145 réponses à ce sujet

[Phate Phoenix]

Aedan_Cousland wrote...

I just have to tell that the bolded part of your post is absolutely and utterly wrong.  In fact, I'm actually insulted by it. However, that's getting drastically off topic, so I'll leave that be.

How many marriages would last even close to their 30th or 40th year, if that marriage was sexless?

Joker can barely walk.

Several that I know of, actually. And any marriage I enter into will be sexless as well, in case you were wondering. Huzzah asexuality.

Joker may barely be able to walk, but he can run awkwardly while the Normandy is under attack, crawl through ventilation shafts, and fire an assault rifle. Unless you're saying sex is harder than those things, I think he can manage.

[jeweledleah]

Aedan_Cousland wrote...

I just have to tell that the bolded part of your post is absolutely and utterly wrong.  In fact, I'm actually insulted by it. However, that's getting drastically off topic, so I'll leave that be.

How many marriages would last even close to their 30th or 40th year, if that marriage was sexless?

Joker can barely walk.

I just HAD to adress that one.  there are paraplegics that have lasting marriages.  joker can move, he has use of both his arms and legs and mouth and frolm what we know, he has the interest in the activity.  which means, that even if they cannot have conventional sort of snu snu - they can still please each other with a tiny bit of creativity.  after all - if Shepard can figure out how to have sex with a Turian, figuring out ways around Vrolik's desease  is child's play.

furthermore - modern marriages that do not survive through dry spells, have bigger issues then sex - specificaly the issue is finding a compromice, a solution that works for all parties in marriage.  In other words, lack of sex is merely a symptom.

[nevar00]

Aedan_Cousland wrote...
I was against either of those characters becoming LIs because I thought some of the aliens should remain 'alien,' and be incompatible with humans in that way. The Tali romance doesn't really make any sense at all, since their people spend near every waking moment in envirosuits, and sex with a human could make them ill or potentially kill them. She was made a LI in ME2 only as fan service for her large and rabid following.

Tali's romance was ok and she was a much better developed character in ME2 than she was in ME1, but I don't think her romance was the best written. I play as a Male Shep and as such have never romanced Thane, but having watched all of the cutscenes I missed online, I have to say Thane's is much deeper than Tali's. So is Liara's romance if you include LotSB. I'd include Jack's romance as being deeper as well, but you already mentioned her.

The romance with Garrus also makes little sense. He is covered with a metallic carapace, has mandibles, and talons. His features are so alien that they wouldn't be physically appealing to most humans, nor would most Turians find humans physically attractive. To Bioware's credit though they did sort of write that into the Garrus romance, since in the final scene he struggles to compliment FemShep. It's clear he isn't physically attracted to her and is only drawn to her emotionally. But the scene still comes off as a bit creepy. I mean realistically if Turians existed, humans sleeping with them would no doubt be viewed as having a bizarre fetish.

I thought they did a good job explaining why it was possible for Quarians to have sex with other species, although I understand what you mean.  (Oh and just to let you know apparently Tali was supposed to be an LI in Mass Effect 1, I recall someone posting a link to an interview where that was mentioned).  I still stand by what I said with regards to Tali being one of the deeper romances, due to what I said (the backstory, you being the only one to help her when she was facing exile, the whole mask thing, etc.)  As I said while I think Jack's was also very deep... unlike Tali's, I didn't find it realistic.  You just talk to her a few times and suddenly she breaks down... it was too easy imo.  Like you I've only played as a guy but from what I've seen of Thane's, it didn't seem anything too special.  Actually my favorite part of his romance was how he goes on about how he's actually afraid to die: he brought some realism back to the mission, but yet it didn't have much to do with the romance subplot itself.

Actually... the more I think about it, the more I think they screwed up on the Jack romance.  Don't get me wrong, the whole 'turning the bad girl' thing was a great idea and I still say it was one of the deeper relationships, but the way it plays out pretty much goes Shepard wants to talk, Jack tells a story.  Rinse, lather, repeat several times with different stories about crimes and sex and whatnot.  Then suddenly she shows up in Shephard's cabin, cries, and boom!  There you go.  It really is more like Shephard's her psychologist than anything: it's way too one sided.  

And personally I never cared for Liara.  Her relationship in the first game felt so forced to me, like there was no real emotion behind it.  LOTSB helped it a bit, but still... meh.  I agree about Garrus, it was kind of odd.  It seems as if the whole thing was about having sex, but yet they weren't completely attracted to each other that way... but still you have history with Garrus and they played it off as a humorously awkward romance, which I think worked.  It wasn't the greatest, but it sure was better then Miranda and Jacob "Teh PRIIIIIZE" Taylor.

Actually, I just realized... Wrex is the only ME 1 squadmate that so far isn't romanceable.  I think we can agree that it would be pretty weird... and yet for some reason I can almost picture Bioware pulling it off in a way that makes sense. 

Modifié par nevar00, 20 février 2011 - 03:11 .

[Abispa]

I don't know why so many people are freaking out about Shepard having sex with aliens, it's not like s/he takes off her/his clothes anyway. Heck, the only ME2 character that I've seen (never romanced Jacob) take off her clothes is Miranda, and even she revealed that amazing bra that never made lines in her tighter than skin outfit.

[Abispa]

You gotta love Shepard dry-humping Jack into submission, though.

[Ahriman]

Did you think asari are depraved race which can date anybody? No, asari are race of nuns compared with Shepard.
I have nothing against romances, but in ME characters start this flirt crap if they are romancible. Imagine situation when evryone on the ship is romancible: wink, flirty voice, sex jokes in every damn dialog. All immersion is broken because Rupert slipped aphrodisiac into the food.

[emmanuelsieyes]

One of the concerns that I have about romanceable characters is that the romance path usually overrides their dialog options.



For instance, if I talk to Tali in ME2 as FemShep, then I hit the end of her dialog fairly quickly, because Tali just keeps repeating 'I have to get this engine clean' or something. By the same token, I have the same problem with Garrus (chose against romancing him as I was staying with Liara). I can only ask to 'let off some stress together' or 'I should go'.



I figure that most of their dialog path is part of the romance option. Thane was pretty good about this, he seemed to have much more unique dialog that was not part of the romance path.



I'm also a fan of limited romance options. For instance, Mordin.Mordin Solus is my favorite ME 2 addition (I used to have him as my avatar, I've been rotating between Mordin, Liara, and Wrex as my favorite ME chars (which reminds me, I need to set it to Wrex soon)). However, making Mordin romanceable would be very out of character for him.



One of the really good things about the romance options is that it's a way to support a character that you like. For instance, I like Liara. Being able to romance Liara is a benefit. However, I don't want to romance a character if that romance is going to derail the character. Even if Mordin was a romance option, I wouldn't take it.



Of course, I'm already biased as to romance options. If Liara wasn't a romance option in ME1, I probably would not be demanding Bioware make her a romance option in ME2. I would talk to her and get my experience points for Codex entries, and then I would think, gee, I hope she comes back in ME2. I think she's cute, and I like her biotics.

[Homebound]

the crewmembers that werent romanceable should stay that way. and no new romances in mass3.

[NamiraWilhelm]

Who says Joker and Shep couldnt have sex? Okay they might be slightly limited, but there are endless ways to spice things up in other ways. Not to mention, PLENTY of people with Jokers condition have FAMILIES. They go on, in most cases, to be normal functioning human beings. Honestly, its like saying people with disabilities dont deserve love lives.

No to mention, Jokers condition has shown vast improvement from ME1 to ME2, who knows how his condition might have progressed between ME2 to ME3.

And what jeweledleah said? Perfect.

If Shep can figure out how to have fun with a probable hemipene, cloaca, whatever, they can figure out how to overcome Jokers condition in the bom chica wow wow department

Modifié par NamiraWilhelm, 20 février 2011 - 11:19 .

[naddaya]

Joker. No way.

[Bugsie]

If the game had no romances - I still would have played. In fact my first Shep made it through ME1 without a single romance.



People can love who they want to love and that doesn't always have to equate to sex.

[Tasha vas Nar Rayya]

^ What buggirl said. I can't see any of my Shepard's hooking up with Joker, but I know there will be a lot of Shepard's who will. I don't see why it is such a far fetched thing, it is a much more sensible option than some of the existing romances. (Although the least sensible LI's: Garrus and Tali are two of my favourites.)



And seriously, why the outrage over romancing Garrus or Tali when no one ever complains about asari? I know they look more alien than asari, but the whole concept is still there.

Human/alien relationships in sci-fi. Guess what, it happens. A lot.

[Hobosapien]

Not against the Joker romance for those that want it. Won't be my Shep's choice. The Normandy is Jokers love, Give EDI a female avatar, instead of the bubble, and he'll be good to go. My ME3 wishlist is deeper dialogue options with crew. This 3 or 4 encounters and done left me a bit unsatisfied.

[Errol Dnamyx]

Every non human.

Also, Joker.

Modifié par Errol Dnamyx, 20 février 2011 - 02:50 .

[Gnoster]

Personally I have no problem with every team member being a potential LI; let it be up to personal preference imo (this also goes to argue that everyone should be able to enter a same sex LI situation). I only ask that they don't create "hidden" paths to activating said romance, where I all of a sudden apparantly have told e.g. Ashley that she is the only woman in the world for me. I would prefer to be able to control who I see as a potential LI.
For example I could never see any of my Shepards with people like Garrus, Tali, Samara, or Jacob. Not because they suck as characters, but because the way their story is written I see myself more of a friend with them. This is why I hate talking to e.g. Jacob whenever I play a FemShep, because she sounds like a schoolgirl with a crush everytime she asks him a question.

Modifié par Gnoster, 20 février 2011 - 03:13 .

[elarem]

Joker, Anderson, Dr Chakwas because they're Shepard's "friends".

As for my Shepard's romantic preferences, s/he isn't into non-human species - Asari (tentacles), Turian (mandibles), Quarians (enviro-suits) and for both Turians and Quarians their hand's and feet, Drell (eyes and lizard-like), Batarians (eyes). I'm shallow - but these are dealbreakers for me and my Shepards (also full body tattoos on humans). S/he'll work with them, respect and even like them, but romance ? No. That leaves humans, but the writers don't seem to want to make 'fully functioning' human beings with no hang ups (especially without same sex possibilities) as "interesting" as aliens with their potentially life-threatening close contact with bodily fluids bonus. So really no additions to the LIs in ME3 - let's deal with the ones that we've got from ME and/or ME2 or just stay single.

[Tasha vas Nar Rayya]

In that case, just make a Shepard who can open his/her mind to have a relationship with an alien. Your Shepard's don't have to reflect your preferences. In fact, it is more fun if they don't!

[nevar00]

Not gonna lie... I'd bang an alien.

[Eliantariel]

First: I am totally open for new romance options. Why? Because with more options there are more reasons to replay the game and to explore everything. Additionally, it helps the players to play their Shepards more likely how they like to play.

There are always the same arguments against Joker as romance option:

1:  physical condition:
- People with bone disease are able to have sex - so Joker should survive sex with Shepard (besides the fact that you can have sex in different and not harmful ways)

- Jokers condition was improved by Cerberus from ME1 to ME2. He can walk without help and fire a gun.

2. No displayed interest and ME3 to late
- That Joker did not flirt with Shep does not mean that he is not interested in Shep. Garrus wasn't really showing interest in Shep in ME1 too and he admit in ME2 that he never thought about it.

- In ME1 it would fit to Joker not to show interest in Shepard - he is with the alliance and yes, he loves flying desperately.
But in ME2 he does not longer belong to the alliance and does not have to fear to be grounded - this already happened to him. In ME2 it is possible to explain Jokers lack of obvious interest in Shep with the fear of losing Shep as friend. The suicide mission could have shown Joker how much he cares for Shep - so this would be easy to implement.

3. Friendship
- With becoming a romance option, it is still possible for the player not to romance this character. It is an option - that means the player is not forced to romance and can still be only friends with this character.

4. EDI
- Who would seriously believe that an adult human male would be more interested to have a love affair with a computer than with an other human being?

And Joker says himself that EDI behaves like his mother.

EDI is not a living being and as Mordin after his recruitment says: EDI only simulates emotions and a emotional voice.

5. Already enough romance options
Say the people who have already found their favourite romance option...
Of course not every character or NPC can be a romance option in the game - that would clearly be too much. But there are characters with which Shep has already a deep connection and of course it is possible that Bioware introduces in ME3 one or more new characters that are so interesting, that players would like to romance them too.

Of course Bioware should regard, that players are not forced in a romance, that there is enough dialogue even if a char is not romanced and that the story does not lack from that. But one or two more new romances would not harm the story or ME3 - it may be the third and last part of Sheps story, but it is still a new game with new decisions and possibilities.


And last but not least: that you have many different romance options does not mean that every squadmate and character (at the same time) is in love with Shep - they are just options for the player to select the one they like. Despite some exceptions where the NPC is clearly showing interest in Shep for most romance options it is Shep who initiates the romance trigger.

Modifié par Eliantariel, 20 février 2011 - 06:57 .

[Abispa]

I would like to see "special" relationships develop between Shepard and crewmates, not just romances. Garrus could be your son or your brother, Samara could be a sister or your mother, Tali could be a daughter, Joker could be your lovable punching bag, etc. Or you could have a "I hate you, but I respect you" or "Wait till this mission's over, punk" style relationships. And I'd LOVE to have a lying backstabber crewmate for drama. "Special" relationships could open new conversation choices and squad comments during the game. I realize that would be a hell of a lot more work for BioWare, but I like being demanding.

[Abispa]

When you get Dr. Chakwas drunk, she confesses that she has a mother / son style relationship with Joker, which surprised me because I'd never seen the two of them together (sarcasm). I'd like to see more evidence of "special" relationships among the crew.

If Joker does become a LI (dear God, why), I'd love to see a scene between you and the doctor when she gives you the mommy "you better not hurt him" threat.

[Dengarde]

Eliantariel wrote...
4. EDI
- Who would seriously believe that an adult human male would be more interested to have a love affair with a computer than with an other human being?

I just have to say that this happens ALL THE TIME. In fact, there was an anime series created SPECIFICLY for this kind of thing. (It was basicly 40 minute episodes of a girl acting freindly and intimate with the viewer, ala Dora the Explorer. One episode is basicly half an hour of her SLEEPING.)

That said, I don't think Edi is particularly romancable anyways >_>

[NamiraWilhelm]

Eliantariel wrote...

- Who would seriously believe that an adult human male would be more interested to have a love affair with a computer than with an other human being?

Isnt that what we're doing

[Null_]

NamiraWilhelm wrote...

Eliantariel wrote...

- Who would seriously believe that an adult human male would be more interested to have a love affair with a computer than with an other human being? 

Isnt that what we're doing 

Tali is real.

Modifié par Null_, 20 février 2011 - 08:40 .