8659 réponses à ce sujet

[Killjoy Cutter]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

oh dear lord I'm seeing some intellectual comments on why people dislike the demo, which is good and I like that, but then I see a string of comments that have nothing to add and are just "it's dumbed down for ADD people. My rogue teleports, wtf is with that, etc..."

it's not dumbed down. I'm tired of saying that and so is everyone else. Your rogue isn't teleporting. If you looked at the screen you'd see he throws a smoke bomb so he can move safely into position to backstab. Teleporting is a whole different thing, which requires a very in depth scientific discussion. Which I'm not in the mood to do.

I'm just gonna stay away from this thread. The stupid is rubbing off on me more than the intellectual is.

"Teleport" -- to instantly move from one location to another without physically passing through the intervening space.  There may be a little smoke bomb special effect, but the rogue is here one frame, and he's there the next frame.  You can pick nits and split hairs, and whatever... OK, fine, we'll call it something else if you don't like "teleport", if you're stuck on some odd quasi-technical defintion.  But whatever you call it, that is exactly what's happening.

Of course, when the rogue is already standing right where he's going to appear, it just looks silly.

[wobble55]

Archer zr0 wrote...

Kirkwall might have a interesting nightlife and be as large as a major city which would take a long time to master.

Hope you're right, but I'm a scenery junkie and like to wander around looking at many, contrasting, amazing environments.  (Stupid me!)

[ozkavo]

this is my first reply here ever...after playing the demo for like 5 or 6 times i couldnt wait to check this forum..everything i dont mention means its great...
wut i want to complain about is not much..and its not too late too fix be4 release:

1- i totally understand the new style of combat.. its great but they didnt have to remove older things..like the top view.. the party takes up 30% of the screen..maybe even more.
i didnt get y they took away the top view! maybe add an option to allow us to scroll out even more, if u dont want all people to b able to do so as soon as they get into the game..but more "tactical/strategical gamers" can use that option to view the battlefield from a more "tactical/strategical" view.

2- where did the buff - debuff - sustained ablilty... status go ? in DAO u could click on a character and on the bottom u can check wut spells are affecting him and how long will they last.. y take it away?

3-is it possible to have more combos.. i mean i nvr enjoyed playing a mage as much as in this demo...but this 5-6 attack combo gets old too fast. make some variation. and btw its great the mage can melee!

everything else is just great. only these minor changes would make a lot of people happy...especially the top view, plz dear Bioware add that..we beg u.

[DarkWulfy]

wobble55 wrote...

Graunt wrote...

Dunno if you've seen this yet, but here's the scan of the PC Gamer review.

http://imgur.com/a/cmLbm

Bottom line: choices mean something, gameplay is very satisfying and the witty banter is much more memorable than Origins. They also show the Assassination tree (the skills are NO suprise at all though).

"Dragon Age 2 is not what you expect. Hell, even during preview sessions I hadn't anticipated it being this much of a traditional sequel".

Thanks... very interesting find.

This bothers me though... "Outside of a few trips to the Deep Roads and a saunter to a Dalish camp, everything in Dragon Age 2 happens in Kirkwall."

Nice review.. I especially am relieved they said it will take 50+ hours.

[YoJoDez]

Hey Bioware (hopefully you guys are reading), as much as I love you guys (outside of Bethesda I think Bioware is Unrivaled when it comes to Rpg's) I am gonna be honest. I like the new art style, but at the same time am nostalgic for the pretty sweet armor we're missing out on. the new ones look cool but not as smooth or aestheticallypleasing. mayb theres more to see. Combat pace is frantic, makes the rogues fun and mage INSANE fun, but for some reason feels awkward w/ the warrior, maybe bcuz it takes so many slashes as you stand there. I cant complain about characters or environment bcuz its a DEMO everybody lol. lookin forward to the game guys

[Shmeaglez]

umm hello ?

[Panpsychist]

SilentK wrote...

I love how different F!Hawke feels when she has chosen more more of the sarcastic choices or more of the red fist. How it changes the little extra things she says for example when they have meet up with Aveline and her husband and they are moving out. This is great replay value for me. I might be wrong but to me it feels like I can have a hero who does good things, but she might have a different personality in different plays. This is great for me, since I very seldom do things in the game that are flat out evil. In ME I very seldom do renegade things, I guess that this is a way for me to have a different voice but still doing my usual nice thing =) love it!!

I just noticed this too.  The dialog tree of the NPCs appears to change depending upon the propotion of the kind of anwers you give.  I at first I thought Bioware was updating the demo to give better dialog responses. The changes were that good. Now I see that my personality shapes the whole world, just as Flemth said it would. For a story lover, this defines replay value.

Modifié par Panpsychist, 01 mars 2011 - 09:37 .

[Narrsan]

S'alright

[Panpsychist]

OriginalTibs wrote...

Darji wrote...

... Not only you need to time your AOE attacks  infront because everything is running so fast  but you also need to try to keep your other party members away which is almost impossible.
...

If I'm not mistaken you don't have to worry about friendly fire anymore on yout AoEs

See Darji, you don't have to worry about tactics anymore!

[TheRealJayDee]

IRMcGhee wrote...

You only get the one-hit kills and exploding darkspawn (plus turbocharged cooldowns and health regen) in the exaggerated section when it's just you and one of your siblings (Bethany also suffers from, erm, physical exaggeration there too:blink:). You did play past this part ? Some people have said they only played the first fight, so I'm wonfdering if that applies here too. The rest of the demo still has the faster attacks and flashier moves, but no over-the-top kills outside of criticals/some specials and normal cooldowns etc.

Really? Maybe we don't get one-hit-kills, but we get at least one-and-a-half-hit-kills. And the "darkspawn" exploded in either part. Which I don't like, cause these things are neither intimidating in appearance nor any kind of dangerous. Flemeth's "rescue" seemed so unnecessary, apart from the ogre there was nothing that could seriously harm Hawke and his companions. Okay, at some point they would have been overwhelmed, but just how many waves of darkspawn could have come there? Hurm, the degeneration of the 'spawn is really one of my main dislikes of what we've seen so far.

DA:O: A hurlock starts running towards my rogue archer. My rogue uses his 'pinning shot'. The hurlock takes a little damage and his movement is stopped for a little while.

DA2: A "hurlock" starts running towards my rogue archer. My rogue uses his 'pinning shot'. The "hurlock's" torso explodes into a fountain of blood.

[Panpsychist]

The Earl Of Bronze wrote...

I liked the combat in DA:O, from what I saw in the demo it felt very familiar, played as a mage throughout DA:O, and playing the demo as one didn't feel all that different, the differences I did feel felt like improvements. Don't have much experience playing as the other classes so can't really comment.

I think most people approve of the mage changes. No one here knows how to cast spells, but everyone knows what it is like to swing a sword and leap. So what a mage can get away with and appear plausible is not what a fighter or thief can get away with and appear plausible.

[derfnosdod]

ok played through the demo now with all three classes, over all very good. would like some easter eggs off of the demo though! cant wait till next week to get my hands on it.

[Tommy6860]

Parahexavoctal wrote...

IRMcGhee wrote...

Vaevictusdeus wrote...
- A new stylistic approach is all well and good, but a "sexy" Flemeth is just...stupid. It invalidates a large chunk of the Morrigan lore in Origins, and to what end? One more overly sexed video game cliche for nerds to ****** too? To hell with continuity! This game needs a hottie milf stat! Absolutely ridiculous.

She's a shapeshifter. Given she's just changed back from her dragon form, there'd be little point in her affecting the dotty old crone persona that she used when dealing with the wardens (to appear harmless ?). 

If she can take a younger form at will, then what is the point of raising daughters like Morrigan to take over their bodies when her own form becomes too old?

You have a point, if going by Morrigan's assumptions after she asked the Warden to kill Flemeth when Morrigan discovers what's in the Black Grimoire. But, if you listen to what Morrigan says at the end on the Witch Hunt about Flemeth, the Grimoire seems to no longer fit Flemeth's physical needs. Ahh, who knows!

[ArcticZombie]

The demo was terrible.  I've cancelled my pre-order and moved on.  Yep, threw away all those pre-order bonuses.  That's how much I disliked this demo.

-the graphics are pretty bad. overall they're bad, but the lighting effects in the opening cinemas stood out as particularily bad. Everything, everywhere looks hollow and half-assed.  Everything is brighter and smoother, but lacking detail.

-combat is terrible. This is where the game falls flat for me.  In DAO i loved the FFXI-like combat system, for me it was a huge reason why I played it so many times.  Now it feels like a sub-par action game.

-the enemy re-design is a digrace. It's not gritty and dirty anymore, it's a bunch of squeaky-clean Skeletors running around. Just terrible design.  It's so plastic looking.

-the presentation sucks. It looks like some cookie-cutter, mainstream menus from a throw-away fps. They lost their style here big time. Words and icons are far too small on screen, and the event ticker has been moved to the center-left of the screen (just sucks).

-Too much talking, cinemas, etc. This game leaves nothing to your role-playing imagination and simply lays out an ugly movie for you to play through. Having a voiced main-character is a big stab to the heart of this franchise as well.

Basically: It diesn't feel anything like DAO in a REALLY bad way.
It's lost its soul.  Game over.

[wakkkkkkkkkkka]

Lusitanum wrote...

wakkkkkkkkkkka wrote...

 i am rather disappointed in the fact that you can only be human..they sorta dumbed it down..you can't be as creative as you could in the previous game

Because less numbers means dumb! Just like proper character development and a PC that you can actually connect to.
   ha you misunderstood..the fact that they put less races in the made the game easier to make so they dumbed it down, not because the number decreased, but because the complexity of the game itself has decreased.  think about it





Seriously, am I the only who's sick of this cheap "you reduced the number of X, so it's dumbed down?" You'd think people who are so worried about the intelectual level of things would be the first to think of quality over quantity before anything else.

I'm not saying that cutting out the other races was a good idea, because I'll have to play the full game before passing that kind of judgment. But the same could also be said of everyone else.

OriginalTibs wrote...

Having been around Bioware as long as I have, and having played the hell out of many of their previous games I intend to explore DA2 (and ME3) completely before passing judgement.

You two sound as if you have reached your verdicts based only on what was intended as a demo: surely your concerns are no more than fears, rather than final judgements, no?

We are gamers:as gamers we can adapt, survive, and thrive. Had the game been Origins-warmed-over you would surely have complained of that instead. Ifthe developer (a developer we have come to admire, and a developer which has amply earned our admiration) has chosen to evolve after conscientious consideration and planning, then we should be willing to wait and see whether the final product, judged as a whole, actually lives up to the admiration we have afforded them.

How much greater the accomplishment for them if, having had the brass to move forward into a 'future that shapes*" before them, they can bringus along with them? Perhaps we may discover that we rather like the evolved game and its core tale, once we have overcome our reluctance to change and embraced the game in itself?

If the demo was to serve not just as a demonstration of the new IP, but also to begin to
acclimatize us to the new environment, then the inclusion of so much cutscenery is understandable. Further, it gives us more meat to ponder, more of the tale, without giving away too much of what went before, or what will follow. Our experience entering the game itself, at last, willstill be fresh.

Finally if, as I fear, your minimization of the demo is instead prompted by a fear of being called fanboi and a desire to gain notoriety because your aesthetic taste is so superior, then I lament your culture and wish you to return to an honest appreciation forthe genre.

* quoting the new interpretation of Flemeth, a line that already exhibits some of the depth we have come to associate with the works of Bioware

If I could reach out of the Internet and kiss this guy, I would.

In a totally heterossexual way, of course.

[Tommy6860]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

oh dear lord I'm seeing some intellectual comments on why people dislike the demo, which is good and I like that, but then I see a string of comments that have nothing to add and are just "it's dumbed down for ADD people. My rogue teleports, wtf is with that, etc..."

it's not dumbed down. I'm tired of saying that and so is everyone else. Your rogue isn't teleporting. If you looked at the screen you'd see he throws a smoke bomb so he can move safely into position to backstab. Teleporting is a whole different thing, which requires a very in depth scientific discussion. Which I'm not in the mood to do.

I'm just gonna stay away from this thread. The stupid is rubbing off on me more than the intellectual is.

I agree that the ad hominem descriptions some of the nay-sayers are using is a bit much, instead of real critique. But, you really are toning down how the rogue makes that kill using the smoke bomb. Seriously the whole action scene happens in a near nano-second, and looks like I am watching an animated scene from The Matrix. People just don't move like that even if it is supposed to be fantasy. It definitely was more realistic in Origins, whe the rogue would flank for backstabs or kills.

[didymos1120]

Tommy6860 wrote...

It definitely was more realistic in Origins, whe the rogue would flank for backstabs or kills.

Sure, except for the turning into a translucent smoke person...right in front of opponents who would immediately forget you ever existed until you attacked them again.

[Icy Magebane]

This demo was underwhelming, but it's not the worst game I've played... I'll just say that I agree with a lot of complaints people have made. 317 pages worth of feedback, so I'll just leave it at that. One more wall of criticism/praise won't really matter.

Oh, and the text is too damn small. That had to be said.

[Javanaut]

Graunt wrote...

Dunno if you've seen this yet, but here's the scan of the PC Gamer review.

http://imgur.com/a/cmLbm

Bottom line: choices mean something, gameplay is very satisfying and the witty banter is much more memorable than Origins. They also show the Assassination tree (the skills are NO suprise at all though).

"Dragon Age 2 is not what you expect. Hell, even during preview sessions I hadn't anticipated it being this much of a traditional sequel".

Thanks for that post, Graunt.

I had decided to pass on DA2 based on the presentation of the demo. After reading this review based on the finished product, I will try to keep an open mind about it. I'm still iffy about the combat. Action gaming should feel crisp, clean...snappy. Most importantly there needs to be a rhythm to it. I didn't get that from the demo. It was just a mish-mash of wild swinging and pretty, pretty particle effects. Reminds me of that time in college when I took shrooms on Halloween. One big colorful blur. Sure it's enough to get through one boring evening, but I certainly wouldn't consider it quality entertainment. I am also somewhat relieved that the RPG elements are more robust than I previously thought; if the review from that scan can be trusted. 

In the future, I hope that Bioware learns the importance of first impressions. Especially with the gaming market as flooded as it is. Anticipated titles, like Portal 2, Deus Ex, and L.A. Noire (just to name a few) are coming out right around the corner. As I am a quality over quantity type of consumer, I tend to be extremely choosey about the games I buy.  I will just have to wait and see at this point.

Thanks again! 

Modifié par Javanaut, 01 mars 2011 - 11:27 .

[Tommy6860]

didymos1120 wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

It definitely was more realistic in Origins, whe the rogue would flank for backstabs or kills.

Sure, except for the turning into a translucent smoke person...right in front of opponents who would immediately forget you ever existed until you attacked them again.

You do realize that was supposed to be that way and you still didn't perform (what seems as) teleporting right behind the enemy for the kill. Aside from that, when you used that ability, you were slowed down as well in Origins, so using that talent was really only good in a melee. If the enemy were to move when activating that talent, it was much more difficult to use, so timing was of the essence. In DA2, you don't need to wrory about timing, or where the enemy is. Just click on the enemy, throw the bomb, appear instantly behind the enemy for a backstab kill. Why am I not using my own tactics when I want to make the kill on my own after dispensing the bomb? Why cannot I just have to move myself to the enemy after throwing the bomb? I am not brainless, I can figure out how to make the kill after hitting the enemy with a smoke bomb, it doesn't have to be automatic.

Modifié par Tommy6860, 01 mars 2011 - 11:36 .

[Brin08]

I like the way Hawke runs. It looks a lot better than the little trot that they do in the first game. And the mages can finally wack enemies with their staffs! This will be a truly glorious game, indeed.

Just one more week to go.....

[wakkkkkkkkkkka]

hotapplepie wrote...



I respectfully disagree. When choosing from an available set of "speech options" which will not be voiced, I can place my own weight, importance, tone and inflection on those words as these variables are not predetermined for my by the voice actors or voice directors interpretation of what it "should" mean. Moreover, I choose exactly what I say and again the importance placed on those words (with imagination). 

I am only presented with no racial choice for my character. The choice of race is significant and should not be downplayed because how each race is treated/viewed by 3rd parties in the game is very different which would cause greatly diferentiated playthroughs. However, this is treading old ground.

i agree with you on all of what you said...choosing the race is extremely important and i haven't a clue as to why they didn't include it in the game, that being said i dont know if they will include it in the final product

[wakkkkkkkkkkka]

Brin08 wrote...

I like the way Hawke runs. It looks a lot better than the little trot that they do in the first game. And the mages can finally wack enemies with their staffs! This will be a truly glorious game, indeed.

Just one more week to go.....

they aren't wacking them with their staves..they are swinging them and hitting them with fire or whatever element your staff has.  you have to look closely to see this

[nick05son]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Graunt wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Graunt wrote...

OmegaBlue0231 wrote...

See all this people talk about the combat I feel my need to weigh in.

DA:O had crappy combat unless you were an archer or a mage, DA2 is actually playable for other character builds.

No, it had crappy combat in general regardless of class.  Archers were especially awful in Origins though, and the best thing about Mages were that they could end the combat quicker both through damage and because they didn't have to run from mob to mob with 10 second intervals in between.  Then again, neither did any of the melee if you used that magical thing called line of sight.

I liked combat in DA:O, it didn't feel video-gamey or cinematic.  People couldn't leap across the battlefield from opponent to opponent, they actually had to run if there was distance. 

A game doesn't have to have lifeless and plodding gameplay for it to not feel arcade like.  The combat in Origins was completely outdated and was the exact same recycled formula Bioware had been using ever since Baldur's Gate and every single subsquent "traditional" RPG they released.

Get this though: the combat is EXACTLY THE SAME in DA2, only faster and melee have quicker approach options.

First, I didn't find the combat in DA:O to be plodding or lifeless.  To me, it felt right.  It didn't feel like a cartoon.

Second, wow, really, your going to pull that one?  "Get this through", right, sure, whatever chief.  And it's really not the same.  Those "approach options" are part of what makes it look and feel so cartoony, so much like a Sam Raimi cheesefest.  Rushing charges at the speed of "kewl", giant impossible backflips, teleporting backstabs... I can't take it seriously, I just keep laughing every time there's combat.  And then there's the new whirlygig animations on the mages. twirling staves like batton-twirling cheerleaders.  In DA:O, the staff as a weapon was like a gun, and the mages used them like guns, not like props in a bad movie.

couldn't have said it any better myslef killjoy

[JoshPloof]

Tommy6860 wrote...

didymos1120 wrote...

Tommy6860 wrote...

It definitely was more realistic in Origins, whe the rogue would flank for backstabs or kills.

Sure, except for the turning into a translucent smoke person...right in front of opponents who would immediately forget you ever existed until you attacked them again.

You do realize that was supposed to be that way and you still didn't perform (what seems as) teleporting right behind the enemy for the kill. Aside from that, when you used that ability, you were slowed down as well in Origins, so using that talent was really only good in a melee. If the enemy were to move when activating that talent, it was much more difficult to use, so timing was of the essence. In DA2, you don't need to wrory about timing, or where the enemy is. Just click on the enemy, throw the bomb, appear instantly behind the enemy for a backstab kill. Why am I not using my own tactics when I want to make the kill on my own after dispensing the bomb? Why cannot I just have to move myself to the enemy after throwing the bomb? I am not brainless, I can figure out how to make the kill after hitting the enemy with a smoke bomb, it doesn't have to be automatic.

Because A.) The battles are suppossed to be a lot more hectic in this game and seem more urgent, so if you just shrouded yourself in smoke and then ran to the back of your opponent and killed him yourself it would take a lot of time and the battles are suppossed to be fast paced. And B.) It looks a hell of a lot cooler.