144 réponses à ce sujet

[Helena Tylena]

As Saibh repeatedly tried to explain, comparing a prologue boss to a 'real' boss is hardly valid.



Also, some mechanics have changed. You can actively avoid attacks using defensive abilities. As such, the two fights don't really match up either.

[AlexXIV]

Siradix wrote...

Purgatious wrote...

The time you'd face the orge in DA:2 is much sooner then you'd face one in origins,


therefore any and all comparisons are hereby declared void.

Enemy difficulties are scaled, it shouldn't matter when you face the ogre.

Well but you played longer and learned to use your abilities better. Also I think having played DA:O is also an advantage even if the combat is faster paced.

[Zabaniya]

Darkhour wrote...

kingjezza wrote...

Firstly I would like to point out these are my personal opinions, I'm not stating them as fact and I'm not a troll simply because I might have a negative opinion about DA2.

My first play through on Origins was on normal so I though both games early fights with an Ogre were comparable, both fights come early on and seem like an intro to a tougher fight, although you have other Darkspawn in DA2 to think about as well.

Dragon age Origins, that Ogre kicked my ass so many times before I got the better of it, noway I could just stand in front of it and just hope for the best, I had to make sure I positioned my party in the right places, set them up properly and continually use tactics during the whole fight, my party were never just kept still, it took some thought to beat this ogre.

Compared to Dragon Age 2, with one less party member and extra darkspawn to deal with compared to the DAO ogre, me (warrior S&S) and Aveline basically just stood in front of it hacking at it as much as possible as Bethany stood in the distance firing at it, not once did I move a party member or do anything with them, I didn't think about the fight at all really, I just let them hack away at the ogre and randomly clicked the special abilties with little thought, it basically came down to who could survive the huge hack fest the longest.

I was wondering what experiences others might have had with the two early game ogres?

Play as a dw rogue and solo it.  It's fairly challenging.

Warriors, 2-handers especially, are overpowered in DA2. DW Rogues are quite pathetic really. Their single target damage is no greater than the 2-hander's AOE damage. I guess they have to earn their lockpicking now by sucking at everything else. 

Although I have to wonder if that ogre had all it's moves.  Only once has it ever done its charge attack, it never knocked anyone down, nor picked them up.  I have to wonder if that fight contained a finished ogre.

Been there, done that.  As a DW rogue.  You do realize that Rogues have more options to avoid damage than Warriors or mages?  Backstab can be used as a offensive AND defensive move, and you have Evade and Miasmic Flask at your disposal as well.  It's just a matter of timing your moves correctly.

[Seventh H3ll]

What...? I found the DAO normal ogre to be way easier than the DA2 one. Then again I played on the 360 and normal on that is supposedly easier.

Edit:
DAO: No deaths.
DA2: Carver dead because of add ons.

Modifié par Seventh H3ll, 24 février 2011 - 12:25 .

[AlexXIV]

Helena Tylena wrote...

As Saibh repeatedly tried to explain, comparing a prologue boss to a 'real' boss is hardly valid.

Also, some mechanics have changed. You can actively avoid attacks using defensive abilities. As such, the two fights don't really match up either.

Well but both times you could kite the ogre in circles which is basically 100% foolproof tactic in both fights.
Just in DA:O I didn't know that yet, in DA2 it was clear that nobody would die if they can just run in circles. Also I think in DA2 the Ogre can actually miss. In DA:O it wasn't that easy to avoid its rush and the stone throw.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 24 février 2011 - 12:26 .

[Demx]

MColes wrote...

It does matter, because the first Ogre in DA:O wasn't part of the tutorial, while in DA2, everything up until Flemeth is!

Varric's first interpretation was the tutorial. The real game starts when Varric begins his story again.

[FieryDove]

Darkhour wrote...

Play as a dw rogue and solo it.  It's fairly challenging.

DW Rogues are quite pathetic really. 

Are you speaking about DA2?

I did solo it and it was not hard, it was even easier than using warrior hawke. Everytime it reached out its hands (maybe to grab or hurl?) it blinked and I wasn't there anymore. I was behind it stabbing away.

Now in the full game and later levels I can't say if they will keep up.

[AlexXIV]

Siradix wrote...

MColes wrote...

It does matter, because the first Ogre in DA:O wasn't part of the tutorial, while in DA2, everything up until Flemeth is!

Varric's first interpretation was the tutorial. The real game starts when Varric begins his story again.

An exaggerated gameplay situation isn't exactly a good tutorial.

[Saibh]

Siradix wrote...

Varric's first interpretation was the tutorial. The real game starts when Varric begins his story again.

Woah, no it wasn't. Unless you're trying to tell me that the exaggerated version is how you're supposed to play the rest of the game. You have no party, no potions, you don't really have an idea of what to do with your character because you didn't choose your skills, you can't play archers or sword and boards.

It was to give you a taste of what you'd be like later, as well as the idea of how people think of your player.

Modifié par Saibh, 24 février 2011 - 12:29 .

[Mad-Max90]

With Mage hawke it was little tougher than rogue/warrior hawke as carver was quick to fall, but once I used pyro spells to clear out the darkspawn, Aveline and I decimated the ogre

[Demx]

AlexXIV wrote...

An exaggerated gameplay situation isn't exactly a good tutorial.

The tutorial isn't going to hold your hand through everything. Did you ever wonder why you had  no abilities, then one, and then more?

Modifié par Siradix, 24 février 2011 - 12:31 .

[DraCZeQQ]

I actually really hate that designers keep picking starting skills for me ... I hope this was only demo thing ... but my mage started with the most useless spell ever thus wasting 1 skill point ...

[Mad-Max90]

Agreed about mind blast that really pissed me off, especially when bethany had fireball, what?

[Johnson45]

People really thought the ogre fight was easy? Only fought it a couple of times, and always had one of my 3 die. :|

[Saibh]

Mad-Max90 wrote...

Agreed about mind blast that really pissed me off, especially when bethany had fireball, what?

Because each class has a generic  skill they start out with. Bethany is an offensive mage, so she starts with offensive powers. You are neither offensive nor defensive. It's similar to how warriors don't have a sword and board or 2H skill.

[Zabaniya]

Saibh wrote...

Mad-Max90 wrote...

Agreed about mind blast that really pissed me off, especially when bethany had fireball, what?

Because each class has a generic  skill they start out with. Bethany is an offensive mage, so she starts with offensive powers. You are neither offensive nor defensive. It's similar to how warriors don't have a sword and board or 2H skill.

I think they meant that the point should be available to invest in a skill of their choosing instead of putting into a talent/spell like that.

[AlexXIV]

Johnson45 wrote...

People really thought the ogre fight was easy? Only fought it a couple of times, and always had one of my 3 die. :|

I never saw it a requirement that everyone needs to live just to be an easy fight. Carver died because I was too lazy to keep him out of trouble. Still easy to win with 2.

[Saibh]

Zabaniya wrote...

I think they meant that the point should be available to invest in a skill of their choosing instead of putting into a talent/spell like that.

Think about it this way: You don't actually have twenty skills. You have nineteen. You never get to choose the first one, therefore, it doesn't exist.

[AlexXIV]

Siradix wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

An exaggerated gameplay situation isn't exactly a good tutorial.

The tutorial isn't going to hold your hand through everything. Did you ever wonder why you had  no abilities, then one, and then more?

Well yes, because it was a short fight and completely unneccesary.

[darklordpocky-san]

Origins wins. . . mainly because the ogre looks so silly in DA2 lol

[Zabaniya]

Saibh wrote...

Zabaniya wrote...

I think they meant that the point should be available to invest in a skill of their choosing instead of putting into a talent/spell like that.

Think about it this way: You don't actually have twenty skills. You have nineteen. You never get to choose the first one, therefore, it doesn't exist.

Well, more a problem for them than me, since I like the skills that characters start off with, anyways.  *shrug*

[Saibh]

Siradix wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

An exaggerated gameplay situation isn't exactly a good tutorial.

The tutorial isn't going to hold your hand through everything. Did you ever wonder why you had  no abilities, then one, and then more?

I already pointed out many more reasons why it wasn't a tutorial.

[Skwurll]

DAO Tower ogre was friggin' tough even on Normal, but considering the only thing DA2 ogre seems to do, besides have more HP, is AoE people, it's a rough fight. The new 45sec CD heal is going to be weird.

[HolyAvenger]

Origins ogre was much tougher initially but that was because I had no idea about gameplay mechanics. With DA2 I knew immediately to lock it down with Aveline, take out the mooks, use a heal spell and so forth effectively making it a much simpler fight.

[DraCZeQQ]

Saibh wrote...

Zabaniya wrote...

I think they meant that the point should be available to invest in a skill of their choosing instead of putting into a talent/spell like that.

Think about it this way: You don't actually have twenty skills. You have nineteen. You never get to choose the first one, therefore, it doesn't exist.

No I actually think of it as yet another fail from Bioware ... but nothing toolset wont fix.