8659 réponses à ce sujet

[Abstract]

Haha, I love the people who say "Blasphemy! it's faster so it's less tactical". No, that is no correct at all. If anything its more tactical due to how frenetic the combat can be. Thing's aren't moving at snail-pace like in DAO, so you really have to have an idea of what you are doing, and what you are going to do next.

Also, anyone arguing the combat was more "Refined" in Origins, apparently we didn't play the same game. You mean the clunky, laggy, often unresponsive combat in Origins was refined? Please.

Modifié par Abstract, 23 février 2011 - 06:17 .

[Saturn226]

I love most of this demo.

Lady Hawk sounds amazing and I really love her default look. I might stick with it

Rogue and Mage are freaking amazing.



Warriors tick me off though. The swords are unreasonably huge and bulky but they move them super fluidly with absolutely no resistance and are able to charge at enemies with these huge swords as well. This is a minor pet peeve.



Otherwise overall, excellent demo experience.

[PPF65]

I loved the Demo. I feel sad that it ends after so little time. Please hurry up Bioware, your community NEEDS this game!!!

[TanithAeyrs]

In contrast to all the time I spent on the DA:O pre-release forums, I have been reluctant to wade into the quagmire of the DA2 forums. However, I feel obligated to comment after playing the demo. I will state for the record that I am a long time Bioware fan (since BG1) so I will admit to some bias.



The good:



Relatively spoiler free demo - the depth of Bioware games makes this close to impossible so I will give kudos to those who managed this. I felt like I got a feel for the combat and the look of the game without ruining my (mostly) cold playthrough with my first real character.



Combat - no real complaints with the DA:O combat - it felt realistic, but postioning rogues took a lot of work (particularly with a multiple rogue party) in DAO. I played both a femHawke rogue and a male Hawke mage through the demo and combat felt much more immediate. The rogue in particular worked better. The mage was a little flashy but I'm not a mage fan so it could be just me. I am hoping there's still opportunities for a sneaky rogue however (demo didn't allow that much exploration of skill trees). Overall game play was relatively easy, but I can play at higher difficulty in the actual game so I'm not too worried.



Kirkwall: the little bits we got to see looked really good, Lighting is much better - particularly in the Chantry. I heard the lighting was reworked for DA2 and it really shows. Nice job.



The clothing: some of the clothing is simply amazing. Isabela's scarf looks like something off a store shelf, not a computer game. Some of the armor is equally well done.



Varric (and his chest hair): I don't think I need to say much more. Even in the few brief glimpses we get of him you can see that he has a well developed personality and a unique view of life. This is a Bioware game so I fully expect a complex plot, difficult choices and memorable NPCs.



On the Fence:



The dialog wheel: not as bad as I had feared. better than Mass Effect certainly. My personal preferance is still for fully written dialog, not just a wheel suggesting the basic idea of what the PC is going to say. The flip side is if you intend a sarcastic response the NPC's react to it as a sarcastic response - something that didn't always come across in the old "select a line" dialog.



Voice acting: see above - I'm just as happy to read my PC's lines. But the voice actors chosen for both male and female Hawke are really good (voice actors for the NPC's sound great too).



Overall art style: Kirkwall looks great, but the landscape around Lothering and some of the characters have an almost "cartoon" feel. I know there was a big push for a distinctive art style, so once again, I'm probably in the minority on this one.



The Bad:



Friendly fire: I miss it. Spamming fireballs with no consequences isn't fun. I think I saw somewhere that there's still friendly fire at higher difficulties so I guess that's okay if it's true. If not I will have to watch what spells I give to my mages - limit AOE spells because of my personal preference. For some people lack of friendly fire might be good - so maybe I'm in the minority.



Laces on womens dresses and shirts: I hope this has changed in the final release - they look painted on, not real at all. For all the lovely detail in other areas of the clothing and armor this is a glaring oversight. This sounds really petty, but I loose immersion because they look so bad.









Overall impression: generally positive. I'm sure I'll enjoy playing DA2. I'll wait and see if it stands up to its predecessors.

[Bloggers99]

Not saying that's something you said in particular. Just making a very good point out of the lack of effect battlefield tactics have in a "visceral" and "realistic" war scenario. AOE has no FF damage. Flanking enemies is pointless. Drawing aggro seems random at best, as my mage will occasionally draw mobs when using base attacks while a warrior using heavy, crowd control attacks gets ignored.



I'm just hoping the demo is from an older build of the game, as foolish as that hope is.

[Cancermeat]

Its the best demo ever since the Warcraft 2 demo game out several years ago

[T1l]

Not a fan of the art direction or assets. The combat is somewhat of an improvement, but it feels less of an RPG and more of a hack'n'slash. Not sure how a sequel ends up looking worse than the original, but I'll wait and play the final product with DX11 and whatnot.

[Lightshunner]

Emloch wrote...

Lightshunner wrote...

I feel a bit better about the game after watching this:

http://www.gamespot....itialclk;series

Seems like the whole game is much better, with regions with more details. I think that the choice region for the demo was wrong because it only showed environments that lacked details and the demo was too linear.

I have mixed feelings about it. While it gives me more hope for enviromnet versatility it also, clearly shows that Bioware has taken away one of the most important features of a true RPG, character customization/inventory management. This is extremely disappointing.

Varric the dwarf is stuck with his crossbow and will use no other weapon. It is also said that each character is limited with armor they can wear, etc. No more universal armor. Basically you'll have to come across "Varric armor" in the game.

Also, it doesn't even seem as though you can give just anybody a ranged weapon. Essentially, your fighter can only perform melee attacks. If you notice in the demo, there is no archery tree. There are also no skill sets; looks like crafting is out too. I may be wrong as the demo may be limited but it seems to me that Bioware has simplified this game too much; to a serious fault. Just as they did with Mass Effect 2; great combat improvements but they ruined the core basics of a good RPG.

I agree. But the crafting will be there. It's just that all is very simplified for the big mass of casual gamers. I guess we will all have to play on hard, because normal is made for casuals, and maybe we will have friendly fire there at least.
Also, why should i hit with a sword a simple darkspawn 10-20 times until it dies?! it's like a piece of rock now, not realistic at all. It's a true hack and slash now. I can already imagine some big bosses taking hours to kill like in WoW.

[Sparafucil]

Bloggers99 wrote...

Efesell wrote...

TrackerTrem wrote...

Ah, I love Bioware apologists. This game has many good things, but it also has many faults

It certainly does, but a lot of the faults I've seen listed strike me more as "this isn't origins waaaaah" in tone.

Because the lack of tactical combat in a Bioware game is solely based on it not being Origins. ME1 & 2 have better pause and play tactical combat.

No they do not. Not even remotely.

[VenomousSwan]

 I just finished the demo, and I thought it was great! Like some other players, though, I don't have a HDTV (I'm saving up for one) and the text is really small and strains my poor eye-balls. If there was a patch or something to help out with that it would be ever so wonderful.  

[throwmeaname]

muse108 wrote...

much much too easy, there was 0 challenge for me, there better be a huge jump up to hard and nightmare

I too would like to be challenge when the retail version comes out but you got to consider that this demo is fixed on normal. You're able to spam that fireball/firestorm/hail of arrows now, but when you set it on nightmare, you'll end up with a wipe due to the friendly fire and harder hitting mobs. But yeah, I'm with you on that though, I want this game to be challenge instead of a mindless button masher.

[JoePilot]

Abstract wrote...

Haha, I love the people who say "Blasphemy! it's faster so it's less tactical". No, that is no correct at all. If anything its more tactical due to how frenetic the combat can be. Thing's aren't moving at snail-pace like in DAO, so you really have to have an idea of what you are doing, and what you are going to do next.

Also, anyone arguing the combat was more "Refined" in Origins, apparently we didn't play the same game. You mean the clunky, laggy, often unresponsive combat in Origins was refined? Please.

You've tried to make the same point 3 times now, we get it: you like frenetic, choppy-choppy,  mind-numbing ninja fights.  Okay.  Good for you.

Tactical means planned, anticipated, fore-thought, all of which is incredibly hard when the action on-screen is an uninteligible blur. 

So yes, by definition, fast-paced frenzied combat with pointless vapor-trails for blade swings and everything else make it much more dificult for tactical style gameplay, and much less enjoyable for those of us who prefer it.

Please.

Modifié par JoePilot, 23 février 2011 - 06:25 .

[Efesell]

As an aside, can anyone tell me who voices LadyHawke, because it's been bugging me all day and I just can't place it.

[Satyricon331]

My impressions were, unfortunately, largely negative.  I'm on the fence about whether I'll be purchasing the game.  I might wait for customer reviews.

Overall, it was a bit like the death of a thousand cuts:
- In DAO, I quickly developed a no poultice or potion rule since I wanted to out-fight and out-skill the enemies, not out-poultice them.  With one healing spell that has a 60s timer, it won't be possible anymore, which feels cheesy to me.  I want to heal like Jesus, not the cheesemeister. 

-Speaking of poultices, they seem to have an invisible timer now.  I'm hoping it's just the demo.

- I dislike the dialogue wheel.  It added a random element to roleplaying.  Sometimes it was good but sometimes it ranged from the disappointing (clicking the great taunt "Cartillion won't be hearing about it" gives the bland "Your threats end here") to the horrible ("He won't be alone" yields the disgustingly glib "At least now father won't be alone!").  It might have been better to have the dialogue options describe the speech without trying to restate the speech in different words.  And the simplistic-feeling diplomatic-funny-confrontational structure is something I hope is limited to the convos in the demo.

- Mages are now acrobatists, using their staff like a kung fu fighter despite having low dexterity.

- The camera limitations weren't ideal, but it's something I could live with.

- In DAO, if you hit tab, everyone's health bars would show up, including enemies.  Now it doesn't, and you sort of have to hunt to spot enemies.  I think this issue is also something I could get used to... at the least, it's more realistic.

- Perhaps it's just b/c it's a low-level demo, but the combat never felt very tactical.  And it's worrisome that the tactics screen is bugged after first selection or two.  After Awakening, I don't have much patience left for that stuff.  Another issue in the tactics screen is that there's no way to see what an ability does, unlike in DAO.

- I especially disliked the cartoon look characters have (I realize many ppl disagree). This problem might have been the biggest issue for me.  Nobody looks good, and male Hawke in particular is just a hideous little man (and who looks like a dorky little brother of the hot Hawke in the trailers).  And "little" isn't too far off how I felt... their looks almost made them feel like toys.  And the darkspawn's new look is just silly imo.  It felt like a cartoon zombie flick.  

On the positive side, I enjoyed the framed narrative and I liked V's sparring with the Seeker.  I also like the nonlinear talent trees, although hopefully they'll feel larger when the rest of them are unlocked.  And again, all of these things are just my viewpoint.  I realize I'm probably in the minority.  And despite the sound of it, I actually do appreciate all the work that went into the demo and the game, and I'm still rooting for you guys.

edit: I forgot to mention, the voices are very quiet.  Having subtitles on was often necessary.

Modifié par Satyricon331, 23 février 2011 - 06:52 .

[Cancermeat]

I watched an interview and they said the combat was going to be more action oriented but i played like origins for the most part. I guess the console version\\ pc version are for different game styles?

[Efesell]

Cancermeat wrote...

I watched an interview and they said the combat was going to be more action oriented but i played like origins for the most part. I guess the console version\\\\ pc version are for different game styles?

I did play very differently on the 360, without the auto-attack. It wasn't bad but I think it would get old pretty quick.

On the PC I played exactly like Origins as well, just faster.

[Morroian]

JoePilot wrote...

You've tried to make the same point 3 times now, we get it: you like frenetic, choppy-choppy,  mind-numbing ninja fights.  Okay.  Good for you.

Tactical means planned, anticipated, fore-thought, all of which is incredibly hard when the action on-screen is an uninteligible blur. 

Not really watch some of the vids made by the devs. If anything combat seems to be more tactical with positioning being more important because in DA2 you can actually move into position rather than shuffling. 

[Nomen Mendax]

 I've now played it all the way through once (warrior) and partially a couple more times.  My general feeling is still one of "meh".  That is, its OK, but from the limited time I've had with it I much prefer the feel of DAO.

The Bad

• The conversation wheel - didn't like it in ME or ME2, and don't like it in DA2 either.  I see no reason not to show the full text of the response, and all this messing about with ambiguous hint texts and equally ambiguous icons just seems a solution to a problem that needn't have been introduced in the first place.  Unhappilly I'll just have to live with it.
• The over-the-top cartoony fighting animations - I realize this is entirely personal taste but I prefer a more conventional look.  I prefer the non-magic parts of the combat to be at least vaguely grounded in reality and I'm not a fan of all of the over-the-top special move stuff.
• Sword and shield animations - I hate to be harsh as I know you guys have worked hard on this stuff, but the basic attack routine for Aveline is terrible.  She lunges while throwing her shield back and leaving herself completely open.  This could conceivably be to defend from a rear attack but she does it all the time when she is fighting a single opponent to the front.  This may seem picky but I can hardly bear to watch her repeatedly demonstrate that she has no idea of the purpose of a shield.
• The camera - I'm playing on the PC and believe that the decision to remove the panned back, overhead view was a very bad one.
• Cut scenes - I'm hoping that the very low resolution cut scenes are higher resolution in the release version.
• The interface - I preferred the look and feel of the interface in DAO, and I'm not a fan of the bright and cheerful glowing colours of the new interface (particularly the skill trees).  Again, I imagine I'll get used to it.

The Good
I liked Flemeth.

OK, that seemed really negative and I really wanted to say nice things as I think DAO was an amazingly well done game.  I suspect that the direction that the team has taken with DA2 is not one I'm going to like, but I'm still hoping that the final product will end up more engaging than the demo suggests.

[gonzalovm]

The only thing that i didnt like was the rogue kicking the flag. Not even the best ninjas do that LOL. But overall it was awesome.

[Efesell]

JoePilot wrote...

Abstract wrote...

Haha, I love the people who say "Blasphemy! it's faster so it's less tactical". No, that is no correct at all. If anything its more tactical due to how frenetic the combat can be. Thing's aren't moving at snail-pace like in DAO, so you really have to have an idea of what you are doing, and what you are going to do next.

Also, anyone arguing the combat was more "Refined" in Origins, apparently we didn't play the same game. You mean the clunky, laggy, often unresponsive combat in Origins was refined? Please.

You've tried to make the same point 3 times now, we get it: you like frenetic, choppy-choppy,  mind-numbing ninja fights.  Okay.  Good for you.

Tactical means planned, anticipated, fore-thought, all of which is incredibly hard when the action on-screen is an uninteligible blur. 

So yes, by definition, fast-paced frenzied combat with pointless vapor-trails for blade swings and everything else make it much more dificult for tactical style gameplay, and much less enjoyable for those of us who prefer it.

Please.

Personally I like a faster pace because it forces you to think on your toes rather than fall into the same motions for every other fight. Which I found myself doing far too often in Origins.

[Abstract]

JoePilot wrote...

Abstract wrote...

Haha, I love the people who say "Blasphemy! it's faster so it's less tactical". No, that is no correct at all. If anything its more tactical due to how frenetic the combat can be. Thing's aren't moving at snail-pace like in DAO, so you really have to have an idea of what you are doing, and what you are going to do next.

Also, anyone arguing the combat was more "Refined" in Origins, apparently we didn't play the same game. You mean the clunky, laggy, often unresponsive combat in Origins was refined? Please.

You've tried to make the same point 3 times now, we get it: you like frenetic, choppy-choppy,  mind-numbing ninja fights.  Okay.  Good for you.

Tactical means planned, anticipated, fore-thought, all of which is incredibly hard when the action on-screen is an uninteligible blur. 

So yes, by definition, fast-paced frenzied combat with pointless vapor-trails for blade swings and everything else make it much more dificult for tactical style gameplay, and much less enjoyable for those of us who enjoy such.

Please.

Try actually experiencing a real fight sometime, in real life, and tell me how amazing and tactical origins combat was based on that. If you wanted realism you would be playing some kind of sim, not this game. Real life doesn't artificially pause and let you make decisions.

Besides that, I made a rather interesting observation that it seems no one has noted or even discovered. If you don't mash buttons, your character will actually act out pretty much the same animations as when you are mashing, just much slower. Meaning you press the buton once, not over and over.

Modifié par Abstract, 23 février 2011 - 06:30 .

[Valtor232]

Is it march 8th yet? because I can't ****ing wait after playing the demo, mage is so overpowered and fun