the already estabilished lore. Right now every expanded universe release to Mass Effect series is building over whatever was before.

Nobody in this thread is saying that Mass Effect 1 had incredible story - the story was good for a video game. Just as Mass Effect 2 story was really enjoyable and nice for a video game. It doesn't change the fact that they were suposed to be parts of one story. If one part contradicts another it doesn't work out too well for both those parts.

The thing is, the book does actually contradict some of what is established in ME1, and bring down the sky contradicts the apperance of Batarians.

I agree though. The books were better at keeping to the lore, but they still weren't exactly great.

[Vengeful Nature]

darknoon5 wrote...
bring down the sky contradicts the apperance of Batarians.

Really? What did they look like before?

EDIT: Never mind. They look really cool. Kind of like streamlined Ithorians. Anyone else think that it's likely that they were made to look more human so the devs could use the human body model, to save time/money. Disappointing.

ifander wrote...

Even Bungie had their own Halo-bible written in-house that they consulted when writing stories, and Halo isn't renowned for its story, rather its gameplay (the lore is actually very good, only most people aren't bothered with finding out about it). If this stuff about Walters using the Wiki is true then it doesn't bode well for the series.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks that.

Modifié par Vengeful Nature, 20 février 2011 - 08:04 .

[Kusy]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
It seems like since Drew got bored and left, Mac used that as an excuse to make everything the way he wanted it.

I think this would be too much to assume for any of us. We don't know if any of this is true, it's more likely that Drew decided to work on a bigger, better funded and more dynamic project TOR is or that he was simply moved there by whoever was in place to take such decision since BioWare has a corporation structure. Also, saying that Mac Walters want to ruin everything already estabilished is reading too much into it - I'm perfectly fine with saying that this comic is bad storywise, I'm not going to judge Mac in any other way than as a writer.

[darknoon5]

Vengeful Nature wrote...

darknoon5 wrote...
bring down the sky contradicts the apperance of Batarians.

Really? What did they look like before?

EDIT: Never mind. They look really cool. Kind of like a streamlined Ithorian. Anyone else think that it's likely that they were made to look more human so the devs could use the human body model, to save time/money. Disappointing.

ifander wrote...

Even Bungie had their own Halo-bible written in-house that they consulted when writing stories, and Halo isn't renowned for its story, rather its gameplay (the lore is actually very good, only most people aren't bothered with finding out about it). If this stuff about Walters using the Wiki is true then it doesn't bode well for the series.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks that.

Yeah, I prefer their original appearance. Looks more Alien. I have enough trouble accepting the Asari, Batarian's are just humans with different heads and more eyes.

I also agree. Halo has very consistent and good lore.

Modifié par darknoon5, 20 février 2011 - 08:04 .

[AdmiralCheez]

Again, Mr. K, you have a point. It's just the impression I got, not necessarily what's true.

[didymos1120]

JamieCOTC wrote...
 I just know he's not a very good comics writer.
 

Well, with the exceptions of Incursion and Inquisition, he doesn't write the actual scripts for the comics. John Jackson Miller does.  Who exactly is to blame for Genesis (because "credit" is really the wrong word to use for that thing)  is unclear.  There's a statement from Jesse Houston saying "Mac also wrote the comic (he wrote the other ones as well)"  The question is, did Mac write Genesis in the way he wrote Incursion/Inquistion? I.e actually wrote the story and script; or did he write it in the way he did Redemption/Evolution?  I.e., gave DH a story which they then scripted themselves.

But anyway, if you hate the stories of Redemption and Evolution, fair enough: they were Walters' work.  But as far as the actual words and pictures that end up in the final products? Those seem to be largely in Dark Horse's hands, and it's not clear how much editorial control Bioware has.  I mean, they obviously have some, but just as obviously, it must have limits.  I doubt, for instance, Bioware could say "No, you can't print that as it is.  We don't care if it's supposed to be on the shelves next week."