109 réponses à ce sujet

[Bruno Hslaw]

Xewaka wrote...

Bruno Hslaw wrote...
Lol I love PC fan boys. I am actually using a PC now genius. I just like the 360 for gaming as to me a PC is a work tool and I use one 40 + hours a week. I need to get away from a keyboard. I have a desktop and 2 laptops as a matter of fact. I have no spite against them what so ever. Its like asking a van driver to use his off time driving in my case. As for the PC should they make an expansion just for the 360 PS3. I bet the PC lot would say no, yet when I say no to extra content just for PC I get called spiteful. What a silly lot PC fan boys are.

You are missing an important detail that invalidates your comparison. It is not possible to apply mods to a console game with the console as is. It is possible to do so with PC. If it was possible to release a toolset for console, we'd see it done, as the devs have already stated that a toolset positively impacts DLC sales, thus it is in their benefit to release one.
There is quite the difference between logistical impossibility and "can't be arsed to".

Never said I asked for a 360 toolset! To be honest I would noty have wanted one.

Just if they are spending X thousand pounds developing stuff for DA2 why should it be for less than a quarter of the users. They could use that to make more dlc for 100% of users is what I was saying.

[Dubya75]

Ok Bruno, I've edited my poll so now it does not mention anything about platforms or encouraging people to vote yes. Hopefully this will satisfy you.
sorry to have caused you so much stress, clearly this is a big issue for you.

[Bruno Hslaw]

Dubya75 wrote...

Ok Bruno, I've edited my poll so now it does not mention anything about platforms or encouraging people to vote yes. Hopefully this will satisfy you.
sorry to have caused you so much stress, clearly this is a big issue for you.

No problem. Have a nice poll.

[FaeQueenCory]

I've heard they want to give us one.... BUT they don't know if they will... I hope they do though!

[AmstradHero]

I would say yes... but I still want people to play DAO mods too!

[AddictedRebel72]

I voted yes and I'm a console player. It's not all selfless though, am getting PC in 6 months time'.

[Takeva_]

Voted no.

If they do decide to give a toolset I hope it's later within the year so that they can focus on more content for everyone.

[0x30A88]

Bruno Hslaw, you're just as much a console fanboy as you claim we're PC fanboys. Yust because YOU prefer a console, doesn't ignore the fact that 50%+ use a PC for gaming. We don't need our PCs. Your hate towards the toolset as you're a console user is like claiming that all you hate shall not exist.

Most of us PC players on here have at least one mod installed or are oblivious to their existance. Consoles aren't designed for modding because they cant do it -- though I tihnk PS3 would be able to read a mod folder on a external drive if they tried. Get your facts straight, PC still dominate the market by 50-55%. The rest is close to equally shared between the three consoles.

Why should your feelings toward a toolset used by a system you don't play on -- and you'd like to force us not to either -- determine it's existance in the sequel?

The x000 pounds is nothing compared to what's already made. They are probably using a similiar toolset that they could just fix a bit on and it's good to go.

Modifié par Gisle Aune, 01 mars 2011 - 03:54 .

[Kovnic]

I REALLY hope they add a tool set, the mods people made for DA:O made multiple play throughs so much more fun, and often allowed you to add things that I felt were desperatly needed (Item storage for one!).

I just have a nagging fear that the lack of "gear" for companions means we are going to see Armour Skins as DLC, and I really dont see Bioware cutting into their DLC profit by letting players mod their own armour sets. I mean, yes, you could argue that the same was true for DA:O DLC, except that those were mostly larger quest chains, and good player made quest chain mods were few. Armour skin mods however were 10 a penny, so if DA2 DLC is going to have those then User made armour mods will have a larger impact on their sales.

I really hope my fear is unfounded, and so for that, I vote Yes to a tool set!

[Bruno Hslaw]

Gisle Aune wrote...

Bruno Hslaw, you're just as much a console fanboy as you claim we're PC fanboys. Yust because YOU prefer a console, doesn't ignore the fact that 50%+ use a PC for gaming. We don't need our PCs. Your hate towards the toolset as you're a console user is like claiming that all you hate shall not exist.

Most of us PC players on here have at least one mod installed or are oblivious to their existance. Consoles aren't designed for modding because they cant do it -- though I tihnk PS3 would be able to read a mod folder on a external drive if they tried. Get your facts straight, PC still dominate the market by 50-55%. The rest is close to equally shared between the three consoles.

Why should your feelings toward a toolset used by a system you don't play on -- and you'd like to force us not to either -- determine it's existance in the sequel?

The x000 pounds is nothing compared to what's already made. They are probably using a similiar toolset that they could just fix a bit on and it's good to go.

So Because I have 3 computers, a 360, a PS3 and yes even a Wii makes me a fan boy? Why by that logic I must be a PC fanboy seeing as I have more than any console. Please grow up. My objection is why spend So much time and effort on a small minority rather than spend that effort on all of us. It is the PC brigade demanding extra not I.
I am happy to have the same as the PC players no problem ref dlc, being a paying customer. Also whats with me wanting a toolset for console show me where I asked for that. I have no wish for any toolset at all. Stop making stuff up to make me look like I said something you are just lying, because you have no valid arguement .

PS get your facts straight the consoles are way bigger than PC ref DAO so much so they geared the sequal towards consoles.

Modifié par Bruno Hslaw, 01 mars 2011 - 05:07 .

[shelledfade]

in B4 console noobism.

If they made a toolset it would be for PC probably because its just software.

I have no doubt that if they made one it wouldn't be for console. Waste of time they are happy with crap linear gameplay as it is, why bother giving them a toolset?

Modifié par shelledfade, 01 mars 2011 - 05:06 .

[Bruno Hslaw]

shelledfade wrote...

in B4 console noobism.

If they made a toolset it would be for PC probably because its just software.

I have no doubt that if they made one it wouldn't be for console. Waste of time they are happy with crap linear gameplay as it is, why bother giving them a toolset?

In before what loser. This is a classic example of ranting fanboyism for PC. Fail. Great timing LOLOLOL

[Elvoria]

No toolset, the amount of player made modules was limited, most of the projects are total garbage on the site, The community is nothing like that of Neverwinter Nights.

[Bruno Hslaw]

Elvoria wrote...

No toolset, the amount of player made modules was limited, most of the projects are total garbage on the site, The community is nothing like that of Neverwinter Nights.

NWN now that was a toolset in its day. I loved that game. I remember many of the mods were great but you had to trawl through a lot of garbage to find it.

[Xeyska]

Elvoria wrote...

No toolset, the amount of player made modules was limited, most of the projects are total garbage on the site, The community is nothing like that of Neverwinter Nights.

Don't be dissin' on other people's projects.

Yes, player modules was limited, but there were a ton of other mods that came as well.

[miltos33]

Don't pay any attention to the console troll who desperately tries to derail this thread. Personally, I do not intend to buy any official DLC unless a toolset is also released.

[AmstradHero]

Elvoria wrote...
No toolset, the amount of player made modules was limited, most of the projects are total garbage on the site, The community is nothing like that of Neverwinter Nights.

NWN is a lot simpler than DAO in many aspects. Making levels isn't a simple process of throwing down a few tiles. Making conversations is more than just creating dialogue. Even the process of creating an NPC takes significantly longer because of face morphs. To give an indication of the time required, it took over 60 and 30 hours of work for me to produce levels like these:



Video walkthrough of Fort Velen (above)




If you want modders to churn out something that looks and feels like a NWN mod - we could certainly do that in around the same amount of time it takes to produce one. But then you'd miss out on the improved graphics, cutscenes, dialogue, the cinematic experience... and many other core things that make Dragon Age what it is as opposed to another NWN.

Don't forget that there are several large quest mods still in development for DAO. Unforunately, it takes a lot of time to make them.

Bruno Hslaw wrote...
NWN now that was a toolset in its day. I loved that game. I remember many of the mods were great but you had to trawl through a lot of garbage to find it.

As I've stated above, the NWN "was a toolset in its day" because it was much simpler. Your snide insinuations about the lack of quality in player created mods does a grave disservice to all modders.

Since you have contributed nothing to this thread after your first post but to attack other players or modders, I would kindly suggest that you leave it. People who chose to play on PC and want a toolset do not deserve your derision. Admittedly you've received your share of insults too, but what goes around comes around. If you choose to play on a console because playing on a PC feels like work to you, fine. But attacking "PC fanbois" is not becoming. I have a console and a PC, and playing different games on different platforms. However, I don't believe in attacking the players who play a game on a different platform to me.

BioWare devs have stated that they know that a toolset increases the longevity of a game, even if only on a single platform. If mods could be ported to consoles (admittedly this can't happen at the moment, and the development would still have to occur on a PC), would you still insist on no toolset? And insist that everyone who wanted a toolset is greedy?

Lastly, I hardly think that people wanting a toolset so they can spend their spare time creating free content for other players classifies as greed....

Modifié par AmstradHero, 01 mars 2011 - 08:40 .

[Bruno Hslaw]

[quote]AmstradHero wrote...

 quote]Bruno Hslaw wrote...
NWN now that was a toolset in its day. I loved that game. I remember many of the mods were great but you had to trawl through a lot of garbage to find it.

[/quote]
As I've stated above, the NWN "was a toolset in its day" because it was much simpler. Your snide insinuations about the lack of quality in player created mods does a grave disservice to all modders.

Since you have contributed nothing to this thread after your first post but to attack other players or modders, I would kindly suggest that you leave it. People who chose to play on PC and want a toolset do not deserve your derision. Admittedly you've received your share of insults too, but what goes around comes around. If you choose to play on a console because playing on a PC feels like work to you, fine. But attacking "PC fanbois" is not becoming. I have a console and a PC, and playing different games on different platforms. However, I don't believe in attacking the players who play a game on a different platform to me.

BioWare devs have stated that they know that a toolset increases the longevity of a game, even if only on a single platform. If mods could be ported to consoles (admittedly this can't happen at the moment, and the development would still have to occur on a PC), would you still insist on no toolset? And insist that everyone who wanted a toolset is greedy?

Lastly, I hardly think that people wanting a toolset so they can spend their spare time creating free content for other players classifies as greed....
[/quote]


Another joker who can not follow a topic. 

! I never have objected to PC games having a toolset. I made several mods in my day for NWN and the old TES toolset etc. I enjoyed that. The fact is and its true m,ost mods were rubbish. I did state many were great so how is this dissing great moders? Some were fantastic I never ever said they were all rubbish just you have to wade through a lot of muck to find a diamond.

! I simply say if they are wasting time and money catering to a very small number of players making a toolset. Why not use that to cater for all plqayers and use the resources on a new expansion. BW have limited resources, which they will admit. My point being not even all the PC community will use the toolset. The consoles as BW have said and shown with the changes to DA2 are the bigger target market.

! Financially why use the resources on a minority market rather than on all the players no matter what format. Its that simple. I do not hate the PC I do not hate the 360 or the PS3. Its just you PC fan boys who want to believe because I am not a outright fan boy that I must hate the PC. Get over it I have never said anything against the PC.

Modifié par Bruno Hslaw, 02 mars 2011 - 03:46 .

[AmstradHero]

Bruno Hslaw wrote...
! I never have objected to PC games having a toolset. I made several mods in my day for NWN and the old TES toolset etc. I enjoyed that. The fact is and its true m,ost mods were rubbish. I did state many were great so how is this dissing great moders? Some were fantastic I never ever said they were all rubbish just you have to wade through a lot of muck to find a diamond.

You're campaigning very hard against a DA2 toolset. That sounds like an objection to me. Also, perhaps you should read up the definition of insinuation and your posts again. Your posts insinuated that you found DAO mods to be garbage - to that I take offense.

Bruno Hslaw wrote...
! I simply say if they are wasting time and money catering to a very small number of players making a toolset. Why not use that to cater for all plqayers and use the resources on a new expansion. BW have limited resources, which they will admit. My point being not even all the PC community will use the toolset. The consoles as BW have said and shown with the changes to DA2 are the bigger target market.

I don't have access to exact sales figures for each platform, Do you? As far as I was aware, DAO sold very well on PC. Perhaps not as much as 360 and PS3 combined, but still very well.  You also seem to assume that the only people who benefit from a toolkit are modders - the players of mods are the ones who truly benefit from a toolset, and they are a much larger group than modders.

Bruno Hslaw wrote...
! Financially why use the resources on a minority market rather than on all the players no matter what format. Its that simple. I do not hate the PC I do not hate the 360 or the PS3. Its just you PC fan boys who want to believe because I am not a outright fan boy that I must hate the PC. Get over it I have never said anything against the PC.

If you re-read my post, you'll see that I never accused you of hating the PC. I merely pointed out that you have attacked people supporting the PC and the those who want a toolset as fanboys. A misconception you've just repeated again. If you'd paid attention, you would have seen that I play games on PC and console. This thread was about the possibility of people getting a toolset, and you have been the one to derail it and turn it into a platform war.

Regardless, you did not answer my key question. For DAO BioWare investigated, but unfortunately had to drop, the idea of allowing user made mods to be released to consoles. If this were made possible for DA2, surely this would make the toolset a very valuable release for all players. Would you argue against a toolset then? Or did you simply choose to ignore this point for the sake or prolonging the argument?

As for the financial benefit, what about the hundreds of thousands of downloads for all the DAO mods that are available? Many of which kept people playing it, and potentially contributed to increased DLC sales because people still had the game on their computer because of those mods. BioWare (and other developers) have admitted that this occurs, and that the very existence of a toolset encourages people to buy their games and gives them sales they might not otherwise get. Do you have the exact answers to determine the financial benefits of DLC vs toolsets? If so, I imagine many game companies would like to talk to you.

You don't want a toolset because it won't personally improve your DA2 experience. Other players feel they would gain a great deal out of a toolset. Attacking people who have a different opinion to you and calling them "fanboys" or tossing around insults is not reasoned or intelligent discussion. As for whether releasing a toolset would be a good business decision on BioWare's part - I don't believe anyone outside of the company is in a position to make an accurate judgement on the cost versus benefit. They can judge how much it would cost to produce a toolset, and they have statistics on DLC sales for various platforms. Without those figures as a starting point, calculating the possible cost or profit of producing a toolset would be little more than an uneducated guess.

Modifié par AmstradHero, 03 mars 2011 - 08:28 .

[panamakira]

Even though I can't use the toolset or mods I liked watching the videos on youtube with all the cool mods people made for DA:O. I loved the Alistair wedding. So I root for toolsets even if I can't directly enjoy it.

[DJBare]

I want a tool set, but I'm not holding my breath, vote cast.

[darkrose]

DJBare wrote...

I want a tool set, but I'm not holding my breath, vote cast.

This.

My experience with EA and user-created content is The Sims. Sims 1 and  2 had tons of content; a lot of which was awful, but some of which was quite good. 

When I started playing Sims 3 recently, I was surprised to see that there's not nearly as much content as there was at the same stage for Sims 2. The reason most frequently cited by content creators is that it's a lot harder to mod in Sims 3 because of the way the game's designed. Why would EA want to cut back on the custom content that's the best part of the game? Because they'd prefer people buy their overpriced stuff that's often not as good as even the mediocre fan-made stuff (which is free). 

For Dragon Age, a large chunk of their audience can't make use of the toolset. Those of us who do are potentially costing them money. The only reason for me to get mods that don't advance the story (see also: Darkspawn Chronicles) is to get the stuff; if I can get better-looking stuff for free elsewhere, then I won't pay for the DLC.

I want to see a toolset, for gear and appearance mods, but also for additional story content like Dark Times, and for bug fixes that are never going to be done through an official patch. My sense is that Bioware would like to release a toolset....just don't know about EA.

[DotStain]

Still waiting for the official news which says: "Yeah, we will release it, cuz we love our community"
*full of hope*

[Elvhen Veluthil]

PC game market is far from dead, in 2010 it has a 20% annual rise:

http://www.rockpaper...-revenue-up-20/