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The Good, the Bad and the Ugly – Why Dragon Age II will never come close to its predecessor


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#1
Zeepee

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This is my two cents of a personal preview of Dragon Age II, my judgment is purely based on the released developer diaries, trailers, the 55 min. in-game walkthrough movie and lastly the public demo Bioware just released.
 
 
First, a little background:
 
I am one of the old PC gamers dating back from when the Eye of the Beholder series was hot.
However I have also played most of newer RPG titles as well, which includes the Baldur’s Gate series, Icewind Dale series, PlanceScape Torment, The Elder Scrolls series and the Fallout series, which I all loved tremendously.
When Bioware started on the Neverwinter Night series I was excited at first, but was quite disappointed with the end product, primarily because of the way the Dungeons & Dragons mechanics ended up implemented in the game. Being a veteran Dungeons & Dragons gamer myself at that time, I personally thought that “The Temple of Elemental Evil” game did a much greater job of implementing the Dungeon & Dragons ruleset into a video game. So I ended up taking a big break from Bioware, while they did the expansions, the sequel and Jade Empire.
 
Years later when I discovered that Bioware was making Dragon Age, which was a step back towards the good old Baldur’s Gate days, I was thrilled. The game turned out to be EPIC in my eyes, a great new world with an exciting story and its own ruleset geared towards a video game and not inherited from a tabletop RPG, worked just perfectly, of course there were some minor issues, but in the big picture it was an instant masterpiece.
 
So now, approximately two years later, Dragon Age II has gone gold and arrives in a couple of weeks.
I have personally been looking forward to its release and I am sure many other people have as well, however the more I see of the game, the more I get the impression that Bioware took a BIG nose dive into the wrong direction and changed a lot of things that really worked very well and made Dragon Age Origins the masterpiece it is today.
 
In Dragon Age II Bioware has decided to remove all the playable character races, except one, because of their new story, furthermore they have removed all skills from the game, removed most of the equipment options for all companions, except weapons and magic enhancements, removed the two-weapon fighting option for the warrior class and lastly they removed the way you could see your dialogue options, before you chose them.
 
Now, what is wrong with that?
You see RPG games are ultimately about character development and important player/story choices, in both videogames and tabletop games; of course you don’t have the same amount of freedom in a computer game as you do in tabletop games, since you have to focus around a specific story and have limited scope around it.
 
In Dragon Age Origins, Bioware really caught that and turned out a fantastic game focused around a great story, but at the same time giving the players a big range of options to choose from, everything from races and origin, to different ways to develop you character, both skill-wise and ability-wise.
 
 
In Dragon Age II, Bioware has removed most of the RPG aspects (except story) in order to make a fast paced action game instead, if you compare the two games, you will see almost all improvements of the sequel is about better graphics, improved combat reaction and control, and a new way for console gamers to play the game.
The shortcomings, you will not be able to choose your race, your origin, you will be more limited in character development, equipment choices, strategy and dialogue options.
 

So to sum it up a bit:    
 
The Good:
-Improved overall graphics
-Improved characters
-Improved city landscapes (does Kirkwall just look amazing or what!!!)
-Nice and streamlined ability trees
-More reactive character control in combat (Needed)
-Beautiful spell effects
 
 
The Bad:
-Only one playable race (story issue)
-Only one origin (story issue)
-Generally over/inhuman sized weapons
-Way too fast combat pace
-Removed two-weapon fighting from the warrior class
-Dialogue wheel
-Open lock is only available to the rogue class
 
 
The Ugly:
-Removed the strategic view
-Removed the skills from the game
-Removed most armor and customization options from all companions
-Removed the PC Toolset
 
 
Some of the issues - In detail:
 
Fast Combat pace
In my personal opinion the new combat pace is way too fast, every melee fighter goes ninja berserk, I agree that the faster combat pace was needed a little, but this is way too much. When characters wield two-handed weapons like knifes it looks unreal and destroys the immersion as it looks too far-out.
Personally I would have loved a pace between the first game and this.
 

Removed the Dialogue wheel:
Personally I really don’t care about if it is a wheel, a triangle or something third. However I really dislike that I am not able to see what sentences/specific words that I am about to say. Again it ruins the immersion of the character as you often end up saying something that you really didn’t want to say.
 
 
Removed two-weapon fighting from the warrior class
What is that; was it really necessary to do that in order to make the rogue class more attractive to play. You don’t make a sequel greater by limiting the options that were available before. Instead you should have improved the weapon options for the warrior class by introducing spears, halberds and other pole arms with unique weapon range bonuses.
Give the rogue class some other unique abilities instead of removing them away from the other classes, especially when it comes to abilities that many players favor.
 
 
Open lock is only available to the rogue class
This one is a minor thing, but again I don’t get the design team.
Dragon Age is one of the only RPG games I know where it is only the rogue class that is able to open a lock. In almost all other RPG games there exists an “open lock” spell or it’s possible for warriors to break open chests and doors.
Again it looks like the design team has problems making the rogue class attractive and therefor only makes it available to them.
Hopefully the modders out there will provide a solution again, making it possible for both mages and warriors to get the above mentioned abilities, as they also did with Origins.
 
 
Removed the Strategic View:
This is one of the biggies, again what are the designers thinking.
I know that the function was only available on the PC version and they sold most copies on consoles, but come on. You are ruining one of the greatest aspects of the game, removing strategy from the game doesn’t make it any better, it just makes it more boring.
Example, you have also removed any need of strategic placement for the rogue regarding backstab, in Origins you needed to be on the side or behind your target in order for it to work. In Dragon Age II you axed that with a Houdini trick, where the rogue vanishes in thin air only to reappear behind the target and backstab, no strategy necessary, only mindless attack-that-target-clicks.
That is not improvement; it is axing and oversimplifying one of the game’s great strengths.
 
 
Removed Skills
Again why was this necessary, the character skills were a nice part of your characters limited development options. I agree with many players that not all skills were useful, but removing skills entirely only makes character development and replay value more limited.
 
 
Removed most armor and customization options from all companions
Personally another design decision I can’t follow. Bioware did the same thing with Mass Effect - in the first game you had lots of equipment options, but when they released the sequel, you couldn’t change the armor of your companions, actually you could barely change your inventory, and no weapons had any statistics anymore.
Again sequels don’t get better by removing options, especially regarding character creation, customization or equipment options. Are the development schedules really that tight that you needed to remove important things like this in order to make the deadline? Sad…
 
 
 
Ending comments:
 
Will I play Dragon Age II, of course I will. I have preordered my signature edition and I am way too curious about the sequel of one of my favorite games, to just let it go because of catastrophic design decisions.
However I am sad that Bioware has decided to remove so many good aspects of a fantastic game.
 
If you have read this far, thanks for your interest, I needed to give Bioware a little personal rant, I hope I haven’t stepped on your toes as well, if so you have the apology of an old frustrated video RPG gamer and Dragon Age fan, who just can’t understand modern videogame producers’ design decisions anymore.
 
Why turn one of best RPG titles (if not the best) of several years, into a limited action game? Because of better console sales..?
 
Sad.. Image IPB
 
Hopefully the final product will have some great surprises.
 
  
PS:
I know most of you probably don’t agree with me, but before you start flaming-away, know that I didn’t write this to start a debate with you. Instead I needed tell Bioware that I don’t agree with the direction the game is taking.

#2
Prio

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**** **** **** ****.

#3
dearlyblvd

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social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/6146306/222

#4
Red Panda

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My Eyes! My eyes! I'm melting! Nice post though, I still prefer the demo for its pace.

#5
Ace Attorney

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dearlyblvd wrote...

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/6146306/222

This.

#6
MasterSamson88

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T3hAnubis wrote...

dearlyblvd wrote...

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/6146306/222

This.

Ah yes, indeed.

#7
Sabresandiego

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Different strokes for different folks. I like fast paced action games with rpg elements. I hate slow paced games. DA2 is a nice blend of both.

#8
October Sixth

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You really ought to have known many of these things prior to playing the demo.

#9
HyperLimited

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Zeepee wrote...
I am one of the old PC gamers

I stopped reading there since I knew where it was heading. :whistle:

Modifié par HyperLimited, 25 février 2011 - 02:37 .


#10
lv12medic

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Doo-EEE-Doo-EEE-Doo



Bwah-BWAH-bwah

#11
Metalunatic

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MasterSamson88 wrote...

T3hAnubis wrote...

dearlyblvd wrote...

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/6146306/222

This.

Ah yes, indeed.


Ahhhhh, yessssss... ''Demo feedback thread'', we have dismissed that claim.

#12
Morroian

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Wow I looked at the subject and thought I can predict what the posters is going to say and what do you know, I was right.

Zeepee wrote...

The shortcomings, you will not be able to choose your race, your origin, you will be more limited in character development, equipment choices, strategy and dialogue options.
 

Character development is not about race and no we will not be more limited in character development than in DAO. We will still be able to role play and build Hawke as we would like.

#13
JrayM16

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HyperLimited wrote...

Zeepee wrote...
I am one of the old PC gamers

I stopped reading there since I knew where it was heading. :whistle:


Indeed.  I kept reading but would like to reiterate that senioity does not equal superiority of opinion.

#14
wulfsturm

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I'd be lying if I said that I cared about you or your opinion.



I'd also be lying if I thought BioWare cares about it either.

#15
Crazy Cpt

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I love how half your complaints are things that would require playing the whole game even though it's not out

#16
XBenotto18

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What a big post thats isnt in the right thread

#17
SpockLives

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Really? This thread again? Are you related to the maker of this thread? http://social.biowar...1/index/6183748

#18
Naitaka

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MasterSamson88 wrote...

T3hAnubis wrote...

dearlyblvd wrote...

social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/6146306/222

This.

Ah yes, indeed.


Zeepee wrote...

This is my two cents of a personal preview
of Dragon Age II, my judgment is purely based on the released developer
diaries, trailers, the 55 min. in-game walkthrough movie and lastly the
public demo Bioware just released.


This, learn to read the first freaking line of the op's post...

#19
LenaMarie

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This was bound to happen, according to this article

http://www.destructo...ro-194232.phtml



Bioware cares too much about people that DONT like their games and not enough about people who are lifelong true RPG and Bioware fans. I have to admit, Im disappointed Bioware worries so much about people who dont like their products instead of catering to those who love their work.



However I still enjoy DA 2's Demo, but its definatly more Diablo then it is Baldurs Gate.

#20
Archereon

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For god's sake...Please learn to read people, there's no need for tl;dr here, it's organized into paragraphs for one, and well thought out paragraphs to boot.



I agree with many of his points, though we've yet to see how much customization we're getting for allies; some sources indicate that the "rune" system is just as comprehensive as armor customization, and only serves to justify keeping companions aesthetically the same over the course of the game.

#21
MasterSamson88

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HyperLimited wrote...

Zeepee wrote...
I am one of the old PC gamers

I stopped reading there since I knew where it was heading. :whistle:


Yeah as soon as I saw that I knew it was one of those "I'm old and experianced and have played lots of games so this gives me enough credibility to critisize design choices because I could definetly make it better." ...threads.

#22
Rockpopple

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This really needed to be said (at least) twice? lol. Hey, want some links to some more forums you can post this in? Just to make sure Bioware heard ya.

Modifié par Rockpopple, 25 février 2011 - 02:43 .


#23
TheJist

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Sabresandiego wrote...

Different strokes for different folks. I like fast paced action games with rpg elements. I hate slow paced games. DA2 is a nice blend of both.


I guess the come question is why did people have to come in and ruin it for those who liked dragon age origins game play I mean isn't there plenty of other fast paced action games out there was it really neccessary to take a good salute to the roots rpg and turn it into action game?

#24
RPGrogue

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Dialog wheel is the ONLY thing that I am not a huge fan of, not changing race and origin is a let down sorta, but its for the story and I am all for a great story.

#25
RosaAquafire

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DA2 owns, you suck.

In the interest of this not being spam: seriously, I literally cannot comprehend how anyone could not like da2 better than DA:O, and I adore old school PC games so uh?