8659 réponses à ce sujet

[ransompendragon]

Rhobert wrote...

Sigh....

Count me as another of the disappointed.

I'm another of the older (40) crowd, who plays on PC (well, Mac on Bootcamp).

I was very eagerly awaiting this, having immensely enjoyed DA:O, and its sequel, on multiple play-throughs.  And, as seems to be the other norm here, I've played BG1, BG2, Icewind Dale, NMN1, NWN2.  Most of them, many times.  My other recent favorite is The Witcher.

I've pre-ordered the "special edition", or whatever it's called, based on my absolute love of the original Dragon Age. And I won't cancel that order either.  The money's not that big a deal (another advantage of being an older gamer), but mostly I'm hoping that the demo is not representative of the final product.

I'm trying to be constructive, and think of positive things to say, as I know people have put a lot of hard work and many hours into this.   Unfortunately I can't think of much that I would call an improvement.  

But, as seems to be the case with PC'ers here, and especially the older ones, I just can't buy into the new combat animations.  Too much suspension of disbelief required.  I just feel like I'm playing an arcade game.  I hate to use these words as I know they're probably insulting to a game designer, but it seems "cartoonish" and "juvenile".  Too much jumping around at super-human speed, too much Darkspawn exploding into ridiculous pools of blood-colored jello after barely being touched, and too much swinging ludicrously over-sized weapons at light-speed like they weighed nothing.

I also fear this will take away  any sense of achievement through levelling up.  If your character is this inhuman from the start, then what sense of satisfaction will I get from further advancement?

Yes, yes, I understand it's just a demo.  But is this aspect of the game really going to be significantly different in the final product?

I guess it's just that the original was such a breath of fresh air, and now we're back to pretty much everything else on the market.

Perhaps there's a dichotomy at play here, based on age and platform base.  I understand market decisions and all, but just to let you know, there is a somewhat smaller base of fans who are admittedly older and a smaller proportion of the market, but would be willing to pay 2-3x the cost for something truly special.

I'm going to be awaiting my delivery on March 8th, and truly hoping that some fantastic things have changed between the demo and now, but I am very disappointed with what I've seen so far.

I'm hoping that the story  and characters will carry the game.  But at this point the combat will be a detractor, rather than additive part.

Well said, sir. I agree completely and would love to see the demographic breakdown - how much of positive/negative  is driven by age and platform?

And yes I would pay more for something truly special (with all the DLC included from the get go).

Edit - LOL, excellent - two of us needed to quote you!

Modifié par ransompendragon, 05 mars 2011 - 05:35 .

[Sidney]

Rhobert wrote...


I also fear this will take away  any sense of achievement through levelling up.  If your character is this inhuman from the start, then what sense of satisfaction will I get from further advancement?

Perhaps there's a dichotomy at play here, based on age and platform base. 

Inhuman? Other than the bullmuffin version to jump start you into the game after that it felt like a large chore to dust off the generic hurlocks. How many sword blows can these clowns take - oh and BTW for the realism crwod where are you on the number of sword blows to the head everyone in these games shurgs off? Once the game shifts to reality I didin't feel godlike at all.

It might be age but unless by that you mean you've developed a case of "Get off my lawn-itis" I'm not sure what it'd be - I'm the same guy you are in terms of age and game history. It is the same game for sure. I mean they can hide it under flashy moves but under the hood I'm still pulling up the recticle, assigning attacks, setting up tactcis and what not.  While the menu look different you can see all the old skills and talents lurking under the hood. Dead things still sparkle to my chagrin and you are still yanking pitiful useless crap off of dead things in that oh so heroic way all the great ones in literature and myth do.

[Dawnielle]

Volleyjeff wrote...

Rhobert wrote...

Sigh....

Count me as another of the disappointed.

I'm another of the older (40) crowd, who plays on PC (well, Mac on Bootcamp).

I was very eagerly awaiting this, having immensely enjoyed DA:O, and its sequel, on multiple play-throughs.  And, as seems to be the other norm here, I've played BG1, BG2, Icewind Dale, NMN1, NWN2.  Most of them, many times.  My other recent favorite is The Witcher.

I've pre-ordered the "special edition", or whatever it's called, based on my absolute love of the original Dragon Age. And I won't cancel that order either.  The money's not that big a deal (another advantage of being an older gamer), but mostly I'm hoping that the demo is not representative of the final product.

I'm trying to be constructive, and think of positive things to say, as I know people have put a lot of hard work and many hours into this.   Unfortunately I can't think of much that I would call an improvement.  

But, as seems to be the case with PC'ers here, and especially the older ones, I just can't buy into the new combat animations.  Too much suspension of disbelief required.  I just feel like I'm playing an arcade game.  I hate to use these words as I know they're probably insulting to a game designer, but it seems "cartoonish" and "juvenile".  Too much jumping around at super-human speed, too much Darkspawn exploding into ridiculous pools of blood-colored jello after barely being touched, and too much swinging ludicrously over-sized weapons at light-speed like they weighed nothing.

I also fear this will take away  any sense of achievement through levelling up.  If your character is this inhuman from the start, then what sense of satisfaction will I get from further advancement?

Yes, yes, I understand it's just a demo.  But is this aspect of the game really going to be significantly different in the final product?

I guess it's just that the original was such a breath of fresh air, and now we're back to pretty much everything else on the market.

Perhaps there's a dichotomy at play here, based on age and platform base.  I understand market decisions and all, but just to let you know, there is a somewhat smaller base of fans who are admittedly older and a smaller proportion of the market, but would be willing to pay 2-3x the cost for something truly special.

I'm going to be awaiting my delivery on March 8th, and truly hoping that some fantastic things have changed between the demo and now, but I am very disappointed with what I've seen so far.

I'm hoping that the story  and characters will carry the game.  But at this point the combat will be a detractor, rather than additive part.

Agreed 100% and one of the best responses I've seen out there.  I'm in your camp, Rhobert, and there are many more like us as well that I with Bioware would listen to.

Thats what I meant to say. LOL.

[Graunt]

ransompendragon wrote...
Well said, sir. I agree completely and would love to see the demographic breakdown - how much of positive/negative  is driven by age and platform?

He isn't that much older than I am, and about the only thing I agree with is that a handful of the animations are over the top and that the exploding bodies were completely unnecessary.  I definitely do not believe that Orgins was a "breath of fresh air".  Replace "fresh" with "stale" and then I'd agree.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 mars 2011 - 05:55 .

[ransompendragon]

@Graunt I am hopeful the story in DA2 will make it for me. The combat is laughable as in it makes me laugh and then is incredibly stupid. I can see why you would say DAO is/was stale but it is the first new third person perspective party based game I was interested in in a long time. Maybe I am the type that just wants the same game over and over, I don't know. But tpp party based RPG is hands down my favorite kind of game to play.

One thing Origins did do was get me to play a dwarf (never had), and a rogue (super rare) for two full play throughs. And I tried out all the origin stories (although they were really lacking compared to dwarf and human nobles). Anyway, pretty good accomplishment for a "traditional" style RPG where I usually play the same warrior/paladin every time. (I play jack of all trades in Oblivion but that isn't really a comparable game anyway).

But I don't run around to forums for FPS games and say they need to be like RPGs, why should my RPG be "action" or "arcade" or what not?

@Sidney, it is hard to not succumb to "get off my lawn itis" but I do think playing games and hanging out in forums helps give me some perspective. Not that I always like what I see.

[Graunt]

ransompendragon wrote...
But I don't run around to forums for FPS games and say they need to be like RPGs, why should my RPG be "action" or "arcade" or what not?

And who says that RPGs need to "be like" anything specific when it comes to the actual combat or anything else?  That isn't what defines the RPG genre at all.  Just because people are used to a specific gameplay style because that's all they've ever seen or acclimated to doesn't mean it's the only way to do something, or that it's even the best approach.  

Pretty much all RPGs have a few things in common -- which is how you define a genre in the first place -- but there's no "requirement" for how a story is told, or whether or not it's solo or group based or the combat and perspective.  To claim otherwise is laughable when you have games like Might and Magic and Wizardry, which play absolutely nothing like the isometric games and have more in common with a game like Doom, yet were the progenitors of the modern cRPG.  Before that it was mostly just text based.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 mars 2011 - 07:50 .

[Arppis]

Grkljan wrote...

When I see my characters jumping around on the battlefield, swinging swords unnaturally (ESPECIALLY two handed ones) I just have to hate it, because I've always considered Dragon Age a game which is so great because of it's reality, because it makes you think it is really possible, because it looks like an alternate reality. But now, with the removal of some, maybe not essential, but depth-adding features, I feel like im playing a game that is too obviously trying to look badass, and it is, but just doesnt have the artistic value that the predecessor had.

Two handers were always unrealisticaly big in Dragon Age games. I wished they would have toned the size down a bit in the sequel. Plus in the first game, you couldn't hit targets around you, even when you swung the blade trough them. I like the fact that two handers actualy have a edge on this game like that. Makes them stand out a bit more.

[Marhkus]

PC/ STEAM

I really liked ((Like)) it. Been going through it once a day, played all classes and trying to listen to all wheel responses ((Male & Female)). I hope you won't mind but when I play I'll make Hawke look a bit younger. He looks like he should of left the farm years ago. I'm hoping I can modify is appearance as the years go by though, the beard must be present at the end but not at the beginning.

The +
>> Fast pace fighting
>> Art style ((Of the armors specially)) Some of the DA:O armors were horrendous.
>> Answer wheel & voice acting
>> ::SPOILER::Ashebelanor/ Flemeth ((Is it wrong that i think she's hot?))
>> The fighting animations: Lets be honest, the fighting animations in the first were pretty basic and if you were a sword and shield warrior, they were down right boring. In DA2, they look good!

The -
>> Based on a full review I read, the game is shorter. I know, it's not based on my own experience but that annoys me.
>> Some skill/class trees were locked and I couldn't see what or where they would lead.
>> The Lothering landscape was a bit barren, I hope parts of Kirkwall are a bit more detailed and alive.
>> From the demo, you get a strong impression that Isabella is perhaps THE love interest of Hawke, I'm hoping it isn't the case. She's nice and all but a man of Hawke's stature can't be seen with a Sea Trollup ((lol)). Need me noble born! With a rich father if possible...

Anyways, overall, great demo. Can't wait to play.

[hagendas76]

Okay Demo....

Played for roughly 20 minutes this morning as Rogue Female got to Ogre got assed kick and decided to wait for full version to come out.

1. Text size even on 50 inch is small.

2. Alot has been said about better background environments graphically....... hmmm looking at the brown wasteland with no features I'm not sure how true this is? But only played for 20 minutes so we'll see.

3. Talking character. Much better hated the robot look of DA O character.

4. Loved DA O. The visual style of the inventory seems much more aligned to ME2 and is an improvement. I used to get totally lost in all the screens in DA O

5. I have booked 2 days off work to wait to play the full version in early May as I figure there will be the usual patches and updates to fix the odd bug already well described in this forum.

6. Loved the first game. Played through twice. Romance and story are important to me as a girl in touch with my inner geek and I'm pleased to say I think I can care about the new characters. But will wait until I can customise my female hawke as customisation is very important to me.

7. Darkspawn grunts did not look as scary as they did in first game and had a slightly cartoony look.

8. Auto attack, I really hope this is in the full version as I personally will get very bored of continuosly pressing the a button, but I did enjoy the immediacy.

9. OMG, I think i'll lose another 60 -80 hours of my life exploring the new game.

10. Worried about linear nature of timeline hated what they did with FF and was complete FF nut before they decided to make a movie with button presses.

Overall good.......

[mouseUp]

I remember reading a article about DA2 where they where talking about panning the camera way back.

The problem they had with that was that the top of every building in the game had to sliced off so there wouldn't be any roofs shown in that point of view.

I remember them saying that was the reason that they didn't do it for DA2.

Found the article
http://uk.ps3.ign.co.../1148330p1.html


This article you may find interesting to read, its the 10 things you need to know about DA2. Like you cant change the equipment of your companions.

http://www.gameinfor...gon-age-ii.aspx

Edit- made de links, links.

Modifié par mouseUp, 05 mars 2011 - 10:28 .

[hagendas76]

Have just read through the link posted.......................

Not a happy bunny.

Can't change equipment on comrades?

All takes place in Kirkwall???? GGMS

shorter is fine but the first one only took me 30 hours with nearly all side missions + DLC?

hmmmm, I'll have to wait and see full version for myself but now I am really worried!!!!!!!!!

[Tommy6860]

Troxa wrote...

Found this on http://gamrfeed.vgch...more-cinematic/
During a presentation on localization, BioWare localization representative Ian Mitchell showed some stats involving the amount of content in Dragon Age: Origins and Dragon Age II. The information gave some surprising insight into the scope of the sequel versus its predecessor. This information is undoubtedly rounded, but some key stats are:

Dragon Age: Origins
1,000,000 Words
1,000 Cinematics
1,000 Characters
56,000 Spoken Lines
60 Hours of Gameplay

Dragon Age II
400,000 Words
2,500 Cinematics
500 Characters
38,000 Spoken Lines
40 Hours of Gameplay

This is a pretty shocking change, as it shows some pretty significant changes in developmental priority. The fewer spoken lines is especially odd, especially with the now fully voice-acted main character, which under normal circumstances would have signifficantly increased the amount of spoken dialog. Are you happy with the new focus of Dragon Age II, or would you have preferred something closer to the original game?

Yes, I saw that there as well and I have to say that it near confirms that the game is going to be much more about action, than character building and interaction with allies and NPCs. I am disappointed in that really. We'll just have to wait for the release to see what it offers. But two and halfs times the cinematics and on 40% of the dialogue?? that's jsut awful. If the game is supposed to be action and that's the target for gamers, that could be a deal breaker for the hack-n-slash fans, let alone alienating the true RPGers respectively.

[ashwind]

Playing the Demo on PC (Male Hawke)

Game experiences lags between cinematic/conversations/in-out of combat - with vsync enabled it is really bad because I can see the "Loading..." text - without I feel a little spike now and then. Hopefully this is because it is a demo and once DX11 is enabled, everything will be fine.

I notice many of the graphics options are disabled - so it is not fair to comment on the graphics - though it would be better - hope it is better in the real game.

Audio is "terrible", sometimes too soft, sometimes too loud - again must be a demo only issue - otherwise these forums will go up in flames in about 4 days

The "Action/RPG" thing that has been receiving so much attention I find is non-existent. The combat basically is like DAO - just a bit faster and flashier.

A bit disappointed with Hawke's voice... a bit too gentle.

Overall - an average demo. It doesnt look like a demo that is made to promote the game, more like a demo that is made for fans who already know something about the game/story/DAO.

and now I m gonna play female hawke

[Graunt]

hagendas76 wrote...

Have just read through the link posted.......................

Not a happy bunny.

Can't change equipment on comrades?

All takes place in Kirkwall???? GGMS

shorter is fine but the first one only took me 30 hours with nearly all side missions + DLC?

hmmmm, I'll have to wait and see full version for myself but now I am really worried!!!!!!!!!

3. Inventory Management Is Better
Your allies in Dragon Age II each have a set of armor that they wear all the time. This means that you can’t equip them with the helmets, boots, and gauntlets that you find in your quest. This may sound disappointing at first, but it results in you spending much less time in the menus sizing up and optimizing equipment. If you pick up a new suit of armor that isn’t an improvement for Hawke, you can just sell it; no need to look at all of your active and inactive party members to see if it’s better for them.

Plus, you can still outfit your companions with rings, amulets, and belts, so the customization isn’t gone completely. Your inventory will be less cramped, especially since you get a storage chest early on and  you aren’t carrying around crafting reagents all the time.

It is funny to see someone post a 30 hour mark for Origins though.  Each time I would say that it took approximately 35 hours (My first playthrough on hard took me 38), you'd see a bunch of "Stop playing on casual and skipping all of the text parts.  It took me 57 - 100 hours!" statements.

10. It’s Shorter, But Not Short
I finished Dragon Age II, along with every sidequest, in approximately 40 hours. While that isn’t the 70 hours it took me to play through Origins, it’s still a large chunk of time, and I certainly didn’t feel cheated by the amount of
content.

Lol...yeah, it's definitely short if he's using that kind of comparison.  To me it looks more like 20 vs 40.

Modifié par Graunt, 05 mars 2011 - 10:50 .

[Dlokir]

Rhobert wrote...
Sigh....
Count me as another of the disappointed.

I'm another of the older (40) crowd, who plays on PC (well, Mac on Bootcamp).

Well I'm in the 50+ minority and funnily also with bootcamp. I'm not disappointed because I had no special expectation. But I'm worry about some points that the demo let anticipate.

I'm trying to be constructive, and think of positive things to say, as I know people have put a lot of hard work and many hours into this.   Unfortunately I can't think of much that I would call an improvement.  

Well, let see:

• Quite more talents allowing probably more character building from the fights point of view.
• More fight talents with singular property offering more tactical elements, for example the sneak attack is interesting by allowing mix an attack and repositioning of the rogue behind an enemy.
• Orders you dive during pause are a priority when DAO had the flaw to put tactics in priority.
• Potions cooldowns seem have been increased, this disabling an abuse of healing or mana potions.

Other than that I don't see any other improvements, but there are other points that seem well done, more or less as well done than in DAO but that's just an anticipation of the full game. 

But, as seems to be the case with PC'ers here, and especially the older ones, I just can't buy into the new combat animations.  Too much suspension of disbelief required.  I just feel like I'm playing an arcade game.  I hate to use these words as I know they're probably insulting to a game designer, but it seems "cartoonish" and "juvenile".  Too much jumping around at super-human speed, too much Darkspawn exploding into ridiculous pools of blood-colored jello after barely being touched, and too much swinging ludicrously over-sized weapons at light-speed like they weighed nothing.

I do agree that it's a lot. Myself I wouldn't mind keep all animations and graphics but at a quite lower speed. I could get used to all but would need something that slowdown all, making look animations less weird and improving fights fun, and ability to control a whole party.

I also fear this will take away  any sense of achievement through levelling up.  If your character is this inhuman from the start, then what sense of satisfaction will I get from further advancement?

Yes, yes, I understand it's just a demo.  But is this aspect of the game
really going to be significantly different in the final product?

I think you didn't noticed the first fights was rather different than the other. First fights are fake legendary fights where the character is overpowerful. Once the real story starts fights become standard. 

I guess it's just that the original was such a breath of fresh air, and now we're back to pretty much everything else on the market.

Well Drakensang, Drakensang River of Time, Dragon Knight Saga, there are modern RPG with big production and a relative old school approach. There's also few indies like Eschalon Book series or Avernum series that are quite old school.

Perhaps there's a dichotomy at play here, based on age and platform base.  I understand market decisions and all, but just to let you know, there is a somewhat smaller base of fans who are admittedly older and a smaller proportion of the market, but would be willing to pay 2-3x the cost for something truly special.

But only a very small minority would really pay this price any game even if in words they claim something else.

I understand your feeling but myself I still have some hope in the game and in the fights.

Perhaps a mod will slowdown all or perhaps I'll get used to the speed. For the animations or the graphic style, I don't care much it's more a detail for me, so it's really only about the speed making control a whole party unpleasant and forcing you fully use tactics for all characters but one. I'm also not sure for the new dialog system, perhaps it will be ok for me, or not.

[Kellex81]

Its a real shame that there`s not an "auto-attack" option for the game, witch means button mashing through the hole game.

I also don`t like how the story is presented. After you get into Kirkwall, you jump 1 year into the future. So when you get the chance to walk around Kirkwall, you will meet people you "know". They will talk about something you did with them, and some also show that you have some sort of history with them. This is annoying as we the players are "robbed" from the experience! So when we finally get to explore Kirkwall, its for the first time for us, but Hawke has been there a full year. What it does for me is to distance me from my characters, the town and the story.

As with the story so far(after some hours) I do miss the epic feel DAO gave you from the get go! Its all about settleing into Kirkwall. No major threat. No traveling the country. No "urgency".

As a final note, with whats said above. I think Im saying, that I miss the driving story and the full freedom to adress it.. It all feels more like a DLC at the moment like Awakening.
Hopefully it will get better by more playing time..



Edit: This post should probably be somewhere else..!

Modifié par Kellex81, 05 mars 2011 - 11:01 .

[Graunt]

Kellex81 wrote...

Its a real shame that there`s not an "auto-attack" option for the game, witch means button mashing through the hole game.

This keeps being said, and someone has to keep replying that there is an auto attack toggle in the retail version of the console games.

[Icy Magebane]

@Kellex: You can toggle auto-attack in the full game, but it's locked in the demo. Also, that time jump is only in the demo. I don't know exactly when you arrive in Kirkwall, but there's more to the story than meeting Isabela, etc... there was a developer Q and A some time ago where he played the full version and that part was in it...

[Dlokir]

Icy Magebane wrote...

@Kellex: You can toggle auto-attack in the full game, but it's locked in the demo. Also, that time jump is only in the demo. I don't know exactly when you arrive in Kirkwall, but there's more to the story than meeting Isabela, etc... there was a developer Q and A some time ago where he played the full version and that part was in it...

Mmm tactics can't be used for this purpose? Even in the demo? Well I don't remember this option in DAO.

For the transition between the two area and time shown by the demo, I'm surprised by the number of players that understood it as a real story evolution and not a shortcut made for the demo. The sudden character auto level up is at least a big hint but perhaps the demo should have make it more clear.

[Icy Magebane]

No, you can set tactics for every party member... I thought that guy meant having to press [attack button] while controlling a character.

I understand what you mean about the time jump.  I also found it jarring, and I knew what was going on lol... I have no idea what the majority of people thought, but had I not already seen some game footage, I might have been thrown off too.

Modifié par Icy Magebane, 05 mars 2011 - 11:34 .

[Dlokir]

Icy Magebane wrote...

No, you can set tactics for every party member... I thought that guy meant having to press [attack button] while controlling a character.

I understand what you mean about the time jump.  I also found it jarring, and I knew what was going on lol... I have no idea what the majority of people thought, but had I not already seen some game footage, I might have been thrown off too.

Arg yea the controlled character, it's something that always bother me, that I have no option to have the controlled character use tactics.

Now I understand players complaining about having to smash attack button "constantly". Well they should use pauses and try think use more special talents, but even that is almost a constant business and don't really let time to half control more than one character. A good point that I'll have to get used to, is that at least now players command is a priority over tactics even if you don't control the character. That was a heavy burden in DAO and it's cool they fix it in DA2. So now in DA2 during a pause you could really give an order to each member of the party.

But well for me too the pace of fights should not have been speed up and I'm worry this will decrease fun of fights for me.

[arb608]

one other thing I noticed is with mind blast if an enemy goes flying into another guy, neither remain undamaged and the other guy just stays standing would be cool to see him get knocked down as well and suffer a bit of dmg, but guess it is too late to impliment it now lol

[Kellex81]

Graunt wrote...

Kellex81 wrote...

Its a real shame that there`s not an "auto-attack" option for the game, witch means button mashing through the hole game.

This keeps being said, and someone has to keep replying that there is an auto attack toggle in the retail version of the console games.

I have played the retail verson, and there are no "auto-attack" that I can see.

[Kellex81]

Icy Magebane wrote...

@Kellex: You can toggle auto-attack in the full game, but it's locked in the demo. Also, that time jump is only in the demo. I don't know exactly when you arrive in Kirkwall, but there's more to the story than meeting Isabela, etc... there was a developer Q and A some time ago where he played the full version and that part was in it...

I have played the retail verson, and there are no auto attack. As for the story its after you gain access to the city. You then get the story teller "updating" you on what has happen through the last year.
This is why I got upset about meeting, lets say mr.X.

Mr.X : Hi Hawke, long time no see eh?! Still working for mr.Y?

Me: Ehh.. Who? What? And you are?

Modifié par Kellex81, 05 mars 2011 - 12:02 .

[Akjosch]

Graunt wrote...

As for why people were dying on the last fight, they shouldn't have been.  All you needed to do was focus fire when all area of effect abilities are on cooldown, and Isabella could tank Hayden while you took out everyone else first.

Tip to win the last fight:

1. Open a side door (there are two, pick any).

2. Enter the small room there.

3. Close the door behind you.

4. Go eat lunch while the immortal Izzy kills everyone.