448 réponses à ce sujet

[Iberius]

pezit wrote...

Sereaph502 wrote...

PyroJack wrote...

I have no problem with DA2 seems like i'm in the minority though everybody's getting their knickers in a twist about something oh but i forgot that's the general practice when bioware release a new game just my two cents

No no, the complainers are the minority.  They're kicking and screaming because they can't handle change, and they don't realize the full game will have more than one difficulty level unlocked, the inventory system unlocked, and the character generator unlocked.

When the game actually comes out I gaurentee you 90% or more of everyone complaining will go, "Gee, that wasn't as bad as I thought!" with only a few hardcore complainers left who will complain regardless of anything.

Hell, if Bioware gave in, recalled DA2, and remade it to be more like origins and BG1/2, you know what would happen?  The very same people who complained about DA2 not being like DA:O will start complaining about DA2 being too much like DA:O and not expanding on anything.

And in comes the guy with the "they're just afraid of change" "argument". If you cannot see the fault of this argument i feel sorry for you but i'll try to make you understand anyway. This statement pretty much says "they cannot change anything to the worse", and that all change is good. Can you really not realise that some people prefer slower combat? Or the previous UI? Or the more varied options in conversations? Of course almost everyone will appreciate something that is clearly an upgrade from the previous, but when it's just a change from slower paced combat to faster paced combat you will have people disagreeing.

Fast combat doesn't mean less tactics though. While the rogue movments are rather histrionic (love that word btw) Bioware hasn't "streamlined" the tactics. Sped up combat should not be a game breaker in itself. The game still has the story, tactics, and attribute/skill depth the other one did.

I understand how some of the pacing could be a let down to people but it's not enough to make melodramatic claims that the game is "broken". Just imo I suppose.

[Maconbar]

pezit wrote...

And in comes the guy with the "they're just afraid of change" "argument". If you cannot see the fault of this argument i feel sorry for you but i'll try to make you understand anyway. This statement pretty much says "they cannot change anything to the worse", and that all change is good. Can you really not realise that some people prefer slower combat? Or the previous UI? Or the more varied options in conversations? Of course almost everyone will appreciate something that is clearly an upgrade from the previous, but when it's just a change from slower paced combat to faster paced combat you will have people disagreeing.

Is the combat actually that much faster? This is an honest question because I am not certain yet. I certainly see that closing is sped up. This actually pleases me. I didn't like it in DA:O when i rightclicked on a mob, the PC would slow down in it's approach. I can't tell if AA occurs more quickly in DA:2 although it might. I can see that the animations are more responsive but it doesn't seem like I can do more actions within a specific period of time. But again I am not certain. 

Editted to clean up/reduce nested quotes.

Modifié par Maconbar, 24 février 2011 - 07:00 .

[Grandmaster Love]

I agree that the graphics feel "weird" but overall the game look really good,don't know why people compare this game to baldurs gate or whatever,if you like games made in the old era then buy yourself a ps1 and play FF7 seriously people need to embrace change, games like ME and DA2 are the new RPG,your complaints and hopes fall on deaf ears people like the games and they sell good so all you complainers have nothing to fall back on except opinions and are labeled as haters

[Temaperacl]

Iberius wrote...
Fast combat doesn't mean less tactics though.

Agreed, with the addition of the word "necessarily" (doesn't necessarily mean). But there were other changes that did reduce the need for tactics, at least as shown in the demo.

Iberius wrote...
While the rogue movments are rather histrionic (love that word btw) Bioware hasn't "streamlined" the tactics. Sped up combat should not be a game breaker in itself.

I disagree. If combat was a minimal part of the game this would be true, but from everything we've seen, combat will be a major portion of the game.  In this case, if speeding up combat makes it less enjoyable, then it is completely reasonable for it to become a dealbreaker.

Iberius wrote...
[...]
I understand how some of the pacing could be a let down to people but it's not enough to make melodramatic claims that the game is "broken". Just imo I suppose.

I would say that claims that the gameplay is less enjoyable are reasonable. And if the gameplay is less enjoyable, then it makes claims the game has been broken or ruined become reasonable.  I agree that it is a bit early to make all-encompassing doom claims or claims that it is broken for everyone, however.

[DrunkenMagicianNL]

Exevier wrote...



I don't understand all this complaining. For one, Bioware has the creative license to do what they want, and that should be end of story. For two, what's wrong with fine-tuning the art style and gameplay so that the game has a more exciting, engaging feel to it? All the numbers are still running, it's still not a hack-and-slash, and Nightmare mode will still make you feel like a little girl.



Sure, by making the same underlying mechanics a bit more exciting, they may draw in a slightly larger crowd. But isn't this a good thing? Personally, I feel Bioware as a company has some of the most talented artists in the gaming industry, and I'd like to see them profit from it accordingly.



To me, it's a win-win situation. For the original fans, it's still Dragon Age. It's still a strategy game at its core, regardless of all the "sky is falling" talk. For potential new fans, it's a really awesome-looking game set in a really interesting dark fantasy world. Personally, I don't feel that March 8 can get here soon enough.

They can do whatever they want, but we don't have to like it. And if we don't like it we have every right to complain about the things we don't like, right? Every game should and could be improved upon, so there is nothing wrong with 'fine-tuning' the graphics and gameplay. Personally I think Dragon Age Origins was one of the best games ever made, not so great as the legendary Baldurs Gate-series, but definitely a huge step in the right direction. Now, based on the demo and some interviews I've seen, this game does seem more like a hack n' slash game, not the great tactical role playing game I was hoping for.....



But alas, that's what most people want to play these days.

I'm not blaming BioWare, I probably would have done the same if I were them.

[pezit]

It'll obviously be different from person to person, but for me the problem isn't that the combat ends faster (if it even does). It's the feel of it, i don't see the characters in the dragon age world doing the kinds of feats that they do in DA2, it kills my immersion. Also each hit does way less damage, in DA:O when my party got hit by a fireball it hurt like hell, even a single swing with a sword took a nice chunk out of the HP, now you punch stuff 20 times before they die. It may not play like a hack 'n slash, but it feels like one.

[DrunkenMagicianNL]

Sereaph502 wrote...

PyroJack wrote...

I have no problem with DA2 seems like i'm in the minority though everybody's getting their knickers in a twist about something oh but i forgot that's the general practice when bioware release a new game just my two cents

No no, the complainers are the minority.  They're kicking and screaming because they can't handle change, and they don't realize the full game will have more than one difficulty level unlocked, the inventory system unlocked, and the character generator unlocked.

When the game actually comes out I gaurentee you 90% or more of everyone complaining will go, "Gee, that wasn't as bad as I thought!" with only a few hardcore complainers left who will complain regardless of anything.

Hell, if Bioware gave in, recalled DA2, and remade it to be more like origins and BG1/2, you know what would happen?  The very same people who complained about DA2 not being like DA:O will start complaining about DA2 being too much like DA:O and not expanding on anything.

No, you're wrong. We would have been happy. But YOU and maybe a large crowd of other console gamers would have been complaining and whining about DA2 being to slow and complicated and boring.:happy:

[Galad22]

pezit wrote...

It'll obviously be different from person to person, but for me the problem isn't that the combat ends faster (if it even does). It's the feel of it, i don't see the characters in the dragon age world doing the kinds of feats that they do in DA2, it kills my immersion. Also each hit does way less damage, in DA:O when my party got hit by a fireball it hurt like hell, even a single swing with a sword took a nice chunk out of the HP, now you punch stuff 20 times before they die. It may not play like a hack 'n slash, but it feels like one.

And darkspawns actually aren't any threat you can kill twenty of them without any healing, that would have been very hard in origins.

[tez19]

DrunkenMagicianNL wrote...

Sereaph502 wrote...

PyroJack wrote...

I have no problem with DA2 seems like i'm in the minority though everybody's getting their knickers in a twist about something oh but i forgot that's the general practice when bioware release a new game just my two cents

No no, the complainers are the minority.  They're kicking and screaming because they can't handle change, and they don't realize the full game will have more than one difficulty level unlocked, the inventory system unlocked, and the character generator unlocked.

When the game actually comes out I gaurentee you 90% or more of everyone complaining will go, "Gee, that wasn't as bad as I thought!" with only a few hardcore complainers left who will complain regardless of anything.

Hell, if Bioware gave in, recalled DA2, and remade it to be more like origins and BG1/2, you know what would happen?  The very same people who complained about DA2 not being like DA:O will start complaining about DA2 being too much like DA:O and not expanding on anything.

No, you're wrong. We would have been happy. But YOU and maybe a large crowd of other console gamers would have been complaining and whining about DA2 being to slow and complicated and boring.:happy:

I am a console gamer and i played and loved DA:O i played the demo of DA2 and loved that too. The fact of the matter is some people like to complain because they didn't get enough hugs off mummy when they were children.

[tez19]

Galad22 wrote...

pezit wrote...

It'll obviously be different from person to person, but for me the problem isn't that the combat ends faster (if it even does). It's the feel of it, i don't see the characters in the dragon age world doing the kinds of feats that they do in DA2, it kills my immersion. Also each hit does way less damage, in DA:O when my party got hit by a fireball it hurt like hell, even a single swing with a sword took a nice chunk out of the HP, now you punch stuff 20 times before they die. It may not play like a hack 'n slash, but it feels like one.

And darkspawns actually aren't any threat you can kill twenty of them without any healing, that would have been very hard in origins.

That wasn't hard for me in DA:O when playing ostagar on normal? I guess i must just be better than you?

[BillyMahoney]

Maybe people should wait for the game to come out in full release before getting so worked up. I'm not saying its good or bad but can people wait a month and see a finished product? I do think Bioware may be rushing their games out a bit. They must have a huge workload with ME3, kotor, DA, and all the dlc they put out on a regular basis.

[Galad22]

tez19 wrote...

Galad22 wrote...

pezit wrote...

It'll obviously be different from person to person, but for me the problem isn't that the combat ends faster (if it even does). It's the feel of it, i don't see the characters in the dragon age world doing the kinds of feats that they do in DA2, it kills my immersion. Also each hit does way less damage, in DA:O when my party got hit by a fireball it hurt like hell, even a single swing with a sword took a nice chunk out of the HP, now you punch stuff 20 times before they die. It may not play like a hack 'n slash, but it feels like one.

And darkspawns actually aren't any threat you can kill twenty of them without any healing, that would have been very hard in origins.

That wasn't hard for me in DA:O when playing ostagar on normal? I guess i must just be better than you?

At the same time?

Anyway very mature of you, and certainly adds lot to the discussion, mocking other peoples skills.

[pezit]

BillyMahoney wrote...

Maybe people should wait for the game to come out in full release before getting so worked up. I'm not saying its good or bad but can people wait a month and see a finished product? I do think Bioware may be rushing their games out a bit. They must have a huge workload with ME3, kotor, DA, and all the dlc they put out on a regular basis.

They have completely different teams on each game, and i gotta say as much as i despised the demo i love bioware for having the guts to release one. Too many companies expect everyone to just blindly trust sites such as gamespot and then buy their game, and then they complain about pirating...

[Querne]

Have asked the openers question myself.

Luckily my anger because of the dull camera perspektive, only one character, short game length, small areas and cut down details has vanished and now I´m looking foward to the future. 

Thanks Bioware  Bethesda! 

[tez19]

Galad22 wrote...

tez19 wrote...

Galad22 wrote...

pezit wrote...

It'll obviously be different from person to person, but for me the problem isn't that the combat ends faster (if it even does). It's the feel of it, i don't see the characters in the dragon age world doing the kinds of feats that they do in DA2, it kills my immersion. Also each hit does way less damage, in DA:O when my party got hit by a fireball it hurt like hell, even a single swing with a sword took a nice chunk out of the HP, now you punch stuff 20 times before they die. It may not play like a hack 'n slash, but it feels like one.

And darkspawns actually aren't any threat you can kill twenty of them without any healing, that would have been very hard in origins.

That wasn't hard for me in DA:O when playing ostagar on normal? I guess i must just be better than you?

At the same time?

Anyway very mature of you, and certainly adds lot to the discussion, mocking other peoples skills.

i was not mockin your skills, i was mocking your ''point'' as it was invalid. I never had any trouble fighting darkspawn on normal difficulty throughout the whole of origins, why should DA2 be any different?

[mcpothead]

tez19 wrote...

Galad22 wrote...

pezit wrote...

It'll obviously be different from person to person, but for me the problem isn't that the combat ends faster (if it even does). It's the feel of it, i don't see the characters in the dragon age world doing the kinds of feats that they do in DA2, it kills my immersion. Also each hit does way less damage, in DA:O when my party got hit by a fireball it hurt like hell, even a single swing with a sword took a nice chunk out of the HP, now you punch stuff 20 times before they die. It may not play like a hack 'n slash, but it feels like one.

And darkspawns actually aren't any threat you can kill twenty of them without any healing, that would have been very hard in origins.

That wasn't hard for me in DA:O when playing ostagar on normal? I guess i must just be better than you?

Omni troll strikes again 

[Galad22]

tez19 wrote...

i was not mockin your skills, i was mocking your ''point'' as it was invalid. I never had any trouble fighting darkspawn on normal difficulty throughout the whole of origins, why should DA2 be any different?

I didn't have any problems either but I couldn't beat 20 of them without any healing like you can here. My point was that they are there just to point their weapons at you they don't actually do any damage, a least in demo.

Modifié par Galad22, 24 février 2011 - 07:27 .

[Apollo Starflare]

The curse of the sequel: Change too little and you get called stagnant, just pushing out carbon copies of previous games with no thought behind it. However if you change too much, or change something the fans didn't want changed then you are destroying everything and causing the end of a beloved franchise (etc.).



Good thing there seems to be plenty of people who are happy to roll with the changes and enjoy what looks to be another fantastic entry in the Dragon Age series. I'll always support Bioware if they continue to experiment and improve on the way games tell stories.

[dangeraaron]

I can cope, but I would like some DLC to include Rangers and Shapeshifters. Also hopefully they decide to make a story in DA3 where you can include a fully voiced Human, Elf, and Dwarf character (possibly even Qunari). I'd be sorely dissapointed if DA3 came out and you can still only be a human. From voiceless Human/Elf/Dwarf to voiced Human, and hopefully to voiced Human/Elf/Dwarf.



Of course, this is just my personal opinion. As far as it not being DA anymore, meh I can see where people are coming from, especially witht he new art direction. Combat is alright for what it's worth.

[PrinceOfFallout13]

Apollo Starflare wrote...

The curse of the sequel: Change too little and you get called stagnant, just pushing out carbon copies of previous games with no thought behind it. However if you change too much, or change something the fans didn't want changed then you are destroying everything and causing the end of a beloved franchise (etc.).

Good thing there seems to be plenty of people who are happy to roll with the changes and enjoy what looks to be another fantastic entry in the Dragon Age series. I'll always support Bioware if they continue to experiment and improve on the way games tell stories.

this^  you cant never win with people so keep doing what you want bioware and i will keep buying your games

[Sereaph502]

pezit wrote...
And in comes the guy with the "they're just afraid of change" "argument".

Best way to explain it.  And the moment someone comes in trying to invalidate an entire argument just by saying "Oh this guy said X!" then you've already lost.

[pezit]

Sereaph502 wrote...

pezit wrote...
And in comes the guy with the "they're just afraid of change" "argument".

Best way to explain it.  And the moment someone comes in trying to invalidate an entire argument just by saying "Oh this guy said X!" then you've already lost.

You just blew my mind, if you're a troll you really got me. If not i feel sorry for you.

[AngelicMachinery]

This thread kills my immersion.

[John Epler]

And we've left the realm of 'discussion' and entered the realm of 'shouting at each other in the vain hope that something will happen and people will change their minds'.



Locking.