348 réponses à ce sujet

[XBenotto18]

Nonoru wrote...

Suck it up or don't play.Noone forces you.

Thats not going to work. We tried that

[Cloaking_Thane]

In Exile wrote...

topster88 wrote..
Even knowing that his dad died, again, how would you supposed to know what he meant by "He won't be alone"? Anyone who says "Well OBVIOULSY he's talking about his dead father" *click* has ESP and needs to get on Ripley's Believe It Or Not

Or we might just think that way. There was a line in DA:O you had with Morrigain about touching which she took as sexual and I thought the line was basically loaded with sarcasm. 

Isnt there an implication there that maybe he's referring to heaven......? and who is missing in the entire Hawke family, again context

do the darkspawn go to heaven?

[topster88]

XBenotto18 wrote...

Who? I've been here all this time. NO ONE AGREES

No one except Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags.....

[Naitaka]

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Well I've heard various iterations spoken at funerals.....so....idk like I've admitted there are flaws, but for me the good outweighs the bad hands down

Yah, at least alot more people I know are now interested in DA2 when I couldn't get them to like DA:O for the life of me. I must say that both the combat and dialogue system does make it alot more accessable to people who are not the core RPG crowd to begin with.

[XBenotto18]

OP should try ME1 and ME2, to see how the wheel actually works. But then again he probably works for another gaming company and wont. Just say how bad the wheel is over and over

[Cloaking_Thane]

Naitaka wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Well I've heard various iterations spoken at funerals.....so....idk like I've admitted there are flaws, but for me the good outweighs the bad hands down

Yah, at least alot more people I know are now interested in DA2 when I couldn't get them to like DA:O for the life of me. I must say that both the combat and dialogue system does make it alot more accessable to people who are not the core RPG crowd to begin with.

Further I dont think we've lost too much RPG going to a voiced protag/ paraphase system, but this seems to be the evolution, and so far I'm on board with it.

[XBenotto18]

topster88 wrote...

XBenotto18 wrote...

Who? I've been here all this time. NO ONE AGREES

No one except Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags.....

OP, Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags..... < everyone else

[HTTP 404]

topster88 wrote...

XBenotto18 wrote...

Who? I've been here all this time. NO ONE AGREES

No one except Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags.....

hold on....



wait a minute...



lemme see here.....


nope, My opinion is still the same.

Modifié par HTTP 404, 25 février 2011 - 05:04 .

[Naitaka]

XBenotto18 wrote...

topster88 wrote...

XBenotto18 wrote...

Who? I've been here all this time. NO ONE AGREES

No one except Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags.....

OP, Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags..... < everyone else

I disagree.

OP, Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags..... < You

is a more accurate statement.











Less of a troll that is...

[Infiniteone2]

I agree, I hate how what you select is not exactly what you say, and I can see this causing many problems in the upcoming mmo Star Wars The Old Republic.

[topster88]

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Its increasingly obvious this is a my way or highway thread,

OP has resolutely ignored the merits of a voiced protag/paraphrase system, despite well reasoned responses explaining said merits, and has increasingly not responded to questions appropriately or simply asked another question in response.

"I" cant figure out what Hawke will say next, is not a problem with the paraphasing, When you put all of the pieces together you can make an informed decision:

1) context
2)Icon
3) paraphrase

please like i said 90% of Mass effect dialogue leads to zero suprise and thats without  icon help

It doesn't help though when 1) the conext is misleading, 2) the Icon is misleading, and 3) the paraphrasing is nowhere near descriptive enough.

And I haven't been ignoring arguments. Here's the arguments I've seen in favor of the radial menu:

- "It looks better than a list": I could not care less.

- "More text would be too cluttered": It looked fine in DA:O

- "It would be repetative to have the VA say the same thing as the text": Then either make the protagonist silent or make the blurbs more descriptive.

- "Tone is more important than the words": BOTH tone and words are important. Just because they "solved" the tone problem with origins doesn't mean it's ok to mess up the words.

Did I miss anything?

Modifié par topster88, 25 février 2011 - 05:07 .

[HTTP 404]

topster88 wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Its increasingly obvious this is a my way or highway thread,

OP has resolutely ignored the merits of a voiced protag/paraphrase system, despite well reasoned responses explaining said merits, and has increasingly not responded to questions appropriately or simply asked another question in response.

"I" cant figure out what Hawke will say next, is not a problem with the paraphasing, When you put all of the pieces together you can make an informed decision:

1) context
2)Icon
3) paraphrase

please like i said 90% of Mass effect dialogue leads to zero suprise and thats without  icon help

It doesn't help though when 1) the conext is misleading, 2) the Icon is misleading, and 3) the paraphrasing is nowhere near descriptive enough.

And I haven't been ignoring arguments. Here's the arguments I've seen in favor of the radial menu:

- "It looks better than a list": I could not care less.

- "More text would be too cluttered": It looked fine in DA:O

- "It would be repetative to have the VA say the same thing as the text": Then either make the protagonist silent or make the blurbs more descriptive.

- "Tone is more important than the words": BOTH tone and words are important. Just because they solved the tone problem with origins doesn't mean it's ok to mess up the text.

Did I miss anything?

why dont we see how it works on when the game is out?  nothing is without its flaws so I give you that.  maybe then we can have a better idea and then throw out ideas that could work maybe in DA3 it can be improved.

[dangeraaron]

Cloaking_Thane wrote...
-snip-
Further I dont think we've lost too much RPG going to a voiced protag/ paraphase system, but this seems to be the evolution, and so far I'm on board with it.

I'm with yah on that.

I'm still hoping that in DA3 we can still have a voiced protagonist with a dialogue wheel...but can also be an elf or dwarf.  In SW:TOR, they have a seperate voice actor for each of the 8 classes and each gender, so I don't think that 6 VAs for the main character is too big of a stretch. 

[XBenotto18]

Naitaka wrote...

XBenotto18 wrote...

topster88 wrote...

XBenotto18 wrote...

Who? I've been here all this time. NO ONE AGREES

No one except Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags.....

OP, Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags..... < everyone else

I disagree.

OP, Metalunatic, _Loc_N_lol_ , Naitaka , XRed_RumX, TJPags..... < You

is a more accurate statement.











Less of a troll that is...

At least I'm not saying anything bad about DAII, I dont see how I'm a troll. If you dont like the wheel then thats fine Mr.T

Modifié par XBenotto18, 25 février 2011 - 05:08 .

[tankgirly]

I have no problem with it.



Obviously you are not a Mass Effect fan.

[topster88]

HTTP 404 wrote...

topster88 wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Its increasingly obvious this is a my way or highway thread,

OP has resolutely ignored the merits of a voiced protag/paraphrase system, despite well reasoned responses explaining said merits, and has increasingly not responded to questions appropriately or simply asked another question in response.

"I" cant figure out what Hawke will say next, is not a problem with the paraphasing, When you put all of the pieces together you can make an informed decision:

1) context
2)Icon
3) paraphrase

please like i said 90% of Mass effect dialogue leads to zero suprise and thats without  icon help

It doesn't help though when 1) the conext is misleading, 2) the Icon is misleading, and 3) the paraphrasing is nowhere near descriptive enough.

And I haven't been ignoring arguments. Here's the arguments I've seen in favor of the radial menu:

- "It looks better than a list": I could not care less.

- "More text would be too cluttered": It looked fine in DA:O

- "It would be repetative to have the VA say the same thing as the text": Then either make the protagonist silent or make the blurbs more descriptive.

- "Tone is more important than the words": BOTH tone and words are important. Just because they solved the tone problem with origins doesn't mean it's ok to mess up the text.

Did I miss anything?

why dont we see how it works on when the game is out?  nothing is without its flaws so I give you that.  maybe then we can have a better idea and then throw out ideas that could work maybe in DA3 it can be improved.

Protip: The point of a demo is to be a demonstration of the full version. I would say it is entirely safe to judge a game based on the demo, because that's the point of a demo.

[XBenotto18]

tankgirly wrote...

I have no problem with it.

Obviously you are not a Mass Effect fan.

you dont even have to be one, its not worth complaining obsessively

[topster88]

XBenotto18 wrote...

At least I'm not saying anything bad about DAII, I dont see how I'm a troll. If you dont like the wheel then thats fine Mr.T

Well this explains a lot. you have no idea what a troll is.

Listen up broheim: A troll isn't someone who complains. A troll is someone who actively tries to get inflammatory responses. Like what you appear to be doing.

[Raanz]

topster88 wrote...

The_mango55 wrote...

This has probably come up before, but I'll state it again anyway.

Have you ever played a game with fully voiced PC dialogue where you select the exact words your character says?

If so, do you not realize how boring it is to listen to your character say the exact same thing you just read?

None of the response choices in origins took longer than 2 seconds to read. I don't see how it would be boring.

It's all about the cinematic experience.  :happy:
The days of 5-6 typed out responses to questions, or to drive a story are over.  Game companies do focus testing, and make major gameplay decisions based on that testing.  I realize there are some folks that love that type of game.  That's the reason why MUDs still exist, but if you haven't guessed all ready, MUDs don't make millions of dollars, they don't "sell" over 2 millions copies.
I find it very hard to believe that not having an entire response typed out for you before a character would say it totally confuses you and causes unwanted behaivor from the pre-written protagonist of the game.
I think what is more likely is that you got used to reading every possible response, and that helped you get into the story, so now you don't want it to change, regardless if it makes a difference or not.

People voicing their opinion about a subject, a game mechanic, a character, etc. really doesn't bother me...what does snap my panties is when folks voice their opinions from atop Mt. Sinai, and claim it's the ten commandments.
Guess what, opinions are like ****s; everyone has one.

[Cloaking_Thane]

topster88 wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...

Its increasingly obvious this is a my way or highway thread,

OP has resolutely ignored the merits of a voiced protag/paraphrase system, despite well reasoned responses explaining said merits, and has increasingly not responded to questions appropriately or simply asked another question in response.

"I" cant figure out what Hawke will say next, is not a problem with the paraphasing, When you put all of the pieces together you can make an informed decision:

1) context
2)Icon
3) paraphrase

please like i said 90% of Mass effect dialogue leads to zero suprise and thats without  icon help

It doesn't help though when 1) the conext is misleading, 2) the Icon is misleading, and 3) the paraphrasing is nowhere near descriptive enough.

And I haven't been ignoring arguments. Here's the arguments I've seen in favor of the radial menu:

- "It looks better than a list": I could not care less.

- "More text would be too cluttered": It looked fine in DA:O

- "It would be repetative to have the VA say the same thing as the text": Then either make the protagonist silent or make the blurbs more descriptive.

- "Tone is more important than the words": BOTH tone and words are important. Just because they "solved" the tone problem with origins doesn't mean it's ok to mess up the words.

Did I miss anything?

Sure, but to get any meaningful conversation we would have to have much much more data to reference, as it stands in this thread id say about 75-85% understood that paraphrase given the, context and Icon

Bioware cant hold your hand about everything,

One important thing youve ignored is this........had they given that option in full you would have picked a different option even if your RP identitiy was charming/compassionate..........you  had a problem with the outcome, it sounded like you just didnt care for that option, but it would have been the end result as that was the writers intent.........

Coming full circle, you are alway choosing from set dialogue, I much much much prefer shorthand when its a voiced protag, otherwise its redundant IMO

[Naltair]

Change is scary and people will always hate change.



The end.

[GrooviestPine]

I don't mind the wheel system in Mass Effect, but from what I can gather of the DA2 demo I don't care for it much. It seemed to me that whenever I selected the sarcastic/humorous option Hawke's actual response would be infinitely less clever or funny than what the text option said.

[topster88]

[quote]Raanz wrote...

It's all about the cinematic experience.  :happy:
The days of 5-6 typed out responses to questions, or to drive a story are over.  Game companies do focus testing, and make major gameplay decisions based on that testing.  I realize there are some folks that love that type of game.  That's the reason why MUDs still exist, but if you haven't guessed all ready, MUDs don't make millions of dollars, they don't "sell" over 2 millions copies.[/quote]

Except, ya know, Origins.

[quote]
I find it very hard to believe that not having an entire response typed out for you before a character would say it totally confuses you and causes unwanted behaivor from the pre-written protagonist of the game.
I think what is more likely is that you got used to reading every possible response, and that helped you get into the story, so now you don't want it to change, regardless if it makes a difference or not.[/quote]

I find it fairly hard to believe that 4-5 single-sentecne responses are that grueling to read


[quotePeople voicing their opinion about a subject, a game mechanic, a character, etc. really doesn't bother me...what does snap my panties is when folks voice their opinions from atop Mt. Sinai, and claim it's the ten commandments.
Guess what, opinions are like ****s; everyone has one.

[/quote]

And forums are a place to present those opinions. Never once have I berated any of you for saying you like the system, so why am I getting crapped on for saying i don't?

[MorningBird]

topster88 wrote...
- "It looks better than a list": I could not care less.

That's your personal preference.  Aesthetics are important to certain people though, in regards to menus.

topster88 wrote...
- "More text would be too cluttered": It looked fine in DA:O

You think it looked fine, other people didn't.

topster88 wrote...
- "It would be repetative to have the VA say the same thing as the text": Then either make the protagonist silent or make the blurbs more descriptive.

Or they can keep it the way it is in DA2, which also works.

topster88 wrote...
- "Tone is more important than the words": BOTH tone and words are important. Just because they solved the tone problem with origins doesn't mean it's ok to mess up the text.

Just because you think it's messed up, doesn't mean everyone does.  Many people in this thread have stated that they think it works fine, so obviously it's not a problem for everyone.

topster88 wrote...
Did I miss anything?

Yes.   WHERE'S MY POLL, DAMMIT?

Honestly, I don't mind that you don't like it.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and no one's opinion is invalid/better than anyone else's.  I don't think BioWare even expects everyone to approve of the changes, but they're never going to be able to please everyone, no matter what they do.  If they did, the internet would explode.

imo, the new system is leaps and bounds better than Origins, and you haven't really convinced me to think otherwise, as I'm sure none of us have convinced you to think otherwise.

I would, however, urge you to give the full game a shot.  One of your problems seems to be that you don't know the meaning behind each tone indicator, but the manuals that come with each copy of the game tend to clear that sort of confusion up, provided you read them.

Anyhoo, my head hurts, so I'm probably heading out of here now!

I still think--if you want a clearer indication of the popularity of the dialogue changes, you should start a poll.  It may prove illuminating for both sides of this debate.

[XBenotto18]

 

Modifié par XBenotto18, 25 février 2011 - 05:22 .