523 réponses à ce sujet

[Esoj16]

cabbagesoup wrote...

They like it because its faster and faster is better these days. Speed and quantity. Because of this mentality and demand I wonder if we will ever see great works of music art or engineering. Its the walmart and fast food smart phone mentality.
Not to mention faster is more action.

First, how you relate faster combat to the "walmart and fast food smart phone mentality" is beyond me.  Second, how does that even affect music and engineering?  Third, you're completely wrong, I just don't understand why there are people that want tediousness in their life.  Walmart is popular because it's cheap and it pretty much has anything you want in a single store, it's bad for small bussinesses and even bad for the economy as a whole, but it's certainly good for customers and it's a smart choice for them.  Fast food is just that, fast food, and sometimes people don't have the time to cook their own dinner, it's not the best choice but it's better than not eating anything.  And what do you have against smart phones? That's a new one, smart phones are incredibly convenient and while some people take things overboard, their usefulness cannot be denied.  

Now on to the actual topic of this thread, it's not dumbed down, at least not too much, some people just like tedium and are too presumptious to realize that the demo was set on normal, which is meant to be easy.  I'm confident you'll need constant use of tactics on hard and nightmare.  The lack of an isometric camera is annoying, I'll admit that, but that does not equal being dumbed down.  Customization for your own character is still fully there, they took away customization for your party members and that might be considered dumbing down the game, but tbh I could never give morrigan robes other than her own, it just wasn't her, and I even used mods to give leliana and sten their own set.  And of course the biggy, faster more responsive combat does not equal being dumbed down, it just means your commands will actually be carried out by your followers.  I just think people like being pessimistic (trolling).

[cabbagesoup]

Salaciouschicken wrote...

If you watched the gamestop video you would see that there are far more enemies, most of which amount to fodder that are easily cut down...by which I mean hacked repeatedly in a very quick but flashy manner until they're dead. The dialogue and voice acting annoys the crap out of me, everyone is so nonchalant about everything. There's no more overwhelm abilities, which some people disliked, but added a lot of difficulty and required thought to overcome. If you were going to face overwhelming foes, remember to bring someone who could stun for instance. Overall the increase in the number of enemies and the decrease in the personalization of the hero and companions implies that it's purposely been "dumbed" down to appeal to people who want a quick and thoughtless jump into the action with little preparation. Although that video was on normal I think.

Well put

[cabbagesoup]

Link3521 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

They like it because its faster and faster is better these days. Speed and quantity. Because of this mentality and demand I wonder if we will ever see great works of music art or engineering. Its the walmart and fast food smart phone mentality.
Not to mention faster is more action.

First, how you relate faster combat to the "walmart and fast food smart phone mentality" is beyond me.  Second, how does that even affect music and engineering?  Third, you're completely wrong, I just don't understand why there are people that want tediousness in their life.  Walmart is popular because it's cheap and it pretty much has anything you want in a single store, it's bad for small bussinesses and even bad for the economy as a whole, but it's certainly good for customers and it's a smart choice for them.  Fast food is just that, fast food, and sometimes people don't have the time to cook their own dinner, it's not the best choice but it's better than not eating anything.  And what do you have against smart phones? That's a new one, smart phones are incredibly convenient and while some people take things overboard, their usefulness cannot be denied.  

Now on to the actual topic of this thread, it's not dumbed down, at least not too much, some people just like tedium and are too presumptious to realize that the demo was set on normal, which is meant to be easy.  I'm confident you'll need constant use of tactics on hard and nightmare.  The lack of an isometric camera is annoying, I'll admit that, but that does not equal being dumbed down.  Customization for your own character is still fully there, they took away customization for your party members and that might be considered dumbing down the game, but tbh I could never give morrigan robes other than her own, it just wasn't her, and I even used mods to give leliana and sten their own set.  And of course the biggy, faster more responsive combat does not equal being dumbed down, it just means your commands will actually be carried out by your followers.  I just think people like being pessimistic (trolling).

Quick easy and cheap and simple. No quality but quantity and instant excitement.
Good old walmart get to by the same cheap crap for less because it doesn't work right and breaks
in not time. Mcdonalds you are what you eat.
Understand.

faster is more simplied dumb down. But the younger generation has been suckered into this so
I'm sure it will sell well like Mcdonalds smart phones and walmart:D

[cabbagesoup]

Link3521 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

They like it because its faster and faster is better these days. Speed and quantity. Because of this mentality and demand I wonder if we will ever see great works of music art or engineering. Its the walmart and fast food smart phone mentality.
Not to mention faster is more action.

First, how you relate faster combat to the "walmart and fast food smart phone mentality" is beyond me.  Second, how does that even affect music and engineering?  Third, you're completely wrong, I just don't understand why there are people that want tediousness in their life.  Walmart is popular because it's cheap and it pretty much has anything you want in a single store, it's bad for small bussinesses and even bad for the economy as a whole, but it's certainly good for customers and it's a smart choice for them.  Fast food is just that, fast food, and sometimes people don't have the time to cook their own dinner, it's not the best choice but it's better than not eating anything.  And what do you have against smart phones? That's a new one, smart phones are incredibly convenient and while some people take things overboard, their usefulness cannot be denied.  

Now on to the actual topic of this thread, it's not dumbed down, at least not too much, some people just like tedium and are too presumptious to realize that the demo was set on normal, which is meant to be easy.  I'm confident you'll need constant use of tactics on hard and nightmare.  The lack of an isometric camera is annoying, I'll admit that, but that does not equal being dumbed down.  Customization for your own character is still fully there, they took away customization for your party members and that might be considered dumbing down the game, but tbh I could never give morrigan robes other than her own, it just wasn't her, and I even used mods to give leliana and sten their own set.  And of course the biggy, faster more responsive combat does not equal being dumbed down, it just means your commands will actually be carried out by your followers.  I just think people like being pessimistic (trolling).

Lets hope your right that on hard or nightmare we will have to actually think about how we are going use are party and their abilities.

[cabbagesoup]

cabbagesoup wrote...

Link3521 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

They like it because its faster and faster is better these days. Speed and quantity. Because of this mentality and demand I wonder if we will ever see great works of music art or engineering. Its the walmart and fast food smart phone mentality.
Not to mention faster is more action.

First, how you relate faster combat to the "walmart and fast food smart phone mentality" is beyond me.  Second, how does that even affect music and engineering?  Third, you're completely wrong, I just don't understand why there are people that want tediousness in their life.  Walmart is popular because it's cheap and it pretty much has anything you want in a single store, it's bad for small bussinesses and even bad for the economy as a whole, but it's certainly good for customers and it's a smart choice for them.  Fast food is just that, fast food, and sometimes people don't have the time to cook their own dinner, it's not the best choice but it's better than not eating anything.  And what do you have against smart phones? That's a new one, smart phones are incredibly convenient and while some people take things overboard, their usefulness cannot be denied.  

Now on to the actual topic of this thread, it's not dumbed down, at least not too much, some people just like tedium and are too presumptious to realize that the demo was set on normal, which is meant to be easy.  I'm confident you'll need constant use of tactics on hard and nightmare.  The lack of an isometric camera is annoying, I'll admit that, but that does not equal being dumbed down.  Customization for your own character is still fully there, they took away customization for your party members and that might be considered dumbing down the game, but tbh I could never give morrigan robes other than her own, it just wasn't her, and I even used mods to give leliana and sten their own set.  And of course the biggy, faster more responsive combat does not equal being dumbed down, it just means your commands will actually be carried out by your followers.  I just think people like being pessimistic (trolling).

Lets hope your right that on hard or nightmare we will have to actually think about how we are going use are party and their abilities.

But I have a bad feeling from what I've seen in the demo this is not the case.

[Esoj16]

cabbagesoup wrote...

Quick easy and cheap and simple. No quality but quantity and instant excitement.
Good old walmart get to by the same cheap crap for less because it doesn't work right and breaks
in not time. Mcdonalds you are what you eat.
Understand.

faster is more simplied dumb down. But the younger generation has been suckered into this so
I'm sure it will sell well like Mcdonalds smart phones and walmart:D

What's wrong with efficiency?  Something that's efficient can still have a high quality:pinched: Walmart has some good stuff, I personally don't like to go there, but I understand why it's so popular (because I'm not a grouchy old man that fears change, even if that change is for the better).  Again, I don't eat fast food very often, but I'm not so close minded that I can't see why some people like it/have to eat from there.  "Faster is more simplified dumb down"? Really? The only thing being dumbed down is my IQ from reading that sentence  Jk btw.  Again with the smart phones, I will never understand you it seems, btw didn't you say you were leaving a few posts ago? <_<

Edit: Couldn't you just edit your last post instead of posting two more posts, one of which you're answering to yourself?  Let me guess, editing is for the young folk who don't like to do things the hard way?

Second Edit:  Sorry if I come off as rude  I don't really have any ill will towards you. You have an opinion and I respect it, but I also want you to respect others' opinion and admit that perhaps you're in the wrong instead of acting as if your opinion is the end all be all, specially when you provide no evidence, not even a coherent argument, to back up your opinion.

Modifié par Link3521, 27 février 2011 - 04:52 .

[godlike13]

cabbagesoup wrote...

Link3521 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

They like it because its faster and faster is better these days. Speed and quantity. Because of this mentality and demand I wonder if we will ever see great works of music art or engineering. Its the walmart and fast food smart phone mentality.
Not to mention faster is more action.

First, how you relate faster combat to the "walmart and fast food smart phone mentality" is beyond me.  Second, how does that even affect music and engineering?  Third, you're completely wrong, I just don't understand why there are people that want tediousness in their life.  Walmart is popular because it's cheap and it pretty much has anything you want in a single store, it's bad for small bussinesses and even bad for the economy as a whole, but it's certainly good for customers and it's a smart choice for them.  Fast food is just that, fast food, and sometimes people don't have the time to cook their own dinner, it's not the best choice but it's better than not eating anything.  And what do you have against smart phones? That's a new one, smart phones are incredibly convenient and while some people take things overboard, their usefulness cannot be denied.  

Now on to the actual topic of this thread, it's not dumbed down, at least not too much, some people just like tedium and are too presumptious to realize that the demo was set on normal, which is meant to be easy.  I'm confident you'll need constant use of tactics on hard and nightmare.  The lack of an isometric camera is annoying, I'll admit that, but that does not equal being dumbed down.  Customization for your own character is still fully there, they took away customization for your party members and that might be considered dumbing down the game, but tbh I could never give morrigan robes other than her own, it just wasn't her, and I even used mods to give leliana and sten their own set.  And of course the biggy, faster more responsive combat does not equal being dumbed down, it just means your commands will actually be carried out by your followers.  I just think people like being pessimistic (trolling).

Quick easy and cheap and simple. No quality but quantity and instant excitement.
Good old walmart get to by the same cheap crap for less because it doesn't work right and breaks
in not time. Mcdonalds you are what you eat.
Understand.

faster is more simplied dumb down. But the younger generation has been suckered into this so
I'm sure it will sell well like Mcdonalds smart phones and walmart:D

LoL, yes. Because faster is more simplified compare to a slower pace. Look at smart-phones, which are much less complex than older phones.

I guess being able to do less, and a slower pace does make something harder.

Modifié par godlike13, 27 février 2011 - 04:39 .

[cabbagesoup]

godlike13 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

Link3521 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

They like it because its faster and faster is better these days. Speed and quantity. Because of this mentality and demand I wonder if we will ever see great works of music art or engineering. Its the walmart and fast food smart phone mentality.
Not to mention faster is more action.

First, how you relate faster combat to the "walmart and fast food smart phone mentality" is beyond me.  Second, how does that even affect music and engineering?  Third, you're completely wrong, I just don't understand why there are people that want tediousness in their life.  Walmart is popular because it's cheap and it pretty much has anything you want in a single store, it's bad for small bussinesses and even bad for the economy as a whole, but it's certainly good for customers and it's a smart choice for them.  Fast food is just that, fast food, and sometimes people don't have the time to cook their own dinner, it's not the best choice but it's better than not eating anything.  And what do you have against smart phones? That's a new one, smart phones are incredibly convenient and while some people take things overboard, their usefulness cannot be denied.  

Now on to the actual topic of this thread, it's not dumbed down, at least not too much, some people just like tedium and are too presumptious to realize that the demo was set on normal, which is meant to be easy.  I'm confident you'll need constant use of tactics on hard and nightmare.  The lack of an isometric camera is annoying, I'll admit that, but that does not equal being dumbed down.  Customization for your own character is still fully there, they took away customization for your party members and that might be considered dumbing down the game, but tbh I could never give morrigan robes other than her own, it just wasn't her, and I even used mods to give leliana and sten their own set.  And of course the biggy, faster more responsive combat does not equal being dumbed down, it just means your commands will actually be carried out by your followers.  I just think people like being pessimistic (trolling).

Quick easy and cheap and simple. No quality but quantity and instant excitement.
Good old walmart get to by the same cheap crap for less because it doesn't work right and breaks
in not time. Mcdonalds you are what you eat.
Understand.

faster is more simplied dumb down. But the younger generation has been suckered into this so
I'm sure it will sell well like Mcdonalds smart phones and walmart:D

LoL, yes. Because faster is more simplified compare to a slower pace.

Look at smart-phones, which are much less complex than older phones.

The more complex and deep something is the slower it has to be by necessity.
There is no arguing this. Chess is not fast paced. Unless you're playing against
someone who doesn't think abount what you are doing.

Great art and music where not thrown together in an instant
and you are wrong everything at walmart is cheap crap.

[cabbagesoup]

Good night kids enjoy your dumb down action game when it comes out don't forget to hook up your controllers.

Modifié par cabbagesoup, 27 février 2011 - 04:45 .

[cabbagesoup]

I like smart phones myself but most people buy them because they can't think or do any of the simple things in life and so have a lazy automated life.

[Esoj16]

cabbagesoup wrote...

The more complex and deep something is the slower it has to be by necessity.
There is no arguing this. Chess is not fast paced. Unless you're playing against
someone who doesn't think abount what you are doing.

Great art and music where not thrown together in an instant
and you are wrong everything at walmart is cheap crap.

You do realize your first statement is proven wrong just by his second sentence right?  Smart phones are extremely complicated yet they're fast.  Some things do require time in order to achieve a better quality, such as cooking, composing music, writing a book.  However, the time invested in a project does not indicate the quality of said project, I could take 20 years to write a book but I guarantee it will still suck at the end.   Great art and music is still being made today by great artists and musicians so I don't get your argument there.  Btw, combat doesn't need to be slow and clunky to be tactical, and as much as I loved DA:O, its combat was slow and clunky.

[wulf3n]

Irony - People complaining something is "dumbed down" all the while acting as dumb as the people they hate.

[Eludajae]

You never fully judge a game by a demo...ever. And I am at a loss over how these so many people complain and whimper over stuff. It's a marked improvement over DAO system wise, graphics wise, story wise (now my character doesn't stand there like an fool as text scrolls by after one of the NPC's voiced over a question to them). Its better period.

[cabbagesoup]

godlike13 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

Link3521 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

They like it because its faster and faster is better these days. Speed and quantity. Because of this mentality and demand I wonder if we will ever see great works of music art or engineering. Its the walmart and fast food smart phone mentality.
Not to mention faster is more action.

First, how you relate faster combat to the "walmart and fast food smart phone mentality" is beyond me.  Second, how does that even affect music and engineering?  Third, you're completely wrong, I just don't understand why there are people that want tediousness in their life.  Walmart is popular because it's cheap and it pretty much has anything you want in a single store, it's bad for small bussinesses and even bad for the economy as a whole, but it's certainly good for customers and it's a smart choice for them.  Fast food is just that, fast food, and sometimes people don't have the time to cook their own dinner, it's not the best choice but it's better than not eating anything.  And what do you have against smart phones? That's a new one, smart phones are incredibly convenient and while some people take things overboard, their usefulness cannot be denied.  

Now on to the actual topic of this thread, it's not dumbed down, at least not too much, some people just like tedium and are too presumptious to realize that the demo was set on normal, which is meant to be easy.  I'm confident you'll need constant use of tactics on hard and nightmare.  The lack of an isometric camera is annoying, I'll admit that, but that does not equal being dumbed down.  Customization for your own character is still fully there, they took away customization for your party members and that might be considered dumbing down the game, but tbh I could never give morrigan robes other than her own, it just wasn't her, and I even used mods to give leliana and sten their own set.  And of course the biggy, faster more responsive combat does not equal being dumbed down, it just means your commands will actually be carried out by your followers.  I just think people like being pessimistic (trolling).

Quick easy and cheap and simple. No quality but quantity and instant excitement.
Good old walmart get to by the same cheap crap for less because it doesn't work right and breaks
in not time. Mcdonalds you are what you eat.
Understand.

faster is more simplied dumb down. But the younger generation has been suckered into this so
I'm sure it will sell well like Mcdonalds smart phones and walmart:D

LoL, yes. Because faster is more simplified compare to a slower pace. Look at smart-phones, which are much less complex than older phones.

I guess being able to do less, and a slower pace does make something harder.

Try downloading a game from matrix games and see if you can play it fast, action dude.
If you can understand it you won't want to play it fast and even if you take all night its still hard to beat or even understand exactly what you have to do. Yeah, that is the other extreme it can be boring but it makes the point of how
you have to slow down in combat to win the battle. You have too much to think about to go rushing through a battle.  Then you'll understand how faster is simplified.

Modifié par cabbagesoup, 27 février 2011 - 04:53 .

[godlike13]

cabbagesoup wrote...

The more complex and deep something is the slower it has to be by necessity.
There is no arguing this. Chess is not fast paced. Unless you're playing against someone who doesn't think abount what you are doing.

Great art and music where not thrown together in an instant
and you are wrong everything at walmart is cheap crap.

So what, because the game-play is now at a faster pace, that means it was thrown together. Ur just trying to switch the argument now. Musicians might take their time to create their music, but that doesn't mean their music is slow.

Also, ya. This looks easier.

Modifié par godlike13, 27 février 2011 - 04:58 .

[cabbagesoup]

wulf3n wrote...

Irony - People complaining something is "dumbed down" all the while acting as dumb as the people they hate.

And your to dumb to understand their arguments, how ironic.

[cabbagesoup]

godlike13 wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...

The more complex and deep something is the slower it has to be by necessity.
There is no arguing this. Chess is not fast paced. Unless you're playing against
someone who doesn't think abount what you are doing.

Great art and music where not thrown together in an instant
and you are wrong everything at walmart is cheap crap.

cabbagesoup wrote...

The more complex and deep something is the slower it has to be by necessity.
There is no arguing this. Chess is not fast paced. Unless you're playing against someone who doesn't think abount what you are doing.

Great art and music where not thrown together in an instant
and you are wrong everything at walmart is cheap crap.

So what, because the game-play is now at a faster pace, that means it was thrown together. Ur just trying to switch the argument now. Musicians might take their time to create their music, but that doesn't mean their music is slow.

Also, ya. This looks easier.

It does if you watch the masters of old. The all time unbeatable champions. That whole thing looks staged.

[wulf3n]

cabbagesoup wrote...
And your to dumb to understand their arguments, how ironic.

yeah...that's not irony.

You know maybe people might take your arguments seriously if you weren't acting like a 10yr old counter strike fan.

[John Epler]

Oh, excellent. Unnecessary condescension, that's useful.

[godlike13]

cabbagesoup wrote...

Try downloading a game from matrix games and see if you can play it fast, action dude.
If you can understand it you won't want to play it fast and even if you take all night its still hard to beat or even understand exactly what you have to do. Yeah, that is the other extreme it can be boring but it makes the point of how
you have to slow down in combat to win the battle. You have too much to think about to go rushing through a battle.  Then you'll understand how faster is simplified.

Ya, because its the slower combatant that usually wins a battle. The one who has to slow down to think, rather than the one that can think at quicker pace.

Modifié par godlike13, 27 février 2011 - 05:04 .

[Esoj16]

Yeah...I've decided to give up on cab, some people just see what they want to see, so I'll just drop it.

[Hexadecimal]

wulf3n wrote...

cabbagesoup wrote...
And your to dumb to understand their arguments, how ironic.

yeah...that's not irony.

You know maybe people might take your arguments seriously if you weren't acting like a 10yr old counter strike fan.

Counter-strike is too fast for him.
...
like smart-phones.

On topic though, I don't think it's dumbed down. Sped up, maybe. Streamlined, perhaps. I'm going to wait for the full game no matter what.

[Thullon]

The speed of something has nothing to do with the complexity. (Yeah, I beat the dead horse.) Part of the skill involved is reaction time.
Even if they made the game exactly as diffcult as DA:O, DA2 will be harder because we'll have to react faster.
From what we've been told (and the demo) the normal mode on DA2 will be easier than normal DA:O. We've been told that hard will be the same as the old hard and Nightmare sounds like it'll be even harder given the class/mechanics changes.
If Nightmare is as hard as they are trying to make it sound then there will be a lot of meaningful planning to be done when leveling your character as well as in combat.

[Felene]

Half of the people complain doesn't even have their facts straight.

WTF is this Hawke, where is my Warden?

WTF is this button smashing!

WTF is this super fast animation, and where is my top-down isometric vew!

WTF is this dialog wheel thing, we got paragon/renegade points now?

WTF is this horrible graphic in DX11?

WTF is this cutscene loading/inventory lock/can't refuse Varric, Isabela join "my" party!

Whiners, for your health concern, please GTFO.

Modifié par Felene, 27 février 2011 - 05:22 .

[Xewaka]

Dubya75 wrote...
I just want to get some facts about this "dumbed down" label.

Lemme give a shot!
Non customizable companion fighting style or armor. - Choice is intimidating for dumb people!
Icons and paraphrase wheel instead of full line. - Dumb people can't read properly!
No overview camera.- Dumb people cannot manage that much information input!
Shortened overall duration.- Dumb people cannot keep concentration for extended periods of time and have bad memory to attempt picking up a halfways run!
Does that work?

Modifié par Xewaka, 27 février 2011 - 05:30 .