215 réponses à ce sujet

[Count Viceroy]

Sabariel wrote...

Count Viceroy wrote...

The cooldown is fine. It just forces people to actually tank with the tank. Not running around willy nilly with their mage who should be made out of paper.

My tank got crushed no matter what I did as my healer couldn't keep up with the pace of battle and keep said tank alive. So not much help there

That sounds like you have mobs attacking the tank from the flanks and/or behind then. Aveline has 50 % damage reduction from frontal damage when shield defense is up. Flanking attacks do more damage.

Modifié par Count Viceroy, 25 février 2011 - 11:34 .

[TaHol]

GuiltySource wrote...

First time through the demo I played a rogue, nobody died once. Second run through I was a mage. Everyone died at the Ogre except Aveline. Bethany made a better mage than I did. I'm cool with that.

This. I played rogue twice, archer and dual-wielder, and they walzed through the demo like two...eh...champions. I was like: man, I'm awesome. Then I wanted to be a mage, and ogre made mince meat of him time and time again. In the end, I managed to finish the demo with mage too (last battle with Isabela was a cake), but God I don't know how I killed the ogre. I run out of potions, my heal was in cooldown, and oh look: Carver and Aveline are both dead.

Looks like I will be playing lots of rogue-playthroughs

[dark zentai]

i found if your HP is low with new combat movement

just run around until the cooldown run out



but saying that the cooldown is to long

[rumination888]

TeamLexana wrote...

Ideally most of the time yes but there is the odd time when the tank doesn't catch all the aggro fast enough which is where healing is suspose to come in so u can last enough to kill what's being difficult and attacking what isn't the tank esp early game when u don't have that many abilities yet to cc and aggro manage.

Fight the ogre again in the demo, except pick Heroic Aura instead of Heal on Bethany/Hawke when you level up. Watch as none of your characters will have a need to use a health potion. If your Hawke is a mage, pick up Winter's Grasp instead of Fireball and watch as the combination of Heroic aura + Winter's grasp makes the ogre about as threatening as a single genlock.

[Sabariel]

Count Viceroy wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Count Viceroy wrote...

The
cooldown is fine. It just forces people to actually tank with the tank.
Not running around willy nilly with their mage who should be made out
of paper.

My tank got crushed no matter what I did as my
healer couldn't keep up with the pace of battle and keep said tank
alive. So not much help there

That sounds like
you have mobs attacking the tank from the flanks and/or behind then.
Aveline has 50 % damage reduction from frontal damage when shield
defense is up. Flanking attacks do more damage.

I tried every thing I could think of. It always ended with Carver dying first, then Aveline, and then my healer. If I could have actually healed my party members I might have actually survived the first time around.

dark zentai wrote...

i found if your HP is low with new combat movement
just run around until the cooldown run out

but saying that the cooldown is to long

Since I can't make all three run around at the same time that tactic doesn't really work. If I leave my mage to make Carver or Aveline run around they eat my mage. If I direct the aggro to Carver so they won't eat my mage then Carver gets eaten and so on...

[mintcar]

One thing that hasn't been said yet: You who died a lot in the ogre fight; did you kill the hurlocks right away? Because I can see why your party died if you focused on taking down the ogre while those pesky things were stabbing you from behind. The way to do it is to have one character keep the ogre busy while the others clear away all the extra enemies as fast as possible. If you do that I don't see how you could loose.

[Sabariel]

mintcar wrote...

One thing that hasn't been said yet: You who died a lot in the ogre fight; did you kill the hurlocks right away? Because I can see why your party died if you focused on taking down the ogre while those pesky things were stabbing you from behind. The way to do it is to have one character keep the ogre busy while the others clear away all the extra enemies as fast as possible. If you do that I don't see how you could loose.

Tried to kill the Hurlocks right away. They killed Carver in roughly 20s then went straight for Aveline, whom I couldn't keep alive, and then once she was dead my healer had no real chance of surviving. Poor thing...

[mintcar]

Sabariel wrote...

mintcar wrote...

One thing that hasn't been said yet: You who died a lot in the ogre fight; did you kill the hurlocks right away? Because I can see why your party died if you focused on taking down the ogre while those pesky things were stabbing you from behind. The way to do it is to have one character keep the ogre busy while the others clear away all the extra enemies as fast as possible. If you do that I don't see how you could loose.

Tried to kill the Hurlocks right away. They killed Carver in roughly 20s then went straight for Aveline, whom I couldn't keep alive, and then once she was dead my healer had no real chance of surviving. Poor thing...

I don't know what to say ... There must be something you did wrong because it's not a twitch based game. If, for instance, you were to do it exactly like I did it – the outcome should be roughly the same, right? And I have played throught the whole demo three times and don't even know how the "game over" screen looks.

Maybe you should save your heals more? They fill almost the entire bar, so you get more out of them if you use them when almost dead. 
 

[Sabariel]

Ada Wong wrote...

TaHol wrote...
I run out of potions, my heal was in cooldown, and oh look: Carver and Aveline are both dead.

What I don't get is why so many people are choosing heal as a spell. Yes, that will be useful in the full game, but you need good offense to take down the Ogre. My mage alternated between Winter's Grasp and Fireballs, which also hit many of the darkspawn grunts at the same time. Easy for warriors to finish off. The faster you kill stuff the less need for healing.

People may need to accept that a different approach is required in DA2. Health potion/heal spams will not win tough battles, merely prolong them, until you run out of potions, then die.

Because some people want to be healers? I don't want to be the same thing in every playthrough. Sometimes I chose to be a "damager" or a "buffer/healer" or a "straight healer" and I don't particularly like being punished for wanting to play a different way. And if the battle is the same way in the actual game that it is in the demo then "straight healers" tend to be punished severely.

Also, no one wants to spam potions or heal. They merely want to use them in a timely fashion

mintcar wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

mintcar wrote...

One
thing that hasn't been said yet: You who died a lot in the ogre fight;
did you kill the hurlocks right away? Because I can see why your party
died if you focused on taking down the ogre while those pesky things
were stabbing you from behind. The way to do it is to have one character
keep the ogre busy while the others clear away all the extra enemies as
fast as possible. If you do that I don't see how you could
loose.

Tried to kill the Hurlocks right away. They killed
Carver in roughly 20s then went straight for Aveline, whom I couldn't
keep alive, and then once she was dead my healer had no real chance of
surviving. Poor thing...

I don't know what to say
... There must be something you did wrong because it's not a twitch
based game. If, for instance, you were to do it exactly like I did it –
the outcome should be roughly the same, right? And I have played
throught the whole demo three times and don't even know how the "game
over" screen looks.

Maybe you should save your heals more? They
fill almost the entire bar, so you get more out of them if you use them
when almost dead. 
 

I waited until the last possible breath to heal my team. But, like I said before,  this thread isn't about getting me or anyone passed the Ogre. I beat the demo with a rogue. I don't need or want to play it again.

This thread is about people who hope for the option for shorter cooldowns. That's all.

Modifié par Sabariel, 25 février 2011 - 11:59 .

[sonsonthebia07]

I think the potion cooldown is great. I hate being able to spam potions liberally. But the Heal spell CD is perhaps over the top, or I am just assuming that for tougher difficulties.



Don't know what Spirit Healer will be like but I'm guessing it will have the basics regeneration, group heal, etc from Origins.

[Chuvvy]

Jazharah wrote...

30 seconds is a long cooldown for a potion when you can be hacked to bits in 10.

EDIT: same goes for the Mage Heal Skill - cooldown is TOO long.

Yeah mage heal is waaay to long.

[dark zentai]

Sabariel wrote...

Count Viceroy wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Count Viceroy wrote...

The
cooldown is fine. It just forces people to actually tank with the tank.
Not running around willy nilly with their mage who should be made out
of paper.

My tank got crushed no matter what I did as my
healer couldn't keep up with the pace of battle and keep said tank
alive. So not much help there

That sounds like
you have mobs attacking the tank from the flanks and/or behind then.
Aveline has 50 % damage reduction from frontal damage when shield
defense is up. Flanking attacks do more damage.

I tried every thing I could think of. It always ended with Carver dying first, then Aveline, and then my healer. If I could have actually healed my party members I might have actually survived the first time around.

dark zentai wrote...

i found if your HP is low with new combat movement
just run around until the cooldown run out

but saying that the cooldown is to long

Since I can't make all three run around at the same time that tactic doesn't really work. If I leave my mage to make Carver or Aveline run around they eat my mage. If I direct the aggro to Carver so they won't eat my mage then Carver gets eaten and so on...

ya but just run around with mage you can attack from a distants heal your self
and then the target is dead the party get back up
but it is tactics that one idea let the party die and do it solo

another is the stun ogre when kill the horde first but most important kill the horde first
20 dark spawn do more damage them 1 ogre
plus it will be a little easter in the full game cos your gear will not be locked and you pick one or two bit on the way

[Loc'n'lol]

sonsonthebia07 wrote...

I think the potion cooldown is great. I hate being able to spam potions liberally. But the Heal spell CD is perhaps over the top, or I am just assuming that for tougher difficulties.

Yes, I can agree with that. I see no reason why the cooldown on the spell should be twice as long as the cooldown on potions. It makes the upgrade look pretty weak. But overall I'm glad they decided to tweak healing the way they did.

Don't know what Spirit Healer will be like but I'm guessing it will have the basics regeneration, group heal, etc from Origins.

The description seems to imply it will have stuff that prevents damage too.

[Walker White]

mintcar wrote...

One thing that hasn't been said yet: You who died a lot in the ogre fight; did you kill the hurlocks right away? Because I can see why your party died if you focused on taking down the ogre while those pesky things were stabbing you from behind. The way to do it is to have one character keep the ogre busy while the others clear away all the extra enemies as fast as possible. If you do that I don't see how you could loose.

This.  Your mage should be a hurlock killer.  Good use of fireball (as most other options are locked); when you draw aggro and they come after you, use mind blast and send them right back.  Rinse, lather, repeat.

[rumination888]

Sabariel wrote...

Because some people want to be healers? I don't want to be the same thing in every playthrough. Sometimes I chose to be a "damager" or a "buffer/healer" or a "straight healer" and I don't particularly like being punished for wanting to play a different way. And if the battle is the same way in the actual game that it is in the demo then "straight healers" tend to be punished severely.

Also, no one wants to spam potions or heal. They merely want to use them in a timely fashion

"I want to play as someone who doesn't wear any armor. OMG why am I being punished for wanting to play a different way?"

"I want to play as someone who only fights with their fists. OMG why am I being punished for wanting to play a different way?"

"i want to play as someone who only uses one ability. OMG why am I being punished for wanting to play a different way?"

Turn the difficulty down when the game ships if you're going to use that kind of logic.

Modifié par rumination888, 25 février 2011 - 12:11 .

[Walker White]

[

Sabariel wrote...

Since I can't make all three run around at the same time that tactic doesn't really work. If I leave my mage to make Carver or Aveline run around they eat my mage. If I direct the aggro to Carver so they won't eat my mage then Carver gets eaten and so on...

Mind Blast is your friend.  One of the cool things about that spell is it works the exact opposite of Mind Blast in DA:O.  In DA:O, that spell drew aggro.  In DAII, it sends them away.

[Sabariel]

rumination888 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Because some people want to be healers? I don't want to be the same thing in every playthrough. Sometimes I chose to be a "damager" or a "buffer/healer" or a "straight healer" and I don't particularly like being punished for wanting to play a different way. And if the battle is the same way in the actual game that it is in the demo then "straight healers" tend to be punished severely.

Also, no one wants to spam potions or heal. They merely want to use them in a timely fashion

"I want to play as someone who doesn't wear any armor. OMG why am I being punished for wanting to play a different way?"

"I want to play as someone who only fights with their fists. OMG why am I being punished for wanting to play a different way?"

"i want to play as someone who only uses one ability. OMG why am I being punished for wanting to play a different way?"

Turn the difficulty down when the game ships if you're going to use that kind of logic.

How about you just turn down your crap attitude instead?

I don't want to play as someone without armor, someone who fights with their fists, or someone who uses one ability. I sometimes like playing as a Healer, who uses many different healing abilites, to keep the party alive.

I could basically play any way I wanted, choose to be any kind of rogue/warrior/mage I wanted in DAO, and I rather enjoyed that. My apologies if that offends your sensibilities.

Walker White wrote...

[

Sabariel wrote...

Since
I can't make all three run around at the same time that tactic doesn't
really work. If I leave my mage to make Carver or Aveline run around
they eat my mage. If I direct the aggro to Carver so they won't eat my
mage then Carver gets eaten and so on...

Mind Blast
is your friend.  One of the cool things about that spell is it works the
exact opposite of Mind Blast in DA:O.  In DA:O, that spell drew aggro.
 In DAII, it sends them away.

I appreciate your help, but I finished the demo as a rogue and have no desire to play it again at this point. But thank-you

Modifié par Sabariel, 25 février 2011 - 12:20 .

[rumination888]

Sabariel wrote...
I sometimes like playing as a Healer, who uses many different healing abilites, to keep the party alive.

Think about that for a bit as it relates to the context of this thread.
A long cooldown on one healing ability wouldn't matter if there were many different healing abilities. There isn't. You can't be punished for something you could never do in the first place. Your argument is moot, and your logic is flawed.

[maselphie]

HEY, you know what I just thought of? I think the developers might be making the cooldown upgradable. Since you can have bonuses and upgrade skills, maybe the cooldown will get reduced if you put a lot of points into Creation? Something we can't experience in the demo, but would address our concerns.

I hope that happens.

Modifié par maselphie, 25 février 2011 - 12:35 .

[Sabariel]

rumination888 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...
I sometimes like playing as a Healer, who uses many different healing abilites, to keep the party alive.

Think about that for a bit as it relates to the context of this thread.
A long cooldown on one healing ability wouldn't matter if there were many different healing abilities. There isn't. You can't be punished for something you could never do in the first place. Your argument is moot, and your logic is flawed.

Since I haven't played the actual game, don't know how many healing abilities there actually are (as Spirit Healer wasn't present in the demo menu), how effective they are, and what their invidual cooldowns are I can't make that call.

And obviously you've made your call long before you got here so I can't see this conversation going anywhere except straight to a dead end.

maselphie wrote...

HEY, you know what I just thought of? I
think the developers might be making the cooldown upgradable. Since you
can have bonuses and upgrade skills, maybe the cooldown will get
reduced if you put a lot of points into Creation? Something we can't
experience in the demo, but would address our concerns.

I hope that happens.

Now that, I would like

Modifié par Sabariel, 25 février 2011 - 12:39 .

[rumination888]

Sabariel wrote...

Since I haven't played the actual game, don't know how many healing abilities there actually are (as Spirit Healer wasn't present in the demo menu), how effective they are, and what their invidual cooldowns are I can't make that call.

And obviously you've made your call long before you got here so I can't see this conversation going anywhere except straight to a dead end.

...then why did you make an argument that you're being punished because you can't play as someone that only heals? You already made your call and now you're backtracking.

[0rz0]

You forget that there's a spirit healer specialization. That one's bound to have some good stuff.

[Sabariel]

rumination888 wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Since I haven't played the actual game, don't know how many healing abilities there actually are (as Spirit Healer wasn't present in the demo menu), how effective they are, and what their invidual cooldowns are I can't make that call.

And obviously you've made your call long before you got here so I can't see this conversation going anywhere except straight to a dead end.

...then why did you make an argument that you're being punished because you can't play as someone that only heals? You already made your call and now you're backtracking.

If the actual game battle is like the demo battle I feared that straight healers would be screwed because of the cooldown time, especially if there aren't as many healing abilites in DA2 as there is in DAO.

I merely asked if the cooldown times were set or if they were a toggle or if they increased/decreased with difficulty because, I believe, a shorter cooldown would be beneficial to a straight healer especially (once again) if there are less abilites.

All I'd like is an answer from BW: "Don't worry, silly. It'll be easier to be a straight healer in the game because ___" or "The cooldowns change with difficulty" or "It's a toggle" and so on.

Modifié par Sabariel, 25 février 2011 - 12:49 .

[Sabariel]

0rz0 wrote...

You forget that there's a spirit healer specialization. That one's bound to have some good stuff.

Sabariel wrote...
Since I haven't played the actual game, don't know how many healing abilities there actually are (as Spirit Healer wasn't present in the demo menu), how effective they are, and what their invidual cooldowns are I can't make
that call.

And obviously you've made your call long before you  got here so I can't see this conversation going anywhere except straight to a dead end.

If the good stuff comes with a 200s cooldown it may not help.

I just wanted some info. Agh!

Modifié par Sabariel, 25 février 2011 - 12:50 .