8659 réponses à ce sujet

[Alexus_VG]

Graunt wrote...

He says absolutely nothing about the gameplay, only to compare it to Mass Effect.  Yet the only viable comparison is in the dialogue change. That has nothing to do with combat, and while the demo may end up being "drastically" different than the gold version, it felt absolutely nothing at all like the changes between Mass Effect and Mass Effect 2.  It didn't actually feel anything at all like Mass Effect other than again, it's faster.

Some of you just seem like traditionalist dinosaurs who insist that if something isn't using the exact same recycled formula down to every last tee,  it's not a "true" INSERT_FAVORITE_GENRE/SERIES.  Bioware combat has been pretty awful ever since the BG games, but they were acceptable for the time.  The problem is, they kept using the same pace and technically the same mechanics for every "traditional" RPG since then.  I'm sick to death of this turned based, but not, real time strategy, but not gameplay that's not fun to sit through for 40+ hours.  What we end up with is the same gameplay that's been around, yet at a much faster speed; but of course it's awful because it's not slower than growing grass.

The dialog changes thought they are one of my bigest issues with the sequel are not the only viable comparison to ME. The overall feel of the story progression is a lot more rushed and imperosnal. Taking the role of a predetermined individual with a lot of the backstory already fact is also a direct link to ME. The approach to the story seems too cinematic for a start, much like it was in ME. I know a lot of people like this but after all that's why there are two separate franchises. The artstyle also resembles the aformentioned series which the exeption of(thankfully) the ME body models which I personaly found revolting.

Much as I can get over most of my discomfort with the new combat changes, if the demo is any indication I don't think Im going to be happy with the new direction of the RP element as a whole. I do believe I noticed a few others commenting on the imersion failure as well so Im not alone in that complaint. I know this is just a demo and can't hold the same appeal as the overall game but none the less it is very lacking.

Keep in mind mate and Im not trying to start an argument here that thought you are within you right to feel fed up with some of the more classical elements of RPGs some of us are just as much in our right to like them. And as DA:O was more along those lines we are obviously disappointed that the sequel isn't.

[Wivvix]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

You know what shows the tone and intention of the reply even better?

SEEING WHAT YOUR CHARACTER IS ACTUALLY GOING TO SAY, NOT AN OFTEN INACCURATE HINT / PARAPHRASE.

Yes but sentences take longer to read and interpret. Bioware can't have their audience reading and interpreting entire sentences or paragraphs of text. Why, they might actually have to think about what is being said! Oh no, much better to create a perverse mockery of morality and have actions defined to make an ally a "friend" or "rival", or worse still make a seemingly pointless joke, than to broach the vast grey chasm of subjective morality.

Modifié par Wivvix, 03 mars 2011 - 06:02 .

[lukecage5]

The demo was good. I have one (1) question for the developers.  When the actual game comes out, will we be able to disable "click to move"?  Don't like click to move.

[XMasterchefX]

Its complete garbage :l everything sucks about it.

[Boopie-Ne]

I don't know if this has been brought up, but after playing the demo on all platforms, I noticed the PS3 version's audio was off in places with echos, such as Varric's interrogation in the beginning and the Chantry area. You can distinctly hear the audio being "cut off" in between spoken dialogue tracks. I went to check the PC and Xbox 360 versions and they had no problems with the audio.

[Toadbat]

So, I also really loved the demo. It was well put together, and had enough content to get a good feel for the game.

The only things that were a little off for me were in the interface (main screen, character sheet, journal, etc.) where selection and clicking on areas didn't perform as expected. For example, clicking on one of the party's portraits didn't bring up the character sheet, or in tactics moving the mouse over the options didn't highlight the options in the list unless I found a very small and specific place on the list.

Again, I really loved the demo, and am looking forward to the game, just wanted to provide some, hopefully helpful, feedback.

-Toadbat

PS: I am using the PC version.

Modifié par Toadbat, 03 mars 2011 - 06:22 .

[blargh13]

Positive:
I greatly enjoyed the combat on console, I felt it moved quickly and kept me engaged.

Negative:
~The immersion and realism are gone. The character models are either walking breasts or jay leno caricature. (MASSIVE CHINS > )
~Additionally, the character introductions feel rushed. While fast pacing isn't undesirable, the draw of the original ~DAO was the sense of character interaction. I didn't feel any connection to the characters.
~The facial textures seem cartoonish. Not only does this style choice greatly reduces the immersion affect -- it clashes with the higher level of detail on NPCs (particularly when juxtaposed with Flemeth, who looks like a decrepit badass).

Mixed feelings regarding the new conversation system. It is simpler to select and interpret, however, the sense of immersion is once again diminished.

Edit : Rewording

Modifié par blargh13, 03 mars 2011 - 06:31 .

[luckyny7]

Yes I am buying the game to watch Isabella (pirate/rogue) throught the game. The rest of the game is just a little gravy on top :-)

[Biohazard89]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

You know what shows the tone and intention of the reply even better?

SEEING WHAT YOUR CHARACTER IS ACTUALLY GOING TO SAY, NOT AN OFTEN INACCURATE HINT / PARAPHRASE.

My mistake. You are absolutely right.

Now, was I sarcastic or sincere?
Can't tell, can ya.

Modifié par Biohazard89, 03 mars 2011 - 06:46 .

[Silvermaul]

"So, I also really loved the demo. "

You and who else lol?

"Its complete garbage :l everything sucks about it."

This.

[Notker_Biloba]

Notker_Biloba wrote...

Graunt wrote...

There seems to be a problem with the "hold position" v. "move freely" modes. Or maybe there was a setting I didn't see? In DA:O the "hold position" meant "don't do anything unless I specifically tell you",
which does not seem to be the case in DA2. In DA:O I almost never allowed my minions to roam freely or think for themselves, because they would use their Talents unintelligently. I would always toggle on the "hold position" mode and either issue individual commands or select the entire party to attack an individual baddie. Sometimes I would toggle
to "move freely" in times of peace, usually to allow them to follow me from point A to point B, because if I left them at point A, the system seemed to bog down as I put more and more distance between myself and them.

Hold does not prevent your allies from using abilities, it simply makes them "hold position".  They will use ranged attacks and spells/skills if they were setup to use them anyway in the tactics. That being said, I encountered numerous issues with my allies moving after releasing them from the hold position.  Sometimes when I never even told them to stop, they would simply not do anything unless I manually took control of them.

I'm not catching the point of the bold text.  Are you saying that DA:O doesn't work like I descibed?  Because it does, on the PC anyway.  The point of my question was to find out if there was a way to make it work that way in DA2, or if I'm hosed into switching in to "move freely" mode, which blows.

Hello?  BW?  Haven't seen a response from you guys on this thread in seven days. 

[Kastagir]

Icy Magebane wrote...

Yup, dual wield is for rogues only.

Again, Bioware "evolves" their game by taking away choices, limiting options.

A certain other game will be the first in the series to offer dual-wielding.  You can judge which signifies progress and which reduces the game experience to something similar to watching a movie play out.

All of this is for naught of course when you consider Bioware's recent record of support for the DA franchise.  Next week will mark the one year anniversary of Awakening's release and that expansion is still broken - unplayable for many - with no hope for further patches.  Even without its obvious flaws, for many people DA2 won't merit a purchase with a record like that.

DA:O was unique among computer RPGs in its mechanics and atmoshphere and its seemingly limitless potential was squandered and abandoned by the developers for a quick revenue-centered sequel.  This will in all likelyhood mark the end of Bioware as a top-tier game developer.  Some would argue that this happened long ago, but games like ME have kept them afloat and DA:O gave hopes of a resurrection of CRPGs of old, but those hopes are now dashed.

[Kastagir]

Notker_Biloba wrote...

Notker_Biloba wrote...

Graunt wrote...

There seems to be a problem with the "hold position" v. "move freely" modes. Or maybe there was a setting I didn't see? In DA:O the "hold position" meant "don't do anything unless I specifically tell you",
which does not seem to be the case in DA2. In DA:O I almost never allowed my minions to roam freely or think for themselves, because they would use their Talents unintelligently. I would always toggle on the "hold position" mode and either issue individual commands or select the entire party to attack an individual baddie. Sometimes I would toggle
to "move freely" in times of peace, usually to allow them to follow me from point A to point B, because if I left them at point A, the system seemed to bog down as I put more and more distance between myself and them.

Hold does not prevent your allies from using abilities, it simply makes them "hold position".  They will use ranged attacks and spells/skills if they were setup to use them anyway in the tactics. That being said, I encountered numerous issues with my allies moving after releasing them from the hold position.  Sometimes when I never even told them to stop, they would simply not do anything unless I manually took control of them.

I'm not catching the point of the bold text.  Are you saying that DA:O doesn't work like I descibed?  Because it does, on the PC anyway.  The point of my question was to find out if there was a way to make it work that way in DA2, or if I'm hosed into switching in to "move freely" mode, which blows.

Hello?  BW?  Haven't seen a response from you guys on this thread in seven days. 

Bioware doesn't seem to be responding to opinions of the demo, only to technical questions and improper conduct.  Releasing a demo a mere four weeks before releasing the game doesn't allow for a great deal of action to be taken in response to feedback, especially when the demo represents a months-old build of the game.  In all likelyhood, the game was released to manufacturing within a week of the demo being released.  It takes this long just to manufacture enough units to meet release date demands.

Also, Bioware hasn't commented on the broken status of DA:O in nine months.  I wouldn't expect them to comment on negative opinions, even after release.  It seems to be their new modus operandi.

[shelledfade]

So... I played the demo. The graphics are bad even in Dx11. Here are some real graphics, just sayin ...
www.youtube.com/watch
I mean, if you wanted the graphics to look good why didn't you use the new frostbite 2 engine? You are in EA and

DICE said they are more than willing to let anyone use their new engine in EA. So... The F*** biofail? The F*** ...

The graphics in this game... yeah... outdated. Honestly I'm not going to lie, they look horrible.

Disappointed by the dialogue wheel. I want to pick what I feel represents what
I want to say. I don't need happy faces or angry faces, when I saw that I felt like this game was made for 6 year olds. I felt like I was playing a little kids game.

The combat in my opinion was actually better. I liked the more fast passed feel to it even while using the
pause system to get more tactical it felt better.

The linearity is still in full force. Don't understand that. Why not open the game up a bit? Why
does the player need walls blocking them on each side like they are running
down a tube with no other free movement choices ? I would have liked at
least SOME explorablity in this dragon age but now that I see its out
this is just another great story on rails. I expected more.

and yes, i DID play it in dx11, either that or it lied considering i saw almost no difference between dx11 or dx9 mode.

I've seen screenshots of dx11 anyway, the visuals blow.

Modifié par shelledfade, 03 mars 2011 - 07:08 .

[JoePilot]

shelledfade wrote...
and yes, i DID play it in dx11, either that or it lied considering i saw almost no difference between dx11 or dx9 mode.

I've seen screenshots of dx11 anyway, the visuals blow.

Just an FYI, it's my understanding that DX11 is disabled in the demo, even if the menu option shows it to be active.  Still looks like crap in my opinion, but I don't want people thinking that they are seeing DX11 in action if they're really not.

DX11 or not, I still can't stand the art direction.

[Notker_Biloba]

Kastagir wrote...

Notker_Biloba wrote...

Notker_Biloba wrote...

Graunt wrote...

There seems to be a problem with the "hold position" v. "move freely" modes. Or maybe there was a setting I didn't see? In DA:O the "hold position" meant "don't do anything unless I specifically tell you",
which does not seem to be the case in DA2. In DA:O I almost never allowed my minions to roam freely or think for themselves, because they would use their Talents unintelligently. I would always toggle on the "hold position" mode and either issue individual commands or select the entire party to attack an individual baddie. Sometimes I would toggle
to "move freely" in times of peace, usually to allow them to follow me from point A to point B, because if I left them at point A, the system seemed to bog down as I put more and more distance between myself and them.

Hold does not prevent your allies from using abilities, it simply makes them "hold position".  They will use ranged attacks and spells/skills if they were setup to use them anyway in the tactics. That being said, I encountered numerous issues with my allies moving after releasing them from the hold position.  Sometimes when I never even told them to stop, they would simply not do anything unless I manually took control of them.

I'm not catching the point of the bold text.  Are you saying that DA:O doesn't work like I descibed?  Because it does, on the PC anyway.  The point of my question was to find out if there was a way to make it work that way in DA2, or if I'm hosed into switching in to "move freely" mode, which blows.

Hello?  BW?  Haven't seen a response from you guys on this thread in seven days. 

Bioware doesn't seem to be responding to opinions of the demo, only to technical questions and improper conduct.  Releasing a demo a mere four weeks before releasing the game doesn't allow for a great deal of action to be taken in response to feedback, especially when the demo represents a months-old build of the game.  In all likelyhood, the game was released to manufacturing within a week of the demo being released.  It takes this long just to manufacture enough units to meet release date demands.

Also, Bioware hasn't commented on the broken status of DA:O in nine months.  I wouldn't expect them to comment on negative opinions, even after release.  It seems to be their new modus operandi.

It's intended to be a technical question; not sure how it's being misconstrued by BW.  Are you saying that the behavior of my minions in DA:O vis-a-vis the "hold position" is an example of DA:O's brokenness?  Because that was the only way for me to get them to do exactly what I wanted them to do.  If this features goes away and is not selectable in DA2, then it's going to severely hamper my tactical combat.

Maybe I could get BW to comment on this?  If I were to mention the ridiculously large-breasted female characters and the apparent increased hyper-sexualization of women in the current offerring, would my technical question then be able to receive some attention?

[Nefarious13]

JoePilot wrote...

Volleyjeff wrote...

I am with Alexus on this. I don't see what Bioware had to gain by releasing this demo so close to official release. For several months, Dragon Age 2 was my "must buy" purchase for this spring. But now that I've played the demo and experienced strong dissatisfaction with the new arcade-style combat, I feel like I've taken a step back and am now, at best about 50/50 on whether to get the game. I will wait until after release to see what the community's feedback is. If some adjustment hasn't been made to combat, I will probably go in a different direction

Which is a real shame, because Origins was one of the best games I had played in years and I absolutely LOVE the world in which it takes place.

Elementary, my dear Watson:

The changes to gameplay are meant to attract and appeal to the "more action!" gamer.  This demo is to show how drastically different this new game is from DA:O, and in so doing accumulate sales from gamers who otherwise would never think of buying a "fantasy" RPG. 

To wit:

Chet: "Duuude, have you checked out the DA2 demo, brah?"

JR: "Weaksauce man, goblins and dwarves and stuff are for nerds."

Chet: "No way, brosinski, you gotta check this out - you swing a ****in' sword as long as your body and skeletors blow up in clouds of blood!!  Plus, the chicks have HUGE knockers man, like double Fs! "

JR: "Awesome! I love big-ass swords and big-ass boobies!"

Chet: "You know it, bro."


It's simple really.  Bioware is selling over-the-top, mindless bloody violence with little to no challange and oversexualized women to the lowest common denominator.
Period.
The.
End.

Awesome post. Sums it up ol' chap!

Modifié par Nefarious13, 03 mars 2011 - 07:52 .

[Kastagir]

I hope Bioware does answer your question about the AI behavior of party members. But don't be deceived - if the demo is any indication, Bioware has no interest in retaining the tactical elements of DA:O's combat for the sequel.

[LongDarkBlues]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...
You know what shows the tone and intention of the reply even better?
SEEING WHAT YOUR CHARACTER IS ACTUALLY GOING TO SAY, NOT AN OFTEN INACCURATE HINT / PARAPHRASE.

Which reduces your character's part of the conversation to brief sentences, and then speaking aloud what you've already read - hard to imagine anything more boring, dialog-wise. I can see the arguments for not voicing the protagonist (though I certainly prefer it) but the arguments against the dialog wheel are so ungrounded.

[Face of Evil]

I finally finished a playthrough of the demo last night. My thoughts are mostly positive: the graphics look good, the voice acting is excellent (and here I was a bit worried about Bann Vaughan's VA as the lead!) and the combat is pretty exciting. I adjusted to the new dialogue system pretty quickly, and Hawke's responses generally reflected what I wanted to say in a given situation.

I found I enjoyed the game better as a warrior than I did as a rogue, which was my main class in DAO. For whatever reason, I couldn't get a handle on the style of combat. I appreciate the new ninja-style of play, but I didn't feel like Rogue Hawke was contributing much to the group.

I notice that some people argue that the game has lost its tactical feel. I don't really feel that's the case; I was far more effective when using strategy and thinking about the best use of my combat talents than when I was simply running up and smacking the nearest hurlock. It requires you to carefully consider when to heal and when to gulp down potions.

The demo probably doesn't help but encourage the "DA has lost tactics" style of thinking because your characters are so low-level and have limited options for attacking.

The one thing I'll have to get used to is constantly hitting the A button to attack. I used to do that in Origins anyway, but now I have to actually THINK about doing it.

Modifié par Face of Evil, 03 mars 2011 - 08:22 .

[TEWR]

Tommy6860 wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

oh dear lord I'm seeing some intellectual comments on why people dislike the demo, which is good and I like that, but then I see a string of comments that have nothing to add and are just "it's dumbed down for ADD people. My rogue teleports, wtf is with that, etc..."

it's not dumbed down. I'm tired of saying that and so is everyone else. Your rogue isn't teleporting. If you looked at the screen you'd see he throws a smoke bomb so he can move safely into position to backstab. Teleporting is a whole different thing, which requires a very in depth scientific discussion. Which I'm not in the mood to do.

I'm just gonna stay away from this thread. The stupid is rubbing off on me more than the intellectual is.

I agree that the ad hominem descriptions some of the nay-sayers are using is a bit much, instead of real critique. But, you really are toning down how the rogue makes that kill using the smoke bomb. Seriously the whole action scene happens in a near nano-second, and looks like I am watching an animated scene from The Matrix. People just don't move like that even if it is supposed to be fantasy. It definitely was more realistic in Origins, whe the rogue would flank for backstabs or kills.

bah I couldn't stay away from this thread. sometimes the ad hominem gives good lulz. I'll admit it may be a TAD over the top, but it isn't teleporting. Maybe if the smoke bomb covered up the entire enemy in a circular type thingy it would be better. But then we'd have people who have a problem with that. sometimes I think half of these nay-sayers are really just saying what they "hate" so they can troll.

[TEWR]

Fandango9641 wrote...

This thread explicitly asks for demo feedback - your opinions regarding the more legitimate contributions of others are off topic and of little consequence. Why not create your own thread if you want to deconstruct the views of others instead of derailing this one?

yea I'm not the only person who's derailed it. It's been derailed like 50 times by different people. Thanks for singling me out there

[Chewu]

Friendly fire from auto attacks (2h warrior in this case) is realistic indeed but it forces you to have no other melees in party and it disables you from saving other party members (I accidentally 1hitted Bethany with scythe while I was trying to kill a bandit that was killing her >>). Also scythe somehow does a lot more damage to party then to others.

[Killjoy Cutter]

LongDarkBlues wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...
You know what shows the tone and intention of the reply even better?
SEEING WHAT YOUR CHARACTER IS ACTUALLY GOING TO SAY, NOT AN OFTEN INACCURATE HINT / PARAPHRASE.

Which reduces your character's part of the conversation to brief sentences, and then speaking aloud what you've already read - hard to imagine anything more boring, dialog-wise. I can see the arguments for not voicing the protagonist (though I certainly prefer it) but the arguments against the dialog wheel are so ungrounded.

Then at least make absolutely 100% sure with no mistakes that the paraphrase accurately indicates what is about to be said by the protagonist.   No implying or hinting at what might be said, and no interpretation to be needed, nothing of the sort.

No "Bob won't ever hear about this" becoming "Your threats end here!"

No "I want you Thane" while he's talking about his dead wife and estranged son, turning into "I'll always be there for you." 

Sheesh.

[Feanor_II]

Finally I've completed it, this is what I least like about it:
- Definitelly I miss de isometric camera, I've read that it won´t appear in the game as we knew it in the first game, I think it is a BIG mistake.
- I don't like the Mass Effectization of the game, I miss the variety of dialogue options.
- I miss the Origins stories, but well this might be the least important thing.

I liked the combat system, I only hope that the different decisions to take in the game aren't simplified.

I must recognize that I had very low expectations about it, but except the first 3 issues I liked it, but I insist, I hope that the decisions and their consecuences are still present like in the first game.