68 réponses à ce sujet

[Hizuka]

He tells you that he was hired to poison the Arl, not forced to.

[phordicus]

i wanted to kill him during the mage origin. too bad Greigor didn't give me the option.

[Saurel]

Hizuka wrote...

He tells you that he was hired to poison the Arl, not forced to.

Though there was the Loghain promising to get him off the hook angle.

As for what he does in the Mage Origin, attacking the Templars is understandable. He would have no choice over his fate and no ability to repent- he would have to lose himself or die.

Hes certainly not the most courageous individual, but I don't think he is evil by a long shot.

[Steelmoon3101]

Jowan reminds me of the 8 million nub WOW players I have dealt with the past 4++ years ..lol

[Wrena]

SupidSeep wrote...

What I understand from the Mage Origin is the Circle of Magi considered Jowan unlikely to pass the Harrowing and was arranging for him to be made Tranquil. Jowan got wind of it through Lily of the Chantry and wanted to escape that fate. He had earlier dabbled in Blood Magic because he wanted a easy route to success/power.

 No they were going to traquil him because they had reports of him practicing blood magic. Wonder if those that pass the harrowing can be made traquil?

[BluesMan1956]

mynameisdanza wrote...

i felt sorry for him until like the 3rd time you hear about him hurting people with his blood magic. repentent my @ss

Amen, Sister!

[BluesMan1956]

Majspuffen wrote...

Whiny? Perhaps, but didn't he have a reason? Jowan was to be made tranquil. What would you have done to avoid that? I'm not sure how Jowan got into blood magic, but I think it was out of curiosity. I only saw him use blood magic to defend himself. He also wanted to use it to help save Connor. He seems like a nice man. A nice man with bad luck. He'd even go into the fade and save Connor himself if you ask him to.

Jowan is the poster boy for why Templars make mages tranquil.  Can you imagine (if you believe the personality he puts forth) such an oblivious fool being given the most powerful mages spells? 
"I'm sorry! I didn't know!  it won't happen again!" after he "accidentally" burns down the chantry with a fireball..

[Flamin Jesus]

Hizuka wrote...

He attacks the templars escorting him back to the Circle, killing some and injuring others, and escapes.  You'll meet one of the survivors imprisoned in Arl Howe's dungeon later on.

That never happened.
The templar you meet in the dungeon is one who tracked down Jowan after he escaped first from the circle, he was intercepted by Loghain's people (Who then recruited Jowan to poison the Arl) and thrown into Howe's prison, there is no indication of what he did after you sent him back to the circle, from what I know.

[BluesMan1956]

Now maybe Jowan could have been given a better backstory that my Mage character could have identified with, but....

I was actually offended when Jowan first approached me and put me on the spot by essentially saying "Ooh, I value our friendship so much and friends do things for each other, right? So will you help me and my girlfriend do something that will p*ss off BOTH the Templars and The Circle, because you are such a good friend, right?"



I'm sorry, WHO THE HELL ARE YOU?

[Maria Caliban]

mynameisdanza wrote...

well in the mage origin he blows a bunch of people up.
i was wrong about redcliffe, it was just the regular poison, not blood magic. sorry i guess i just meant hurting people in general

after redcliffe i suggested that he be given to the circle to deal with. later on, while in arl howe's dungeon, i met a templar who had been guarding him when he blew people up again and escaped. i suppose that wouldn't have bothered me, except he seemed so sincere about accepting responsibility for what he had done earlier.

That's interesting. After Redcliffe, I didn't get an Templar. Did you go with anulment?

Edit: Sorry about that, misread. Yes, I met that templar.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 16 novembre 2009 - 05:19 .

[Gill Kaiser]

Jowan basically made one mistake, which was to dabble in blood magic during his Circle apprenticeship (which, we learn, he was hardly the only one to do). As far as we see during the game, he didn't use blood magic for any evil or malicious purpose until forced to do so to save his and Lily's lives during the Mage Origin, and to save his life later on. What happened to him is just as much the fault of the Chantry's intolerance as it is the fault of Jowan. Irving himself said that if it were up to him, he would be leniant, and the game clearly shows Irving to be a wise and fair man.



The fact that he poisoned Eamon shouldn't count against Jowan either, since that was Loghain's doing, and Jowan was a desperate man on the run for his life.



That said, Jowan was indeed whiny and as wet as a sponge in a monsoon.

[Rylor Tormtor]

Flamin Jesus wrote...

Hizuka wrote...

He attacks the templars escorting him back to the Circle, killing some and injuring others, and escapes.  You'll meet one of the survivors imprisoned in Arl Howe's dungeon later on.

That never happened.
The templar you meet in the dungeon is one who tracked down Jowan after he escaped first from the circle, he was intercepted by Loghain's people (Who then recruited Jowan to poison the Arl) and thrown into Howe's prison, there is no indication of what he did after you sent him back to the circle, from what I know.

I was curious about the chronology of this. I thought this was the case, but wasn't sure. I was confused when I freed the templar, mostly because I had told the Teagon to execute Jowan.

[BluesMan1956]

Gill Kaiser wrote...

Jowan basically made one mistake, which was to dabble in blood magic during his Circle apprenticeship (which, we learn, he was hardly the only one to do). ...

Jowan shows a propensity for making bad decisions and my Mage has a sad propensity for listening to him and giving him another chance.

Seriously, as the OP stated, "Jowan is a turd"

[bobsmyuncle]

mynameisdanza wrote...

well in the mage origin he blows a bunch of people up.
i was wrong about redcliffe, it was just the regular poison, not blood magic. sorry i guess i just meant hurting people in general
after redcliffe i suggested that he be given to the circle to deal with. later on, while in arl howe's dungeon, i met a templar who had been guarding him when he blew people up again and escaped. i suppose that wouldn't have bothered me, except he seemed so sincere about accepting responsibility for what he had done earlier.

That templar was guarding him after he escaped. They tracked him down after the mage origin, then one of Loghain's guys talked him into blowing up some templars and poisoning the arl. I was able to use the templar's testimony in the Landsmeet to prove that Loghain was a big jerk.

If you want to know what Jowan got up to after Redcliffe, there is supposed to be a chantry board mission in Denerim about him but I never got it

I think he blood magics some more templars to get away. I can't say I blame him, I wouldn't want to die or be lobotomized either.

[Wintermist]

Jowan is one of those people who doesn't comprehend cause and effect, and as such continue to make mistake after mistake after mistake... Doesn't matter if he wants to or not.

[Endurium]

If playing a female mage you can have a funny moment by telling him you have feelings for him in front of Lily. It doesn't go anywhere but it's a light moment.



I think he's one of those people who means well but invariably goes about things the wrong way. He sincerely felt he was helping Ferelden by poisoning the Arl, for example. His lack of proper mage training (never underwent the Harrowing) led to Connor being possessed due to same lack of proper training. Ultimately I suggested they send him back to the Circle.



His voice actor can be heard behind certain other NPCs in the game, as well as the Suave voice for the male human (listen to it several times and you can hear Jowan come out in a few lines).

[BluesMan1956]

imported_beer wrote...

He is far more nuanced than any NPC I have met in the recent past- most of them are so.singular in purpose. Jowan was very..human. He was awesomely written. Sometimes I felt like flinging a heavy object on his head. Other times I wanted to sympathize with him because I was starting to feel like Jowan there for a bit.

If he wasn't so awesomely written and performed we wouldn't have this thread.
He's still a turd,.

[JamesX]

From what I can tell, Jowan made one mistake. And then in trying to fix it he made it worse. But he ultimately realized his error and faced up to his responsibilities. To the point of wanting to be executed for his crimes when, as his friend, I tried to get him off the hook yet again.



So.. he got executed.

[BluesMan1956]

JamesX wrote...

From what I can tell, Jowan made one mistake. And then in trying to fix it he made it worse. But he ultimately realized his error and faced up to his responsibilities. To the point of wanting to be executed for his crimes when, as his friend, I tried to get him off the hook yet again.

So.. he got executed.

Did you play the mage origin?  When I ran into him at Redcliff Castle I ws still chafed about how he wasn't up front with me.
And he had never been all that good a friend.  he should have been made tranquil

[Taleroth]

I like Jowan.

[JamesX]

Yeah I played Mage Origin. I wasn't upset about him lying to me. (. .)' because I lied to him too. I was the one who turned him into Irvine. So I don't have a high horse to sit on.

[Taleroth]

I wasn't upset about him lying to me because he never did. He never told me he wasn't a Blood Mage. Everything he told me was the truth, they were probably going to make him Tranquil.

[Ickabod27]

I used him to free Connor and then tossed him back in the dungeon. Pretty cool that he comes up in another origin.