57 réponses à ce sujet

[UKStory135]

I took the Sniper Rifle, the Viper fits in better with my play style. I tend to stay in the back and use my little drone buddy and my squad to draw fire while I get head shots with either my M5 pistol or sniper rifle. I guess once an infiltrator, always an infiltrator.

[JaegerBane]

UKStory135 wrote...

I took the Sniper Rifle, the Viper fits in better with my play style. I tend to stay in the back and use my little drone buddy and my squad to draw fire while I get head shots with either my M5 pistol or sniper rifle. I guess once an infiltrator, always an infiltrator.

I take the Viper on my Adept, for the same reason that it fits my play style. It allows me to do some sniping but is flexible enough to function as a battle rifle in most scenarios.

I've never totally understood the level of hate sniper Adepts get. Sure, the power-zoom thing can look a little weird but I've never once seen it affect the potency or the targeting of my biotics. Generally, I find the Viper's defence-stripping potential is the perfect thing to render my enemies vulnerable to my biotics before they come within range of them. And it's death on bosses.

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...
lol, first thing that comes to mind is always the Mattock...../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png 
However, it's true, the Vindicator (and possibly the GAR) will
outperform the Tempest vs. armored targets. This is another reason why
the Locust is often a better rounded weapon than the Tempest, as its
anti-armor performance is comparable-enough to the assault
rifles.

Actually the Geth Pulse Rifle falls behind the Tempest vs armour, but that's more to do with how crap the GPR is rather than issues with SMGs vs ARs. To be honest even the Locust isn't that great against armour as the SMG class lacks any kind of research boost (which boosts the performance to a far greater degree than it appears), it falls well behind the Vindicator as you say.

On the other hand, if the class doesn't have an assault rifle then it's a good choice, substantially better than the Avenger of the GPR. Against any target where the Locust's lesser performance against armour is noticeable then the Carnifex would have been a better option anyway.

Modifié par JaegerBane, 24 février 2011 - 11:06 .

[termokanden]

Very true. The research bonuses (something like 50% against a specific defense) mean that all SMGs really are best against shields and barriers, not armor. But it also depends on what you're shooting at. Fighting husks for example, I could destroy their armor in no time at all with the Locust, so no need to switch to pistols. I guess the armor is just to prevent the player from instakilling them with biotics.



But for bigger things, I have had more luck when switching weapons.

[jamesp81]

I restarted last night as an infiltrator after winning the game (no one left behind achievement to boot) and I'm coming to appreciate the Shuriken more than I did initially. It requires a bit more trigger discipline, since if you just tap fire it full auto, you spray everywhere and don't hit anything. My plan is to get Kasumi early since the Locust is in that mission, and then I'm going to get the Viper ASAP. The Viper is nice in that does more damage than the Mattock and has a telescopic sight. I plan to use it like a designated marksman would; think scoped battle rifle. After that, I'll probably use the Widow at least some, because I like cutting off Harbinger in the middle of assuming direct control with it.

[termokanden]

I think most people love killing Harbinger mid-sentence.

[Locutus_of_BORG]

JaegerBane wrote...

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...
lol, first thing that comes to mind is always the Mattock...../../../images/forum/emoticons/whistling.png 
However, it's true, the Vindicator (and possibly the GAR) will
outperform the Tempest vs. armored targets. This is another reason why
the Locust is often a better rounded weapon than the Tempest, as its
anti-armor performance is comparable-enough to the assault
rifles.

Actually the Geth Pulse Rifle falls behind the Tempest vs armour, but that's more to do with how crap the GPR is rather than issues with SMGs vs ARs. To be honest even the Locust isn't that great against armour as the SMG class lacks any kind of research boost (which boosts the performance to a far greater degree than it appears), it falls well behind the Vindicator as you say.

On the other hand, if the class doesn't have an assault rifle then it's a good choice, substantially better than the Avenger of the GPR. Against any target where the Locust's lesser performance against armour is noticeable then the Carnifex would have been a better option anyway.

Good to know about the GPR, as I've never gotten around to using it beyond Haestrom. I guess if only the Mattock and Vindicator are able to outperform the Locust, then I suppose I was still half-right... Still, for serious armor, non-soldier classes, with the exception of Vanguards, get Heavy pistols, Sniper rifles AND Incinerate/Warp, which are more than enough, imo.

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 24 février 2011 - 03:30 .

[Praetor Knight]

Well regarding the Geth Pulse Rifle, it is actually a fine weapon, I use it often.

The base damage seems comparable to the Avenger, and if you have
Tungsten or better yet Inferno, the weapon can be pretty wicked IMHO.

Also, the low spread and recoil allows the player to land more shots without having to correct as often. But on PC, I imagine accuracy is less of an issue then on 360 with the mouse and keyboard.

Also on 360, I'm often fighting a funky pulling to the right, which seems to happen regardless of which controller I'm using, meh

[Simbacca]

It has taken many playthroughs, but on this latest Infiltrator run I've come to love the Shuriken. I enjoy mid-to-close range cloaked assassinations with it (with an appropriate ammo type for the health). Also, again with the appropriate ammo type this time for defenses, rapid pulls of the the trigger shred shields and barriers on large targets.

[Ares Caesar]

iOnlySignIn wrote...

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...

JaegerBane wrote...

iOnlySignIn wrote...

Learn the Tempest. It's one of the best guns in the game. It's so satisfying with Cryo Ammo or Inferno Ammo (Vanguard). With Inferno/Tungsten ammo it kills Praetorians, YMIRs, and Geth Primes like they're total jokes.

I'm not sure about this. While it's not a terrible weapon to use against such targets I wouldn't really describe them being 'total jokes' to it. Its DPS against armour, even with Tungsten Ammo, isn't that great in comparison to the high end assault rifles.

lol, first thing that comes to mind is always the Mattock...  However, it's true, the Vindicator (and possibly the GAR) will outperform the Tempest vs. armored targets. This is another reason why the Locust is often a better rounded weapon than the Tempest, as its anti-armor performance is comparable-enough to the assault rifles.

Heavy Pistols. You want to use those against pure Armor (Scion, Krogan). As Tony pointed out earlier, there is a reason why switch animation between SMG/Heavy Pistol is so fast - you are supposed to switch often based on the enemy type.

I don't like most Assault Rifles or the Locust because they are OK against everything but not particularly good against anything.

Why use the Locust/GPR against Shields/Barriers while you can use the Tempest/GPS/Scimitar? Why snipe with the Vindicator when you can snipe with the Incisor/Viper? Why use any of these guns vs. Armor when you have a Predator, a Carnifex, or a Viper? The only Assault Rifles that are good are Mattock/Revenant. All others are for people who are too lazy to switch weapons.

I think its pretty fair to say that its almost always ideal to use the proper weapons against the proper protections.

Couple things go into that though

1) Situation - Sometimes switching weapons just isnt practical based on the fact that Harbinger, or a Geth Destroyer is storming your position and you've already lost your shields.

2) Upgrades - Early on when you're  still working on getting certain upgrades (or perhaps some arent even available?) some guns are distinctively better than another (Snipers are pretty beastly pre-horizon since you can obtain all 3 upgrades for +50% armor +50% headshots). So while later in the game, when most upgrades have been obtained switching weapons is more practical ammo and DPS wise, early game when certain guns arent quite beefed up yet via upgrades, its not always as effective to switch weapons.

However, all that aside the general rule of thumb I would say to any new player on the subject of guns and which is the best to use - "Match your guns to the situations and protections you are facing, the same as you would biotic/tech powers"

Honestly, I think coming from many other games where typically you use 1 specific weapon/gun the whole time because its "The Best" its hard to sometimes grasp the notion of utilizing the complete weapon arsenal in ME2, as each weapon has a specific strength for a specific situation.

Modifié par Ares Caesar, 25 février 2011 - 06:52 .

[ShadoHaze502]

Tempest and the locust are the best SMGs.

[JaegerBane]

iOnlySignIn wrote...
Heavy Pistols. You want to use those against pure Armor (Scion, Krogan). As Tony pointed out earlier, there is a reason why switch animation between SMG/Heavy Pistol is so fast - you are supposed to switch often based on the enemy type.

To be fair, I think that's reading a little too far into it - the animation, near as I can tell, is identical in terms of speed and motion to the original pistol activation from Mass Effect 1, pre-dating any concept of switching weapons based on defence.

Generally, the lesser performance of SMGs vs armour (and vice versa pistols vs shields) is only even noticeable when the defences are heavy and the weapon in question has only had minor uprgrades - while it's fairly obvious that you have a weapon to handle heavy defences of each type, I'm not so sure you're expected to change every time you hit a defence your current weapon isn't 'strong' against. It'll largely depend on the situation whether you should switch - swarms of husks, for instance, may be armoured but generally aren't the type of enemy best handled by pistols.

[kombra]

JaegerBane wrote...
It'll largely depend on the situation whether you should switch - swarms of husks, for instance, may be armoured but generally aren't the type of enemy best handled by pistols.

I'll have to disagree on that. Pistol for taking down armor + Mordin spamming Cryo Blast = no more swarm (a lot better than SMG). (Occasionally throw in an Incineration Blast of your own.)

[termokanden]

And I'll have to disagree with that! I found it easiest to use SMGs to strip armor then either use powers or (in my case) let Squad Cryo handle the rest.

I do use heavy pistols, but I find pray and spray with SMGs a lot easier against husks because you are likely on the move the whole time.

Modifié par termokanden, 25 février 2011 - 06:40 .

[kombra]

If you hit the husks with spray and pray SMG, you are too close. 2 Carnifex shots strip armor = 3 stripped husks per reload. Often, after you hit a trigger point, the husks will take a while to spawn - use that time to move back.

[Locutus_of_BORG]

^Carnifex + Cryo ammo = 2 shot Husk kill 95% of the time.

Modifié par Locutus_of_BORG, 25 février 2011 - 07:01 .

[termokanden]

kombra wrote...

If you hit the husks with spray and pray SMG, you are too close. 2 Carnifex shots strip armor = 3 stripped husks per reload. Often, after you hit a trigger point, the husks will take a while to spawn - use that time to move back.

Why am I too close? I do tons of damage and hit them with every shot that way. You don't get hit unless you move into a corner.

I guess it also comes down to playstyle. When it comes to husks, I prefer up close and personal. They are not dangerous if you move correctly.

[kombra]

Locutus_of_BORG wrote...

^Carnifex + Cryo ammo = 2 shot Husk kill 95% of the time.

Doesn't work for me. One shot doesn't strip armor (I've been playing NG+).

[ryoldschool]

termokanden wrote...

And I'll have to disagree with that! I found it easiest to use SMGs to strip armor then either use powers or (in my case) let Squad Cryo handle the rest.

I do use heavy pistols, but I find pray and spray with SMGs a lot easier against husks because you are likely on the move the whole time.

If you are talking about Reaper IFF mission, then Locust ( with LotSB SMG upgrade ) has 6 upgrades by that time and is deadly vs the armor on those husks.

[kombra]

termokanden wrote...

kombra wrote...
If you hit the husks with spray and pray SMG, you are too close. 2 Carnifex shots strip armor = 3 stripped husks per reload. Often, after you hit a trigger point, the husks will take a while to spawn - use that time to move back.

Why am I too close? I do tons of damage and hit them with every shot that way. You don't get hit unless you move into a corner.

I guess it also comes down to playstyle. When it comes to husks, I prefer up close and personal. They are not dangerous if you move correctly.

If you are close, it's more difficult to systematically strip armor (the husks will cover each other).

[termokanden]

I'm talking about those missions where you get swarmed by husks. Reaper IFF, Collector ship at some point, those mines as well. On Horizon I think I used the pistol a bit more. It's not really easy to run around CQCing husks with two scions trying to get you.

But yeah, you have a point with the upgrades. You can get many SMG upgrades fairly early.

If you are close, it's more difficult to systematically strip armor (the husks will cover each other).

Didn't really have any problems with that.

Modifié par termokanden, 25 février 2011 - 07:15 .

[Bozorgmehr]

termokanden wrote...

kombra wrote...

If you hit the husks with spray and pray SMG, you are too close. 2 Carnifex shots strip armor = 3 stripped husks per reload. Often, after you hit a trigger point, the husks will take a while to spawn - use that time to move back.

Why am I too close? I do tons of damage and hit them with every shot that way. You don't get hit unless you move into a corner.

I guess it also comes down to playstyle. When it comes to husks, I prefer up close and personal. They are not dangerous if you move correctly.

Seconded. The only rule fighting Husks is Do Not Let Em Surround You. Up close you'll do double damage with your guns and Husks won't return fire. You can also sprint through a wave of Husks without them touching you at all.

Scions are potentially deadly, Husks are not. With some space to move around and plenty of ammo (pickups) I'll happily take on 100 Husks at once. With a bit of luck they won't even scratch Shep's shield

[ryoldschool]

Bozorgmehr wrote...

termokanden wrote...

kombra wrote...

If you hit the husks with spray and pray SMG, you are too close. 2 Carnifex shots strip armor = 3 stripped husks per reload. Often, after you hit a trigger point, the husks will take a while to spawn - use that time to move back.

Why am I too close? I do tons of damage and hit them with every shot that way. You don't get hit unless you move into a corner.

I guess it also comes down to playstyle. When it comes to husks, I prefer up close and personal. They are not dangerous if you move correctly.

Seconded. The only rule fighting Husks is Do Not Let Em Surround You. Up close you'll do double damage with your guns and Husks won't return fire. You can also sprint through a wave of Husks without them touching you at all.

Scions are potentially deadly, Husks are not. With some space to move around and plenty of ammo (pickups) I'll happily take on 100 Husks at once. With a bit of luck they won't even scratch Shep's shield

You sir, have a confidence that would get me killed a lot.  I hate to get killed when they do surround you, so I like to take them at range when possible.  That is why I always take the Cain on the last room on Reaper IFF - its difficult not to get surrounded. 

[Bozorgmehr]

ryoldschool wrote...

You sir, have a confidence that would get me killed a lot.  I hate to get killed when they do surround you, so I like to take them at range when possible.  That is why I always take the Cain on the last room on Reaper IFF - its difficult not to get surrounded. 

I like that last fight - one of the few places you can be flanked though it are only Husks.

BTW jwalker has found a way to stop flanking at the IFF core. Check this video (last fight starts around 3:00) - having Grunt do his Krogan Combat Drone Thing also helps

[Locutus_of_BORG]

If all else fails, there's always the Cain/Avalanche ground'n'pound or Revenant+Inferno+CryoSquadmate spray'n'pray.