53 réponses à ce sujet

[Davasar]

To the OP:

Maybe because these players are unhappy with the Mass Effect direction DA is going.

They have valid complaints. As I have pointed out:

Features that are good you ADD ON TO AND IMPROVE, you do not take them away or replace them with something disliked by a large portion of your fan base.

I am sure Mass Effect has it's audience, but to pretend they are absolutely one in the same as the DA audience is a pipe dream.

These changes are meant to drag in a mass audience for whom many of the RPG elements we love simply hold too much complexity for their attention spans. This is not opinion, several quotes from various EA...I mean, Bioware people have confirmed this.

It's not that the more casual gamer cannot figure those elements out, it's that they are too lazy to, or do not want to or both. So, the designers took said lazy rout to appeal to this audience rather then the one that helped them get where they are today.

...And Bioware has made it emphatically clear they could care less about that audience that bought their products all along the way until EA bought them and started making drastic changes in order to make fast cash with less content and quality (shorter games, DLC, more bugs. I am not wrong here).

Anyway, voicing valid opinions about the state of the game is perfectly acceptable.

How else can Bioware know that many people are unhappy with the simplification of a once beloved franchise.

Modifié par Davasar, 25 février 2011 - 03:01 .

[PopeTackler]

Saphara wrote...
Also, putting HEIL also discredited your points. No one likes random Hitler name throwing

Agreed! <_<

Completely agree with the OP on this one. Constructive criticism and rational arguments are few and far between from the nay-sayers on this board. Your issues with the game would be taken more seriously if it didn't sound like you were just throwing your toys out the pram for the sake of being heard.

[DieHigh2012]

Don't let the minority get you down man.



Check the poll



http://social.biowar...9&poll_id=15635

[Haussier]

I take offense when they say this is not an rpg. It clearly is to the very core a rpg.

also it should be noted that the month before release is when the trolls wake from hibernation in force.

[Wolvenrunner]

Davasar wrote...

To the OP . . . 

Anyway, voicing valid opinions about the state of the game is perfectly acceptable.

How else can Bioware know that many people are unhappy with the simplification of a once beloved franchise.

I agree completely and simply ask that they are delivered with courtesy as you have done. I was present on the Starcraft 2 forums around its release and they were far worse than anything here, though many similar complaints as to X company merged/bought out Y were made in those heady days. Still are in fact, evidence often to the contrary (at least in that case).

Modifié par Wolvenrunner, 25 février 2011 - 03:05 .

[kedcoleman]

You think this is bad? Obviously you didn't go anywhere near the Wizards of the Coast forums around the time D&D 4e was coming out. Broken base? More like shattered, ground up, torched, buried and the ground salted over the burial.

[Helena Tylena]

I'm actually curious to know which gameplay elements are 'mass effect'-ified. I can't think of any off the top of my head. The conversation wheel is a UI element, not a gameplay element. It could've been done in a vertical list just as easily, but they chose not to do it that way. It doesn't affect gameplay in any way.

[Dynamomark]

I don't think DA2 as a whole will be that much more different from DAO. Yes, it will have less talents, will be shorter, etc. But that's understandable, since they decided to redesign the game. IMHO the game is marketed in a somewhat silly way, which makes people think that Bioware is taking a whole new direction with DA2. But I don't think the game will be too different from DAO from an RPG standpoint.

[Haussier]

Helena Tylena wrote...

I'm actually curious to know which gameplay elements are 'mass effect'-ified. I can't think of any off the top of my head. The conversation wheel is a UI element, not a gameplay element. It could've been done in a vertical list just as easily, but they chose not to do it that way. It doesn't affect gameplay in any way.

Only the dialog wheel really. Can't really count the voice over because thats in every other game out there.

[Saphara]

Haussier wrote...

Helena Tylena wrote...

I'm actually curious to know which gameplay elements are 'mass effect'-ified. I can't think of any off the top of my head. The conversation wheel is a UI element, not a gameplay element. It could've been done in a vertical list just as easily, but they chose not to do it that way. It doesn't affect gameplay in any way.

Only the dialog wheel really. Can't really count the voice over because thats in every other game out there.

One could argue making combat less boring Mass Effectified it, but i think tht was a GOOD change. I was getting so bored with it, except mage combos.

Plus, no one can say Archery is casual bad. It NEEDED to be spiced up. Now its so completely badass I'll deffinately be an archer several times over.

[pezit]

You might like oldschool real RPG's as well as action-RPG's, and this is why you still enjoy DA2. The reason why people are saying it's a kids game is because it IS mainly targeted at teens who wants more action in their games, not saying that older people can't as well. I mean i love several "childish" things, i just don't want it in my RPG's, and when a sequal to a game i really like suddenly makes this big change it makes me angry since i was looking forward to the game. I mean it's not like we're overflowing with RPG's and when one of the few games i look forward to disappoints i get a bit pissed off.

[drahelvete]

pezit wrote...

You might like oldschool real RPG's as well as action-RPG's, and this is why you still enjoy DA2. The reason why people are saying it's a kids game is because it IS mainly targeted at teens who wants more action in their games, not saying that older people can't as well. I mean i love several "childish" things, i just don't want it in my RPG's, and when a sequal to a game i really like suddenly makes this big change it makes me angry since i was looking forward to the game. I mean it's not like we're overflowing with RPG's and when one of the few games i look forward to disappoints i get a bit pissed off.

If it's mainly targeted at teens, it wasn't very smart to make it a M rated game, was it?

[Helena Tylena]

drahelvete wrote...

pezit wrote...

You might like oldschool real RPG's as well as action-RPG's, and this is why you still enjoy DA2. The reason why people are saying it's a kids game is because it IS mainly targeted at teens who wants more action in their games, not saying that older people can't as well. I mean i love several "childish" things, i just don't want it in my RPG's, and when a sequal to a game i really like suddenly makes this big change it makes me angry since i was looking forward to the game. I mean it's not like we're overflowing with RPG's and when one of the few games i look forward to disappoints i get a bit pissed off.

If it's mainly targeted at teens, it wasn't very smart to make it a M rated game, was it?

Playing the devil's advocate here, most M-rated things are targeted at teens.

[FieryDove]

People are complaining? I am outrage!



errr...did I do it right?

[Naitaka]

DieHigh2012 wrote...

Don't let the minority get you down man.

Yes, the fact I didn't cancel my Pre-order means I'm completely fine with every change they made to the game. Try harder next time please. While I agree with the op's sentiment, the way he/she put forth the argument is quite condescending by over-generalizing people who are critical of the game. I don't go around calling people mindless fan boys and put words in their mouth, neither should people who support the the direction Bioware is taking the DA franchise.

[DieHigh2012]

Naitaka wrote...

DieHigh2012 wrote...

Don't let the minority get you down man.

Yes,
the fact I didn't cancel my Pre-order means I'm completely fine with
every change they made to the game. Try harder next time please. While
I agree with the op's sentiment, the way he/she put forth the argument
is quite condescending by over-generalizing people who are critical of
the game. I don't go around calling people mindless fan boys and put
words in their mouth, neither should people who support the the
direction Bioware is taking the DA franchise.

I wasn't trying to do anything my friend. What should I be trying to do? I'm not quite following you....

Please continue your crusade for the very vocal minority, I am happy that I don't feel your stress.

By the way, I think you are trying to put words in the OP's mouth, thats a no no.

[Naitaka]

DieHigh2012 wrote...

I wasn't trying to do anything my friend. What should I be trying to do? I'm not quite following you....

Please continue your crusade for the very vocal minority, I am happy that I don't feel your stress.

By the way, I think you are trying to put words in the OP's mouth, thats a no no.

Where exactly did I put words in the op's mouth? I did not make up a hypothetical strawman argument that generalize what people who are critical of the game might say. I can very well enjoy something and still be critical about it. Heck, the more I like the product the more critical I'll be, call it professional hazard. I much prefer people to speak their mind and then decide whether there's merit to their complaint.

Modifié par Naitaka, 25 février 2011 - 04:00 .

[DieHigh2012]

Naitaka wrote...

DieHigh2012 wrote...

I wasn't trying to do anything my friend. What should I be trying to do? I'm not quite following you....

Please continue your crusade for the very vocal minority, I am happy that I don't feel your stress.

By the way, I think you are trying to put words in the OP's mouth, thats a no no.

Where exactly did I put words in the op's mouth? I did not make up a hypothetical strawman argument that generalize what people who are critical of the game might say. I can very well enjoy something and still be critical about it. Heck, the more I like the product the more critical I'll be, call it professional hazard. I much prefer people to speak their mind and then decide whether there's merit to their complaint.

I think that you did (kind of like you think he was being condescending. You dont need any evidence, why do I?), it sounded very respectful to me. Unless you are one of those people that he is talking about that is. Even then he's not saying GTFO, just please stop.

In the post he says it's perfectly fine to be critical, just stop being insulting. So what's your problem again?

[Naitaka]

DieHigh2012 wrote..

*snip

Sounds more like he/she's claiming that "most" people who are critical to the game are making ad hominem attacks on people with a different opinion. Do you even understand what a strawman is?

[DieHigh2012]

Naitaka wrote...

DieHigh2012 wrote..

*snip

Sounds more like he/she's claiming that "most" people who are critical to the game are making ad hominem attacks on people with a different opinion. Do you even understand what a strawman is?

Oh, am I suppose to feel insulted? You sir have just shown your true colors. No wonder that upset you so much. :innocent:

Yes I do, but we call it a scarecrow. I dont see what a implement used to keep birds off the crops has anything to do with this conversation.

Modifié par DieHigh2012, 25 février 2011 - 04:24 .

[Ace Attorney]

DieHigh2012 wrote...

Naitaka wrote...

DieHigh2012 wrote..

*snip

Sounds more like he/she's claiming that "most" people who are critical to the game are making ad hominem attacks on people with a different opinion. Do you even understand what a strawman is?

Oh, am I suppose to feel insulted? You sir have just shown your true colors. No wonder that upset you so much. :innocent:

Yes I do, but we call it a scarecrow. I dont see what a implement used to keep birds off the crops has anything to do with this conversation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

[slimgrin]

XRed_RumX wrote...

op confirmed for casual hack n slasher

Lol. 

[Jarek_Cousland]

BUT I HAET TEH NINHA MUUVEZZZZ!!!!!!!!!!111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

[Naitaka]

DieHigh2012 wrote...
Oh, am I suppose to feel insulted? You sir have just shown your true colors. No wonder that upset you so much. :innocent:

Yes I do, but we call it a scarecrow. I dont see what a implement used to keep birds off the crops has anything to do with this conversation.

What? That doesn't even make sense? Trust me, if I were to insult you I'd not have tried to explain my reasoning to begin with. Honestly, I don't know whether you're trying to be sarcastic and failing horribly or you really don't know what a strawman argument is. So here's a short quote from the wikipedia.

The straw man fallacy occurs in the following pattern of argument:

• Person A has position X.
• Person B disregards certain key points of X and instead presents the superficially similar position Y.

EDIT: Anyway, we're veering off topic fast, so if you want to continue this, please just pm me instead of posting here.

Modifié par Naitaka, 25 février 2011 - 04:30 .

[Joy Divison]

Selene Moonsong wrote...

JigPig wrote...

 [Spam image removed by Moderator] 

*Falls off chair laughing*
I propose a demo motivational thread!
I also get to make demands of the council!
Excellent Pic though, never saw that, I used FemHawke

im really curious what that pic was