334 réponses à ce sujet

[The Fred]

Chaos Wielder wrote...
Plot:                 To
slay the Tarrasque(yes, I’m serious).

This sounds great. It's a loose enough plot hook that people can go their own way and have a "story lite" world filled with dungeons, old-school enough to fit the SoZ-style theme, and motivating enough to grant some structure to the storyline. Also, the Tarrasque is basically invincible, so it could open up room for extension or a sequel (in theory, at any rate).

As for level ranges, it's probably better to pitch the opening at at least 4th-ish, as in SoZ, so that people can have fully-formed characters, and to iron out LA power curves. However, starting it too high would mean people wouldn't be able to use certain enemies (no goblins, no gnolls etc) without making them ridiculously tough (for what they are) or ridiculously easy (for the party).

It would be nice to have some sort of loose thread through the game, too. Shallina's point about low-level characters not being called upon to kill the Tarrasque is a good one, though; perhaps a more experienced group of adventurers could try and fail first, somehow giving something for the party to do in the meantime (maybe they go looking for them when they don't return, etc)? Perhaps, brave and bold adventurers of higher levels march off to face the Tarrasque, but the PCs get some intelligence which reveals that there's an artefact etc. which will make killing it actually possible? Then, they go looking for that, first. Perhaps they even run into the beast and have to flee from it before they get the pieces.

[Shaughn78]

The Fred wrote...
It would be nice to have some sort of loose thread through the game, too. Shallina's point about low-level characters not being called upon to kill the Tarrasque is a good one, though; perhaps a more experienced group of adventurers could try and fail first, somehow giving something for the party to do in the meantime (maybe they go looking for them when they don't return, etc)? Perhaps, brave and bold adventurers of higher levels march off to face the Tarrasque, but the PCs get some intelligence which reveals that there's an artefact etc. which will make killing it actually possible? Then, they go looking for that, first. Perhaps they even run into the beast and have to flee from it before they get the pieces.

I think The fred makes a good point here and it goes with my last post. For the story it might make more sense that the low level party was sent to gather information for the "True Adventurers."  As the story advances either they ignore your advice or just get bored waiting for you to complete your mission and attack the creature. With the "true heroes" dead you're now the only ones with the knowledge of how to kill this thing and you need to gather the artifcats and a bit more experience.

[dunniteowl]

From the Tome of Woes of the Lands of Turm
(Found in an older underground section of the Library at Aglahon, which had collapsed 30 years ago.)

...And it came to pass that our Faire Lands were ravaged by a most fearsome and indestructible beast of colossal proportions.  Everywhere it went, little of use remained.  Many a hero went up against this foul denizen, never to be seen again.  The entire land was in terror.

A council was convened.  All in attendance were of great wisdom, scholars of repute, mages of reknown and mighty kings, princes, queens and princesses from every corner of the lands.  They convened and argued, debated, proposed, got angry, left, came back and finally settled upon a plan.

They would construct a mighty artifact of such awesome power that it would be fashioned in eight parts.  Each part would be a powerful item in it's own right.  When assembled and activated, the holder of the Might of Turm could have a chance to vanquish this aweful and terrible creature.  Even with all the power of the Might of Turm, no-one could say for certain if it was powerful enough to slay the beast.

A call went out for the strongest, most wise, powerful and clever heroes far and wide, so that they could carry the Might of Turm in it's separate parts to where the Tarrasque was currently wreaking havoc.  Then, they would assemble the Might of Turm and activate it, while engaging the beast in a most fearsome and mighty battle.

A group of heroes came forward, having met the tests and bested them all.  They were given the parts and sent on their way, with the will and the hope of All of Turm going with them.  They met the creature most foul and hastily assembled their individual parts of the Might of Turm.  The wizard with them spoke the words and struck the heart of the device with his most potent wand, which was destroyed in the process.

Each of the heroes felt stronger, mightier, braver and more powerful of mind as well as soul.  The Might of Turm made a sound of musical force of ringing tones, chord like pipe organ sounds and the rush of seraphim, along with the cacophony of all demonkind and the skirling cry of the Bain Sidhe all rolled into one.

The tarrasque halted in it's devouring and shivered along it's entire length.  It turned to face the nearly deafening sound, twitching anxiously.  The heroes charged!  They met the tarrasque and fell to battle in sound fashion, laying about with weapons of varying kinds, all the while dodging, dancing and avoiding the terrible claws and enormous mouth of the creature in front, and leaping, rolling and jumping to evade the creature's stupendous tail, lashing in fury, uprooting trees in single massive swipes.

All day this went on and the heroes never flagged or waned of strength, nor did they tire and slow.  And though the tarrasque is a mighty and awesome beast, before the sun began to set, it recieved a last fusilade of blows from the heroes and went down.  For some reason the heroes could not stop fighting the creature, even though it appeared to be vanquished.

At the last, one of the heroes was heard to say, "I wish this beast would finally DIE!"

All at once, a trumpeting sound shook the hills and forests, or what remained of them, and trembled the very ground and bones of all within it's reach.  A blinding flash of light emanated from the Might of Turm, washing over the tarrasque and blinding all who were witness to this mighty event.  As the light faded and the thunderous noise waned, people began to shout, "It's a Miracle!"  They were all pointing to where the tarrasque had fallen.  It was no more.  It was completely gone.  So, too, was the Might of Turm.

Reading further one might find that the Might of Turm was assumed destroyed in the process.  However, over the tens of decades since this mighty event, occasionally a rumor would surface about an item someone possessed which had great powers. 

One was reputed to have been able to grant the possessor great strength like that of a giant.  Though there are other tales that conflict.  Some say there is an item that grants the holder untold magical force.  Others say there is an item of great value that grants immunity to all manner of poisons, disease and ailments.  There are also tales of an item or artifact that heals a person's wounds, even mortal ones, nearly instantaneously.  It is believed by some scholars of Aglahon that these tales represent sightings by common folk of parts of the Might of Turm.

Some now believe that the Might of Turm was not destroyed.  Instead, they consider it very possible that the Might of Turm was magically cast apart into each of it's individual pieces and scattered magically across the lands in secret or out of the way places.  It is also odd to note that the tales of these items always end badly with an untimely demise and the sudden disappearance of the item in question.

If that isn't a solid and believable plot hook, I'll eat a mouse.  Oh.  Right.  I already eat mice. 
dunniteowl
(I'll attempt some areas, though I think mostly I will focus on story details, if that's alright.)

[manageri]

I'd say avoid making the plot more specific then it needs to be. Why does the party have to have been hired by anyone? Maybe you just came across information about the artifact and decided to go after it for whatever reason, your group doesn't even have to be motivated by stopping the tarrasque (but in the most predictable plot twist ever you need to use it to destroy the tarrasque in the end anyway to avoid being devoured and stuff). This keeps the door open for more character concepts.

[nicethugbert]

NEAT!



Will this work with Kaedrin's?

[WyrinDnjargo]

Hellfire's beatnen  me to an overland map suggestion thats looking pretty funky - I was only going to add my Northern Cormyr one into the mix, but could probably do with a bit of polishing (main hub city of Arabel is also on the vault). This is from a shelved project I had to recreate the time of troubles and ascension of Kelemvor, Cyric and Midnight/Mystra in a campaign. Jus' throwing it into the mix, but that Vilhoon map is looking nice and more different than say Cormyr vs Western Heartlands...


Finding fragments and completing item to destroy the tarrasque is good segue into the sandbox. Only caveat is that the tiem should be more like the scrolls in the OC rather than the only weapon that can harm it (so it's a case of defending a PC to activate item to make the tarrasque vulnerable then all PCs pil in, rather than one PC having the only effective weapon in the combat).

But count me in for sure. Keen to re-flex my NWN imagination

And hey, why not the Tarrasque at level 20, then Cthulhu at level 30...

[Shallina]

Before starting modding, scripting, area making, there are many thing that need to be done :

First you need to define all the balance mecanism of the game in order to be able to make cool encounters.


-- Define how the rest system work :

- rest anywhere any time like in the OC ?
- rest only once every 8 hours ? ( I don't like it, can't tune hard encounters with that system)
- Allow to rest only when some condition are meet
exemple:
In town you are allowed to rest only in an Inn, in exterior you need a camp, in exterior you can be disturbed by monster, you cannot rest in a dunjeon, or if you do you have a hight probability to be disturbed.

How do you handle area where you are not allowed to rest ? ( a guard wakes you up when you try to sleep, just disable the sleep function ?)

How do you handle area where you shouldn't rest ? A dunjeon, an ennemy territory, 100% chance to be disturbed ? Just don't allow to rest ?


Difficulty setting, do you want to alter the game depending on the difficulty setting ? more harsh rest system the harder you set the difficulty, make encounter dinamic via scripting, and depending on the difficulty setting make them more difficult ?


---

The kill the Tarasque plot device :

Is it an item ? Is it special(s) ability(s) that the character devellop thrue is journey ? A combinaison of the both ?

Is the Tarasque the only thing ? Could  an organisation  exist to prevent you from killing the Tarasque and wich could be found accross all the game ?


Where is the hub (wich city ?) ? where is the main seeting of the story?


-----

The main char background :

- a random adventurer ? (SOZ/IWD/DAO like)
- Someone special ? ( OC/MOTB/BG/planescape like) if someone special then how ? And how does it devellop ?


A community module where several modder work on different part, is I think one of the few possibility to have a full scope campaign that could take a player from lvl 1 to lvl 20 or 30.

A general plot line that allow each modder involved to do what he wants with her/his assignement. That idea of killing the Tarask as a final goal is a good one. Will you give the Tarask an army to be defeated with it ?


---

You also need to put  in place a collaborativ space where the modders can share their work.

Modifié par Shallina, 22 février 2011 - 10:57 .

[Arkalezth]

Agreed with others, if the reason to not start at level 1 is because adventurers would be too weak, you can simply not mention the Tarrasque until later. For example, a level 1 party is hired to kill some rats/goblins/whatever, a few levels later they find some information on the Tarrasque, and decide to go for it.

I haven't read Kamal's link entirely, but it'd be cool if there were more than one way to kill it in the end, if possible.

Modifié par Arkalezth, 22 février 2011 - 11:38 .

[WyrinDnjargo]

Just throwing this out there as an idea, but what about some time dependant thing where you can actually have the tarrasque rampaging around the OLM destroying locations if the PCs cannot get there in time to stop it rising - more pressure on PCs to act then before the death toll counter peaks and locations are destroyed. Maybe I just like the image of the huge creature stomping over the map that the PCs had gotten to know, now with a trail of destruction in its wake...





Oh and for those wanting level 30 gameplay, maybe we should work in a mounted animation so PCs can ride their tame Tarrasque and head on to epic level adventure!

[Arkalezth]

This is personal preference, but I don't like to be rushed by a timer (as in MotB). However, the party could visit some location previously destroyed by the Tarrasque, or make a choice between two paths, the other being destroyed by it.

[Shallina]

The Tarasque could rampage the overland map, that could actually be fun, having the player stay away from it until he is ready, but rushing the player isn't good.

[Dorateen]

Shallina wrote...


Is the Tarasque the only thing ? Could  an organisation  exist to prevent you from killing the Tarasque and wich could be found accross all the game ?

Aye, this. I'm already thinking of an insane cult of halflings that actually want to release the Tarrasque. Well, maybe not halflings. But definitely a pro-tarrasque faction that will seek to impede the party.

Harumph!

[kamal_]

Given that the T is functionally immortal, there are easily factions that could view it's continued existence as important.



The T was supposedly created to kill gods. Someone could view it's existence as a check if the gods got out of hand (cough, even a good guy who views the T as a necessary evil).



The T is viewed as a living elemental force of nature (remember the T is neutral, it has no concept of good and evil because it's too stupid), so druids or other groups could want to preserve it. After all, forest fires are part of nature too, and lead to regrowth, so it would be easy to think of a druidic group that did not mind, or even encouraged, forest fires.



Spelljammer posited a homeplanet for the T's, where they're not violent at all (stop laughing, I came across this when I google searched for the T). So a bunch of civilized T's could show up in a Spelljammer ship to take the "sick" T back to it's home planet (now you can laugh).

[kamal_]

Chaos Wielder wrote...
As far as setting goes, I left this open. I'm willing to make an "executive" decision and just pick a location I want(Like, Hellfire's map looks good to me)--but, then again, Cormyr has always appealed to me. I'd like if someone with extensive D&D knowledge could make the case for a specific region and why. I really don't have the knowledge to make a claim one way or the other.

Cormyr itself is quite civilized, so the opportunity to run around exploring the random ruins and dungeons this effort would generate and whatnot is limited. They've all been explored. Turmish would be fine, especially since the map's already made.

[Shallina]

For the early level, don't be to specific, sending a lvl 1 against a Tarrasque is well, not a good thing.



You can set the begining of the Tarrasque plot at lvl 5 where the player arrive in the main hub.



And the lvl 1 - 4 would be left 100% free on how the character started adventuring (and made optional for those who don't like those lvl at all).



What about compagnion ?

[Shaughn78]

Chaos Wielder wrote...

In general, I want to follow the SOZ systems. So, here's how it follows:
[b]Resting is only allowed on the OLM and Inns. No resting in dungeons unless in unique circumstances. No time dependent rest. Again, the SOZ system for this made sense and was easy to use/understand. 

Finding and fighting for that "safe place" to rest in a dungeon is always nice touch especially for caster based parties.

I like the idea of the T wandering the world map. The player may not be able to go where hey want and have to do something different. Villages similiar to to the SOZ towns could be placed on the map. These would be non-plot areas but would allow resting and each could have a unique store. As the game goes on the T could crush these villages 1 by 1. A gui genius could keep track of the T's villages destroyed and people killed. A little replay goal to save more people. The T's wander path sould be fairly random and if it gets with a radius of the destroy villages it takes them out, likewise if the player gets too close it goes into the final battle. The T should be a unique or neutral creature on the map so it won't chase down the player or other encounter creatures.

In addition to the wish artifact, a very small amount of +5 items could be hidden or created through quest to bypass the creatures damage resistance. If we wanted to limit the +5 items we would also need to ensure they weren't in any stores or random/placed treasure and modify the crafting so the best that could be made is +4.

Back to level 1 game play. The player is given a bunch of task low level task from some small town. Once they reach the level of plot worthy their town is destroyed by the T and the main plot line starts.

[kamal_]

Shallina wrote...
For the early level, don't be to specific, sending a lvl 1 against a Tarrasque is well, not a good thing.

Sure it is. The T is hungry, and adventurers make tasty snacks, especially plate clad types that are crunchy on the outside, but soft and gooey on the inside. And really, the thing goes back to sleep after sufficient destruction, so how else do you want to get it to reach it's preset kill limit, eat innocent townsfolk?

No really, Mr. Paladin, you must go, so someone in town will be saved. It's very noble and Lawful Good and self sacrificial of you.

Modifié par kamal_, 22 février 2011 - 03:02 .

[dunniteowl]

I think, honestly, having a very tight plot specific setup for the Tarrasque is not only doable, but important. It will be the glue that holds this module effort together. That said, I also believe that the plot devices shouldn't be too heavy handed. If you read the little piece I whipped up from the first post I made, all that is written is nothing more than a huge clue. You'll need to find these items, based on rumors of someone having an artifact or item that grants them special powers. You'll have to gather them all together, then go near the Tarrasque and assemble it. (this is how you get your +5 enchantments to bypass the DR, this is how you get healing for that awful final battle, this is where you get a few extra spells and this is where you get your primary buffs or effects that prevent you from being struck with awe from the might of the creature, etc.)

It doesn't do anything more than provide a little flavor background beyond telling you there is at least one way to stop the beast. You'll also note that the fight didn't end until a character in the original story shouted, "I wish this beast would die!" Hint hint, it says, you have to bring it to -30 HPs and then use either a Full Wish or a Miracle.

This is what the Might of Turm provides when it is assembled.

That doesn't mean it should be the Only way to defeat the Tarrasque. Or that it will be easy to find the items. Note that in the story, all such rumors and stories of folks finding the device parts all died suddenly and the items disappeared.

Was it this insane Cult of Destruction responsible? Could they have the missing pieces? Are they hunting for the other missing pieces? Can you stop them? More importantly, can they stop you?

Could you choose to join them and allow the Tarrasque to ravage the lands until the level of destruction is completed and the beast just goes away and goes back to sleep?



I design story ideas with the intent that each one is a short story, complete to itself, independant of the happenings in other short stories. One day I had an epiphany about how life is like that. You have all these little short stories of what goes on in a person's life, a town's doings, the occurrences in a region, etc. and they all sort of entertwine to become a piecemeal collection of Your Story as you move through them and deal with what happens.

Sandbox play does not mean there is no story, or that there can't be a compelling plot. It only means you get to experience these Short Story events in the order in which you find them instead of experiencing them as the train slides by them in orderly fashion. So. My offer still stands, I wouldn't mind focusing on story elements and will also attempt to provide a few interiors and exterior areas (mostly for others to populate) though would make my primary focus on having the "weaver of tales" position.

You guys can hash out the rest.

dunniteowl

(by the way, I just totally whipped up that little story about the previous encounter right there as I posted it. There is no canonical basis for a Tarrasque showing up anywhere. I also did a little Turmish Lands study when Hellfire and Baron first broached it as I was going to do the Library at Aglahon Reach.)

[_Knightmare_]

Here's my various suggestions:

- I like the idea that a group of druids (or something similar) is seeking to protect the T. They are doing so simply from the point of view that is is a force of Nature and Balance (as is the forest fire mentioned before). They might be a True Neutral group, but with a couple factional/sub-group differences: one group within this druid group sees the T going around destroying civilization itself as a good thing (these guys are Neutral Evil for the most part). The other half are seeking to protect the T as the afore mentioned "last of its kind and a part of Nature" (these are Neutral Good members). Having the player face off against a "rival" good aligned group can lead to some interesting adventures. What do they do - you can't (or shouldn't) just wipe out/kill off an entire group of Good people.

- Set the campaign somewhere outside the Heartlands of Fearun. Not only are they played out, but they are also full of "super-heroes" - this avoids the "why are we doing this when people like Elminster live just down the road."

- Have the player start off as like a Henchman for the more powerful/well-known group of adventurers (those who eventually die fighting the T as others have mentioned). And I more mean "henchmen" in the old 2nd edition AD&D than the current version. Back in those days, henchies were low level "followers" of more powerful adventurers/heroes, sort of like a knight's squire. This is a good reason the player is such a low starting level.

- Don't have the T as the opening point of the story. Just have the player do a couple "squireish" (is that a word, if not here's my TM) adventures. On that terrible day the T comes to town, the player returns to find the place totally destroyed by some unknown force, which of course is the T.

I can offer some help out with scripting and I've done work in my own module with moving creatures around the OM plus worked on having locations change (both in terms of the people/NPCs there and the visual look). You will need a scripter to help keep track of variables and such that might transfer between the different submitted modules. As my new son will be born in about 8 weeks, I may have very limited time to do things, but I'll offer what help I can.

[Hellfire_RWS]

_Knightmare_ wrote...

Here's my various suggestions:

- I like the idea that a group of druids (or something similar) is seeking to protect the T. They are doing so simply from the point of view that is is a force of Nature and Balance (as is the forest fire mentioned before). They might be a True Neutral group, but with a couple factional/sub-group differences: one group within this druid group sees the T going around destroying civilization itself as a good thing (these guys are Neutral Evil for the most part). The other half are seeking to protect the T as the afore mentioned "last of its kind and a part of Nature" (these are Neutral Good members). Having the player face off against a "rival" good aligned group can lead to some interesting adventures. What do they do - you can't (or shouldn't) just wipe out/kill off an entire group of Good people.

I like this idea myself and it fits nicely with the Turmish lands druid order, the Emerald Enclave

Taken from the Vilhon reach 9520 source book
The Emerald Enclave is the most well-known organization
within the Reach. Stories of its deeds are
told to small children to both comfort and frighten
them, or they are spoken of at political gatherings and
retold at the bars and taverns. Like all tales, they become
more grandiose and bloated with each telling.
The Enclave is composed primarily of druids, but
there are bards and others of neutral bent who also serve.
The only requirement that the Enclave enforces upon its
members is that they not be inclined toward good or
evil. Theirs is a narrow road best traveled only by those
who can walk between light and darkness.


There is a large amount of information available on this area.

Modifié par Hellfire_RWS, 22 février 2011 - 03:51 .

[Quixal]

I have several thoughts.

First, for something like the Tarrasque it is unlikely that only one group would be tasked to deal with it. Not only would a given faction likely hedge their bets with more than one group but it is likely a lot of people would have a personal interest in seeing the threat ended, altered or maintained. I think you shoudl run into other groups.

Another thought is that as an alternative to having locations destroyed over time, actually work the destruction of a location into the final battle. Say you come across the Tarrasque as it is attacking a city and how you engage it has an impact on how well the location comes through the fight.

Finally, what about encountering the Tarrasque several times over the course of the story? Whatiif ye old ancient lore suggests several ways to combat it, only one of which actually works and there are several aborted attempts to defeat the creature by the party or other parties?

Edit: One day I will get used to the quirky formatting here.

Modifié par Quixal, 22 février 2011 - 03:55 .

[kamal_]

_Knightmare_ wrote...
- Set the campaign somewhere outside the Heartlands of Fearun. Not only are they played out, but they are also full of "super-heroes" - this avoids the "why are we doing this when people like Elminster live just down the road."

Because Elminster, Khelben, Drizz't etc are in on the need for the T. Isn't it obvious?!?!?!   

The T doesn't only rampage and kill good guys, it destroys everything in its path. Maybe it only comes out of sleep (or is it woken up by Elminster et al) when some great evil has arisen that only it can stop. Yeah! you've killed the T.... Wait, you killed the T!? What have you done?!?!

[kamal_]

Hellfire_RWS wrote...

_Knightmare_ wrote...

Here's my various suggestions:

- I like the idea that a group of druids (or something similar) is seeking to protect the T. They are doing so simply from the point of view that is is a force of Nature and Balance (as is the forest fire mentioned before). They might be a True Neutral group, but with a couple factional/sub-group differences: one group within this druid group sees the T going around destroying civilization itself as a good thing (these guys are Neutral Evil for the most part). The other half are seeking to protect the T as the afore mentioned "last of its kind and a part of Nature" (these are Neutral Good members). Having the player face off against a "rival" good aligned group can lead to some interesting adventures. What do they do - you can't (or shouldn't) just wipe out/kill off an entire group of Good people.

I like this idea myself and it fits nicely with the Turmish lands druid order, the Emerald Enclave

Taken from the Vilhon reach 9520 source book
The Emerald Enclave is the most well-known organization
within the Reach. Stories of its deeds are
told to small children to both comfort and frighten
them, or they are spoken of at political gatherings and
retold at the bars and taverns. Like all tales, they become
more grandiose and bloated with each telling.
The Enclave is composed primarily of druids, but
there are bards and others of neutral bent who also serve.
The only requirement that the Enclave enforces upon its
members is that they not be inclined toward good or
evil. Theirs is a narrow road best traveled only by those
who can walk between light and darkness.


There is a large amount of information available on this area.

As an added bonus, Elanee could be worked in so we could kill that anooying do-gooder.